Cork GAA Discussion Thread

slingerz · 23-01-2014 3:57pm

There is no right or wrong approach IMO. Only what works for the group of players currently at your disposal.

Clare are a young team and can train with that intensity for a period of time. But in a couple of years time they will need to vary their approach. Cody has done that with Kilkenny and reaped the benefits.

IMO I think Allen's approach, where the players enjoyed training is one that can work at a certain point in time as it improves the positivity in the camp and brings a renewed mental focus and approach.

The game is 95% mental in how you approach, prepare and play the game. This can be achieved in a number of ways and needs to be tailored to the group that you are dealing with.

shockframe · 23-01-2014 4:22pm

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

I saw Clare train last Tuesday week night the Hurlers ,in Limerick,for two solid hours from .A panel of around 35 that night,all the big names,Kelly,Donnellan ,Ryan ,with a lot of young potential stars like Flanagan,Duggan etc.

I have watched many teams train,and some at intercounty,are just piss balling about in terms of what they think is "Intensity".I have seen college teams train harder.
They fool no one but themselves.

Clare don't mess about.It is right from the start to the last.Even there warm up is intense .

People have this myth that any team can win an allreland by just getting lucky in the year.When you watch Clare train,or kilkenny in the past and the intensity they do it,it is far from a fluke.They may have lost a battle along the way,but they won the War.

John Allen said in last Tuesdays paper in an interview he lacked the ruthleness that some managers have ,and Limerick players emailed him thanks for "training was "fun ,begs belief.If I was any County Board,looking for a manager,that interview,would not inspire me to hire him.I made a point of going to watch Clare train,just to see there intensity.He claims he's records justify he's means.

A devalued Munster title in that two home games,beat a 14 man cork ,blown out the gate by Clare,lost a league final, they should have won.
He did win All ireland with Cork,we were expected to win but ,Cork remained static and never evolved in time and like Counihan lacked the ruthless streak to bring us to the next level in he's last years.Counihan was ruthless at the start and immense credit due for that ,he had no emotion with any of the players.Crucially,when he won the all ireland ,that changed though.

Watch Davy fitz and Jim Gavin this year.It is clean slate,reputations won't carry anyone .Like Cody,your are only as good as your last game.
Gavin laid it on the table ,play hurling your choice.I won't tell you or dicate what you choose ,thats up to you.But you ain't doing both.He had to do that for the greater good of he's team .

It is likely not one Clare lad thought training that night was fun and neither did Tony Kelly hardly thought running at 5.30 am last christmas was fun on he's own in Cratloe Woods, ,but walking of ,when the ,you can clear as day see their is an appreciation and a self containment,a feeling of goodness they know ,that at end of that session, they are much better prepared than they were at start ,and that makes them do it again and again,as the end justifys the means.After intense training of any kind you always feel you are stronger than anything else anyone else throws at you,you could conquer the world.

Getting an email thanking him for training was "fun,"sweet lord.I don't know which is worse,Allen for thinking it as a kind of "Accolade or notable achievement,or the limerick lads for doing it in the first place.
Training is not meant to be fun.Did they win the All ireland?No ,they never contary to the belief they were realistic contenders ,they never were never even close to it last year.

I know it sounds grand and courteous,but my view is it is a soft mentatilty.At the end of the day,they did not win an all ireland.Would Roy Keane thank a manager for training was fun or ,espiceally if they won a secondary competition,and as much as I love it,lets be honest a provincial title like a Munster one,is secondary to an All Ireland.An all Ireland is the Holy Grail.This is not kids level,it is Senior Intercounty,you must be ruthless in all honesty.

I'd sure Davy does not want emails or Cody ,he hardly prints them of ,and frames them,he looks at 26 celtic crosses getting handed out at a function for all ireland winners in december ,and like cody that is the thanks that means so much to him.

You can be ruthless and create a, one of us mentatily ,between manager and a group and everyone is together,and still be ruthless ,contary to Allens view,as the benefit of the team always comes first.

Davys attuitde is clare are a big family ,and everyone is together.Yes a player makes a mistake,no matter who he is,he gets told so in no uncertain terms ,and will get ten press up etc , and Davy he will do anything for he's panel,but at the same time ,like cody ,he is ruthless,in training and picking a team,and unlike allen who lets emotion get in the way,Davy has two emotions passion a fear not to give a 100 per cent.In the Clare training,he demands every last inch and gets that.

People have this myth that your dinosaur,or a Dictator, if your ruthless ,or a bad person.Not at all.This lark about having tolerance and goodness is important more so than winning ,i find it strange, and do not find a conflict interest in both together ,in that I do belief they can go hand in hand,and you must be ruthless to be constantly succesful.Allen said you need a "certain madness to be an intercounty manager".I don't see being ruthless as a madness,I see it as an unquinchable hunger and Desire and Raw Passion to be a winner and do what ever is needed within the rules to achieve that.That is something to admire ,not resent in a manager.

Surely a unity,and togetherness like Clare,the All blacks,Munster ,have tolerance,incluivsness and goodness within,yet make no mistake about it,are ruthless in the pursit of there ultimate aim.I don't that is wrong,in the win all mentality.As proved against Ireland,with the last play of the game,they want to win every game .

Now there is a line,taking enhancing performing drugs in sport like Lance Armstrong,is an example where ,tolerance,incluisveness,and goodess are values not present,and go out the window in hes win all menatity to achieve the goal.He crossed the line .And that I am totally opposed to,and always will be.That is a different kettle of fish.

Fr Bertie Troy,and Canon Michael O' Brien were two great Iconic managers,and ruthless when they need to be,but also were extremely good tolerant,men and very holy men,and brought tolerance and goodness to Cork teams but combined it with a ruthless,bloody minded streak to win.Fr.Troy ,was a gentleman,ask anyone with links to St.Colmans or Newtownshandrum or North Cork ,and had as much a deep love of people as he had for hurling,yet he was ruthless in the pursuit of glory.

When Cork won the two in a row,Troy realised one flaw,as great as Wexford were,Kilkenny would test Cork in a different way to win 3 in a row,such Troy was ruthless to change dramatically the way the 1978 team trained ,in that ,to beat kilkenny you had to keep the play,moving keep it at pace.It was not a case of don't change what is not broken,more change this or it will be broken.He had the foresight to realise this ,but the ruthless streak to dramatically change a winning team ,for the better of the team.
Cork under Allen ,unlike with Troy,did not evolve in there bid for 3 in a row,against Kilkenny,and suffered as a result,as that day we were far too predictable.Allen was not ruthless to change things,or drop Captain Pat Mulchay ,and worse still lef him get roasted by Aidan Fogary, who got 1-3,before the superb,Wayne Sherlock was used.
Sentiment and emotion ,and not ruthless to drop the captain who had struggled all year ,for a sub,who would have walked on any intercounty team in the country.

JBM, modelled Corks play in 99 on troys philopohsy to beat Kilkenny ,and even when you look at last year in thurles,JBM had Troys philosphy to beat kilkenny ,very much evident,the ball was played a pace,every time,the sliothar was kept moving,as Cork played fast ,open,direct hurling.The ball was never static,in one place,in that you see the "Sliothar Here and There "but seek it Everywhere".It never remained in the one place for very long,once Cork had possesion, in the blink of an eye ,and like the speed of a bullet it was gone.Kilkenny couldnt beat Cork because they never got enough ball.Simple really,but there was a ruthless streak to implement that game plan,away from the tried and trusted and to move outside the safety of the comfort zone,don't change whats not broken.

Cody on the field is different ,than he is off it.He is a winner.Monday he ,said was all about attuide.Every single game has a meaning and purpose with Cody,in that he has such expectations of each player every day,he always take something from it.
Players that excelled in there huge win,he will say ,I expect that ,in these games,any lad that didnt do it yesterday is on hes radar,and thats if they are lucky,they may not even get a luxury of another chance.

Clare on sunday , there young lads made a statement ,they want to be on the team,and they had a huge intensity,so much Tj Ryan was complaining about the tackling of Clare.Davy was bang on the money,welcome to the big time.People think davy is making noise again hes not.He is talking straight.Tj wanted ,respect for the team,you earn respect.I'm suprised O grady allowed TJ,says those things,thats a huge worry for limerick,TJ very much the one in control of the team,if that happens and O Grady in the backseat.

TJ Ryan 1st game ,and he makes headlines for the wrong reasons.Man up ,in fairness.That what Limerick have to face ,in most games.AS cork did ,and Harnedy showed if the ref doesnt protect you you protect yourself,and you actually earn the respect of the opponent ,rather than cry wolf after.
Cork and clare were tough,and the replay wasnt cynical,and both teams gave as good as they got.I was a huge fan of Tj Ryan as a player,but he was hardly an angel himself now ,and played well on the edge,and protected himself ,he should tell hes lads who are well able to take care of themselves to do the same.

But anyone want to see what down to earth,salt of the earth,geuine man he Cody is,watch hes interview with Gay Byrne,"the Meaning OF Life" a must see for anyone, and he holds the same values in life and is a good ,good man,and knows right from wrong,but on the field,doesnt hold back,or is not afraid to drop guys ,as he wants to win.

JBM is a gentleman,but as proven with Cusack,Coleman,Gardiner and many more through hes tereune even in 1997,etc for a gentleman and such a charismistic man ,he is ruthless.

The Legendary Micko Dwyer is a lovely man with the same values Allen and rightfully so holds,but he was ruthless,watch him on the side line during many a game.

Interestingly,and every year Munster Rubgy,quailfy for the knockouts,there be it ,with O'Gara,Mick Galwaey,Jim Willams,you name them,different names come and go,but one common ,undeniable demoniator is,they all say we are Friends at Munster ,we play for each other.

Yet such a family unity,tolerance,and inclusivness within the Group from Management to the players,at training they push the limits of everyone ,and after any woeful Munster performance,in there world renowned Truth and Honesty sessions,they dont hold any barrels back,and if anyone is not doing what is expected,they are told so,in no uncertain terms and with words you probably would not find in a dictionary.

No one Munster player,takes it as an insult or you are a Dictator ,in fact it is taken an insult ,if you are not honest ,as to be a Munster player ,you Must be honest to yourself ,and then to the group.At training they go so hard,scraps have taken place,yet soon as training is over,its friends again,in truth they were never enemies,all they are is ruthless to push every button within to be a success.Training is not fun ,any time I watched them at Ul.

I know Allen means well,when he said he found it hard to drop a player etc.But at the end of the day,you know that is part and parcel of a job when you take it.The one basic common concept that has not changed over time ,is you can only pick 15 to start.This nothing new to the game.The length of the game ,the rules changed,but for practially all it's life span,it has been 15 players,so it is Enevitable players ,are dissapointed if they don't play.When a player is not dissapointed for not playing ,it is a bad sign.I cant understand why managers complain they have to drop players.They know this is inevitable from day one.If they have such a problem,don't go in to management.

Munster dropped Paul O Connell,Mr Munster Ruby,to Munster,what Christy Ring is to Hurling,what Shefflin is to Kilkenny ,yet it was done purely with emotion taken out of the equation,as Munster to evolve ,and to have a new leader,gave it to Peter O'Mahony ,as Munster keep getting year on year out of there group,and beating the odds,as they evolve ,for the greater good of the team.It is no coincendce he got two crucial tries ,at vital times the last two weekends ,when leadership was needed from a captain.He has and continued to grow.That happened only cause Munster were Ruthless to allow him that opportunity.Did that mean there was no tolerance goodnesswithin ,?,no I doubt it,to hear Paul o Connell interviewed afterwards ,these values were still present and very much so within Munster Rubgy .

O'Connell had a reputation,in Munster second to none,up there with the best,yet , he's captaincy was taken away.That may seem harsh but it is not that bad,when it is for the good of the team,and the end justifes the means.

I will say fair play to Allen for saying he is not ruthless to go back in to intercounty management.I do respect the honesty.

Allen is a gent, a lovely man ,a love for the game and as nice as you could get ,and one of Lifes Good Ones, but I always said he wasnt tactially that good and compared to others,was not ruthless,and always more of a facillator .He is ideal to be part of something but as a Leader ,he lacks that edge .At the end of the day the manager picks the team.

You must have that edge to push players out of comfort zones.Mickey Harte is a gentleman,sees only good in life,and the poor man has had he's fair share of tragedys,yet on the field of play he is ruthless as a manager.Sean Boylan was a ruthless manager,but a man full of tolerance,incluisveness.

Davy is a ferioucous competitor and gives tough love ,but at the same time when he had to he brought the team in to he's home after the Cork game in June ,and gave them what they needed.Did they give him a box of choclates or a thank you card.No but when he asked for a hundred and ten per cent at training,they gave davy that and much more at training and in games.The biggest gratiude of all.There is a goodness in Davy deep down, and a loyalty to people behind the persona he sets.He just has goals,and he will be ruthless to achieve them.I dont see a problem with a win all mentality.You don't ask at the top level,you must demand and expect high standards.When Conlon was injured in june in the cork game,he went to hospital to him.He was the one that said independent doctors should ,make the call on concussion,not team doctors,as it takes away the emotion in the decision.In rubgy,there is quite a lot of professional managers not or dont want to address concussion.See ,davys win all mentailty never crosses the bounds of player safety .Davys bond with hes team is inhibited by tolerance,goodness,and is not dictaorship ,like Codys in kilkenny.

He is a win all cost purely in the team and game itself,but he knows the boundary too.On the field and in training,he gets every last inch out of he's team,and thats what you want.

What did not suprise me last week is Clares organisition at every drill in training,and it was varied ,and it kept a freshness mentally and physically with them.

A range of ball work,speed,resistance,tackling,you name it,it was done.Davy is the coil,in which that team revolves around,but crucially he steps back,and allows O'Connor and Kinnerk ,Mulqueen do their roles,never intefers,but ready to step in for hes role.Wonderful organisiton in management ,as no waiting after a drill,and what next,they all know what to do,when to do it,and there is a speed and cohesion to what they do,many intercounty teams at various levels train at a snails pace when you compare it to kilkenny and Clare.Cork last year training was I am glad to say up to standard ,senior hurling wise.

He doesnt micro manage he's set up,as he trusts and knows there up to the mark.He wouldnt have them invlolved otherwise.Davy is not the Dictator he is made out to be ,he knows when and where hes place is needed.He is the main man without a doubt,but he doesn't control or try to conrol he's coaches.He trusts them.Far from a dictator ,or is Jim Gavin .Gavin ,coming from the Air Corps,is bound to be strong,and is resoulte,and makes hard calls ,he is far from a Dictator though.

Anyone that thinks Clare will fade away,is in for a big shock,even if they do not win 2 in a row,there is another all ireland in them.Clare are a credit to watch ,and unlike other county teams in the past wont drink,or believe they are better than they are,wont do social media,and when they do talk to the media,they know the bounds not to cross,and i'm sure they will be hand picked in who can do that.Certain players,play the media like a fiddle,others can get played by some.There is an attention to detail in the set up,hardly a Dictaorship .

You see soccer so called stars on twitter,unlikely you would see Clare ,or Munster on it.Phil Mickleson says Mcllroy has to stay away from social media to improve he's game.
He is right in what he said.
What a laugh,though ,Clare and kilkenny, were never on it in the first place ,Ameteaurs behaving like professionals,yet a professional behaving like an ameteaur.No distractions.

The lads on the team have to be better to hold a place,the subs better than the starting 15,and anyone wanting to make the panel equally as good,like kilkenny were and Dublin are sure to be at the football.That is always the case of any champion wanting to retain its crown.

Cork can't be as good as last year and expect to win,we wont even be competitve if we stay at that same level, and to win we must find another level ,and improve further,as kilkenny and Clare will improve,have no doubt.Kilkenny and Clare will be ruthless in that pursuit ,and that is a Great Quailty to behold,I believe.

Cork have no had no option but to clean out last year panel ,and to do that must be ruthless and a Win All Mentailty.We are playing catch up as it is,the first and foremost thing we must do is match there attuide for a start.The hurling panel,like the league fooball to be announced in a week ,will indicate how ruthless both management teams are ,in dropping certain players,and making the hard calls.Any manager shouldnt take it personally ,and most dont ,when they drop lads or dont pict them ,it is a fundamental part of management .Cuthbhert said he will be ruthless,next week will tell.He has failed once already in that when Jbm wanted the hurlers ,he was not ruthless like Jim Gavin to say no or make a choice.

Jbm ommission of two high profile players yesterday still young ,is good in that he is like Davy and Cody willing to make hard calls for the greater good of the team.It doesnt mean that being ruthless is a sign of Dictorship,or hes team doesnt hold ,tolerance etc, as anyone that knows the cork squad,knows that tolerance and inclusivity and spirit and a family spirit is within that squad and has been part of any team within JBM,yet Jbm is no dictator ,but he is Ruthless.And from what I saw ,last year ,Corks training is intense and far from fun,Paudie Sul said it was the toughest he ever done under Matthews.Thats good.There is a savage intensity but a great blend of hurling skills.Hurling can and should be fun and that freedom of spirit resembles our style of play.They hurl for the love of it.When there training though the intensity isnt fun.Id be very worried if it was.

People say at a glance Allen and JBM,are simlar in nature,they are both mild mannered,timid,soft spoken and intelligent.That is true,but the huge difference with JBM,he is ruthless when he needs to be.
And above any myth that is portyrayed,you must be ruthless in intercounty management for constant success.

Best to ease up on the John Allen bashing there seriously.

thinkstoomuch1 · 23-01-2014 4:38pm

CORK HURLING PANEL TO PLAY UCC ON SATURDAY 23/01/2014
The Cork panel to play UCC in the Canon O'Brien Cup challenge game on Saturday at 12 noon at the Mardyke is as follows:

1. Anthony Nash (Kanturk)
2. Shane O'Neill (Bishopstown)
3. Stephen McDonnell (Glen Rovers)
4. Kilian Murphy (Erin's Own)
5. Eoin Keane (St. Finbarr's)
6. Mark Ellis (Millstreet)
7. William Egan (Kilbrin)
8. Paul Haughney (Midleton)
9. Lorcán McLoughlin (Kanturk)
10. Brian Lawton (Castlemartyr)
11. Cian McCarthy (Sarsfields)
12. Michael O'Sullivan (Tracton)
13. Stephen Moylan (Douglas)
14. Patrick Horgan (Glen Rovers)
15. Jamie Coughlan (Newtownshandrum)
16. Stephen Nyhan (Courcey Rovers)
17. Stephen White (Ballygarvan)
18. Christopher Joyce (Na Piarsaigh)
19. Daniel Kearney (Sarsfields)
20. Michael Cahalane (Bandon)
21. Luke O'Farrell (Midleton)

thinkstoomuch1 · 23-01-2014 4:44pm

shockframe wrote: »

Best to ease up on the John Allen bashing there seriously.

Ah stop the lights.It is not a bashing.Many people give views on any thread,my view is purely as a hurling manager.Nothing personal here I said.He said he wasnt ruthless ,and I made a point ,you can be ruthless and holds all the values he mentioned and other managers are ruthless and can hold the values he mentioned.Just giving another side of the argument.

Fans like a poster said on the waterford thread are entitled to give views ,once it is on hurling ,on players and managers in the game.

Seriously,part and parcel of the game.

closeline · 23-01-2014 7:43pm

I did find that John Allen piece very strange. Not what you expect from an inter county manager and certainly a factor in Limerick flopping in the semi final.

thinkstoomuch1 · 23-01-2014 10:55pm

Cork minors hurlers had a good challenge game against ardscoil harty cup team tonight ,won around 3-14 to 13 points.

closeline · 23-01-2014 11:31pm

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Sorry ,for late reply,just saw that now.

Yeah it was the main ptich .They had mcgrath cup sunday,cork minor hurlers v rochestown monday night,hamilton and dungarvan that day in harty cup,that night cork u21 v tralee,i believe there was too munster b and c games there today,cork minors play ard scoil tommorw in hurling(not sure but I doubt ard scoil will play on the other ptich as they have I believe a few injuries ,and dont want more with a huge harty cup semifinal in mallow on the 1st.,so they want the main one I would think.

That is a lot of games on the main ptich.It held up well though.The ground staff do an amazing job there.

That is grand to say. It will be fine now with ok weather. However, this will tell as time goes on. Doesn't matter what ground staff you have or weather it wont last. I think it might have been last summer where the pitch was in an awful state. Only a matter of time for that to happen again.

thinkstoomuch1 · 23-01-2014 11:37pm

closeline wrote: »

That is grand to say. It will be fine now with ok weather. However, this will tell as time goes on. Doesn't matter what ground staff you have or weather it wont last. I think it might have been last summer where the pitch was in an awful state. Only a matter of time for that to happen again.

Its a fair point ,and its gets so many games its bound to tell .

Horse84 · 24-01-2014 10:17am

Article here suggesting underage hurling structures in the county are slowly improving
http://punditarena.com/2014/01/23/cork-hurling-underage-structures-improving/

thinkstoomuch1 · 24-01-2014 11:28am

Horse84 wrote: »

Article here suggesting underage hurling structures in the county are slowly improving
http://punditarena.com/2014/01/23/cork-hurling-underage-structures-improving/

A good read but I don't think it tells us anything that donal o grady didnt say in hes good articles last year on schools problems.

Im always amazed when people try to complicate a problem that doesnt exist.Winning at minor and u21 isnt straighforward.

I dont buy that,its not very straightforward. to win at minor.Again like every article I have read mentions,urban population,talent,money ,but no one has yet mentioned coaching how young coaches must be developed,and how as times proved,coaches with good records are being overlooked for lads with no records.

Nothing changed in the blink of an eye with cork u21 football from 2003 to 2004 when we became a huge force at u21.That team had even lost some of the minor all ireland winning team,yet we had tony leahy and cleary,and it made a huge impact.

I saw the cork minors last night play a full strength harty cup ard scoil and win 3-14 to 0-13,our
r second string side,as a lot were rested,or injured,or harty cup,yet the talent was superb.

From going to a lot of games,there is no huge difference in talent to last and this year,bar michael cahalane and horgan made us stronger talent wise,but this team has a serious chance as they are the best prepared set up I saw in years.

Honestly,from warm up,to warm down,to style of play ,they are four months in ,but have a lot of great work done.

Landers and ring and o dywer etc are doing a super job.If its not this year ,i do believe this set up before the 2 year is up,will win an all ireland.
A lot of last nights team are eligble next year once they dont reduce the age limit to below 17 at minor.

Horse84 · 24-01-2014 1:59pm

Interesting seminar on at rochestown park Monday night, jbm, Kingston, Nash and a few others speaking. If I'm around I might go.
http://www.eveningecho.ie/2014/01/24/cork-hurlers-will-offer-insight-training-preparation/

thinkstoomuch1 · 24-01-2014 2:19pm

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/rebel-ogs-app-liance-of-science-to-eradicate-burnout-in-players-256404.html
A great idea,fair play to all involved.

It is just a shame that with the all science being used,common sense goes totally out the window when it comes dual stars at senior level in that burnout is a major factor at senior and dualism at senior increases that.

thinkstoomuch1 · 24-01-2014 2:31pm

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/criost-ri-may-act-after-refs-card-error-256406.html

Chriost ri are appealing the game with Dingle over the black card.I didn't think it had a huge bearing,but reading today there was still time left,and what makes it worse is how in name of jesus,a linesman that is on the kerry background team with Eammon fitzmaurice at senior ,where fitzmurice was the Dingle manager Wednesday was allowed officate as a linesman in the same game.

Ephie was right to complain ,and I hope they get a replay.The other linesman was a kerry man also.

thinkstoomuch1 · 24-01-2014 3:15pm

Hamilton beat templemore in theMunster B football,through to the semi final,with most of the hurling team.
What a week for them.James Mccarthy ,Haven has been doing coaching there.,super coach.

thinkstoomuch1 · 24-01-2014 9:36pm

That is a good team for Saturday ,bar Mcdonnell at full back,but while in truthJBM, did not have much options he still had two.Mcdonnell for all he's hurling is not a full back,good enough to start for Cork anywhere from 2 to 9 bar 6 and 3.
He lacks a presence for a central position as the main man to command an aera and command others.He has pace,hurling,and a super athlete he can play anywhere else.

Colm Spillane I hope starts ,with UCC,and it will be a good a test on Patrick horgan.Anyone wants to how good full back is at any level and how the basic concepts of it are required and needed even at school level,in that while its a level below,the fundamentals apply ,brave,honest,good under the high ball and a full back that plays the aera first and foremost and then the ball.

Barry Fitzpatrick Ard scoil,Kevin Daly Dungarvan ,and Michael Mcsweeney of Hamilton are all strong,fine solid men ,and full backs by nature at schools.Mcsweeney and Daly gave an exibhition of full back play in the Harty Cup,both making vital blocks and putting there body on the line time and again,and plucking ball after ball out of the rky,and then made long raking clearances up field.They showed why a full back is the cornerstone of any team at any level thats wants to win.

Rochestown have John Cashman,Doon have Tom hayes,similar players.

My point is even at schools you must have solid reliable full backs.
Intercounty senior hurling at the elite level is the highest level,so if a natural 3 is fundamental in schools,it has to be at Senior.
All the schools full backs I mentioned,stand firm,don't allow the man beat them ,and protect there goal.That is there instinct,and they have been coached this from a young age.

Mcdonnell has not been a fullback.He was midfield as a minor.
Yes you can convert some players to that role.The Rock was a half forward ,on the Mideltown CBS Harty Cup team,95 I think,he was strong under the high ball and hardy.
Mclirney of Clare was the same.
They were converted ,from ballwinning forwards to full back,as the quailtes they had as forwards were similar to what you needed at 3.They werent free scoring forwards.
Mcdonnell as shown before and in the semifinal against Dublin doesnt stand tall and upright if he is taken on and is exposed for goals ,and is not dominant under high ball,and is too much like Shane O Neill,and Brian Murphy ,a super hurler with too much hurling and not enough discpline or organistion for a 3.

Eoin Keane a great talent at underage ,and Mark Ellis are better options ,i would feel for there saturday.Yes there is reservations with both but at least it something new.We know what Mcdonnell brings ,and does not bring to the table.

He will be made look poorer than what he is at 3.He may survive on Saturday,depending who is on him ,but others will cause him bother.
Lehane if he starts there for UCC ,would actually suit Mcdonnell,in that he is super fast and has hurling to mark lehane.Lehane isnt an orthdox full forward .

Seamus Harnedy is unlikey to play ,if he did would have been a great test of mcdonnell,the type he is not suited to.Dan Mccormack may trouble him.Bud Hartnett will suit he's style.

Keane is brave,hard ,tough,and only for a bad injury would have rattled it but it remains to be seen how that set him back.He deserves a chance,but at 3 and it is interestingy if he is a centre back.
Him and Ellis are better options than Mcdonnell or Cadogan or Cahalane .

Like I said last year,it is impossible to win an All Ireland without a Natural 3.Yes we came close ,but were brutally exposed in the replay.The warning signs were there all year ,Clare were the only ones ruthless to attack that aera.
No Cork team in the last 40 years won an All Ireland with out a formidable presence at 3.

Corner backs,are fine Shane O Neill ,and Killan Murphy wont let the side down(very good in knowlan park).Murphy is top quailty,may not start in May,but that is not a reflection on him,he is up against top top corner backs,we can only play 2.
Half back line is not great .Ellis and Keane ,could be exposed.Are they better than Joyce at 6,no they are not.The worry so early now,is they don't see joyce as a centre back.Eliis does not have the pace for a wing back,yes he could get away with that at centre back,but he doesn't have the speed of hurling for that posistion.
.
Egan needs to find he's form,the talent is there.He needs consistency.What is strange,is the best half back in Cork at club last year,worth a go at 3,is not even on the Cork panel,in Jamie Nagle
.
Stephen White has been around since 2008,is brave,honest etc,but we know what he brings and does not.
Lacks the speed of Hurling against faster teams like Clare and Kilkenny,and hits poor clearances at times.He has aggression and bite ,but Nagle has those attriubtes in abundance but way more hurling.

Willam Egan got sent off during the week in Dublin,and is not at a crucial cross roads in he's career with Cork,in that potential and talent is not enough for a player in he's 4th year on the Senior stage,he must start delivering constantly good performances,which he has the talent to do so .As that famous line from the poem,Invictus states

"I am the master of my fate",
that applies to Egan with Cork.
Midfield ,is Lorchan and Haughney.Lorcan is fine for Saturday but isnt a partner for Kearney later on.Kearney is certain to start in May.
Haughney,has super hands,wristy like a flyweight in boxing,and hasunreal hurling.

Has he the bite,aggression,doggness,and steel for Galvin of Clare or Lester Ryan of Kilkenny is the question.???Give him he's chance and we will see.

That remains to be seen and Rob O Shea if UCC ,play him there who I rate,and has a bit of cut about him ,is a good test for him.O Shea with Coughlan and the sub Sugrue were the pick of cork at u21 tead last year against Tipp.

Lawton deserves a chance.
Cian Mac, I would not start him.What can he tell us that we do not already know.He is fine in heavy ground,dry fast ground ,not mobile or fast enough,at best a 20 min sub,howerver a better sub than what we had last year.

Michael Sullivan,im a huge fan,super strength,good in the air,a worker,grafter and a super engine ,he never got a sustained run of games,give him a few and judge him then.Would have been an option last year before Walsh,Cahalane came in the picture ,but now not a starting half forward as the lads ahead of him,with Harnedy can score,he can be erratic,but I would love to see him at midfield,could be the perfect foil for the attacking Kearney.And he is brave and gutsy,loves the rough and rumble.Done very well against Noel Mcgrath,2011 u21 and against Limerick in the epic final.

Coughlan is a super player and suited to the modern game ,with a full league be unreal for Cork ,but not a corner forward,better at half,but serious competiton there and thats good.A great bite and cut to him.
Hogsy unreal,needs to play like last year,and he will be fine.
Moylan super as a sub in the all ireland final,a replicate of Paudie Sul,bags of hurling,brave and knows where the goals are.

A good team,we dont know what UCC will start,with a game against Clare on Sunday ,and they start the defence of there Fitzgibbon cup ,on Thursday,but im hoping for a big test,but that is unlike to happen ,and Cork should win .Impossible to say for certain what they may start and that will decide the winning margin.

It is impossible to preview the game ,with any accuracy as to do so in any game you must analayse the strength and weakness of your opponent.That opponent UCC, team could start two different teams such is the pick they have.

Only two forwards are in the subs with Cork,Michael Cahalane and Luke O Farell.I can't wait to see Cahalane in a Cork shirt ,im suprised with a Harty Cup Semi final a week later he is there.I pray to god he does not get injured absoultey vital for Hamilton against Ard Scoil in the Harty Cup semifinal.They are far from a one man team,but Cahalane is there main man,in that he has played schools senior for Hamiliton be it in A or B competitions and he has a wealth of expierence that is vital to them as Ard Scoil have huge expierence in there squad.

I would hope ,he just gets ten minutes and no more,an introduction more or less.He played at such an intensity Wednesday and he then played I think in the Munster B ,in Hamilon super win against Templemore ,he hardly needs 3 games in 4 days,with a Harty game next week,the biggest game in the School History.Fair play to there win today,James Mccarthy done coaching with them,it helped.

Speaking of Ard Scoil they played a very good,great workout for both teams ,against the Cork Minors last night on a cold damp eveining.They had all the big guns,Morey,Galvin,O Hallorhan,,Mike Casey corner back senior Na Piarsaigh v Portumna soon, and Clare likey u21 Barry Fitzpatrick etc.

There taking the Harty game with Hamitlon seriously,as from what I could tell, I think,English,O Brien and Brown were there.

Cork had a lot of the 45 panel missing for various reasons,club games ,etc but gave great account of themselves,won around 3-16 to 13 points in a great game.Ard Scoil have an eye on the Harty Cup,but they will be happy with the workout.

Biliy Dunne was maganifcent .2-1,a joy to behold with Eoghan Kinery superb. from play,won loads of clean aerial ball ,and strong running ,and like I said 4 months ago ,when I saw him at the u17 All Ireland,this guy from killeagh St Itas is a serious ,prospect,loads of hurling,similar to Seamus Harnedy,the way he plays..He scored some lovely points.He is strong,fast ,mobile,works so hard and is very brave.

Darren Casey was superb ,like he was against Doon last week in the Harty cup at midfield,and Browne on both the football panel as well,had a great game.Diramuid Buckley at left half back,was very good,and got a good goal also.

This was a Cork team with loads missing yet the hurling and touch in heavy rain was super ,and this team played super intelligent hurling.We have lovely hurlers and always had in Cork .We have an abundance of super goalkeepers at all levels.Dalton was superb,and Patrick Collins u21 keeper last year is minor this year also and probably the starting keeper,but Dalton is some keeper.

Like I said ,Cork with Ring and Landers would be superbly trained and a serious team.They are that ,and when a lot of other come back ,they have the makings of a very good side.There is some super talent at cork at underage.A lot of lads that played tonight are underage next year once they dont change the age limit at minor,and whatever happens this year,I am extremely confident Landers and Ring will deliver an All ireland Minor to Cork before there term is up.You see unlike other teams where you hope they do well,this set up ,I have a belief ,and confidence in the set up,because as a whole ,with management and talent availble ,it is as good as anything else where in the Country.

I have seen Limerick minors train many times with Wallis and Cregan ,and saw them in challenge matches,particulary against Mary 1,where they annilhated them .They are a serious test away from home for Cork,and have around 10 of last years team,should we meet in the semifinal,but I have seen nothing between both squads to suggest Cork can't win ,or Limerick are ahead of us in preparation.
They cut there panel last week I believe.If that game materilases between the Treaty and Rebel County,it is a Must see for any Hurling fan,as it has the makings of a thriller.Watching young lads play,there is always a freedom of spirit an elgance to their play.

The Cork Minor team is just 4 months in but have done super work ,and they will get better.A tough job to cut that panel to around 30 or whatever they decide ,when it is done next week as they are some talent on that panel,and its hard to predict what it will be.

That team was missing a load,yet the hurling touch ,and speed of play was good,as was the cohesion and understanding and team play amongst them.

TheBigGreen · 24-01-2014 10:56pm

Cork footballers playing Dublin tomorrow on a challenge match, somewhere in Dublin I think.

thinkstoomuch1 · 24-01-2014 11:00pm

TheBigGreen wrote: »

Cork footballers playing Dublin tomorrow on a challenge match, somewhere in Dublin I think.

Yeah there is a load on ,at the moment.U21 team play Galway in LIT,minors played Beara tonight .

A lot of cork teams tommorrow with Youghal and Clyda and Cork hurlers.No shortage of games .

Horse84 · 25-01-2014 10:27am

It's been confirmed that the rock will be in charge if cork u-16 hurlers this year with ger Cunningham as has already been said taking the u-15's. Both very good appointments there.

Rebel Og Academy 2014 Appointments

The Rebel Og Academy, which oversees programmes for Cork GAA Development squads and regional panels from U13 to U17, incorporating an extensive development programme for all youth players in Cork, is pleased to announce the following appointments.
Three-time All Ireland winner Diarmuid O’Sullivan of Cloyne has been ratified as the Cork U16 hurling manager for 2014. Having served Cork with distinction from his debut in 1997 to his final appearance with Cork in 2008, his experience at all levels will be of huge benefit to the young players under his care. Former Cork Senior and current Midleton CBS coach Ronan Dwane of Aghada will also be involved.
Meanwhile, former Cork football captain Derek Kavanagh, a key member of Conor Counihan’s All Ireland football winning side in 2010 has been appointed as manager of the Cork U15 footballers for 2014. A winner of eight county titles with the famed Nemo Rangers, he is expected to bring a wealth of knowledge to the programme.
Also, former Cork hurling legend Ger Cunningham of St. Finbarr’s, has come on board as U15 hurling manager for the coming season. A three-time All Ireland and four-time All Star winner, he comes with extensive inter-county sideline experience also and will oversee a group of emerging coaches, who will take charge of the Tony Forrestal winners from 2013. These include Noel Furlong of Carrigtwohill and Declan Fitzgerald of Buttevant, who are also currently coaching the UCC and UL Fresher hurling teams, respectively.
There are a number of appointments yet to finalised. These are Under 16 football and at Under 14 level. The full list of squad mentors will be announced at the official launch of the year’s programme at the Mardyke Arena on February 5th next.
Finally, appointments are also being made at U17 in both football and hurling, with both squads now operating under the respective Minor inter-county team managements.

zetecescort · 25-01-2014 10:59am

Success not a certainty but good to see former players with experience of winning All Irelands and the demands of modern GAA involved.

Horse84 · 25-01-2014 11:44am

Ucc team today

willietherock · 25-01-2014 12:04pm

Whats the story with Shane O Donnell?

webels · 25-01-2014 2:49pm

Cork 2:19 ucc 1:14 (moylan got corks first goal horgan 2nd)

North Cork Star · 25-01-2014 4:14pm

Good outing today by both Cork Hurlers and UCC!
Players to watch out for throughout the spring: Paul Haughney midfield, hurled very well and scored 3 nice points. Eoin Keane, hurled well in the half backline, could get himself out of trouble easily when in possession. Michael O'Sullivan, then hurled very well, worked tirelessly and set up scores, win frees as well as scoring two points himself. Rob O'Shea, Colm Spillane, Daniel Roche, Barry Lawton and Brian Murray also hurled a fair share of ball throughout the game.

Horse84 · 25-01-2014 4:32pm

A good outing is right. It was never going to be a shootout with that wind there, some unreal gusts there at times.
I'd be very slow to over analyse today at all but what was said above with the players named if agree with. Who was very effective today from the word go was cian mac. Caught and broke the world of ball and had a very good player in paudi pender in trouble. Took some nice points in the second half and and generally made the right choice in possession. Showed good encouragement to mickey sull and and Lawton outside him which was very good to see. Jimmy made a point of going out to him when he called him ashore late on and congratulating him.That said, I'd expect him to do well in that heavy ground. His hurling was never in question but he just doesn't have the mobility on hard fast ground. Still an option off the bench for me.

Very impressed with haughney today finished the game stronger than he started it and got some lovely scores. He's def put his hand up. Mickey sull likewise, seems to be able to have that ability to break a tackle and is a good direct runner, caused the ucc defence a lot of trouble late on, he did well and with Harnedy and Cronin possibly missing for the limerick game, he's an option.

A word on eoin Keane lastly, I'll admit, I haven't seen a whole pile of the guy before today at all. At first I thought he started the game very well, big strong lad, not afraid of it and dealt well with rob o Shea early on but I dunno does he just look out of place at wing back maybe? Where's his natural position for Finbarr's? His recovery speed seems to be poor on first viewing but that's only on first viewing.

One final thing does someone know who the last 2 subs were, 23 and 24 not on the team sheet,I didn't catch the announcer.

zetecescort · 25-01-2014 5:52pm

Best of luck to Youghal and Clyda Rovers tomorrow. Would be great to have both in Croke Park in two weeks time.

zetecescort · 25-01-2014 5:57pm

Have just seen on facebook that the Youghal game is off

thinkstoomuch1 · 25-01-2014 10:04pm

A good win today for Cork hurlers ,in truth never any doubt,and UCC understandably didnt play Lehane,Harnedy ,Prendergast,Bud etc.

Mcdonnell did not start and was not a big loss ,at full,shane o neill went there,and again like in the replayed all ireland final,and against Galway in the league,he is not good under the high ball,and was badly at fault of a super goal by Griffin,o neill mistimed hes move for the ball.

Colm spillane I thought well for UCC ,has aggression ,and is fast and he showed why he must get games in the league,and good under the high ball.

Eoin keane was very good,tough ,and teak,and you can only go around him,not through him,hence no way,like I said yesterday he is a half back.He would be absoultely roasted by ,damien hayes ,John O Dywer ,Tonly Kelly,etc on a dry day at half back.Hpn heavy going he struggled at times.As a full back he is worth a go,as he will give you a physical prescence ,and is good in the air-brave ,and has undestanding of full back play and he has a lack of pace,but with two fast corner backs he wont be as exposed,and would give us a physical prescence.
Is he the answer at 3,needs more games but him and spillane are better long term options than wasting time on cadogan and cahalane.
.

I would start him or spillane at 3 for limerick.The rock never had great pace,but had a good reading of the game,keane has that.Only for injury,he would be a starter.Can he get that form back?time will tell,today he done enough to get more game,but not as a half back.

Ellis is the same, at full back if anywhere is the place to play him,but like I said not as good as keane in potential.

Haugney,by god,some hands,blessed by the lord jesus,lightening fast and 3 good points ,done what was expected,but with the greatest respect,murray and roche who played under age for cork,and who wouldnt be known for steel,or toughness,didnt test him in that regard and he remains to be tested,against tough,steel players,and I would start him against limerick,and hopefully limerick will show us plenty of timber and it will test us,he done all that was asked of today ,but want to see him against better men.Hurling isnt a doubt,attuide,i want to see,and a steely resolve.
cian mac did do very well,but I said that last night ,he would.If every day was like today he would be an automatic starter,but it wont,and in a scorching thurles or croke park ,he wont have the pace for clare or most teams.As a sub,maybee,but he is unlikely to last a fast flowing ,high tempo game.Todays pace was slower and he thrived as he has and always had plenty of hurling.

O shea at half forward,very good and was tough ,and relishes the tough stuff.For me he must get a chance at midfield,haughney 3 points gets him the start for limerick,but o shea is a good sub.He is an intelligent hurler and moves the ball fast .

I said I rate Michael sul,and today showed why.He is tough,fast,some engine ,brave and can win aeral ball,but is sturdy in ,that he is strong as an ox.

If harnedy is out for limerick,start him at half forward,but he is not a realistic half forward in may,as lehane,harnedy,walsh,cahalane are all better in they do everything he does,but they score which he cant.

But when harnedy is fit,he with o shea,and haugney are options at midfield.Sullivan is consistent,he always gives a hundred per cent ,and has super stamina,and it begs belief and I said it many a time,how cussen and naughton were used ahead of him last year .
He has it for intercounty.I don't rate guys and say they are good unless they are good,and he is good.

Horgan got a super goaland lead the attack well.Today he showed a good attuide.
Moylan like I said will get goals,and that was a great reaction goal.
We have depth we didnt have last year up front.Thats great as the starting 6 have to play better than last year to stast,subs better than the starting 6 to start.Thats good for cork.Lawton done very good

A good workout,and I heard ,not confirmed yet,we have a challenge match next weekend then Limerick in two weeks.

Joyce done okay ,at corner back which is not.
My team for limerick
Nash .o neill,keane,sul or brian murphy or killan or mcdonnell(all are fine)

Mcloughlin,joyce Egan (or spillane)

Kearney ,haughney (if not up to it ,o shea as sub )

Lehane,Sullivan(if harnedy is out)Walsh

Moylan ,Cronin(keep mccarthy honest)horgan

Tommorrow is a huge day for Clyda ,and fitzgerald is a huge loss,but the weather is hail stones,and heavy rain,and as the west is notourious for,a gale force wind may be there.
That will suit clyda down to the ground.,as they dont have any ,not even one marquee forward ,that can get five or six points from play,that all teams have ,but they are a team,and every player is essential to them.It is the sum of the parts that get them there winning total.

For that to happen,clyda must keep kilteragh to below 13 points or so as they wont win a shoout ,and despite the critics cant play open football,if they do,they will be beaten out the gate.English knows that,and he will play to there strengths and win or loose they wont leave anything on that field.
O shea,carey,kissane,hanlon,buckley(struggling with an injury,heavy conditions will test him)mullanes all have to and I believe they will,have big games,and the blanket 12 man defence with heavy wintry conditions will suit them,and kissane will love that,and hes endurance,strength and stamina,where he wont be exposed for a lack of pace in days like that ,will give them a great chance.

Numbers mean nothing tommorrow,as clyda will have 12 backs,and kissane drive and energy is key ,and if clyda win,expect him to get a point.

Clyda have to keep this low scoring,and unlike against miltown malably,cant chase the game,as with mike macsweeney ,7 goals out of there 11 in 8 games for kilteragh and mayo minor ,Conroy ,1-3 in the all ireland minor final ,can exploit space and score ,but once clyda keep there shape, and space is kept confined ,they will get frustrated,and if that happens as kilteragh are used to free flowing football,may panic and clyda who have heart,fight,and eypierence and know how to win a close game,dont have any big stars like kilteragh ,but are a team in every word and that maybe,just get them over the line.

Its a big ask against a team that played senior for over 10 years,and mayo club football is strong,but they may do it.It is a close call,if fitzgerald was there ,i would say clyda,as midfield is key ,and macsweeney and conroy as lethal as they are ,cant score ,unless they get quailty ball.

Best of luck to clyda ,win or loose,they have already done cork proud.

Youghal game is meant to be called off.In a way good news,at least I may make that the next day,as it was hard to choose between that and the football ,and I was undecided as both teams have big games.

Mcloughlin and galvin made the league panel it said in the paper for the cork footballers.Delighted,for galvin,he deserves a chance.
Mcloughlin is a strange call by management.Against kerry last sunday,he was exposed on a number of occasions .

Great to see the hurlers back in action,and hopefully it will be a long summer.They have there games with laois away and limerick at home ,telvised live by setanta ireland.

thinkstoomuch1 · 25-01-2014 11:22pm

Horse84 wrote: »

A good outing is right. It was never going to be a shootout with that wind there, some unreal gusts there at times.
I'd be very slow to over analyse today at all but what was said above with the players named if agree with. Who was very effective today from the word go was cian mac. Caught and broke the world of ball and had a very good player in paudi pender in trouble. Took some nice points in the second half and and generally made the right choice in possession. Showed good encouragement to mickey sull and and Lawton outside him which was very good to see. Jimmy made a point of going out to him when he called him ashore late on and congratulating him.That said, I'd expect him to do well in that heavy ground. His hurling was never in question but he just doesn't have the mobility on hard fast ground. Still an option off the bench for me.

Very impressed with haughney today finished the game stronger than he started it and got some lovely scores. He's def put his hand up. Mickey sull likewise, seems to be able to have that ability to break a tackle and is a good direct runner, caused the ucc defence a lot of trouble late on, he did well and with Harnedy and Cronin possibly missing for the limerick game, he's an option.

A word on eoin Keane lastly, I'll admit, I haven't seen a whole pile of the guy before today at all. At first I thought he started the game very well, big strong lad, not afraid of it and dealt well with rob o Shea early on but I dunno does he just look out of place at wing back maybe? Where's his natural position for Finbarr's? His recovery speed seems to be poor on first viewing but that's only on first viewing.

One final thing does someone know who the last 2 subs were, 23 and 24 not on the team sheet,I didn't catch the announcer.

Two midelton players aidan ryan at half forward ,and seamus o farell.

Not likely to make it ,much better ahead of them.Ryan isnt a half forward ,naturally ,and was and is a super half back,played a few game with cork a few years ago.

Is he likey to start ahead of harnedy,walsh lehane,lawton,cahalane,sullivan,i doubt it.Was in america ,and before he left should have got more game at half back a few years ago .

If cork are to play him ,then half back,unlikely as he plays club at halfforward.

thinkstoomuch1 · 25-01-2014 11:58pm

Great news with Rock,and Cunningham,and while it was not official until now ,it is not new,in that this has been known for the last week or so.

Cork hurling now have cunningham at u15,rock u16,u17 is under the control of the minor set up but will have coaches, and as the minors we have ring and landers,and at senior ,jbm ,and between ucc and cit at college level,we have cody,pat mulchay ,casey,cunnighham,grainger ,enright ,we have great coaches at most levels .

Cody is meant to be leaving youghal ,and is a huge loss.A super coach.

Kavanagh is a great appointment in the football.

thinkstoomuch1 · 26-01-2014 12:15am

willietherock wrote: »

Whats the story with Shane O Donnell?

He is a sub for ucc ,against clare in the bridge tommorrow at 2(with the weather warning and the forceast, and seen as the youghal game just a few miles away in the gaelic grounds postponed,it may not go ahead)i would think he will get game time,as
(a)davy will want to see him up against he young lads,to test them ,and he will want to view all hes players
(b)ucc play wit thursday,they will want him to get game time

closeline · 26-01-2014 12:44am

Jesus Christ it's Kiltane

Connorzee · 26-01-2014 2:53pm

UCC panel for today. Programme is useless as there's 10 changes to the starting team. 8 All ireland starters on the Clare team. Shane O'Donnell off the bench for UCC for the second half. 1-10 Clare. 1-03 UCC at half time

Be6OyzPIAAAYtaZ.jpg:large

Boots234 · 26-01-2014 3:38pm

Clyda were beaten 2-9 to 9 points

Connorzee · 26-01-2014 4:02pm

And a UCC selection were bate 2-28 to 1-04

closeline · 26-01-2014 10:25pm

Any accounts from games today?

thinkstoomuch1 · 27-01-2014 12:48am

closeline wrote: »

Any accounts from games today?

At the Clyda game, they were beaten by 6 points,a team that doesnt concede many goals,just one all year ,it let in two that cost them,two in five minutes,and against the wind ,a huge wind in the 1st half wind ,they were doing well.The 1st goal was poor defending,Carey got beaten,the second was a super goal ,hard to stop.

Clyda had an even share of possesion ,but once it became over a 13 point total to win the game,it was over,as they don't have a maquee forward.

Buckley and I said it last night ,he would struggle to last the game with hes injury ,he had to go off after 20 minutes and Clyda do not have depth and Fitzgerald was a huge loss also.

They as they do when they were even 12 points down,neve gave up,and brought it down to 6 points and they gave it everything and they left nothing on the field.

Thats a fine Mayo club team,they are senior bar words,in they are that good,and I expect and hope they win it outright
Clyda done themselves,and Cork proud,and they now have a break ,till Skibbereen in the 1st round of the Senior Championship.Today is Padraig Mullane's last game I would say,what a stalwart, for the club and Clyda ,I would say will miss him.

Kissane missed a penalty,played a great, game and he got a point like. I said he would,but it baffles me why he took the penalty.He was with the greatest respect ,never the most natural kicker and it is not he'strong point,and he went for power in the kick when you should place it.

Mullane or James Murphy were much better options and fair enough he wanted to take it,but some one else should have taken it.It did not cost them the match,but it would have given them some hope with 10 minutes to go.

Clyda didnt play worse than other games they played or very poorly,they just met a better team that took there goal chances and goals win games and they were not going to chase this team.

They went down with dignity,grace and showed a lot of heart and. Ned English deserves great credit,he got every last inch out of that team.

UCC look like they have only eyes for Thursday and the Fitzgibbon Cup.ULand Tippeary in the hurling was called off,and the Youghal game is refixed for next Saturday.

thinkstoomuch1 · 27-01-2014 7:48pm

Cork Senior Football Manager Brian Cuthbert has named his panel for the upcoming Allianz Leagues, while the team to play Westmeath on Sunday will be named tomorrow (Tuesday) evening.

In addition to the main panel, eight U21s have been identified as developing players. They have been with the panel at various stages throughout the winter and it is envisaged that they will continue to work with the squad and the back-room team throughout the League.

Cork Senior Football Panel for Allianz Leagues 2014
Michael Shields (Capt.) - St. Finbarr's
Ken O'Halloran - Bishopstown
David Hanrahan - Douglas
Eoin Cadogan - Douglas
Tomás Clancy - Fermoy
John McLoughlin - Kanturk
Damien Cahalane - Castlehaven
Noel Galvin - Ballincollig
Jamie O'Sullivan - Bishopstown
James Loughrey - Mallow
Alan Cronin - Nemo Rangers
Tom Clancy - Clonakilty
Kevin O'Driscoll - Tadhg MacCárthaigh
Micheal O Laoire - Naomh Abán
Andrew O'Sullivan - Castletownbere
Aidan Walsh- Kanturk
Ruairi Deane - Bantry Blues
Fintan Goold - Macroom
Barry O'Driscoll - Nemo Rangers
John O'Rourke - Carbery Rangers
Colm O'Driscoll - Tadhg MacCárthaigh
Donncha O'Connor - Ballydesmond
Dónal Og Hodnett - O'Donovan Rossa
Paddy Kelly - Ballincollig
Colm O'Neill - Ballyclough
Daniel Goulding - Éire Óg
Brian Hurley - Castlehaven
Paul Kerrigan - Nemo Rangers
Mark Collins - Castlehaven
John Hayes - Carbery Rangers

U21 Development Players
Conor Dorman - Bishopstown
Brian O'Driscoll - Tadhg MacCárthaigh
Ian Maguire - St. Finbarr's
Cathal Vaughan - Iveleary
Alan Cadogan - Douglas
Dan MacEoin - Ilen Rovers
Mark Sugrue - Bandon
Kevin Crowley - Millstreet

thinkstoomuch1 · 27-01-2014 7:56pm

Ruairi Deane is on it excellent news.
Ray carey did not make it,and that is a correct call.John Mcloughlin should not be there,Gould is very lucky,he must justify the faith in him.
Barry O driscoll ,and colm o driscoll did not do enough in the games I saw.
So much for being ruthless,he has only dropped Sheehan it seems,as Carey was not on it .Sheehan was not cut out for intercounty,like I said a month ago.
Cork beat Dublin in a challenge match the weekend 2-13 to 1-11 in Dublin,Goulding and Hodnett with the goals.
A big weekend for Cork GAA,Youghal are playing Saturday,Cork v Westmeath,Rochestown v Doon in the Harty Cup,and Hamilton v Ard scoil in the Harty Cup.(i done a preview of that in the harty cup thread) all playing.

thinkstoomuch1 · 27-01-2014 10:33pm

HARTY CUP SEMI-FINALS & OTHER POST-PRIMARY FIXTURES 2014
Harty Cup Semi Finals - Saturday February 1st
St. Francis College Rochestown V Doon @ Cahir, 12:30pm
Ard Scoil Ris V Hamilton HS Bandon @ Mallow, 3:30pm

How long would it take to go to Mallow from Cahir does anyone know?

corkrobinhood · 27-01-2014 11:13pm

Why is Ray Carey not on it?

Delighted Ruari Deane is in there,i'd agree on Barry O Driscoll,i'd give Colm another try,hes far tougher than Barry anyway.

I'd have McLoughlin before Galvin,but again I'd like to see how both do in a tight league game.

The forwards available are scary,the backs scare me

thinkstoomuch1 · 28-01-2014 12:20am

corkrobinhood wrote: »

Why is Ray Carey not on it?

Delighted Ruari Deane is in there,i'd agree on Barry O Driscoll,i'd give Colm another try,hes far tougher than Barry anyway.

I'd have McLoughlin before Galvin,but again I'd like to see how both do in a tight league game.

The forwards available are scary,the backs scare me

We will be able to judge galvin and mcloughlin in the league,i think he will make it,but if galvin isnt up to it,i will be the 1st to say it.
Yeah colm is tough but is better at half back than a forward?

Cant wait to c the team picked.

Carey couldnt train til after clyda were beaten and it dint fit with cuthbhert.He is not up to that level ,but its strange when he isnt picked as he wouldnt train since the start yet dual players are more than faciltated.

corkrobinhood · 28-01-2014 3:15am

I'm surprised by that Carey decision,I would have felt he was still good enough,has his play got that bad in the last 2 years away? Shame really,I always felt he was one of very few of our defenders who could stick with a quick Kerry forward.

D'Agger · 28-01-2014 10:41am

I'm not suprised by the Carey decision tbh

a) It's the league and there's plenty of time for him to play himself back into contention, given he's had a longer season with Clyda, maybe best to give him some time to recover and regain form
b) His form for Cork hasn't been great for the past two years imo, Cork management are right to try out different players, like I said, it's the league, it should be used to learn how your extended squad can perform

thinkstoomuch1 · 28-01-2014 11:31am

D'Agger wrote: »

I'm not suprised by the Carey decision tbh

a) It's the league and there's plenty of time for him to play himself back into contention, given he's had a longer season with Clyda, maybe best to give him some time to recover and regain form
b) His form for Cork hasn't been great for the past two years imo, Cork management are right to try out different players, like I said, it's the league, it should be used to learn how your extended squad can perform

Id agree with that

He was super in 2009 but never scaled those heights since.He was made look better than he was with clya 12 men behind the ball,and he was at fault for the 1st goal sunday.

What is ironic is Cuthbher having one rule for dual players and another for others.I dont see a problem in carey not training with cork as he was with clyda ,and its same with the the crokes players with kerry.

Id say he wont get on it now.Yeah you like the hurlers with cussen and naughton hear the door is still open,its just talk,they didnt make the league,no way will they be recalled.

Its a good panel ,but there is at least four that are no way related to senior intercounty against a top 4 team.

Cuthbhert wasnt ruthless bar carey but he wasnt there last year.Lyons ,murphy,killan o connor never had a realistic chance with sheehan so drop them is no suprise.

A huge worry is he has lads that have been shown up time and again yet not just on the panel but very much in line to start for cork.

Deane is a good call,but hes form was just as good as october yet they left him out.Tralee it ,i heard on good authority had done a piece ,stats wise and a profile on him and gave to the cork management,a cork man is with tralee it in the background.Great to hear ,but a poor reflection when such efforts had to be made to get a lad with great bite and cut and can actually play and kick a ball to get on the cork panel-when most of cork bar the management failed to see what was before them.

A mixed bag from them so far and hardly inspiring stuff.

Interesting to hear the team later,should be beating westneath by at least 5 points,as there captain is out.Thats the expected mininum performance I want .Kildare should test us next week.

thinkstoomuch1 · 28-01-2014 12:04pm

WHAT THIS IS:

Ard Scoil and Hamilton meet in the. 2014 Harty Cup Semi final in Mallow ,on the 1st of February at 3.30,the second time both teams have played each other in the Harty this year,the 1st time was in the Mallow venue in the Autumn and the North Ciruclar Road team were victourious on a score line of 4-20 to 3-14.

ARD SCOIL RIS HISTORY:

Ard Scoil ,are all boys secondary school in the heart of the Treaty county ,on the North Circular Road , in existence since 1963 and from around 50 students at the start ,it has now over 700,and have became a powerhouse in Rubgy and GAA,and it has had distinquished rubgy men like Paul O Connell who was a Munster Heinken Cup Winner,Lions Test Series Winner and Former Series Captain,Grand Slam Winner,and Captain of Ireland.
Current Munster and Ireland Rubgy Internationals David Kilycoyne ,and Leinster and Current Irish International Sean Cronin are also past pubils that graced there corridoors,but have excelled in there chosen sport.

Sam Lynch the Irish Rower and a World Champion with Ireland went to the school.

In GAA many former Clare and Limerick Intercounty stars went to the school such as Nicky O'Connell,Darach Honan(mother is a Cork woman),Cathal Mclirnery(joint captain when they won the Harty in 2010,and Kevin Downes,Declan Hannon,Adrian Breen ,(UCC,suprise ommisson from the senior intercounty set up)Seamus Dowling,and Niall Moran .

It is not just Sport the school is known for ,but Pat Cox, former President of the European Parliment ,was a former pupil,and renowend debater also went there.
If you want an entertainment link with the school ,look no further than,Dave Chambers and Bob Mcglynn ,of Rubberbandits fame ,as they are past pupils.They are trying to become the first Limerick school since CBS Sexton Street brought an All Ireland Title at senior schools back to Limerick in 1966 and it remains more a question of when,rather than if,that they accomplish that feat.The young Cork hurlers in 1966,were not the only boys that became men.That school are the only school,in Limerick that won a Croke cup,they won it in 1964 also.

Corks schools have won the Croke Cup14 times.In the Harty Cup just 3 Limerick schools have won it ,CBS Sexton Street ,have 10 Harty's ,and St .Munchins have just the 1.

Cork schools between ,St .Finbarrs Franfrerris (current Hamilton selector Noel Crowley won a Harty with them and would have learned under the expertise tulage of there Coach the Great Canon Michael O Brien,)North Mon,St Colmans,Midelton, Chriost Ri,and Cholaiste Iognaid RIS,they have over 40 titles and if Hammies were to win one,they would form a "Magnificent 7"in Cork schools that won the famous Harty Cup.

A bit like the spider that could not get up the wall.He may fall down repeatedly ,but he never stops trying,and eventually he finds a way.A bit like that spider,Ard Scoil won't give up ,and it is just a matter of time ,before the Dr.Croke Cup is resting at Ard Scoil.

And "Time" has been the storyline of Ard scoil,it has not been a case that many believe in that,the pick of talent between Limerick and Clare is put together,for instant success.Far from it.The foundations since 2002,have been laid and great work by the likes of Cormarc Bonnar of Tippereary,Liam Kennedy,Derek Larkin of Offaly, , Liam Cronin,Niall Crowe, Fergal Lyons ( a Cork man)and Pat Tobin , Victor Leydon,Tom Hennessy,Colm Honan (father of Clare player Darach), ,Jimmy Browne(expierence with Clare minors and u21 and LIT, Natal O’Grady and Joe Hannon (father of Declan) among may others at various times have all helped the school at various stages make good progress.

Niall Moran ,got involved in the mid 200O's and introduced modern training,recovery sessions,nutrition,post match video anayalis,tactial awareness and it benfited them greatly.

Of course they got money inputed in to them from the Limerick and Clare County boards, and the Limerick Supporters Club in Dublin and that is of mutal benefit ,there are players from both counties involved,so they will reap what Ard Scoil sow.

They also got help from the various GAA boards in Limerick and John Lyons of Supermacs down the years. They have been given the provison of use of facilties for use in many grounds,Meelick,LIT and Ul's superb North Campus complex,to name but a few,and combined with the huge support of parents ,they have and continue to build something special in Hurling.The money as it inevitably does made a difference,but it could not have helped,unless like the change in Dublin Hurling,it needed the "Will of the people involved"and it had that in abundance.

They are the only Munster school to compete in all A grades at u14,15 etc up along,and on any academic year they could have up to 14 teams in competition.

They learned the hard way,lost there 1st Dean Ryan Cup in 2005,won the Dean Ryan in 2008 and then decided to enter the Harty Cup in 2007, and won the 1st one in 2010.They lost a Thriller of a Dean Ryan Cup to Midelton this year by a point,in a match they could easily of won.Just like the Dean Ryan 2005 loss did not set them back,the 2013 loss is unlikey to do so also.
The next generation of Ard scoil Harty Cup teams are already taking shape on the production line.

Again there is a structure and organistion to everything they do ,and a clear path to Glory lined out.The school has a vision,and have the teaching and coaching staff to implement it,along with the talent to cultivate there dreams in to reality.They then won two succesive Harty cups in 2010 and 2011,two White Cups (u15)and won and u14 All Ireland in the last few years.

In essence,everyone from the teachers,to the coaches,to the county boards,the sponsor,the parents and most importanly the players themselves have turned Ard Scoil from a minnows competing in B Hurling in to a Powerful and Significance force"in terms of competing and winning regulary at the elite level of Senior Schools Hurling,the Harty Cup.And the school is a credit to both Limerick and Clare Hurling and all involved with them.a

HAMILTON HIGH'S HISTORY:
The school is an all boys Catholic Secondary school situated North of the River in Bandon .It is a privately owned school and it was founded by Sean Hamilton and the a Limerick man Patrick Cahill.It is owned to this day by Sean's son,Padraig Hamilton ,and is very much in line with the traditions and foundations it was built on.Sean Hamilton,was a great man,and is known to have cycled from Bandon to Cork City ,to school every day ,hail,rain or snow,as a young scholar go to school in Cork.He done it the hard way,and like this present new generation,no obstacle is ever too big for them,they just get on with it,and as seen as seen in this years Cork Colleges which they won in hugely convincing style ,and the Harty Cup ,when the odds are against them ,they like the founder of the school,always had the endurance,stamina ,and determination to reach there goal ,no matter how long or diffcult or ardourous that journey is.

The school has around 375 pupils and has 7 teams involved GAA across different levels , and are already in a Munster B final in football,with many duals players on both teams.Noel Crowley ,GDO with the Cork County board has done fantastic work with them,and so too has Aidan O Donuguhe.They get there players mainly from Valley Rovers,Bandon,Newcestown,and Courcey Rovers .

They wouldn't have the financial rescources of Ard Scoil.
They don't use that as an excuse not to succeed.In fact,former Prinicipal ,and coach of the Hurling teams,Kerry man ,Jim Costello said once ,that what makes the school so succesful ,is there is very little"Dont's"in the way of school life ,and there ethos is much in line with giving the students the freedom and trust to do things themselves .

For such young lads ,that is paying of ,and that ethos is very much in line with the way they play the game,they are not afraid to play themselves out of trouble at the back ,and play with a smile and freedom and fluency like they did ,last Tuesday ,that the postive ethos they have always enables them to look forward and embrace and relish a challenge,instead of playing with fear and not being as succesful.

Famous past pupils ,are the legendary GAA journalist ,Con Houinhan,former Cork hurling captain Pat Kenneally ,and former Cork Senior football Captain and current Cork Senior selector Owen Sexton.

Judge Con Murphy,who has a Cup presented in he's honour ,to the winners of the Junior A Hurling league in Cork GAA is also a past pupil.

Most notably more famous in Football,in that they won a load of Munster B,and C competions down the years and two All ireland a B football title in 1975 and a C title in 2007,Hurling is now far from the poor relation.They have won Munster Senior C hurling titles,B U 16 title in 2012,u15 C ,but never won in the A grade,and from 1995 up to last year,never entered it ,but in the second year back,became the 1st school from West Cork to advance to a Harty Cup Quater Final.

In 2012/2013 they won there 1st match 1-18 to 3-10 against Chriost Ri,beaten by just 3 points to quater finalists Midelton,drew with the defending champions Nenagh and pushed Thurles all the way.

They are not satsified to rest on there laurels,onwards and upwards they remain.

THE FORM GUIDE OF BOTH TEAMS:
Ard Scoil have got here,with a total of 8 goals-96 points(4 the 1st day against Hammies in Mallow)and conceded 8-47 ,3 of those againts Hamilton the 1st day and ,Hammies are one of few teams to get that many against them and in truth could of had 5 that day.

Hammies have got 8 goals in a return of 8-78 and conceded 6-65,but It is important to note they have unlike Ard scoil who failed to score in 2 games,they only failed to find the net once against Dungarvan .
They know where the goals are,and while they never threatned to raise a green flag ,against Dungarvan ,they are more than capable of scoring them.It is a good sign,they can win a game ,when they don't score them.

Hammies got 9 goals in 3 games in the Cork Colleges Truimph,but it was the way they beat ,and dismantled Midelton ,that really was there stage,they had no fear against the reigning champions that were going for 3 In A ROW,and like when they beat the powerhouses and traditionalists in St Colmans ,St Flannans,Dungarvan with 5 of last year Dr.Croke winning team ,they always find another gear within themselves against the best.A great sign of a team.
How far is left in them?,is like how long is a piece of string?in that no one can say with certainty ,but there is more in them,enough to beat Ard Scoil this Saturday ,only the passing of time will answer that.

IS THIS GAME THE FOREGONE CONCLUSION MANY BELIEVE IT IS:

Ard Scoil are a formidable team with the huge talent they have from, various clubs in Limerick(Adare,Patrickswell,Na Piarsaigh etc) and Clare (Clonlar,O Callaghan Mills,Sixemile bridge etc)yet like any schools team ,are not unbeatable at all,at all on any given day.

They were beaten by Templemore last year ,and were huge favourites ,they drew with St .Colmans in the Group stages,who they were expected to beat easily ,and the question remains,while,they are fine in free flowing games,can they win a close game.There must be a worry,a geuine fear that the lack of most games they played ,are over as a contest in the last quarter,if Hammies are with them ,in the last quarter,it is unchartered terriorty for them and it remains to be seen how will they react in the heat of the battle.

They were huge favourites in the Dean Ryan Cup,and then Garan Manley,ace man ,for Midelton was unable to start.No body saw them beaten.Then 9 points up,Midelton ,made a super ,super comeback.
The lesson like I always believe in, is that school teams deal with expectation differentLy and understandably,as these are still young lads and many are not as battle hardened as other teams.

No one gave Facthnas a chance against Jack O Connor Sceilge,or against Brendans in the Corn Ui Mhuiri football last week.Hamilton were not expected to beat Dungarvan,or were Rochestown against Thurles .Jack O Connor was wary of that ,and tried to play Facthnas as favourites.

Ard Scoil before last week game was even as low as 1/2 to win the Harty outright,and not just the seni final.Favourites yes ,but no way are they by that much.It is sheer madness for anyone to back large sums on a schools game ,as there is always that degree of uncertainty attached to them.

The underdog has a huge advantage in these games.As seen in minor and u21,huge favouritism can test a team.Dr.Crokes a senior team,were expected to win in a canter against Cratloe in the Munster Final, yet they barely won in the end.

And this semi final is going to be like an intercounty minor match,in both teams are prepared as such ,and have so many talented players ,that ,are set to grace intercounty teams in the future that, who ever wins the game has to be focused entirely ,and turn up on the day,not just take to the field ,but they have to be focused on it.

Ard scoil have such favourtism,the way they blitz teams ,and with so many intercounty stars,all the focus is on them.They are expected to win .Hamilton ,have done so well,they are winners no matter what ,and are in bonus terrirorty.

The other huge advantage they have is they were beaten to almost most 50/50 balls,there touch was way off,yet they never gave up the good fight against Ard Scoil in the 1st group stage,and a lesser team would have thrown in the towel.They stuck at it ,and they know that within.And they were much closer to them and the 9 point winning margin suggests .

Hamilton have resilence .They had only minimal ball work done in the lead up to that game, compared to Ard Scoil who had there Limerick Intercounty stars benefiting from top class hurling just weeks before ,in the minor All Ireland semi final to Galway .They had the touch,where Hamilton were way off the pace,and gave away two sloppy goals ,and that team then had not the confidence or belief they have now 14 weeks later.They know they are better this time around.

They are a shadow of that team that played in the Autumn,and winning the Cork Colledges beating Midelton, then in the Harty Cup beating Dungarvan ,St Flannans and beating Templemore in the Munster B Football last week,with a lot of the hurlers playing in Mallow,they fear no one. There is a belief in them.

The venue has a huge bearing also.Just like Thurles ,has became the home of hurling for Cork ,the West Cork school has had a good love affair with the North cork venue.

Hamilton have had many a good day in Mallow in hurling and football,even as far back as 2005,,in the Old Mallow Venue of Carrokeal,they won a Munster C football.

They beat Dungarvan last Tusday there,and then in the same venue beat Templemore on the Friday in the football.It is safe to say they know every corner ,and blade of grass in Mallow,and this is like a home match,as there will be a huge Cork crowd in general at it,as North Cork loves it's hurling,and unlike a weekday,a Saturday makes it viable for most to attend the game.

With Rochestown also doing well,Midelton winning the Dean Ryan Cup,and the appointment of Mark Landers and Denis Ring to the Cork Minor team,complimented by the great appointments of Ger Cunningham to the Cork u15 team,and the Rock to the Cork u16 team,there is a great buzz and excitement back in Cork underage hurling,and that will make many a Cork fan go to Mallow this Saturday,added to the fact ,a lot will want to see recently called up Cork Senior Michael Cahalane ,among many other stars on the ptich.

They played Ard Scoil in the 1st round match here ,the day they got beat but that day they learned they were a match for the best ,and that day was the turning point for them ,in that they learned you must start a game against the best well.Against Flannans,in the next game they tore in to the game from the off.

They now have there 4th game here,and have a familarity with the venue ,that is another string to their bow,and I would imagine they are delighted to be back there.
Ard scoil only played there once ,and they know Hamilton have an advantage,such was there decison to play Cork minor hurlers in a challenge match last thursday night,to add to the one game they played there.

THE MATCH ITSELF:

Barry Fitzpatrick is a top full back from Sixemilbridge and tipped to rattle the Clare u21 team .He is solid,strong ,under the high ball and knows how to man he's aera,and has oceans of Hurling.Trevor Horgan ,a dual Cork minor ,has faced the best and while he has not always came out on top,he has survived ,and that is good when your up against the best,to break even.Last Tuesday ,he faced the Waterford Captain and super full back Kevin Daly ,and got two points from play ,and made two scores,but crucially won ball when the need for he's team was greatest ,and when Daly did win ball,he chased,harried and blocked him,in that Daly always could not clear fast long ball,but had to lay it off ,to a team mate,and second phase possesion is easier dealt with by your half back line.

So while it seemed he was not doing much,in essence he was doing a lot for he's team.He has huge scoring in him,and he will cut loose some day ,3 goals in a county minor and u21 final and maybe now is the time to play him at centre forward,and Cahalane at full ,as Cahalane will be targeted.I expect an element of suprise with Hamilton,but it remains to be seen what that may be.He done it against Clare at minor this year also with 3 good points.

Kevin Daly only conceded one point from play to Brian Molloy in the All Ireland minor final ,that is how good an opponent,Horgan faced.Fitzpatrick has two good corner backs around him,in particular Na Piaraighs Josh O Halloran ,and if Casey starts at centre back ,then he may mark Reilly,but Kevin O Donovan is just as lively and got a great goal in the Cork College final,and whatever 3 they start here,there is scoring in them,but the forwards and that is a credit to them and there coaches ,work just as hard of the ball as they do on it,and yes they have key men,but Hamilton are a team in every word.

The half back line of Ard Scoil has Gordon Brown,and Mike Casey ,two club men at Na Piarsaigh,where a lot of Ard Scoil lads play ,and former Ard Scoils players both past and present had a huge part in the clubs two Munster Senior club tiles,and Casey is likely to play against Portumna at corner back in the up coming Club Semi final.He is fast,and can hurl both sides.

Jack English compliments that line and they are a huge threat to Hamilton,as they must be prevented from getting a foothold in the game,as if they do,they will starve Hamilton of any forward supply of ball ,and thus will give there own lethal forwards possesion to work with .

They had Ronan Lynch,super from placed balls within 60 yards of goal,and also able to score from a sideline cut,at midfield the last day,and he got 3 points from play out there.Will he remain there or drop to half back and form an all Na Piasaigh unit?

Jerry O Neill has to have a huge game ,and him and maybe the excellent David Healy with 3 points against them in the 1st game will start in the half forward line,and he also can drop in and help midfield,and he is well able to score from distance .If Horgan ,or Cahalane is in there at centre forward,that unit should win ball.

I think that the middle third may be congested at times and Kevin O Donovan may drop deep from corner forward also and help them out in defence like he did last week.Ard Scoil will want to crowd out Hamilton,and in particuar ,Cahalane.Hamilton need to use every length of the ptich,and spread out at half forward ,as O Neill and Cahalane or Horgan are capable of winning there own ball,and using there strength and power.In last weeks challenge match,Cork kept Ard Scoil open and wide,and Eoghan Kinery and Sean Hayes won a load of ball at half forward.

For that reason,I hope the lightening fast,and skilful ,Eoin o Reilly starts in the other corner,as he is able to play in a two man full forward line,and he's pace ,with the space inside could be a real threat different to what Fitzpatrick expects .

Eoin O Reilly is similar to Billy Dunne,and the Cork minor caused Ard Scoil huge problems last week with he's pace and got 2-1 from play.Fitzpatrick is a fine full back,but a fast nippy forward can cause him problems.Dunne kept swtiching,with Dan Landers,a big man.Hamilton have to do the same,numbers don't mean a whole lot up front once they all get the right ball,they have to keep rotating and moving players.Ard Scoil will try and do what Clare done to Cork,crowd there half forward line,and win the match from there,and the half back unit likes to hunt in packs.

If Casey is at centre back,they loose that yard of pace inside in the full back,so every cloud if Hamilton are smart enough can have a silver lining for them.
Curran who is a fine player may start at half forward.It will be a case of horses for coarses.

Midfield will be vital ,and Jonathan Mulchay and Luke Meade who was everywhere the last day,a certainty to make the final cut of 30 when the Cork minor panel is announced this week ,will have a great battle with Cian O Brien and either Ronan Lynch or Clares Ian Galvin who may play half forward and can score.

The half back line of Murt Kenneally,the majestic and brave Chris O Leary,and Niall Murray,were awesome last week,hooking and blocking,winning ball,and then playing short cross field passes to a spare man,always in control of possesion,not hitting wasteful long Hail Marys to the forwards.
O leary did not fare the best against Cian Lynch,(ciaran carey nephew)the 1st day,but he was awesome against Flannans,and Midelton in the Cork College final,and also against Dungarvan ,he hurled a lot of ball ,and that unit will hold there own against any half forward line left in the competition.
Lynch will try and drag O Leary all over the ptich,so the likes of Meade etc ,will have to drop back and help when the need arises.Meade has fitness to do that and is lovely hurler,very fast hands.

The full back line of Captain Michael Mcsweeney ,definetly one of the best full backs in the competiton,will be solid and whether it is Alex Morey of Clare ,or more likely Michael O Loughlin,he won't let the side down.A brillant,brave block ,in the last few minutes against Dungarvan,showed he is brave,a leader,and like Cahalane up front,with O Leary ,very much the heartbeat of the team at the back.

Morey is lightening fast ,and Jack O Callaghan ,would have the pace for him.Crehan of Clare is just as good,and Andrew O Connell will have a tough opponent.
Mcsweeney is the key to that unit,he's commanding prescence,and hes always talking to the backs to keep there shape is a good foundation for them,and once you have a good defence ,with a superb. Centre and full backand Hamilton do,they have a realistic chance.

THE BEST TILL LAST:
Which leaves us to Michael Cahalane ,and Ronan Lynch.This is no slight on any of the other 28 players,as there is great talent there,but these two men I feel are the best men for either teams.

Cahalane has played senior hurling since 2nd year,only there 3rd ever pupil to have that distinction,and done it in football also.He has a lot of schools expierence,played in minor and u21 county finals for Bandon,senior hurling for Carbery,played in an Intermediate County final at 17 for Bandon,played for Cork minors in hurling and football,and has a load of expierence,and is calm and composed,and has sublime natural skill,natural strength,poise,elgance,a great hand,and as he's side line cut showed with that super point last week,he has all the basic skills in hurling,but excels in them.He is hugely versatile,in he could play half or full forward ,or even centre back,such a great reading and understanding of the game he beholds at a young age.He has been ,and that is no suprise , called up to the Cork Senior team in the last week,and I expect to see him in a few games in the league.He did not and rightfully so play any game time for Cork on Saturday,and that was a wise move,as he had played Tuesday and Friday for Hamilton.He's day will come with the Cork Senior team,that is a certainty.

He's scoring rate is superb.Ten out of the teams 13 points last week.A super goal and around ten points against Ard scoil in the group gameg.Around 1-8 against Flannans, and 6 from play I think in the Cork Colleges final.

He got 1-11 against the Barrs in an u16 county final,got 3 goals against the Rockiers at U14 county final,this year got 18 points in a minor game against Carragline ,and got like 14 points in the Carbery u21 final out of he's teams 18 points againrgt Newcestown.
He got 1-1 against Kevin Daly ,for Cork against Wateford this year.

Ronan Lynch is just as vital for Ard Scoil,and just as versatile,in that he
has the pace to play anywhere 2 to 9,and is such a presence with so much hurling,and fast hands ,and a good man under a high ball,he is just at home at centre back or full back,but he has so much hurling and can score long range points,he would be wasted at full back.

He was superb last year for Limerick minors,and is a pivotal figure this year for that team.He did mark Cahalane already in the group game,Cahalane got a great goal, but Lynch had hes moments too.

They may mark each other if both start at centre back or centre forward respectively ,or Ard Scoil may go with Casey on him,and let Lynch play at midfield,hence he can score ,and also play a sweeping role ,as a defensive midfielder just ahead of Cahalane,or just behind him,helping Casey out.I think they may do that.

Cahalane can handle either player,but two together is impossible,and if that happens,then Hamilton need to be cute and drop him in full forward, and withdraw the half forwards,with O Reilly inside with him,if that happens Ard Scoil are between a rock and a hard place,as if Lynch goes back to double team him,he can't score from there ,and horgan can win ball at centre forward also for Hamilton.

Either way,Hamilton will be keen to watch Ronan Lynch if he stays at midfield,and Curran or O Donovan may have to help out in curbing him.
The key for Hamilton is not to let Cahalane be crowded at centre forward ,and if they do crowd him,they must utilse the free space that is bound to be else where.Both lads are a joy to watch in free taking,and the art of sideline balls.Both are key men in there teams of stars on Saturday.The match ups have could end up in many different variables,and that unkownity adds to the excitment and fasination of this game.

THE VERDICT:
Contary to the belief ,among many,I think ,and I have watched a lot of them ,and seen them grow and evolve ,as a team this year ,Hamilton have a huge chance to win it ,and there is more in them.As I said earlier,how much more is in them,and will it be enough as a hard question to answer.They have improved in every game since the 1st group match ,and the Dr.O .Callaghan Cup was a huge boost to them.

As a sunny dry Kilmallock,on a Autumns day ,on dry hard ground ,they have the skill,touch and fire power to play on a dry day and shoot a high return,yet on a wet,wintry,heavy day in Mallow,they had the grit,strength,power ,and dog fight and composure to grind a hard fought win.They are adaptable to any weather.That is a great sign of a team,they have many a string to there bow.Hammies Captain Michael Macsweeny said when accepting a team award for the school said " A Team is only as strong as it's weakest link".

It is hard to find any weak link in the team.Like any team ,you must have leaders and a solid spine at full back,centre back, pace at midfield,centre forward and full forward.In Macsweeney,O Leary,Meade,Cahalane,and Horgan they have those key men in central positions,flanked and supported by good hurlers around them.
And they have a very good goalie in Robbie Mccarthy,who is good and composed under a high ball,and varies the short and long puckouts extremely well.For a goalie that doe not play much club hurling,he's sharpness or reflexes is not an issue.

Like any ship preparing to sail the high seas ,and through stormy waters ahead,you must have a good captain to steer you in the right direction,with a good support crew also.Noel Crowley and Aidan O Donughue provide Hamilton with that.This could be a free flowing game,but tactics will play a huge part in the game also .This game won't be far off ,if even that,intercounty minor standard in terms of hurling,speed ,and intensity .

Ard scoil are the same as Hamilton,a very adaptable team and have key men and leaders in all of the central postitions,but I think they may be slightly lighter.They were cold last year with no games in the lead up to there defeat to Templemore ,but once shy twice bitten,they had a good run out last Thursday against Cork Minors,who beat both teams in challenge matches ,so they won't be stale on the day.They have more expierence at this stage of the Harty Cup than Hammies.
Fitzparick,O Brien,Casey,Cian and Ronan Lynch,O Halloran,Crehan,O Loughlin all played in and won a quater final last year.
I have seen them a few times ,and have always been impressed by them.

Ard scoil,want to start fast and will try and blow Hamilton away early on,and they have huge fire power anywhere from midfield up,but if Hamilton,stay with them,and are with them in the last quarter,in what will be a huge Cork Crowd at it ,I feel ,they may just edge it,as unlike Ard Scoil ,they were tested in the quater final with a hard tough game.Many fans would have liked to have the comfort of winning by a bigger margin ,but that game could be a blessing in disguise for the team for Saturday's Litmus test.

As much as I want Hamilton to win,I make that call,as I always do with emotion taken completely out of the equation.But it is truly an impossible game to predict with any certain accuracy,and I would not like to bet on it.

May the best team win,and we have another entralling Cork ,Limerick under age contest in prospect ,if it half as good as the Munster 2011 u21 final,or the Dean Ryan 2013 Cup final ,between both Counties ,it should be some game,and Hurling and the Harty Cup will be the real winners.

The only draw back is this game clashes with the other semi final,which is sure to be as equally pulsating and mouth watering ,in Cahir between Rochestown and Doon,another Cork v Limerick clash.It is a pity people won't make both ,and that they are not on at the same venue as a Double header.Having just seen now that there is a gap between both starting times ,maybe just maybe it is possible to do both,fill up the tank ,and have the sambos and flask of soup in the car,and and you start praying for a clear run with traffic.
If the weather is as bad as the last two days ,its unlikey to make both games.

It is only Monday,and I am counting down the days to Saturday,.I'm not from any of the 4 remaining schools,I'm only a Hurling man ,and Saturday represents all that is good about Hurling and the Harty Cup.Bring it On.....some games ...and it is not even the Summer yet!!!!

thinkstoomuch1 · 28-01-2014 1:18pm

UL
1 Rory Byrne Castlebar Mitchells Mayo
2 Eamonn Kiely Brosna Kerry
3 Tom Clancy Clonakility Cork
4 Brendan Harrison Aghamore Mayo
5 David Dolan Garrymore Mayo
6 Dessie Mone Clontibret Monaghan
7 Luke Mulligan St. Pats Blennerville Kerry
8 Phelim McHugh Drumkeerin Leitrim
9 Enda Hogan Mountbellew/Moylough Galway
10 Paul Whyte Kilrossanty Waterford
11 Denis Daly St.Marys Cahersiveen Kerry
12 Eoin Carroll Cappincur Offaly
13 Shane O’Callaghan Austin Stacks Kerry
14 James O Donoghue Legion Kerry
15 John O Rourke Carbery Rangers Cork
16 Eoin Slattery Eire Og Clare
17 T J Ryan Rockwell Rovers Tipperary
18 Brian O Shea Dr.Crokes Kerry
19 Conor Lowry Ferbane Offaly
20 Conor McNamee Rhode Offaly
21 Matthew Galvin Ballymcelligott Kerry
22 Craig O Brien Wolfe Tones Clare
23 Gavin Ryan Rockwell Rovers Tipperary
24 JP Spillane Templenoe Kerry
25 Adam Barry Brosna Kerry
26 Cian Bradley Moate All Whites Westmeath
27 Mark Eaton Kinsale Cork

Thats the ul team today in the sigerson,if that team had played us we would have been tested.

Best of luck to them with clancy and o rourke and lets hope they dont get injured as both are define starters in my view for the westmeath game.
That team is named tonight and is being showed in full,in a defferred showing sunday on tg4 for those can't make it.

Cork were meant to be playing tippereary in a hurling challenge but not sure if that is going ahead as tipp play ul in the waterford crystal.

corkrobinhood · 28-01-2014 4:22pm

D'Agger wrote: »

I'm not suprised by the Carey decision tbh

a) It's the league and there's plenty of time for him to play himself back into contention, given he's had a longer season with Clyda, maybe best to give him some time to recover and regain form

I would feel that if he misses the league campaign his football would be lacking coming into Championship,theres no greater preperation for Championship than playing regular football.

Only way his form will improve is training and game time.

D'Agger · 28-01-2014 4:44pm

corkrobinhood wrote: »

I would feel that if he misses the league campaign his football would be lacking coming into Championship,theres no greater preperation for Championship than playing regular football.

Only way his form will improve is training and game time.

As my father would say 'Hunger is the best sauce' - If Carey is of the standard to play for Cork, then you'll think he'll be called back in should he start showing it in club games.

If a player gets dropped then the onus is on the player to regain his place on the panel again, it's up to Carey now to show the hunger, and to start producing the goods consistently for Clyda - they're senior this year after all, he'll have a big bearing as per whether they stay up there or not.

Best of luck to him, but if he can regain his form then I've no doubt he'll be pulled back in again

corkrobinhood · 28-01-2014 4:46pm

Very true.

Hopefully,as I said previously I feel hes one of few we have that can do a job against Kerry.

Then again,after our League campaign I really hope we'll have found 2 decent corner backs.

thinkstoomuch1 · 28-01-2014 8:13pm

ALLIANZ LEAGUES: CORK SENIOR FOOTBALL TEAM V WESTMEATH 28/01/2014
The Cork Senior Football team to play Westmeath in the Allianz Leagues on Sunday at 2pm in Páirc Uí Rinn will line out as follows:
Ken O'Halloran (Bishopstown)
John McLoughlin (Kanturk)
Eoin Cadogan (Douglas)
Michael Shields (Capt. - St. Finbarr's)
James Loughrey (Mallow)
Tom Clancy (Clonakilty)
Tomás Clancy (Fermoy)
Aidan Walsh (Kanturk)
Andrew O'Sullivan (Castletownbere)
Mark Collins (Castlehaven)
Paul Kerrigan (Nemo Rangers)
Fintan Goold (Macroom)
Daniel Goulding (Éire Óg)
Brian Hurley (Castlehaven)
Donal Og Hodnett (O'Donovan Rossa)
The full panel will be finalised later in the week.

The game is Brian Cuthbert's first Allianz League game as manager of the Cork Senior Football team, and features a Senior League début for former U21star, Donal Óg Hodnett. Click here to view the full Cork panel for the Allianz Leagues.

Cork GAA Discussion Thread

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