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NTL phone service

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  • 18-05-2007 5:12pm
    #1
    PauloMN
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 10,857 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    Hope this is the right forum for this. I have NTL broadband and got a leaflet and phone call from NTL telling me about their new phone service. Free line rental for 3 months and then €4 per month thereafter.

    Is this just a VoIP service? I am (kind-of) trying Freespeech at the moment as I had intended to drop Eircom completely, but haven't been overwhelmed with the quality of the service. The main problem is the delay which doesn't hugely annoy me but can seem to annoy others I've spoken to using that connection.

    If the NTL service is not going to be as reliable as a standard phone line in terms of quality and availability, then I don't see the point in getting it.

    Anyone on here used it?


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    #2
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,331 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    It is VOIP with QOS implemented so it might be slightly better. But if you have QOS on yoiur router then I don't think you will benefit much.

    It might not do any hamr to trial broadtalk and blueface also. I'm happy with Freespeech now that they seem to provide caller-id.


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    #3
    RangeR
    Registered Users Posts: 7,265 ✭✭✭RangeR


    jimmycrackcorm wrote:
    It is VOIP with QOS implemented so it might be slightly better. But if you have QOS on yoiur router then I don't think you will benefit much.

    It might not do any hamr to trial broadtalk and blueface also. I'm happy with Freespeech now that they seem to provide caller-id.

    QOS on your router is totally different from QOS on the NTL network. It's apples and oranges. Your router can only QOS what goes through it. After the VoIP leaves your router, it doesn't get priority over the internet.

    With NTL QOS [in theory, anyway], the VoIP call gets priority until it leaves the NTL network. For most local calls the "leaving the network" part is probably to a phone line.

    Not even blueface or "broadtalk" can compete with that QOS.

    Then again, NO QOS can work miracles with a ****e broadband package :P


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    #4
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,331 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    IrishTLR wrote:
    QOS on your router is totally different from QOS on the NTL network. It's apples and oranges. Your router can only QOS what goes through it. After the VoIP leaves your router, it doesn't get priority over the internet.

    With NTL QOS [in theory, anyway], the VoIP call gets priority until it leaves the NTL network. For most local calls the "leaving the network" part is probably to a phone line.

    Not even blueface or "broadtalk" can compete with that QOS.

    Then again, NO QOS can work miracles with a ****e broadband package :P

    Due to the nature of a cable modem broadband delivery, your BB has no chance of doing any QOS as all other cable modems on your block are sharing the same range of frequencies. All the NTL ATA does is apply the same QOS as any decent router does.

    while they do have an advantage in their own network for QOS, it is generally not the ISP network that has the voip issues as most ISPs have adequate bandwith. You only have to set up an unrestricted P2P download to see the negative effects in your own LAN without QOS.

    My NTL 6mb connection shows consistent top speeds and low latencies so I'd doubt that paying NTL an extra tenner would get better results.


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    #5
    sirlinux
    Registered Users Posts: 651 ✭✭✭sirlinux


    I would guess the ntl router tags the traffic so it get's priority at edge routers (maybe something as simple as dscp with an ef tag), and i would say they have strict routing policy to drop other traffic in favour of there own voip traffic, the qos on ntl's voip product is always going to be better than your own qos as it's end to end.


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    #6
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    I asked about it here too
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055097232

    I could never get consistent call quality with Blueface + NTL. It varied from ok to unusable. The main problem with it was the latency on NTL. Skype seemed better, but I never made extensive use of it. I was wondering, and haven't checked it out yet. Regarding the NTL offer can you cancel without penalty during the 3 month free trial?


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    #7
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,470 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    Got a call from NTL yesterday trying to sell me their VoIP setup, I was happy to tell them that I already have such a service, I don't pay line rental as its pay as you go :)

    Thanks blueface :)
    Though I should use it more...


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    #8
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,331 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    BostonB wrote:
    I asked about it here too
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055097232

    I could never get consistent call quality with Blueface + NTL. It varied from ok to unusable. The main problem with it was the latency on NTL. Skype seemed better, but I never made extensive use of it. I was wondering, and haven't checked it out yet. Regarding the NTL offer can you cancel without penalty during the 3 month free trial?

    I seriously doubt that NTL's own service woudl be any better. I've got consistent latency and so my freespeech is fine. In fact I was trying to talk to someone the other night on my mobile phone but the connection was bad so I used fring on the phone to call him back using my voip and that worked much better.


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    #9
    MHP
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭MHP


    I had the UPC phone service installed yesterday. It's very good. I tried three other VoIP providers and had problems with quality and CallerID on all of them. No problems (so far) with UPC.
    The modem is a Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) EPC2203.
    Looks like I'll be porting my Eircom number to UPC soon :)


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    #10
    dubadubdub
    Closed Accounts Posts: 118 ✭✭dubadubdub


    MHP wrote:
    I had the UPC phone service installed yesterday. It's very good. I tried three other VoIP providers and had problems with quality and CallerID on all of them. No problems (so far) with UPC.
    The modem is a Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) EPC2203.
    Looks like I'll be porting my Eircom number to UPC soon :)

    Now that you've had this a few days I'd be interested to hear how consistent the call quality has been for you. Thinking about making the move myself.

    Also which NTL BB package are you on?

    Thanks in advance.


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    #11
    MHP
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭MHP


    dubadubdub wrote:
    Now that you've had this a few days I'd be interested to hear how consistent the call quality has been for you. Thinking about making the move myself.

    Also which NTL BB package are you on?

    Totally consistent - no difference between it and the Eircom line even with simultaneous heavy internet usage. I've sent off my number porting form.

    I have the 3Mb package.


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    #12
    dubadubdub
    Closed Accounts Posts: 118 ✭✭dubadubdub


    MHP wrote:
    Totally consistent - no difference between it and the Eircom line even with simultaneous heavy internet usage. I've sent off my number porting form.

    I have the 3Mb package.

    Thanks for the reply.

    Do you use a wireless DECT phone with it? When I tested Blueface there was a real drop in call quality when I connected a wireless phone.

    They just replace the modem?

    No more questions after this I promise!


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    #13
    MHP
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭MHP


    I've used a DECT phone and a wired phone with it - both good.

    They take away the old modem and replace it with a Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) EPC2203. This has Ethernet or USB connections (I use Ethernet) and two phone sockets. The only complaint I have with it is that the green LEDs are too bright, but that was easily cured by sticking some red masking film over them.

    Something I didn't mention is that this is not a SIP system but MGCP/NCS. There are no user-configurable settings so you can't, for example, set up call forwarding.


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    #14
    koloughlin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 97 ✭✭koloughlin


    One comment on using you ISP's phone service, it's one more way they lock you in and make it difficult to ever change to another provider. It's similar I suppose to the ISP specific email addresses that they provide. My opinion (for what it's worth :) ) is to get an email provider to provide email, a VoIP provider to provide VoIP and ISP to provide access. That way you can pick the ones that meet your needs best, and you can change with minimum fuss if you find that the service isn't as you expected.


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    #15
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 65,025 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    Finally the first triple play in Ireland then!
    Cabaal wrote:
    Got a call from NTL yesterday trying to sell me their VoIP setup, I was happy to tell them that I already have such a service, I don't pay line rental as its pay as you go :)

    Blueface have a €10 per month line rental (unless you don't need a geographic number), so €4 is a lot cheaper

    Edit: just looked at the ntl website and the call charges are very high compared to VOIP providers like blueface. I'll stay put for the moment :)


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    #16
    koloughlin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 97 ✭✭koloughlin


    unkel wrote:
    Blueface have a €10 per month line rental (unless you don't need a geographic number), so €4 is a lot cheaper

    Doesn't the €10 per month from Blueface also include 300 minutes of calling, so it's not really equivalent to line rental.


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    #17
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,470 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    koloughlin wrote:
    Doesn't the €10 per month from Blueface also include 300 minutes of calling, so it's not really equivalent to line rental.

    It does your right,
    I used to use the blueface 9.99 service but really didn't need the 051 number anymore and wasn't using it enough (hardly ever used all the 300 free min) so I was happy to change to a PAYG a/c and get a 076 number.

    Recently I've given up using my ATA and phone and instead find it easier to use my macbook and a USB headset :)

    The only real advantage NTL have over Blueface is they can assign better QOS to their service so it won't be affected as much by heavy downloading which might be useful for heavy downloaders :)


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    #18
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    Cabaal wrote:
    ...
    The only real advantage NTL have over Blueface is they can assign better QOS to their service so it won't be affected as much by heavy downloading which might be useful for heavy downloaders :)

    Or contention effected by the same downloaders...I'm guessing?


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    #19
    Rosser
    Registered Users Posts: 591 ✭✭✭Rosser


    Does anyone know if you can run a centrally monitored house alarm if you use something like NTL phone. I've got a phonewatch system so presumably that's out but if I switched the monitoring to someone else can VOIP do this? Cheers


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    #20
    mwrf
    Registered Users Posts: 522 ✭✭✭mwrf


    Rosser wrote:
    Does anyone know if you can run a centrally monitored house alarm if you use something like NTL phone. I've got a phonewatch system so presumably that's out but if I switched the monitoring to someone else can VOIP do this? Cheers


    there could be problems, data doesnt travel well on voip.


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    #21
    dubadubdub
    Closed Accounts Posts: 118 ✭✭dubadubdub


    Rosser wrote:
    Does anyone know if you can run a centrally monitored house alarm if you use something like NTL phone. I've got a phonewatch system so presumably that's out but if I switched the monitoring to someone else can VOIP do this? Cheers

    You could get your Eircom Phonewatch alarm fitted with Eirlink. This enables them to monitor your alarm via GSM, like a mobile phone. Last time I checked with Phonewatch they charged around €270 to install it and the monthly monitoring fee remained the same.


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    #22
    Rosser
    Registered Users Posts: 591 ✭✭✭Rosser


    Thanks - I'll look into that


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    #23
    Aquos76
    Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 9,032 Mod ✭✭✭✭Aquos76


    Got Ntl phones service installed today and I must admit, so far the quality has been fantastic. No difference from an eircom line. I have taken the anytime package from them also, So €14 a month for unlimited land line calls and line rental on a line as good a quality as a land line is excellent value. I didn't bother with porting my number over as I had already cancelled with my current provider.

    The only flaw I can find is only one of the telephone sockets on the back of the modem actually works. The one closest to the power socket. Is this the same with others?

    Also, did anyone else have any problems with their email passwords since the change over. My mail settings were spot on before I got the new modem installed, but now its giving me incorrect details error.

    One final thing, at this moment in time, Ntl cannot facilitate customers who want their number to show up as a private number when a call is being made. They say its a software related problem and should be sorted in the near future. In the mean time, I must use the 141 prefix.


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    #24
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    Those you of you finding the phone service good quality. Have you had any problems with your NTL before?


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    #25
    MHP
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭MHP


    Yes, only line 1 works.

    No problems here with email passwords.

    I got my first bill since installing the phone service. It's supposed to be free for the first six months and €4.02 per month thereafter. Guess what! They charged me €15!


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    #26
    Aquos76
    Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 9,032 Mod ✭✭✭✭Aquos76


    MHP wrote:
    Yes, only line 1 works.

    No problems here with email passwords.

    I got my first bill since installing the phone service. It's supposed to be free for the first six months and €4.02 per month thereafter. Guess what! They charged me €15!

    €15, I take it that you also took the €10 package for unlimited calls too. Did you check to see if there are any credits on your bill. i think the way they do it is charge yo for all services and then credit you back whatever promotion you are on.


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    #27
    Aquos76
    Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 9,032 Mod ✭✭✭✭Aquos76


    BostonB wrote:
    Those you of you finding the phone service good quality. Have you had any problems with your NTL before?

    Generally I find their BB service very consistent.


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    #28
    MHP
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭MHP


    Aquos76 wrote:
    €15, I take it that you also took the €10 package for unlimited calls too. Did you check to see if there are any credits on your bill. i think the way they do it is charge yo for all services and then credit you back whatever promotion you are on.

    No, I took the basic package. The bill reads as follows:

    Digital Telephony - Basic......15.00
    6 Mth Promo: TV/Broadband/Phone......-2.73

    NTL's billing department couldn't figure it out either. They said they'll credit me with €15 on my next bill and hope it doesn't happen next time.


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    #29
    stoneroses
    Closed Accounts Posts: 56 ✭✭stoneroses


    Aquos76 wrote:

    Also, did anyone else have any problems with their email passwords since the change over. My mail settings were spot on before I got the new modem installed, but now its giving me incorrect details error.

    .

    With the mail change your user name format has changed and must be as follow Fname.Sname@upcmail.ie YOU MUST INCLUDE THE @UPCMAIL.IE as part of the username.


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    #30
    Aquos76
    Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 9,032 Mod ✭✭✭✭Aquos76


    I got my email sorted out. They had reset my password at their end for some unknown reason.


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    #31
    MHP
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭MHP


    Got a call from NTL this morning, telling me that my Eircom number has been ported. I sent the form to them only two weeks ago - not bad!


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