Ring Of Honor thread

estebancambias · 14-07-2007 7:52pm #1

Do i have the power to make my own threads? Well if I am I think this should be done. The reason I make the thread is because the question I wanted to ask does not merit a full topic.

I think it's a good idea but if not, what are you going to do.

My question is, will ROH ever have a show in Ireland? I think they should as they would easily get 2,000 people in my opinion.

Also do you prefer ROH back in 2005 or now? I loved the roster back then because it had people like Gibson, Kendrick and London, Punk, Joe etc.

I still love it, but I felt more in touch with the roster back then.

estebancambias · 14-07-2007 8:00pm

Wait I take back London I doubt he was in ROH at the time but I'm sure Spanky was.

the flananator · 14-07-2007 8:10pm

Personally, I feel while the matches are still of a high standard, ROH has lost its identity.

As for an Irish show; 2000 people? I doubt it.

estebancambias · 14-07-2007 8:12pm

Really? I thought it would be a shoe in. What arena would they hold it in?

Fozzy · 14-07-2007 8:49pm

I wouldn't imagine they'd get 2000 in Ireland, although I'm sure there'd be plenty of British fans who'd go too. Anything's possible if they advertised it enough though and if Irish promotions started doing better business then ROH could possibly do a show here in the distant future. I'm sure they'd do Canada first

I loved ROH when Joe was on top and Punk was entertaining every single time he appeared on camera, there were some great matches and feuds back then. I'm lovin it at the moment too though, they're developing more characters and the angles are better now I think. I can't wait til Jimmy Jacob returns!

The Sparrow · 14-07-2007 9:26pm

Fozzy wrote:

I wouldn't imagine they'd get 2000 in Ireland, although I'm sure there'd be plenty of British fans who'd go too. Anything's possible if they advertised it enough though and if Irish promotions started doing better business then ROH could possibly do a show here in the distant future. I'm sure they'd do Canada first

I loved ROH when Joe was on top and Punk was entertaining every single time he appeared on camera, there were some great matches and feuds back then. I'm lovin it at the moment too though, they're developing more characters and the angles are better now I think. I can't wait til Jimmy Jacob returns!

Just out of curiousity Fozzy, where do you watch ROH? DO you get tapes or watch it online or on TWC? I`d like to give it a watch, but everytime I see it its a one off show and I`d prefer to watch it in some sort of order so I could follow the angles.

Or do you get your "cousin" to send it over?

estebancambias · 14-07-2007 10:02pm

The Wrestling channel is weird because it looks like sometimes ROH follows no particular pattern and they just throw up what ever show they want.

Yeah Jimmy Jacob's return will be crazy. I think after Nigel wins the title he will.
James Gibson needs to return.

The Sparrow · 14-07-2007 10:38pm

estebancambias wrote:

The Wrestling channel is weird because it looks like sometimes ROH follows no particular pattern and they just throw up what ever show they want.

Yeah that really puts me off watching ROH on TWC. For me at least, wrestling is all about storylines and justifications. Why does Wrestler A wanna fight Wrestler B. As great as a one-off match could be, I want to know the background and the storyline leading up to it. It would annoy me watching random shows when it should be episodic.

Fozzy · 14-07-2007 10:55pm

woooo232 wrote:

Just out of curiousity Fozzy, where do you watch ROH? DO you get tapes or watch it online or on TWC? I`d like to give it a watch, but everytime I see it its a one off show and I`d prefer to watch it in some sort of order so I could follow the angles.

Or do you get your "cousin" to send it over?

Mainly a mix of dvds and my "cousin". Some of my mates buy dvds now and again too. I don't think I've ever watched ROH on TWC

I've pretty much kept up to date with ROH ever since they started out, there's still plenty of shows I haven't seen, but I can understand what you mean with the random shows. I'd suggest giving their first ppv a watch, there's links in the video thread. That show is more of an introduction to ROH than anything else, it's not the best show they've done but the commentators do a good job of explaining who the guys are and why they're fighting

estebancambias · 14-07-2007 11:06pm

I think I would give Respect is Earned an 8/10. I think it got alot of fans for ROH. Once ROH goes mainstream we will need another promotion to fill the void.

HorseRadish · 15-07-2007 12:07am

Why the hell not I say. I'd be first in line for sure

Mr.Nice Guy · 15-07-2007 12:59am

Ring of Honor - the showcase of the overrated.

If it's not the wrestlers trying to kill themselves with some insane move it's the fans trying to steal the show with their 'support'.

It is in my eyes nothing but a poor man's ECW (Heyman's one that is).

Before the ROH brigade weigh in with their usual "Have you ever watched ROH?" question. Answer: yes and I think it's pants.

estebancambias · 15-07-2007 1:12am

That is outragous. ROH is not 'pants'. They get a passionate crowd, what is the problem? A crowd in my opinion goes along way to making a wrestling match. Well actually ROH have made profit unlike the original ECW, they must be doing something right. Perhaps the matches are too long for your attention span? That is not an insult, I'm just trying to figure out how you could hate ROH.

Mr.Nice Guy · 15-07-2007 1:24am

My favourite match of the year so far is Cena vs Michaels from London which went near an hour so my attention span is fine thank you very much. If anything it seems many ROH fans suffer some sort of attention disorder since the wrestlers seem to pull out whacky moves every minute and drag out the finish to a match for ETERNITY.

What's the problem with the crowd? Passion is one thing but being wedged up your own arse is another. Those fans love themselves more than the actual talent.

And on ECW, it's laughable of you to compare it to ROH when ECW at least went national unlike ROH living off of its DVD sales. Go Kobashi!

Fozzy · 15-07-2007 1:42am

There was a time when I thought ECW was the best thing to ever happen wrestling, but I enjoy ROH so much more. What's the big deal with going national anyway? TNA's done it and they still make less profit than ROH. There's absolutely nothing wrong with living off dvd sales if they're as good as they are for ROH

All too often in WWE you get nonsensical angles and multiple breaks in continuity, along with guys who don't deserve to be where they are. None of that happens in ROH which is one of the many reasons I enjoy it. I honestly don't know if I could watch WWE if it weren't for promotions like ROH, no matter how boring a WWE show ends up I know I can rely on ROH to pick me back up and restore some faith in me

I don't think ROH is perfect, but I get a lot more entertainment out of their shows than I do with any other promotion. The fans don't bother me in the slightest, they're enjoying the show as much as I am usually so I can't begrudge them their opportunity to make some noise

Mr.Nice Guy · 15-07-2007 2:37am

Going national is relevant when someone seeks to draw a comaprison with a company that not only went national but by doing so grabbed pro wrestling by the balls and shook up the industry.

I believe the negatives far outweigh the positives when it comes to ROH.

estebancambias · 15-07-2007 12:00pm

''favourite match of the year so far is Cena vs Michaels '''

Co-sign. Cena demonstrating that he can be carried to an amazing match, however my problem was, why did they make this better than their WM match?

Double C · 15-07-2007 2:30pm

ROH fans do tend to over do it a little at times, starting chants for the sake of making noise, most notably in the UK for the Briscoe vs Briscoe match. "Your both awesome" has to be the worst chant ever. That being said, the atmosphere for the PPV was tremendous (great move by Gabe to encourage the fans not to use the word Awesome in any chants). That kind of atmosphere is bound to have a positive effect on the match, as shown with Marufuji vs Romero, that match was way better than it should have been.

I agree on the point of wrestlers killing themselves. They overdo the high risk moves, especially Mark Briscoe, even though I hold Doi responsible for the botched SSP at All Star Extravaganza III. The other one I can think of is Jack Evans vs Ricky Reyes from 2005, Evans landed right on the back of his head, how he got up after it I'll never know.

estebancambias wrote:

Also do you prefer ROH back in 2005 or now? I loved the roster back then because it had people like Gibson, Kendrick and London, Punk, Joe etc.

For me, 2005 stands out, storyline wise. The Summer of Punk is my favourite ROH story ever. I highly recommend all the shows from Death Before Dishonor III through to Punk the Final Chapter. That's 6 shows. Money well spent.
That year also had the Embassy vs Generation Next feud which was great, mainly for Shelley and Nana.

2006 was better match-wise with Danielson's run. Overrated or not, he's one hell of a wrestler. Also, the CZW feud was class. 2007 is shaping up nicely too.

Mr. Nice Guy wrote:

Before the ROH brigade weigh in with their usual "Have you ever watched ROH?" question. Answer: yes and I think it's pants.

That's a bit hard to take from a Cena fan. If it's not your cup of tea, it's not your cup of tea, fair enough. Pants though? Strange phrase to use.

Vince135792003 · 16-07-2007 9:18am

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

And on ECW, it's laughable of you to compare it to ROH when ECW at least went national unlike ROH living off of its DVD sales. Go Kobashi!

Ring of Honor make money. Not many wrestling groups do that. It doesn't matter how you do it and the I like the fact that they know were there at. They should be praised for the business model they have.

They're not running huge buildings like some groups we know this year and losing a ton of money. They are working within their size and thats a good thing.

gimmick · 16-07-2007 9:54am

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Go Kobashi!

What does that have to do with an ROH discussion? :rolleyes:

Anyway, ROH was better in 2005. It had better star power then, with Gibson, Punk, Spanky, Joe, Styles, Daniels, Shelley etc. Storylinewise it was pretty hot also. That is not to say that 2007 isn't great. Sure it has lost its way somewhat due to TNA using their power to make wrestlers exclusive to their company, as is their right I guess, but there are still many many positives, namely The Briscoes, Nigel McGuiness, Morishima, we had the culmination of the Jacobs Whitmer fued.

Re living off DVD sales - So what? If it turns profit that cant be seen as a negative can it?

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Ring of Honor - the showcase of the overrated.

Explain this please? And if its going to be another diatribe about Punk and or Danielson spare us and copy a link to your previous ones. Wrestling, IMO, by its very nature is very much open to opinion of what constitute over rated and genuine class. For example some people love to watch, say, a Cena Vs Lashley match, while others would imagine that as painful, and would prefer to watch a fairly techical affair between Danielson and Shelley and vice versa. Does that make me say that Cena is over rated because i dont care for his upcoming match? No, It just means I dont care for it. I may not like Cena but I can certainly appreciate that he is probably the hardest worker in wrestling today, something I dont think I would have ever said as recently as a month or two ago.

Re an Irish show - If ROH could only pull 1200ish in Liverpool, it would be lucky to pull 500 in Ireland.

estebancambias · 16-07-2007 2:45pm

Wow. There is only a small number of us then.

Mr.Nice Guy · 17-07-2007 10:45pm

gimmick wrote:

Re living off DVD sales - So what? If it turns profit that cant be seen as a negative can it?

Well they're moving into PPV now so obviously living off of DVD sales is not their preferred situation.

gimmick wrote:

Explain this please? And if its going to be another diatribe about Punk and or Danielson spare us and copy a link to your previous ones. Wrestling, IMO, by its very nature is very much open to opinion of what constitute over rated and genuine class. For example some people love to watch, say, a Cena Vs Lashley match, while others would imagine that as painful, and would prefer to watch a fairly techical affair between Danielson and Shelley and vice versa. Does that make me say that Cena is over rated because i dont care for his upcoming match? No, It just means I dont care for it. I may not like Cena but I can certainly appreciate that he is probably the hardest worker in wrestling today, something I dont think I would have ever said as recently as a month or two ago.

Sorry to again bring up ROH's former messiah CM Punk but I must. This guy was hailed as the greatest wrestler of his generation, the next HBK blah, blah, blah. He was supposedly starring in 5 star matches and yet he comes to WWE and...he's actually quite average! Fancy that! Funny how he hasn't managed even a very good match in WWE thus far despite numerous WWE appearances. Oh MNG give him time and wait until he and Elijah Burke have a one-on-one match I was told. And what happened? It was mediocre. In fact Punk seemed a shoe-in to be made ECW champion and they didn't even have faith in him to hold the strap and instead went with a guy who had been floundering on Heat for months.

Of course Danielson is ROH's new messiah and if I dare say a bad word against him it must be another "diatribe". Yawn.

Don't you realise that the bulk of these die-hard messiahs who you and other ROH fans hero-worship are actually more often than not out of their depth when they make it to the big leagues? The whole company is overrated right down to the fans who think they're smarter than they actually are.

Fozzy · 17-07-2007 11:08pm

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Well they're moving into PPV now so obviously living off of DVD sales is not their preferred situation.

It was more a situation of it being too good to turn down. ROH have to pay very little and they get increased revenue and exposure from ppv

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Don't you realise that the bulk of these die-hard messiahs who you and other ROH fans hero-worship are actually more often than not out of their depth when they make it to the big leagues? The whole company is overrated right down to the fans who think they're smarter than they actually are.

I don't know what other ways I can put it. CM Punk entertained me more than any other wrestler in the last five years when he was in ROH. That was not due to him being in ROH, it was not due to me thinking that someone not in WWE is in some way more talented, it was nothing to do with me being "smarky". If CM Punk did exactly what he did in ROH now in WWE, if anything I'd probably be even more entertained by him than I was. Do you think that what we're seeing CM Punk do now is what I enjoyed so much when he was in ROH?!

I just don't understand your view at all! You seem to think that a ROH fan will look at ROH in a different way than they would to WWE. As if an average match which happened in WWE would be called crap by someone like me, but if the exact same match happened in ROH I'd call it great. That just isn't the case! I'm a wrestling fan, I don't care where the matches are coming from, if they're good they're good, end of story

I can't fathom your "out of their depth" comment either. WWE does not employ all the best wrestlers in the world, and if you think they do then you're delusional

I really just don't understand your hatred for ROH! It almost comes across like you're bitter that some wrestling fans can enjoy the matches there and have a good time watching them. Maybe it's just not for you for whatever reason, but personally I enjoy most of what ROH puts on as I think the majority are very good wrestling matches

Vince135792003 · 18-07-2007 12:18am

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Well they're moving into PPV now so obviously living off of DVD sales is not their preferred situation.

.

Well any decent company in wrestling is always looking to make new fans and find new ways to make money. This is just a very low risk way for ROH to do it. And it still really revolves around dvds.

They hope that people who order the ppv will like what they see, become a fan and order many, many dvds.

Mr.Nice Guy · 18-07-2007 1:09am

Vince135792003 wrote:

Well any decent company in wrestling is always looking to make new fans and find new ways to make money. This is just a very low risk way for ROH to do it. And it still really revolves around dvds.

They hope that people who order the ppv will like what they see, become a fan and order many, many dvds.

I don't object to the way they're going about things but I do think it's premature to be comparing them to companies who have done a hell of a lot more.

Fozzy wrote:

I don't know what other ways I can put it. CM Punk entertained me more than any other wrestler in the last five years when he was in ROH. That was not due to him being in ROH, it was not due to me thinking that someone not in WWE is in some way more talented, it was nothing to do with me being "smarky". If CM Punk did exactly what he did in ROH now in WWE, if anything I'd probably be even more entertained by him than I was. Do you think that what we're seeing CM Punk do now is what I enjoyed so much when he was in ROH?!

But I'm talking about his wrestling ability. I'll agree that his persona in ROH was far better than his two dimensional babyface role that he has in WWE. However is he in the top 5 or top 10 wrestlers in WWE? I would say certainly not and so I just don't get the hype for the guy.

Fozzy wrote:

I just don't understand your view at all! You seem to think that a ROH fan will look at ROH in a different way than they would to WWE. As if an average match which happened in WWE would be called crap by someone like me, but if the exact same match happened in ROH I'd call it great. That just isn't the case! I'm a wrestling fan, I don't care where the matches are coming from, if they're good they're good, end of story.

Well hate's a strong word and I don't think I hate them but I find the whole company from the wrestlers down to the fans to be totally pompous and self-absorbed. The style of wrestling in ROH just isn't good in my opinion.

Fozzy wrote:

I can't fathom your "out of their depth" comment either. WWE does not employ all the best wrestlers in the world, and if you think they do then you're delusional.

You saying the Great Khali isn't one of the world's best?

Of course they don't always employ the best wrestlers in the world but to make it to the top in WWE you have to have a certain x-factor and I don't think ROH has any guys who fit that criteria right now. Bryan Danielson does not ooze charisma in my view either!

Fozzy wrote:

I really just don't understand your hatred for ROH! It almost comes across like you're bitter that some wrestling fans can enjoy the matches there and have a good time watching them. Maybe it's just not for you for whatever reason, but personally I enjoy most of what ROH puts on as I think the majority are very good wrestling matches.

I'm not that I'm bitter it's just that there are certain fans in the wrestling community who enjoy hyping up wrestlers who really are not proven commodities. These tend to be the same people who proclaimed Mistico the greatest wrestler of 2006 (still can't believe how absurd that was).

I suppose Morishima will win it this year over Shawn Michaels. Then the lunatics will well and truly be running the asylum.

Fozzy · 18-07-2007 1:54am

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

I'm not that I'm bitter it's just that there are certain fans in the wrestling community who enjoy hyping up wrestlers who really are not proven commodities. These tend to be the same people who proclaimed Mistico the greatest wrestler of 2006 (still can't believe how absurd that was).

That Wrestling Observer Award wasn't for "greatest wrestler of the year", it was for the guy who "has the ability to carry an entire promotion by themselves". Mistico sold out more arenas than any other wrestler last year and was immensely important to CMLL. He absolutely deserved that award. There seems to be a bit of a backlash on him now though, he got booed pretty heavily at an event at the weekend

For the record, Bryan Danielson won the closest thing to a "greatest wrestler of the year" award and I would not argue with it

As for comparing ROH to ECW, Lance Storm wrote a nice piece about his ROH experience here and he compares it to ECW by the third paragraph

Vince135792003 · 18-07-2007 9:24am

Fozzy wrote:

That Wrestling Observer Award wasn't for "greatest wrestler of the year", it was for the guy who "has the ability to carry an entire promotion by themselves". Mistico sold out more arenas than any other wrestler last year and was immensely important to CMLL.

Exactly, I remember an interview with Steve Sims, a guy that covers lucha who said that on weekends Mistico could wrestle six times in one day!

Its also why Tito Ortiz was second in that same vote. He is by no means the best MMA fighter but as a draw he was an incredible one in 2006.

gimmick · 18-07-2007 9:34am

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

I suppose Morishima will win it this year over Shawn Michaels. Then the lunatics will well and truly be running the asylum.

Comments like that make your entire arguments pretty much worthless. Morishima and HBK is like comparing Liverpool FC to Donegal GAA. Both Very good at what they do, but quite different at the same time. Crap comparison I know.

I don't object to the way they're going about things but I do think it's premature to be comparing them to companies who have done a hell of a lot more.

Who is comparing them to other companies?

Well hate's a strong word and I don't think I hate them but I find the whole company from the wrestlers down to the fans to be totally pompous and self-absorbed. The style of wrestling in ROH just isn't good in my opinion.

The wrestlers? How so? Some fans, well ok, but you seem to be taking that entirely from looking at the ROH forum, which i dont understand why you look at anyway as you just dont like ROH fans.

Totally pompous and self absorbed? All ROH fans? Can the same be said about people who think you have to be in the WWE to have made it big?

WTR the style, well thats your opinion. I and many others like it. if you dont like it, dont watch it, and save time.

Bryan Danielson does not ooze charisma in my view either!

No one has ever said Danielson oozes charisma. he is a good heel and a great wrestler.

In fact Punk seemed a shoe-in to be made ECW champion and they didn't even have faith in him to hold the strap and instead went with a guy who had been floundering on Heat for months.

It is too early to give Punk the EVW world title, as he has not held any belt in WWE yet. It would have been bad business and poorly thought out. At least Nitro has been around for a few years, been involved in the IC scene for quite a while and a multi time tag champ. Thats better business. Had Punk been given the title, people would be crowing all to quickly that he isn't deserving and not paid his dues.

Of course Danielson is ROH's new messiah and if I dare say a bad word against him it must be another "diatribe".

You said before that Danielson is a rest hold/headlock merchant when that is quite clearly wrong. Say bad all you want, but until you actually know what you are talking about with regard to him maybe dont comment. Again, if you just dont like his style, fine, but dont say he is crap just because you think so.

These tend to be the same people who proclaimed Mistico the greatest wrestler of 2006 (still can't believe how absurd that was).

Do you watch Lucha?

Fozzy · 19-07-2007 4:20pm

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Liverpool FC don't play Gaelic football so I don't get your point. My point is that a guy who truly deserves the award will probably miss out because he's not a hero to die-hards but rather the mainstream wrestling community.

Shouldn't die-hard's opinions count for more though? If you look at the music industry, the mainstream opinion is that the likes of Westlife, Crazy Frog and Girls Aloud are the best music going. But if you ask for the opinions of die-hard music fans, who appreciate the creativity, originality, etc. of artists, you'd get a much different view of the best music

Anyway, the mainstream wrestling community is basically the WWE wrestling community, right? I would say that if all you watch is WWE then you should be disqualified from voting on who the best wrestler is, as you have no idea if you only have a partial view. I would also say that Wrestling Observer Newsletter subscribers are some of the most informed fans in the world and so they would have an even better idea of who's most important to their promotion than the casual fan who just watches WWE. Depending on what happens later this year, I could see Rampage Jackson giving anyone a run for their money in this award for 2007

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Sorry but who are you to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. I've seen his numerous chin-locks and rest-holds and he's another Randy Orton in that regard. I even read an ROH fan mark-out once because someone chanted "boring" to one of his holds and he proceeded to do a whole string of these holds. Apparently this made Danielson "cool" whereas I think it makes him look limited. Just because we disagree on his style is no reason to start bitching.

I know you're a fan of the likes of Finlay and Regal, which is why I find your opinion of Danielson to be so strange. Regal has said that training Bryan is one of his proudest achievements in interviews, and Regal is a big reason why Bryan changed his style to a more technical style when he was learning from him. You can say what you want about Chris Benoit the person, but as a wrestler you can't argue that he knew his stuff and he mentioned Bryan in the same breath as Regal and Finlay when talking about the best technical wrestler in the world. I just don't get how you can compare Danielson to Orton rather than those guys. He's like an American version of Regal

Mr.Nice Guy · 19-07-2007 7:00pm

Fozzy wrote:

Shouldn't die-hard's opinions count for more though? If you look at the music industry, the mainstream opinion is that the likes of Westlife, Crazy Frog and Girls Aloud are the best music going. But if you ask for the opinions of die-hard music fans, who appreciate the creativity, originality, etc. of artists, you'd get a much different view of the best music

Well I think when it comes to awards the mainstream is usually fair in music. You'll see bands like Snow patrol, Arctic Monkeys etc picking up gongs and i reckon they're good bands myself. I think die-hard wrestling fans tend to favour lesser known wrestlers which in my view makes it a farce.

Fozzy wrote:

Anyway, the mainstream wrestling community is basically the WWE wrestling community, right? I would say that if all you watch is WWE then you should be disqualified from voting on who the best wrestler is, as you have no idea if you only have a partial view. I would also say that Wrestling Observer Newsletter subscribers are some of the most informed fans in the world and so they would have an even better idea of who's most important to their promotion than the casual fan who just watches WWE. Depending on what happens later this year, I could see Rampage Jackson giving anyone a run for their money in this award for 2007.

I don't agree as the WWE is the pinnacle when it comes to wrestling. To me your argument is like saying the Player of the Year award in England should not be judged with Premiership players but on players who excel in lesser leagues. I don't think that's fair. I think the best players are from the highest level and I think those who excel at wrestling's hihgest level - HBK, Edge, Cena etc. should be obvious contenders instead of nobodies like 'Rampage Jackson' (never heard of him honestly).

Fozzy wrote:

I know you're a fan of the likes of Finlay and Regal, which is why I find your opinion of Danielson to be so strange. Regal has said that training Bryan is one of his proudest achievements in interviews, and Regal is a big reason why Bryan changed his style to a more technical style when he was learning from him. You can say what you want about Chris Benoit the person, but as a wrestler you can't argue that he knew his stuff and he mentioned Bryan in the same breath as Regal and Finlay when talking about the best technical wrestler in the world. I just don't get how you can compare Danielson to Orton rather than those guys. He's like an American version of Regal

It's true Regal has spoken in glowing terms about Danielson but I don't see them as being in the same league. To me he is all hype. Samoa Joe is another guy that ROH fans have hyped up and I do have a lot of admiration for him but as for Danielson, I don't get the fascination. Put Samoa Joe on a big PPV event and I reckon he'd deliver. I don't think Danielson would.

ShawnRaven · 19-07-2007 7:27pm

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

nobodies like 'Rampage Jackson' (never heard of him honestly).

A pretty big name in UFC at the minute, hardly a nobody (as opposed to half the people the cameras focus on in the front row every monday night on RAW) but if you don't follow UFC then it's understandable that you didn't hear of him.

VR!