Smart employee happy to answer questions on bb rollout

colin300 · 11-02-2005 4:38pm

Ok i have read all of the thread and as someone has brought up about Bray's exchange being activated.

Not too happy bout this cause I am on the worst of all isp's UTV nothing but problems. What i dont get is why not bray we have loads of industrial parks and loads of businesses that use Broadband. What i am getting to and if I am wrong please correct me. When esat announced there fibre optic lines that would go around ireland I remember something about dart and railway lines were going to be used as places for them to bring there fibre optic lines along are you planning anything like this as I would appreciate the sweet release it would give me being able to send that form in saying I would like to cancel my subscription. The exchange is like 500 metres away from the railway line.

My contract ends middle of march and I dont plan on signing for another 12 month contract wth anyone so I wll leave the rolling contract with utv for a while yet. Because I believe something will happening end of march beginning of april because that free trial off is coming to an end and i believe they will be something else in its place.

iano · 11-02-2005 4:41pm

Garfield,
From Smart Telecom FAQ

We require a direct debit payment. This is an advanced monthly payment that is taken from either your bank account or a credit card. Download a Direct Debit mandate form here (PDF format).

The form is not suitable for Credit Card payment. Do you have an alternative one that is?

ranDom_tAsk · 11-02-2005 5:23pm

hi guys, i'm just gonna jump in here and ask, which is better speed and cost wise ?

NTL or Smarttelecom ?

OfflerCrocGod · 11-02-2005 5:30pm

ranDom_tAsk wrote:

NTL or Smarttelecom ?

NTL is actually available on the other hand Smart's offering is still not available. Can you get both?

ranDom_tAsk · 11-02-2005 5:39pm

OfflerCrocGod wrote:

NTL is actually available on the other hand Smart's offering is still not available. Can you get both?

i'm using ntl bb at the mo, i just heard on the wireless that stelecom are given free rental for the first 100,000 customers, did i hear wrong ?

just wondering weather to swich or not...

PiE · 11-02-2005 6:10pm

Yea they are offering free line rental, however NTL broadband doesn't require a phone line in the first place. I'd recommend staying with NTL for the moment at least, until Smart's promises materialise. I doubt they'll reach the 100k mark for a few months anyway.

colin300 · 11-02-2005 6:12pm

well they are giving free line rental but until they can get there system up and running u cant avail of it because that offer only applies to the BB offer.

NTL BB is faster depending what level of there system your on and if u play games and upload stuff u would be best to stay with them as from what u can gather from earlier posts it is only a 128k upload which really isn't sufficent enough to the 2mb download they are offering.

ranDom_tAsk · 11-02-2005 6:50pm

PiE wrote:

Yea they are offering free line rental, however NTL broadband doesn't require a phone line in the first place. I'd recommend staying with NTL for the moment at least, until Smart's promises materialise. I doubt they'll reach the 100k mark for a few months anyway.

yeah, i'd rather not have the bb going through me phone line, i have to say ntl bb is great, i use stelecom for me phone line and love them, to both great companies...

eircon :rolleyes:

Saruman · 11-02-2005 7:23pm

I did the line test ant got this:
Your phone number ****** is in the exchange PALMERSTOWN. The exchange code is PALD.
Unfortunately, Smart Broadband is not yet available to you! The date of availability is yet to be confirmed. Would you like to register your interest anyway?

Are you using a completely different technology then? I have had broadband for ages!

colin300 · 11-02-2005 7:25pm

yes they aren't reselling eircom so they have to do as eircom did in the first instance and install all there own equipment in each individual exchange and there system will work over lnger distances. There system is called ADSL2+.
Also since they dont get money from everyone they need to begin slowly in order to see what the take up so they can see if it advisable to upgrade more exchanges. They are also restricted due to there own fibre network and so they can only activate a few exchanges at the moment and over time as there fibre network expands they will be able to activate others.

dub45 · 11-02-2005 9:01pm

Saruman wrote:

I did the line test ant got this:
Your phone number ****** is in the exchange PALMERSTOWN. The exchange code is PALD.
Unfortunately, Smart Broadband is not yet available to you! The date of availability is yet to be confirmed. Would you like to register your interest anyway?

Are you using a completely different technology then? I have had broadband for ages!

At the moment all they check is what exchange you are connected to. they are working off their proposed exchange roll out. Your line is not being tested at all.

dub45 · 11-02-2005 9:12pm

jdsiiken wrote:

Hi Garfield
Nice to see you on boards.

Is the free line rental for life offer locked to the line or the customer ? That is, if I move house can i still avail of the offer ?

They could never commit to that if only on the basis that they might not have service to house you move to.

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 9:42pm

Sentinel wrote:

Garfield,

Some questions/points please respond:
You are providing VoIP services from your DSL Modem/Router.
Which is transparent to the Home User ie. they put the same POTS phone they have at home into the phone port on the box and voice calls happen as normal.

Ahh, goading me to answer?

Okay, it's Friday night and I've just realised that boards.ie is at least mildly addictive. I'm going to answer some of the easier questions. I'm not avoiding the harder ones, I just don't want to have to think too hard!

The answer to the above question is...'No'. The POTS phone will be plugged into the POTS port on the filter. VoIP services will be available seperately.

Sentinel wrote:

I assume then like the POTS phone at home, when Electricity to the home fails there is power provided through the port to the phone ie. the -50DC is passed from your kit in the exchanged through the phone cable throught the 'dead' modem/router to the phone?
Imagine no power and no access to emergency services etc if phone doesn't work - no doubt you couldn't contemplate this.

No doubt. Your POTS port is line powered. It will work in a power failure. Of course, if you have a DECT phone, like I do, you're in trouble anyway (DECT phones require seperate power sources). Thank God for mobiles ;-)

Sentinel wrote:

Also can you provide assistance if need be to the Gardai to track crank callers -and other serivces the Telco can and is obliged to provide eg. Lawful Intercept?
Will CLID, Voice mail, 2nd Caller be provided as most people take these services for granted from their voice line supplier?

CLID (Calling Line Idendifier for inbound and both CLIP and CLIR (Calling Line Indentifier Present and Calling Line Identifier Restrict) will both be available. We have some very interesting ideas on voicemail, though I'm not willing to elaborate here. AFAIK, call waiting is good to go, but I'll have to check for an update on this. Lawful intercept is good to go too.

Sentinel wrote:

You mention ADSL2+ and providing 2Mb downstream as though this is a massive bandwidth. ADSL2+ in Italy provides 12MBDownstream @ €20 permonth and up to 50MB where line quality allows. Now why would the average home user and casual internet user care about this - well as you are probably well aware - you need at least 4MB ( and usually 8 ) to the home downstream to receive or be provided with video services. So you may be limited by sticking with and signing up to Smart Telecom if another provider comes into the market with Triple Play = voice, video, data to the home - which is inevitable.

Italy is a wonderful place. Fabulous wines, great climate, damned low cholestorol. Italy is not Ireland. 2MB downstream for an effective 11 euro a month is a huge step forwards for Ireland Inc. Italy also has unusually short copper loop lengths, or rather Ireland (and UK) have unusually long copper loop lengths. I'm not saying 2MB is the max. I'm saying that's the service we are launching. We'll be trialling triple play shortly.

Sentinel wrote:

Also for the home worker the Upstream rate is important when for example you are uploading files - 128K upstream is no better for file transfer than ISDN with 2B channels connected. It is still in the Dark ages in terms of upload and will perpetuate the frustration of the home worker.

Fair point. Point taken. We're looking at it.

Sentinel wrote:

I am personally frustrated with the lack of vision of the socalled Broadband/voice/data providers and alternative carriers in ireland 128K, 256K 512K 2Mb whatever - capped or not capped who cares - it's all narrowvisioned short term make money quick - no one is going after the big picture.

Sentinel, like I said above, what we are doing is a huge step change, to my mind. Network rollouts cost money. I'm going to sound arrogant now, but I don't think there is another company out there with a bigger 'big picture' approach than Smart. We've made substantial changes in the Enterprise fibre space. We'll replicate that in the DSL space.

Sentinel wrote:

For sure you'll say video is regulated and very difficult to sign up the studios for access to movies, programmes etc.
Well the sooner the better a Content Provider such as SKY comes into the market to provide triple play services the better via satelite/DSL or DSL or fibre to the home or whatever - then there'll be something to be excited about.

I didn't say that. We already provide fibre to the home in place. We have a development is Smithfield and have other coming on stream. We have the content relationships in place already.

Good questions. Thanks,

Garfield.

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 9:48pm

james1234 wrote:

Just hope March/April really means March/April!
Spent 3 1/2 months trying to get IOL BB connected switched over from u.tv, despite IOL quoting 20 days conenction time on their website

Do you foresee any free trial periods before comitting to a year contract, like most other ISPs?

1. You hope it really means it? I'm the Programme Manager for this service. James, how ever much you hope, I hope it more. At present we're on schedule, most recent updates as of this afternoon, confirm that.

2. Free trials? Not a chance. This is 2MB broadband for €35 less €24 line rental. €11 for 2MB. What's not to like? If we can't deliver the service, you can invalidate the contract.

Garfield.

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 9:57pm

pauld wrote:

Garfield,

Hi, I have eircom phonewatch at home and I note that your website says the service is not available to phonewatch customers.

I have spoken to phonewatch (pw) today and they assure me that they can install a splitter at the main phone socket (where the line enters the house) which would then enable broadband and phonewatch to both work on the same line.

pw advised me to sign up to your service and when I receive the equipment from you, I should then contact pw. They will send out an engineer (75e) who will install splitter and ensure that the broadband connection and pw works

I realise this question may be outside your area but are you aware if what phonewatch says re the splitter is true. I really would like to avail of your service!

Many thanks
Paul

Paul,

The 'No' to PhoneWatch is a bit of a catch all answer. We didn't want people accusing us of causing their lose of alarm service. As of yesterday, we've spoken with PhoneWatch and have commited to test the service with their engineering department to make sure it can work. It obviously won't be as easy an install, but hopefully it will be possible.

Garfield.

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 10:04pm

dub45 wrote:

They could never commit to that if only on the basis that they might not have service to house you move to.

The contract is with the customer as much as the line. If you move and the new line is on-net, then I imagine we will continue the offer. However, there may be a charge for the continuation of the service.

I don't have a nailed down answer on this. Boards.ie is certainly posing some interesting questions. I hope I won't be cruxified for admitting I don't have all the answers.

Thanks,

Garfield.

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 10:13pm

colin300 wrote:

Ok i have read all of the thread and as someone has brought up about Bray's exchange being activated.

Not too happy bout this cause I am on the worst of all isp's UTV nothing but problems. What i dont get is why not bray we have loads of industrial parks and loads of businesses that use Broadband. What i am getting to and if I am wrong please correct me. When esat announced there fibre optic lines that would go around ireland I remember something about dart and railway lines were going to be used as places for them to bring there fibre optic lines along are you planning anything like this as I would appreciate the sweet release it would give me being able to send that form in saying I would like to cancel my subscription. The exchange is like 500 metres away from the railway line.

My contract ends middle of march and I dont plan on signing for another 12 month contract wth anyone so I wll leave the rolling contract with utv for a while yet. Because I believe something will happening end of march beginning of april because that free trial off is coming to an end and i believe they will be something else in its place.

Colin300,
I can't comment on EsatBT's fibre infrastructure. We don't have infrastructure extending to Bray. That's why Bray isn't on the list.
Smart's network philosophy is to directly connect to exchanges using fibre lit by Smart's own electronics (Luminous Technologies' RPR technology if anyone is interested).

Sponge Bob · 11-02-2005 10:24pm

GarfieldConnoll wrote:

I hope I won't be cruxified for admitting I don't have all the answers.

Garfield.

Normal Irish exchanges can 'service' out to 5 miles or 8KM using POTS and are natonally distributed thus. Eircom DSL kit only does 4.5Km , leaving a large unserviced area on the exchange fringes. That is their 256k RADSL service which is "Up To 512k" in the T&C's but marketed as 512k .

90% or more of all DSL customers in Ireland have this 256k service.

BT offer higher speeds closer in, 1Mbit at 6km, and 512k only beyond that , albeit up to 10Km. Dunno what the real minimum is .

It would be refreshing in the Irish context to see a 'best effort' at the distance margins, say above 5km where the 2Mb service is unlkely to function , and where you have no competiton anyway . By setting your port size too high you will lose a lot of punters who will take 512k ....as distinct from the guaranteed nothing at present.

Have Smart any ideas as to what will available at roughly what distance or at what Db levels failing that and how will this be phrased in the T&C once the service goes live. Will the 2Mb be a 1Mb minimum for example ?

What packages do you envisage selling and at what distances or Db levels .

Ta.

f1refox · 11-02-2005 10:35pm

Sponge Bob me thinks you work for opposition

Great question do.

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 10:41pm

Sponge Bob wrote:

Garfield.

Normal Irish exchanges can 'service' out to 5 miles or 8KM using POTS and are natonally distributed thus. Eircom DSL kit only does 4.5Km , leaving a large unserviced area on the exchange fringes. That is their 256k RADSL service which is "Up To 512k" in the T&C's but marketed as 512k .

90% or more of all DSL customers in Ireland have this 256k service.

BT offer higher speeds closer in, 1Mbit at 6km, and 512k only beyond that , albeit up to 10Km. Dunno what the real minimum is .

It would be refreshing in the Irish context to see a 'best effort' at the distance margins, say above 5km where the 2Mb service is unlkely to function , and where you have no competiton anyway . By setting your port size too high you will lose a lot of punters who will take 512k ....as distinct from the guaranteed nothing at present.

Have Smart any ideas as to what will available at roughly what distance or at what Db levels failing that and how will this be phrased in the T&C once the service goes live. Will the 2Mb be a 1Mb minimum for example ?

What packages do you envisage selling and at what distances or Db levels .

Ta.

SpongeBob,

This is going to be a really quick and high level answer to this question.

You're right. We do have the potential to address customers above and beyond other operators. What can we do for them? Off the top of my head we could put them in a seperate VLAN and manage them seperately, so that whilst there is less bandwidth available over the distance, we could still provide a sustainable and credible service.

One of the reasons I'm here is to start to think about these questions. Not just the questions that address the majority, but also those that address the minority, whether that minority is based on those that are disenfranchised or those that have different requirements (upload speeds for example, or static IP addresses).

On the subject of static IP addresses, what has people's experience been of dynamic DNS as a substitute? I used it all the time for connecting back to my home computer when I was on eircom's dynamic IP service.

Garfield.

Sponge Bob · 11-02-2005 10:43pm

me sez only that Smart will have guaranteed 100% of DSL customers more than 4.5Km from the xchange if they offer a package that works out there .

ADSL2+ 2Mb will not work beyond 5km but can do 256k at c. 8km .

Call it "Far Out" , you are the product manager non ?

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 10:48pm

Sponge Bob wrote:

me sez only that Smart will have guaranteed 100% of DSL customers more than 4.5Km from the xchange if they offer a package that works out there .

2Mb ADSL2+ will not work beyond 5km but can do 256k at c. 8km .

At that point (closer/ further based on copper quality, etc) if the customer reckons that 0.XMB for €35 a month (€11 effective with free line rental) is still a worthwhile service to them, then they can choose to take it. Same for customers within what is considered a reasonable radius but with 'poor' copper.

Not the 'product manager', I'm the programme manager.

Garfield.

Tony H · 11-02-2005 10:55pm

any idea of when COBH in co cork will be enabled by SMART for your BB service?

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 11:02pm

fitzdragon wrote:

any idea of when COBH in co cork will be enabled by SMART for your BB service?

Fitzdragon,

None, sorry. Smart's DSL rollout is based on operating our own infrastructure directly to the exchange. That means we service each exchange on fibre lit by our own electronics. That means we entirely control the customer experience. Not to be flippant, but to get Cobh on-net, we need either a MAN that can be connected to an ESB backhaul point, or an exchange close to an ESB backhaul point. I can look into it, but if we haven't identified Cobh already, unless we've made a huge mistake, your exchange isn't on a build programme for now. Sorry.

Garfield.

mad m · 11-02-2005 11:02pm

@GarfieldConnoll

I have been keeping a keen eye on this thread as well as your companys service.Im with Ntl contract now myself at moment but who wouldnt mind a 2MB line.Im still mulling it over.Im Terenure exchange so i qualify woo hoo!!

Take a break GarfieldConnoll its friday mate,enjoy weekend.

GarfieldConnoll · 11-02-2005 11:05pm

mad m wrote:

@GarfieldConnoll

I have been keeping a keen eye on this thread as well as your companys service.Im with Ntl contract now myself at moment but who wouldnt mind a 2meg line.Im still mulling it over.Im Terenure exchange so i qualify woo hoo!!

Take a break GarfieldConnoll its friday mate,enjoy weekend.

Point taken, I'm off to watch Threat Matrix.

Garfield.

halenger · 11-02-2005 11:35pm

GarfieldConnoll wrote:

On the subject of static IP addresses, what has people's experience been of dynamic DNS as a substitute? I used it all the time for connecting back to my home computer when I was on eircom's dynamic IP service.

Personally I'd prefer a static IP but providing an auto-updated dynamic DNS would be a very very good idea. My old router (now only used for extra capacity for the network/wireless) didn't directly support it and my auto-update programs simply never worked. My current main router does, however, support DynDNS and I've found it to be invaluable. It's by no means a static IP but at least it's a way to connect to my home systems from college/elsewhere even after a disconnection.

Blaster99 · 11-02-2005 11:49pm

So you have a set of exchanges that you can serve with existing fibre assets and you have some MAN's coming online in the future that can also hook up a few exchanges. What happens after that? End of roll-out or are you going to extend the fibre network to get greater coverage or are there other alternatives?

I incidently think you would be wise to offer a best-case service to as many as you can, particularly as your footprint looks to be quite limited based on the above so you may as well sell a service to as many as you can. Despite what Sponge Bob says there is very little evidence of Eircom doing ADSL at anything less than 450kbps so they are definitely not pushing the envelope. I'm at the outer radius of [Eircom] ADSL coverage from my exchange and I'm getting 53-54KB/s download speeds solid.

By the way, another thing to consider when it comes to your line tests is that it appears that an ADSL installation lowers the line quality so that Eircom's test fails. This is the case for me, for instance. Ever since I got ADSL installed my line has failed the test. It kinda tells you how messed up that test is. There are many other examples of people disconnecting their Sky boxes and/or wireless phones to pass the test and then plug them back in again and ADSL is happy as Larry.

Dr Bolouswki · 12-02-2005 2:23am

Can anyone anticipate/estimate what pings are likely on a service like this? I'm with IBB and the pings are up and down the whole time... a mate on NTL is consistantly sub 60ms..... will ADSL+2 likely give a good ping time? I gather its likely to be variable, but anyone know from the technology if pings are generally good?

OFDM · 12-02-2005 2:27am

GarfieldConnoll wrote:

we need either a MAN that can be connected to an ESB backhaul point, or an exchange close to an ESB backhaul point.

I assume this rules out the Balbriggan exchange (code: BRND) any time in the near future??

Smart employee happy to answer questions on bb rollout

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