The worst cars of the 00's.

Guy:Incognito · 20-03-2011 12:39pm

RoverJames wrote: »

YOu were poor but bought a new car :cool:

Not entirely. I just found more interestign ways to distribute my wages, which mostly involved behind the bar, which left me too poor to worry about a car that was running fine on its own :-)

johnos1984 · 20-03-2011 12:44pm

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Maybe I'll play devils advocat here for a minute and say you may be a bad judge of 2nd hand cars?

Fair enough.

The Alfa I knew what I was getting into and expected no less. The Clio appeared to be a very good car but ended up being nothing of the sort.

I also had my fingers burned with a Golf which developed faults very soon after it was bought but had nothing obvious wrong when I bought it and had to go to the main dealer to have the faults found before rejecting it.

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

I bought a Clio new in 2000 and much like the hoards of Punto buyers at the ime I was young and poor. The car saw nothing other thna petrol for the first 2 1/2 - 3 years of it's life and 45,000 miles until it went to my mother who ran it (with services now though :-) ) for another 7 years before getting a Megane on scrappage last year.

The Clio I had was bought with '45k' showing on the clock. I won't get into its history but to say it was shady was putting it lightly however it had nothing of worry showing until a number of weeks later and as it was a private sale there was little I could do.

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

I've treated all my Renaults (and the families) much better since then and none of us have every had a breakdown. Closest was a dead battery after the cold spell early last year in my dads Laguna I.

In fairness to myself I'm pretty anal about servicing and looking after cars and thats why I enjoy restoring one classic every year. I get them serviced bang on time, sometimes before and if anything shows up not being right it gets proper parts and booked into the mechanics for checking up. Nothing is put on the long finger, ever, regardless of the car and how much its worth.

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Even the most fervant anti-Renault posters on here over the years have admitted at one point that the Clio is a good car.

I personally have had a bad experience and that is not to say I wouldn't buy one again. I buy cars I like if I can afford to and importing a 2.0DCI Megane sport hatch when the time comes isn't beyond the bounds of possibility. I've driven them in Britain and liked them

My father had many Renaults that never gave trouble but me and my mates have had a lot of trouble with them. I would say everything up to the Laguna II and beyond until about 07/08 was dirt. Before that they weren't a bad car, the electrics were complex but everything else was solid enough and they were no worse than competitors.

As the thread title however is to nominate cars from the noughties I still put the Laguna II from 2001-2007/8 forward as being the worst car.

I'm not a Renault hater but I do view the cars form that period as being a low point for the manufacturer. The older stuff is very interesting and the newer stuff is keenly priced and appears to be holding up reliability wise.

Fair is fair and all, I can see they aren't a pig any more

Monty Burnz · 20-03-2011 12:46pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

Cityrover, without a doubt.

Described in the marketing as an 'urban on-roader' - wtf does that mean? A 'car'?

johnos1984 · 20-03-2011 12:47pm

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Described in the marketing as an 'urban on-roader' - wtf does that mean? A 'car'?

That a STREETWISE your thinking of

Monty Burnz · 20-03-2011 12:50pm

johnos1984 wrote: »

That a STREETWISE your thinking of

Yeah, my bad - was just going to amend my post with this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rover_Streetwise

Eric Cartman · 20-03-2011 1:41pm

savagecabbages wrote: »

come to think of it one car which actually makes me angry is the Lexus RX400h, a hybrid SUV. Its a complete contradiction. I dont mind a manufacturer going down the route of reducing emissions and impact on the environment, but a hybrid car is not a good way to do this. [A fully electric car or a good diesel is a better way to achieve this.]

This is a large SUV jeep with a 3000cc engine! Yes 3 litres! Its got an engine twice the size of many cars on the road, while pretentious people go around in them thinking they are being environmentally conscious. 'I drive a hybrid, aren't I great'. VOMIT

despite having a 3 litre engine (also if you think thats mad , look up the ls600h) that car was definitley the more money than sense buy for property developers and other boom-ists, one of the most boring cars I have ever driven , and its replacement the rx450h is even worse , atleast the 400h was 4wd , the new 450h is 2wd - and even more boring , try to corner at any speed and the dashboard lights up like a christmas tree with traction notifications and slows the car right down, 0 feeling through the wheel, definitley a contender

savagecabbages · 20-03-2011 3:02pm

Well yeah the Lx600h is worse in its own way by having a bigger engine, but at least its a car. The newer Rx is almost admitting that its cashing in on 'environmentally conscious' rich people, who want to be able to sleep at night, safe in the knowledge they are helping save the planet and still drive an SUV...

Its this whole hybrid craze that gets to me. Its a poor solution to the problem of mpg and co2 emissions, they still have internal combustion engines which consume oil all through their life, and spew out pollution. The modern, small TDi engines or fully electric cars are a much better option. I'd put any hybrid car in this thread!

As for peoples reason for buying, in ireland anyway its the low tax and vrt. You can tax an rx for €156.

If someone is wealthy enough to buy a car starting at €60,000 the cost of taxing it is hardly at the forefront of their mind.

Even Formula 1 is snubbing hybrid technology, as having two different propulsion systems in a car only adds weight without an acceptable increase in performance...

colm_mcm · 20-03-2011 4:03pm

savagecabbages wrote: »

If someone is wealthy enough to buy a car starting at €60,000 the cost of taxing it is hardly at the forefront of their mind.

Even Formula 1 is snubbing hybrid technology, as having two different propulsion systems in a car only adds weight without an acceptable increase in performance...

Probably why the 520d is such a flop in these recessionary times..

As for f1, they're not using Diesels, not using rechargeable battery power, not being taxed on emissions, nothing to do with real life really.

FGR · 20-03-2011 4:13pm

Daewoo, Nissan.

Ali Babba · 20-03-2011 4:15pm

Any Ssanyong, horrible, horrible things..........

savagecabbages · 21-03-2011 8:15pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

As for f1, they're not using Diesels, not using rechargeable battery power, not being taxed on emissions, nothing to do with real life really.

They aren't now, but he short lived KERS system using forward motion to charge batteries used for power boost, just like a hybrid, was dropped last season as the drawbacks of carrying two different propulsion systems outweighed the benefits. It hasn't been outlawed, no team wants to use it...

Hybrids are a fad, in 10 years they'll be out of fashion and replaced by much smarter, more practical systems

Big Nasty · 21-03-2011 8:57pm

jetsonx wrote: »

Chrysler 300 - the most vulgar and crass car on Irish roads bought during
the Tiger years - meant to be a cr@p car to drive also.

Love the presence of them but visibility is sh1te. The 3L CRD is reponsive for the first 5 seconds but after that it dies. Wouldn't mind taking the 6.1 Hemi for a spin on the open road though!

Thought the estate version looked really cool too! :cool:

Leonard Hofstadter · 21-03-2011 9:54pm

Toyota Auris - words cannot describe how terrible one of these are
Nissan Tiida - need I say more?

The Laguna II was not exactly what you'd call a good car even when it was working either....

alias no.9 · 21-03-2011 10:00pm

savagecabbages wrote: »

If someone is wealthy enough to buy a car starting at €60,000 the cost of taxing it is hardly at the forefront of their mind.

Just watch the number of clowns in less than two year old cars that cost €40k+ who are holding their mobiles up to their ear while driving. You're talking less than 1% for a decent handsfree but no, they've got hands. Penny wise but pound foolish, do you really think they wouldn't spend thousands to save hundreds?

ottostreet · 21-03-2011 10:09pm

savagecabbages wrote: »

They aren't now, but he short lived KERS system using forward motion to charge batteries used for power boost, just like a hybrid, was dropped last season as the drawbacks of carrying two different propulsion systems outweighed the benefits. It hasn't been outlawed, no team wants to use it...

Hybrids are a fad, in 10 years they'll be out of fashion and replaced by much smarter, more practical systems

It's not forward motion that was being used for KERS, it was heat energy from braking that was being harvested. Also, the Williams team DID want to use KERS in 2010, but it was flywheel KERS, and not braking KERS.
McLaren did want to use it also, but agreed to be part of the 'gentlemans' agreement amongst the teams not to use it.

I agree with your argument for the drawbacks outweighing the benfits, I thought it an unnecessary technology.

Zonda999 · 21-03-2011 10:12pm

The laguna II was by no means good even when it was working but to be fair, i'd still put it nowhere near the hideous yokes that are the auris and tiida. I never thought it was the worst car design wise, and was in a v6 one in france and twas okay to be driven in!

Leonard Hofstadter · 21-03-2011 10:13pm

alias no.9 wrote: »

Just watch the number of clowns in less than two year old cars that cost €40k+ who are holding their mobiles up to their ear while driving. You're talking less than 1% for a decent handsfree but no, they've got hands. Penny wise but pound foolish, do you really think they wouldn't spend thousands to save hundreds?

+1, you just have to look at the amount of people that talk about spending 20 or 30 grand on a newer car so they can get a low tax diesel, in spite of the fact that diesel could mean swirl flap failure, turbo failure, dual mass flywheel failure, injector failure, DPF failure and EGR valve failure. The price gap between certain 07 and 08 models is quite simply amazing.

savagecabbages · 21-03-2011 10:44pm

ottostreet wrote: »

It's not forward motion that was being used for KERS, it was heat energy from braking that was being harvested.

Sorry what I meant by forward motion was the mechanical energy of the car, think you explained KERS a little better than me

:D

In fairness the Laguna 2 was the first car ever to get a 5 star Ncap rating

And also it was maybe a little naive of me to think people wouldn't be drawn into paying more for a car to save money on tax... This is Ireland after all!

marketty · 21-03-2011 10:48pm

+1 on the Tiida, looks like a feckin Lada or something and i don't believe they're even that cheap,seems like a car they knew only irish people would buy.
I know it doesn't qualify as it was released this decade but Nissan have managed to top it with the Juke...god i think i just got sick in my mouth a little

Daegerty · 21-03-2011 10:48pm

captainspeed wrote: »

+1, you just have to look at the amount of people that talk about spending 20 or 30 grand on a newer car so they can get a low tax diesel, in spite of the fact that diesel could mean swirl flap failure, turbo failure, dual mass flywheel failure, injector failure, DPF failure and EGR valve failure. The price gap between certain 07 and 08 models is quite simply amazing.

False economy but tbh I'd say they just want an excuse to buy a brand new car

Dartz · 21-03-2011 11:56pm

johnos1984 wrote: »

Renault Laguna Mk2

Rubbish in every way, not just reliability.

Reliability is very poor, expensive to maintain, none of the engines are particularly good due to poor reliability and being under powered, heavy car, cheap interior plastics, uncomfortable seating, low roof line, smells funny, plastic leather, squeaky plastics, poor visibility, expensive, depreciation, old man image and ugly compared to what went before.

I really can't think of a good point about the car. Now some cars have those faults but I can't think of another that has them all

At least the Cityrover was cheap is all I'll say

And yet... and 9 years old it's become a comfy, cheap to insure, reasonably large and well equipped thing. It feels like an old leather couch that's broken in and aged gracefully.

Looks are a matter of preference. I quite like it. It feels low and sleek. Even if the turning circle is a bit crap.

There's a difference between a bad car, and an unreliable car. In general, this one must be a bit of a quare one... nothing has ever gone wrong on it beyond the normal wear and tear in a 9 year old car that might've clonked a few potholes, been driven into rampaí's a little too fast and the like.

What's gone wrong:
1 battery after 8 years
1 wheel knocked out of balance by a pothole (I got it off the last owner because he thought it was a driveshaft problem too expensive to be worth fixing.)
Tyre pressure sensor on one wheel failed.
Air-con is... quirky
And I recently had the front suspension done because the salt over the winter got in and murdered the bushings and one of the CV joints.

So what... it's a 9yo car, and keeping it going is cheaper than getting another.

And the smell, just get one of them feckin' trees.

Joe 90 · 22-03-2011 2:58pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

Probably why the 520d is such a flop in these recessionary times..

As for f1, they're not using Diesels, not using rechargeable battery power, not being taxed on emissions, nothing to do with Ireland really.

GTE · 22-03-2011 4:29pm

savagecabbages wrote: »

They aren't now, but he short lived KERS system using forward motion to charge batteries used for power boost, just like a hybrid, was dropped last season as the drawbacks of carrying two different propulsion systems outweighed the benefits. It hasn't been outlawed, no team wants to use it...

Hybrids are a fad, in 10 years they'll be out of fashion and replaced by much smarter, more practical systems

KERS is back now anyway. I think Ferrari are using this year at the very least.
Its really moving off topic I know but thought Id chuck it in there

no1beemerfan · 22-03-2011 5:06pm

johnos1984 wrote: »

Renault Laguna Mk2

Rubbish in every way, not just reliability.

Reliability is very poor, expensive to maintain, none of the engines are particularly good due to poor reliability and being under powered, heavy car, cheap interior plastics, uncomfortable seating, low roof line, smells funny, plastic leather, squeaky plastics, poor visibility, expensive, depreciation, old man image and ugly compared to what went before.

I really can't think of a good point about the car. Now some cars have those faults but I can't think of another that has them all

My father had the laguna I from 1994, 1995, 1996 and 99 and when the Lag II came out he'd one for a week to try. He handed it back after two days and said no thanks! It was a shocker compared to the mk I.

zilog_jones · 22-03-2011 8:30pm

Another vote for the CityRover - a car completely devoid of any redeeming features, and ridiculously overpriced for what it was. If they priced it right or, you know, made a good car instead, maybe Rover would still be around today? I'm not saying it single-handedly killed the company - the 25 and 45 were in dire need of modern replacements too.

johnos1984 · 22-03-2011 8:34pm

zilog_jones wrote: »

Another vote for the CityRover - a car completely devoid of any redeeming features, and ridiculously overpriced for what it was. If they priced it right or, you know, made a good car instead, maybe Rover would still be around today? I'm not saying it single-handedly killed the company - the 25 and 45 were in dire need of modern replacements too.

The Phoenix 4 knew the end was near when the ****yRover was launched

Jimmy Garlic · 23-03-2011 4:55pm

zilog_jones wrote: »

Another vote for the CityRover - a car completely devoid of any redeeming features, and ridiculously overpriced for what it was. If they priced it right or, you know, made a good car instead, maybe Rover would still be around today? I'm not saying it single-handedly killed the company - the 25 and 45 were in dire need of modern replacements too.

It was one of the only cars produced in the mid 00s that could easily have passed for something made in the mid 90s. The interior in particular was stuck in a 90s timewarp.

Full?id=5669160

It was made in India and it shows.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4yzPRJGNWA

n97 mini · 23-03-2011 5:15pm

savagecabbages wrote: »

Hybrids are a fad, in 10 years they'll be out of fashion and replaced by much smarter, more practical systems

They're not a fad, they're a bridging technology, between a 120 year old technology and a new technology, electric.

As for worst cars of the 00s... anything with a turbo, a DMF, a DPF and swirl flaps.

Eric Cartman · 23-03-2011 5:25pm

n97 mini wrote: »

They're not a fad, they're a bridging technology, between a 120 year old technology and a new technology, electric.

As for worst cars of the 00s... anything with a turbo, a DMF, a DPF and swirl flaps.

turbos are fine once you know what your at, people in Ireland moved from NA petrols to turbo diesels without actually looking into it, proper maintenance , not pushing it hard when cold and taking it handy for the last few minutes of your trip or giving the car a minute or so idling after a hard trip and your turbo will be fine

Conor_M1990 · 23-03-2011 6:47pm

That Ssangyong people carrier yoke

savagecabbages · 24-03-2011 1:15am

n97 mini wrote: »

They're not a fad, they're a bridging technology, between a 120 year old technology and a new technology, electric.

As for worst cars of the 00s... anything with a turbo, a DMF, a DPF and swirl flaps.

Electric cars outdate petrol/diesel ones by 50 or 60 years. I honestly do think they are a fad, very few manufacturers are producing hybrids, and most seem to be placing their bets on super clean/efficient petrols and diesels, with fully electric projects just over the horizon. The technology is here, it'l just take the price of petrol to spiral out of control for the demand to materialize.

Just my 2 cents. I dont expect everyone to agree with me, but I think we'll all be looking back at the 00 decade and the fashion accessory hybrids that came with it. Especially the 'big', expensive and still relatively polluting hybrids...

Dartz · 24-03-2011 1:45pm

Dartz wrote: »

And yet... and 9 years old it's become a comfy, cheap to insure, reasonably large and well equipped thing. It feels like an old leather couch that's broken in and aged gracefully.

Looks are a matter of preference. I quite like it. It feels low and sleek. Even if the turning circle is a bit crap.

There's a difference between a bad car, and an unreliable car. In general, this one must be a bit of a quare one... nothing has ever gone wrong on it beyond the normal wear and tear in a 9 year old car that might've clonked a few potholes, been driven into rampaí's a little too fast and the like.

What's gone wrong:
1 battery after 8 years
1 wheel knocked out of balance by a pothole (I got it off the last owner because he thought it was a driveshaft problem too expensive to be worth fixing.)
Tyre pressure sensor on one wheel failed.
Air-con is... quirky
And I recently had the front suspension done because the salt over the winter got in and murdered the bushings and one of the CV joints.

So what... it's a 9yo car, and keeping it going is cheaper than getting another.

And the smell, just get one of them feckin' trees.

And on saying this. Up this morning. Push starter button.

Silence.

"Non! Je suis allergique à la conduite"

24-03-2011 2:15pm

Dartz wrote: »

And on saying this. Up this morning. Push starter button.

Silence.

"Non! Je suis allergique à la conduite"

Murphy's law.
Fingers crossed it's not anything too serious, how fresh in the battery?

Guy:Incognito · 24-03-2011 2:32pm

Dartz wrote: »

And on saying this. Up this morning. Push starter button.

Silence.

"Non! Je suis allergique à la conduite"

Thats what you get for poking the bear.

I remember the original thread when you got it, I'll take it off your hands for what you paid for it.:)

Vicxas · 24-03-2011 2:37pm

im gonna wade in here and say the Fiat punto, the head gasket situation was a joke. Ive heard bad things about the 206 but my ma had one for years and only had one serious issue.

Mycroft H · 24-03-2011 2:45pm

K series wasn't a bad engine, well the smaller ones anyways. The 1.8 just have cooling problems, wasn't designed for a engine that size.

I'm going to say the smart for two was the worst car of the 2000's. Not that economical, and thats one of the main idea of a small car

savagecabbages · 24-03-2011 2:53pm

were head gaskets more common on the 90s puntos?
The 90s astra used go through head gaskets for breakfast too!

Was in a Ssanyong Rodius taxi (god what an awful name even) recently and the driver was boasting about its Mercedes engine. I was skeptical enough, but low and behold the Rodius has a Licensed Merc (possibly from 1989 but I cant find where I read that) engine built in Korea! Now i'm no expert on quality control but I refuse to accept that the Korean one is as good as the German one...

Jimmy Garlic · 24-03-2011 3:02pm

landyman wrote: »

I'm going to say the smart for two was the worst car of the 2000's. Not that economical, and thats one of the main idea of a small car

So it doesn't get 60mpg average?

Monty Burnz · 24-03-2011 3:42pm

landyman wrote: »

I'm going to say the smart for two was the worst car of the 2000's. Not that economical, and thats one of the main idea of a small car

If you are driving on country roads or motorways, it's not much of an improvement, but for city driving it is pretty cheap. And the road tax is peanuts too.

Dartz · 24-03-2011 7:38pm

RoverJames wrote: »

Murphy's law.
Fingers crossed it's not anything too serious, how fresh in the battery?

About a year. Wasn't the battery.... was a fuse that went. Oh well.

I remember the original thread when you got it, I'll take it off your hands for what you paid for it.

Thanks.... but no thanks.

Mycroft H · 24-03-2011 7:40pm

Monty Burnz wrote: »

If you are driving on country roads or motorways, it's not much of an improvement, but for city driving it is pretty cheap. And the road tax is peanuts too.

Tough to get much more then 40mpg when you get any sort of speed up. It was far too expensive to start with too

Victor Meldrew · 24-03-2011 9:54pm

The Ssangyong Rodis and others are deserving of a mention for being so crude, wasteful and willfully ugly.

Buying one must show a complete lack of taste/style and sense.

Rover were pretty reprehensible too.

As for reliability, it's relative, I had loads of Astras and they were bomb proof. My issue with them was their evil handling and deathly brakes.

Peugot have also had a dismal decade. I almost consider driving one of those a character flaw.

johnos1984 · 24-03-2011 9:58pm

For all of the CityRover fans

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Offical-Rover-CityRover-Press-Pack-/130499369193

dubtom · 24-03-2011 10:54pm

Victor Meldrew wrote: »

The Ssangyong Rodis and others are deserving of a mention for being so crude, wasteful and willfully ugly.

Buying one must show a complete lack of taste/style and sense.

Rover were pretty reprehensible too.

As for reliability, it's relative, I had loads of Astras and they were bomb proof. My issue with them was their evil handling and deathly brakes.

Peugot have also had a dismal decade. I almost consider driving one of those a character flaw.

I bought a Rodeus,6 years ago,180K on it now. It's never let me down. I'll live with my lack of taste, style and sense thanks. Funnily enough,I've carried thousands of people in that car and nobody has ever called it ugly, they've been blown away by the spec, couldn't believe the room inside, commented on the how comfortable it was, but never called it ugly. My only gripe is that the suspension is too hard and their selling used for a song, but I'd buy one again.

alias no.9 · 24-03-2011 11:12pm

dubtom wrote: »

I bought a Rodeus,6 years ago,180K on it now. It's never let me down. I'll live with my lack of taste, style and sense thanks. Funnily enough,I've carried thousands of people in that car and nobody has ever called it ugly, they've been blown away by the spec, couldn't believe the room inside, commented on the how comfortable it was, but never called it ugly. My only gripe is that the suspension is too hard and their selling used for a song, but I'd buy one again.

It may make sense as a workhorse taxi, but would you buy one with your own money (i.e. not as a business investment)?

dubtom · 25-03-2011 12:57am

alias no.9 wrote: »

It may make sense as a workhorse taxi, but would you buy one with your own money (i.e. not as a business investment)?

If I had a large family yes, it's perfect. Although I must admit that they seem overpriced now at 45K,mine cost 42. Are SSangyong the only brand that has increased in price?

Jimmy Garlic · 25-03-2011 3:01am

dubtom wrote: »

If I had a large family yes, it's perfect. Although I must admit that they seem overpriced now at 45K,mine cost 42. Are SSangyong the only brand that has increased in price?

You bought a SSangyong for 42 grand?...

Darth Vader is more easier on the eye than a Pyongyang.

Conor_M1990 · 25-03-2011 3:11am

dubtom wrote: »

If I had a large family yes, it's perfect. Although I must admit that they seem overpriced now at 45K,mine cost 42. Are SSangyong the only brand that has increased in price?

45k :eek:

Id sooner live with the vasectomy then pay that

Jimmy Garlic · 25-03-2011 3:22am

Conor_M1990 wrote: »

45k :eek:

Id sooner live with the vasectomy then pay that

He paid 42k for his.. i suppose if he is happy with it:D grand

I could buy a nice gaff in Bulgaria for that kind of money.

alias no.9 · 25-03-2011 9:23am

dubtom wrote: »

If I had a large family yes, it's perfect. Although I must admit that they seem overpriced now at 45K,mine cost 42. Are SSangyong the only brand that has increased in price?

It would probably keep your kids fit, there's no way they'd want to be dropped off at school in a Rodius.

The worst cars of the 00's.

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