Empty commercial property

galwaybabe · 17-12-2008 8:47pm #1

Some of you may have seen this video already as I posted it on the Galway forum yesterday.
Filmed in November '08, this video attempts to document some of the empty commercial property in Galway. It is really shocking how much there is.

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=6sEzeW7TU5g&fmt=18

The_Conductor · 17-12-2008 9:42pm

galwaybabe wrote: »

Some of you may have seen this video already as I posted it on the Galway forum yesterday.
Filmed in November '08, this video attempts to document some of the empty commercial property in Galway. It is really shocking how much there is.

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=6sEzeW7TU5g&fmt=18

Unfortunately the Galway situation is probably a lot better than it is in quite a few other locations around the country......
I did an experiment today- I walked from outside the Dail on Kildare Street, Dublin 2, as far as the top of Grafton street- via Molesworth Street, Hibernian Mall and Lemon Lane. I counted 16 vacant commercial properties.......
Its endemic all over the country.

Its almost impossible to run a commercial enterprise- its just far too expensive.

The one shop that I've been looking at is the vacant shop on Eyre Square- which used to be a speciality shoe shop- its had 5 different tenants since February, and is now vacant yet again.

This little country of ours is in serious trouble.........

dny123456 · 17-12-2008 10:10pm

this little world of ours is in trouble too!

SimpleSam06 · 18-12-2008 6:47am

Would it be an idea for government regulation of commercial rents to be put in place? I'm not a fan of regulation in general, but extortionate rents are literally sucking the lifeblood out of the economy. Money spent on paying a commercial lease is money not spent paying employees or expanding the business, as well as pushing prices up generally, leaving less money in the pockets of everyone else.

Dob74 · 18-12-2008 6:58am

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Would it be an idea for government regulation of commercial rents to be put in place? I'm not a fan of regulation in general, but extortionate rents are literally sucking the lifeblood out of the economy. Money spent on paying a commercial lease is money not spent paying employees or expanding the business, as well as pushing prices up generally, leaving less money in the pockets of everyone else.

Thankfully commercial rents are droping but not fast enough. Hopefully the saving will trickle down to the consumer quickly.

The_Conductor · 18-12-2008 8:28am

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Would it be an idea for government regulation of commercial rents to be put in place? I'm not a fan of regulation in general, but extortionate rents are literally sucking the lifeblood out of the economy. Money spent on paying a commercial lease is money not spent paying employees or expanding the business, as well as pushing prices up generally, leaving less money in the pockets of everyone else.

Commercial rents are just one aspect of a wider problem.
We are an incredibly expensive country in which to do business.
An even bigger drag on business is the Irish welfare state, and the very high minimum wage. Its very difficult to persuade people that there is a price to pay for having a high standard of living- irrespective of who ends up having to pay that price.

If you compare the Irish model with the French or Swedish model- the stark contrast is the Irish taxpayer is not willing to personally shoulder the bulk of the expense of providing the welfare state (on top of the incredible mess its in). So- business pay for it in 'rates', increased VAT, a silly minimum wage, Employers PRSI etc etc etc.

Yes- commercial rents have been very high- but its more symptomatic of wider problem, than the answer to the problem itself. We need massive widescale reform. People don't like reform or hardships. The current government certainly doesn't have the guts- look at them rolling over on education, the farmers, the medical cards- in short- hold a little protest, shout and scream a bit- and you'll get what you want. What the hell way is that to do business?

connundrum · 18-12-2008 11:39am

On a drive down to Galway yesterday I noticed maybe 3 or 4 vacant retail/commercial parks.

I think there were one or two outside Lochrea which were fully built and ready with nothing in them, and I honestly don't see anyone going into them any time soon.

Was it greed to build all these unnecessary commercial units on every patch of land available? I think so.

Nearly as bad as all the unwanted apartments tbh.

Best use for a vacant commercial park/group of units - convert it into a school.

galwaybabe · 18-12-2008 11:30pm

connundrum wrote: »

On a drive down to Galway yesterday I noticed maybe 3 or 4 vacant retail/commercial parks.

I think there were one or two outside Lochrea which were fully built and ready with nothing in them, and I honestly don't see anyone going into them any time soon.

Was it greed to build all these unnecessary commercial units on every patch of land available? I think so.

Nearly as bad as all the unwanted apartments tbh.

Best use for a vacant commercial park/group of units - convert it into a school.

That's exactly what they did in Briarhill. The school relocated to an industrial unit while they replaced the prefabs.

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan · 23-12-2008 5:26pm

Commercial rate have been too slow to adjust to market conditions creating a big tipping point which were on at the moment.

One property owner is quoted as saying “It’s awful times, I’m basing the price on the mortgage (they took out to buy the unit in early 2007), that and my small mark up so i’ve no room to negotiate on price.” Thats in an estate that has been 95% empty for the last year and "phase 2" just finished doubling supply in the estate.

They just don't seem to get that taking a letting at below their ideal rent is better than supporting empty shell.

brianthebard · 23-12-2008 6:23pm

Dob74 wrote: »

Thankfully commercial rents are droping but not fast enough. Hopefully the saving will trickle down to the consumer quickly.

Lolz I love the use of the phrase trickle down, without a hint of irony.

professore · 23-12-2008 6:48pm

smccarrick wrote: »

Commercial rents are just one aspect of a wider problem.
We are an incredibly expensive country in which to do business.
An even bigger drag on business is the Irish welfare state, and the very high minimum wage. Its very difficult to persuade people that there is a price to pay for having a high standard of living- irrespective of who ends up having to pay that price.

Agree

smccarrick wrote: »

If you compare the Irish model with the French or Swedish model- the stark contrast is the Irish taxpayer is not willing to personally shoulder the bulk of the expense of providing the welfare state (on top of the incredible mess its in). So- business pay for it in 'rates', increased VAT, a silly minimum wage, Employers PRSI etc etc etc.

Agree

smccarrick wrote: »

Yes- commercial rents have been very high- but its more symptomatic of wider problem, than the answer to the problem itself. We need massive widescale reform. People don't like reform or hardships. The current government certainly doesn't have the guts- look at them rolling over on education, the farmers, the medical cards- in short- hold a little protest, shout and scream a bit- and you'll get what you want. What the hell way is that to do business?

Agree except for the schools bit. If the cuts are focussed properly there's no issue. For example the supports in schools for kids that have difficulties of one sort or another (the sort of kids that have reading or maths problems etc who would normally drop out early but with a bit of focussed attention would turn out fine) is being cut. The pupil-teacher ratio thing is a red herring IMHO. It is equivalent to Pfizers cutting their new drugs development programme to save money. Sure it saves money in the short term but it will cost money massively in the medium to long term. BTW I am not a teacher.

Why not cut the Th1nk contraception ads and the Power of one ads for a start? They're both stupid and a waste of public money. Close all open tribunals. Buy vacant properties from bankrupt builders at knockdown prices and convert to schools. Instead of bailing out the banks make a € 2 Bn government run fund available to SME's to borrow from and f**k the banks who have shown themselves to be worse than the govt. Change the planning laws for certain essential infrastructure to allow things like windfarms and onshore gas processing facilities to be built without allowing unelected vested interest groups to hijack and hold up to the detriment of the rest of us. Make the OAP's pay for medical treatment if their income is over a certain threshold (not 700 PW that's too high !). Do not subsidise health insurance for OAPs - only well-off OAPs can afford it in the first place.

Start an immigration program to invite more people here to fill the empty houses.

And finally .... IF you're a politician don't send me a christmas card.

bloggerB · 27-12-2008 10:18pm

smccarrick wrote: »

Unfortunately the Galway situation is probably a lot better than it is in quite a few other locations around the country......
I did an experiment today- I walked from outside the Dail on Kildare Street, Dublin 2, as far as the top of Grafton street- via Molesworth Street, Hibernian Mall and Lemon Lane. I counted 16 vacant commercial properties.......
Its endemic all over the country.

Its almost impossible to run a commercial enterprise- its just far too expensive.

The one shop that I've been looking at is the vacant shop on Eyre Square- which used to be a speciality shoe shop- its had 5 different tenants since February, and is now vacant yet again.

This little country of ours is in serious trouble.........

Landlords should be made to pay rates on empty shops, this would encourage them to drop rents

Victor · 27-12-2008 11:52pm

professore wrote: »

Why not cut the Th1nk contraception ads and the Power of one ads for a start?

But both campaigns will save people money in the short to medium term. If people are spending less on energy (or babies) they have more money for other things.

Buy vacant properties from bankrupt builders at knockdown prices and convert to schools.

How many are suitable? Are there lots of suitable vacant buildings in the new suburbs which are the ones most in need of schools?

Instead of bailing out the banks make a € 2 Bn government run fund available to SME's to borrow from and f**k the banks who have shown themselves to be worse than the govt.

You mean like they did with ACC in the old days, where the local TD could get your loan written off?

Change the planning laws for certain essential infrastructure to allow things like windfarms and onshore gas processing facilities to be built without allowing unelected vested interest groups to hijack and hold up to the detriment of the rest of us.

The existing law is perfectly good. All that needs to be done is for the law to be applied.

What you suggest is akin to a robber baron's charter.

Start an immigration program to invite more people here to fill the empty houses.

And where will these people work?

bloggerB wrote: »

Landlords should be made to pay rates on empty shops, this would encourage them to drop rents

Agreed.

johnnyskeleton · 27-12-2008 11:55pm

Victor wrote: »

And where will these people work?

Why, they will work building more houses of course.

SimpleSam06 · 28-12-2008 9:18am

Victor wrote: »

The existing law is perfectly good.

There are some tens of thousands of people stuck in traffic in Galway every day that would disagree, I'm afraid.

Victor · 28-12-2008 2:58pm

There is a diference between law (planning acts) and policy (county development plans).

The problem with Galway is so many people live on the west side and work on the east side.

SimpleSam06 · 28-12-2008 6:28pm

Victor wrote: »

There is a diference between law (planning acts) and policy (county development plans).

The problem with Galway is so many people live on the west side and work on the east side.

Apparently bog cotton is enough to stop the permission for an outer bypass that would have solved many issues, objections primarily received from non-locals. The planning acts need to be reformed.

Victor · 30-12-2008 12:22am

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

objections primarily received from non-locals.

Does where you are from determine whether you are right or wrong?

galwaybabe · 01-02-2009 10:26pm

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

objections primarily received from non-locals.

Objections about decisions made by non-locals would be more like it.

Empty commercial property

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