Cardinal will only step down if told by Pope

Winty · 15-03-2010 01:25PM #1

"The head of the Catholic Church in Ireland, facing calls to resign over revelations that he did not report complaints against a paedophile priest to police, said today that he will only step down if told to by the Pope."

from todays Irish Indo

Question:

Did Brady not break the law, perverting the course of justice?

WindSock · 15-03-2010 01:29PM

Well that's no surprise, the man only does what he is told. He has no mind of his own to work with.

Fratton Fred · 15-03-2010 01:30PM

Winty wrote: »

from todays Irish Indo

Question:

Did Brady not break the law, perverting the course of justice?

Yes.

The law should be changed so that anybody. Regardless of who you are, that is aware of any child abuse, or has child abuse reported to them, must report it. Otherwise they are as guilty as the person who carried it out.

Take away any ambiguity, any privileges and any decision making by people who are not trained to make those decisions.

mike65 · 15-03-2010 01:32PM

The Bish Cardinal needs a right kick up the jacksie

Elenxor · 15-03-2010 01:36PM

The Catholic Church only follows the Laws of the Catholic Church...
The rest of us can just F*** off as far as they are concerned!!!:mad:

genericguy · 15-03-2010 01:40PM

at this stage, i have no respect for anyone who goes to mass anymore. i used to think hey, live and let live, but it has gotten to the stage where anyone who attends, and gives them money is a fcuking idiot. they raped you, they raped your kids, and they blame it on satan. and then they asked for you to donate the money to pay the legal bills. and you still go, and you still give it to them. fcuk all you catholics.

PeterIanStaker · 15-03-2010 01:40PM

Elenxor wrote: »

The Catholic Church only follows the Laws of the Catholic Church...
The rest of us can just F*** off as far as they are concerned!!!:mad:

Exactly.

Ze cardinal vos only following orders:mad:

Winty · 15-03-2010 01:43PM

genericguy wrote: »

at this stage, i have no respect for anyone who goes to mass anymore. i used to think hey, live and let live, but it has gotten to the stage where anyone who attends, and gives them money is a fcuking idiot. they raped you, they raped your kids, and they blame it on satan. and then they asked for you to donate the money to pay the legal bills. and you still go, and you still give it to them. fcuk all you catholics.

Thanks Generic Guy

I do agree, but back to the OP, did Brady break the law and if he did why will the courts not step up and do something

Jip · 15-03-2010 01:48PM

Did you hear that guy on Morning Ireland ? I thought I heard it all from the catholic church but this morning was really breathtaking, the excuses he was giving were unbelievable. And then the Monsignor guy defending him on Pat Kenny was from a different planet.

Winty wrote: »

Did Brady not break the law, perverting the course of justice?

According to the monsignor idiot he wasn't breaking any laws and had no obligation to tell the state or gardai about anything.

prinz · 15-03-2010 01:48PM

genericguy wrote: »

at this stage, i have no respect for anyone who goes to mass anymore.... fcuk all you catholics.

Why what did I do?

I haven't abused anyone, raped anyone, I haven't excused anyone for the crimes they have committed, I fully support prison sentences for anyone who was involved directly or was involved in the cover up.

By the by the majority of abuse takes place in the home.. by parents and family members. **** all you parents, and grandparents, and children, and uncles, and aunts and cousins....

scargill · 15-03-2010 01:49PM

Winty wrote: »

Thanks Generic Guy

I do agree, but back to the OP, did Brady break the law and if he did why will the courts not step up and do something

That's what struck me when I heard him on the radio this morning. He reckons he did at the time what he felt was right. It wasn't right - it was wrong. It was wrong then and it is still wrong now. He didn't report a suspected crime to the authorities - surely he has questions to answer over this ?

Hope the guards are knocking on his door as we speak - I doubt it though, because the clergy are "different" in this country for some reason.

PeterIanStaker · 15-03-2010 01:50PM

Winty wrote: »

Thanks Generic Guy

I do agree, but back to the OP, did Brady break the law and if he did why will the courts not step up and do something

This is a case of Canon law -vs- Civil law, failure to report a crime is an offence under Civil law, but I dont know how Canon Law interprets it. He is trying to wash his hands of swearing these victims to silence by invoking some grey area of Canon Law.

North_West_Art · 15-03-2010 01:50PM

genericguy wrote: »

at this stage, i have no respect for anyone who goes to mass anymore. i used to think hey, live and let live, but it has gotten to the stage where anyone who attends, and gives them money is a fcuking idiot. they raped you, they raped your kids, and they blame it on satan. and then they asked for you to donate the money to pay the legal bills. and you still go, and you still give it to them.

+1

how many great minds have been lost to this institutions' program of brainwashing and fear? A male monarchy guilty of the most henious crimes against humanity... stop and think for a minute, and wonder how you would feel today, if no-one had told you that this bullsh1t ever existed

Winty · 15-03-2010 01:52PM

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

This is a case of Canon law -vs- Civil law, failure to report a crime is an offence under Civil law, but I dont know how Canon Law interprets it. He is trying to wash his hands of swearing these victims to silence by invoking some grey area of Canon Law.

Thanks Peter

Now things are clear, its the Church looking afer their house and dam the rest.

Mark200 · 15-03-2010 01:53PM

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Yes.

The law should be changed so that anybody. Regardless of who you are, that is aware of any child abuse, or has child abuse reported to them, must report it. Otherwise they are as guilty as the person who carried it out.

Great, and thanks to your narrow-mindedness the children in question who suffered child abuse would now be criminals.

It's disgusting that this cardinal didn't report it, but how did he break the law??? I'm pretty sure preventing the course of justice only applies to things like people lying to the police about what they saw. He didn't prevent anything, he just omitted to do something about it.

ScumLord · 15-03-2010 01:53PM

prinz wrote: »

Why what did I do? I haven't abused anyone, raped anyone, I haven't excused anyone for the crimes they have committed, I fully support prison sentences for anyone who was involved directly or was involved in the cover up.

By the by the majority of abuse takes place in the home.. by parents and family members. **** all you parents, and grandparents, and children, and uncles, and aunts and cousins....

The church is an organisation that has along reputation of crimes against humanity and supporting them in any way means you contributing to the vile acts they continue to carry out.

There's nothing wrong with being Christian but after everything the catholic church has done I don't understand how anyone could support them.

Elenxor · 15-03-2010 01:54PM

Winty wrote: »

Thanks Generic Guy

I do agree, but back to the OP, did Brady break the law and if he did why will the courts not step up and do something

Because .........

They are afraid of the "silent majority"....the ones who insist that it's only a few bad apples and the rest are good and holy people.

Personally I think if the 'rest' were good and holy, they would resign from the

church en masse (no pun intended)

scargill · 15-03-2010 01:54PM

prinz wrote: »

By the by the majority of abuse takes place in the home.. by parents and family members. **** all you parents, and grandparents, and children, and uncles, and aunts and cousins....

True, but what the Catholic Church did was to conspire to keep it secret, and to keep the information from the authorities. It orchestrated a cover up through every level of its hierarchy from priests, bishops, cardinals and popes. that makes it different in my eyes.

super_furry · 15-03-2010 01:54PM

Same old, same old from the Catholic Church. Nothing ever changes with those in power and they're probably wondering what all the fuss is over themselves.

anti-venom · 15-03-2010 01:54PM

I heard Maurice Dooley on Pat Kenny's show this morning and he has put us straight on who is to blame. Apparently it was the police's failure in not catching Brendan Smyth that resulted in his continuing to abuse kids long after in became known he was a paedo. It was NOT Brady's place to make a complaint to the police. It beggars belief. But what's even more baffling is that they have any congretation left at all to preach to.

sbsquarepants · 15-03-2010 01:55PM

Seeing as the pope is now implicated in a cover up scandal of his own, i predict absolutely nothing to be done. Anybody surprised??

prinz · 15-03-2010 01:57PM

scargill wrote: »

True, but what the Catholic Church did was to conspire to keep it secret, and to keep the information from the authorities. It orchestrated a cover up through every level of its hierarchy from priests, bishops, cardinals and popes. that makes it different in my eyes.

+1 many were involved in a cover up. I hope they all pay the price.

bleg · 15-03-2010 01:58PM

Winty wrote: »

Thanks Peter

Now things are clear, its the Church looking afer their house and dam the rest.

That's pretty much been the unwritten rule of the Catholic Church since its inception.

prinz · 15-03-2010 01:58PM

ScumLord wrote: »

The church is an organisation that has along reputation of crimes against humanity and supporting them in any way means you contributing to the vile acts they continue to carry out.
There's nothing wrong with being Christian but after everything the catholic church has done I don't understand how anyone could support them.

Replace the Church with democracy and Christian with democrat...

Would you give up on democracy itself?

PeterIanStaker · 15-03-2010 01:59PM

Winty wrote: »

Thanks Peter

Now things are clear, its the Church looking afer their house and dam the rest.

I'm afraid so. Its sick. However, I want these "holy men" to keep coming out with this hypocritical nonsense, it shows them for what they are - evil. There is no way these people can believe in the Hell they threaten their flock with, because if they did, they wouldnt behave in this fashion. The whole enterprise, not only Catholicism but all religions, is built around power, control and fear.

Nodin · 15-03-2010 02:00PM

betafrog wrote: »

Fuck you Dolphin, and fuck you Whale!!!!

..and the poxy protoplasm that spawned the pair of them.

super_furry · 15-03-2010 02:03PM

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0315/abuse.html

Just reading this and every time I think I can't be more apauled or sickened by the Irish Catholic Church, they shock me.

"Speaking on Today with Pat Kenny, Monsignor Maurice Dooley, former Professor of Canon Law, said Cardinal Brady had no obligation to report anything to gardaí.

At the weekend, Dr Brady confirmed that he was present in 1975 when two young victims of the late Fr Brendan Smyth were asked to sign an oath of secrecy."

Sick, evil men.

sbsquarepants · 15-03-2010 02:04PM

I think the majority of church hierarchy over the years, over the centuries in fact, better hope that they peddle nothing more than bullsh.it, cos if there is such a thing as hell, they have got to be on the short list for admission. I'm actually sorry i'm an athiest because the thoughts of those bastards burning for all eternity makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside!

ScumLord · 15-03-2010 02:05PM

prinz wrote: »

Replace the Church with democracy and Christian with democrat...

Would you give up on democracy itself?

The church isn't anywhere close to democracy. There's a problem with politicians being more interested in their own career than doing the job they where elected to and there is greed and corruption but they answer to the people and we can get rid of them. The church considers itself a law onto itself, it's convicts people that have done nothing that out of the way (like having a child) to cover up the horrible things they've been up to the whole time.

prinz · 15-03-2010 02:10PM

ScumLord wrote: »

The church isn't anywhere close to democracy. There's a problem with politicians being more interested in their own career than doing the job they where elected to and there is greed and corruption but they answer to the people and we can get rid of them. The church considers itself a law onto itself.......

The problem is the Church isn't a law unto itself!!! It's up to our government to take some action. I would happily sit back and watch anyone involved in abuse or covering up abuse get dragged out of their office or church and subjected to the law of the land same as everyone else.

seamus · 15-03-2010 02:13PM

prinz wrote: »

Why what did I do? I haven't abused anyone, raped anyone, I haven't excused anyone for the crimes they have committed, I fully support prison sentences for anyone who was involved directly or was involved in the cover up.

But you're still providing support for the institution which perpetrated this cover up. It wasn't a few small groups here and there, the entire organisation from top to bottom was involved in this. Their rulebook basically "enforced" this cover up, and not once have they made any apologies for it or otherwise admitted that what they did was completely and utterly wrong.

So by supporting that organisation, you're tacitly approving of their actions in covering up the sexual abuse.

I'm not saying that you need to abandon your faith, far from it, but why aren't the congregations putting pressure on their own priests to force change from the bottom up? Withhold church donations, hold protests outside your own churches - let Rome know that its followers won't be happy until the organisation takes responsibility and changes itself completely.

By going to mass, you're supporting Rome and you're support what the organisation has done.

Your faith does not hinge on the existence of this organisation. The existence of the organisation hinges on your faith. Let them know that you're losing it.

But in general, the congregations refuse to accept that there was any wrongdoing.

Some choice quotes from newstalk interviews outside a church:

"Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty? Until a court finds him guilty, he's innocent" - Except that he's admitted it. Therefore, guilty.

"Sure it was thousands of years ago. It all happened so long ago now, we need to operate in the present" - WTF. That "thousands" is not a typo. One woman actually thinks it was thousands of years ago. And she didn't sound old.

So the congregations are not only supporting an institution that engaged in the wholesale cover up of child sexual abuse, but they also refuse to hear any evidence about it.

So therefore, Fnck you Catholics, fnck the whole lot of you.

Cardinal will only step down if told by Pope

Should he be charged and step down? 227 votes

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