.NET & SQL SERVER v VB6 & MySQL

yop

Lads

Have to come up with a sceal for a comparison .NET & SQL SERVER v VB6 & MySQL between them two.
We as in the developers want NET & SQL SERVER but the IT manager who is a muppet wants VB6 & MySQL.

Can you give me any points why one is better than the other or why I would use one over the other.

thanks in advance

bonkey

So...you want one configuration, but can't explain to your boss why, so you want some help?

So is your choice to "want" it based on anything?

Your boss is the muppet, but you can't explain why you want one over the other?????

That sounds like a "we want shinier toys" decision to me....but how and ever.....

To be honest, a decision like that (for me) would be highly based around issues like existing competencies, the nature of the project, etc. etc. etc. as much as they would be around issues like stability, scalability, support, etc. etc. etc.

Depending on the background detail, I could see any mix of VB6/VB.Net + MSSQL/MySql being the "right" one for a project....but its usually obvious why.

jc

yop

Your boss is the muppet, but you can't explain why you want one over the other?????

Where did I say I can't explain why I want it? I know why it is better, all I want is more opinions.

I asked for opinions not drivel.

RicardoSmith

VB6 + MySql is a lot cheaper in a lot of ways than just the ticket price. They wouldn't have to retrain all you muppets for starters. Then theres a lot more functionality in NET & SQL SERVER. Depends if you need any of that extra functionality or not doesn't it. Do a needs analysis and a function matrix of both your requirements and what the software provides.....then make the conclusion prove your point ala Mr Bush/Blair. Who cares if he doesn't want it. You should be looking out for numero uno. Personally I kinda like VB6 and MySql as a solution. Its like the RyanAir of solutions.

Oh and pissing off the mod is not a good idea....especially when hes the only one that replied. How to make friends and influence people eh?

Kernel32

SQL Server = $$, around $10k per CPU I think
MySql = Free

SQL Server has advanced capabilities, Stored Procs, functions, user defined types, triggers, replication, scheduled jobs, and works well under load.

Mysql has, dunno really, some stuff but not much advanced as far as I know, a decent database but not for enterprise development

If the projects is a mickey mouse client server application with not many users and doesn't require stored procs then use MySql.

As for VB and VB.Net my vote is use C#, VB6 is legacy, VB.net is pretty decent but C# is kick ass.

yop

An update on what I have found out in case anyone comes up against the same "issue"

SQL Server - Processor licence + 1 Server Licence - about 6k Euro

MYSQL - $450 licence unless the source is released.

MySQL - No relationships, view, triggers, procedures, integrity.
Very fast for text searches, Google use it as one of their DB's

VB.NET - Inheritence, ADO.NET built on XML allowing easier integration into legacy systems, ADO.NET uses OLEBD which is faster than ODBC, which MYSQL has to use.
CLR - allowing integration of code developed in C# and VB.NET
Faster development due to improved IDE and availability of web tools.

The arguement on Friday was that "if u can learn .NET then it is the same as JAVA so you will pick it up easier or PERL"
"You do not need triggers or SP's or relationships, you can do all this work in code"

The Corinthian

The use of .NET may well be overkill for whatever you’re building; the problem being that we don’t actually know what it is that you’re building.

And that’s really the issue - you’re looking for a definitive answer that .NET/SQL Server is better than VB6/MySQL on an absolute level, which is just not true. I’d concur with bonkey here; depending on your project requirements, in-house skill set and budget either could be better for the job.

I won’t deny that .NET/SQL Server may be the way to go for your project, but at present, you’ve given me no reason to believe that it should be any more than using VB6/MySQL (which could be more than adequate for the job and a hell of a lot cheaper).

If I were being cynical, I’d suspect that you just wanted to get some .NET/SQL Server experience on your CV.

Just as a side note on MySQL licence fees; they don’t apply if we’re talking about an internal project that won’t get distributed/sold.

yop

This is a full crm product that will be used both desktop/laptop application and web based. Time scale is going to be 1 - 1.5 years to complete. Heavily reliant on security, reliability and scalability.
There will be a strong emphasis on server / db processing with little or no db activity occuring in the applications. SP's, triggers and relationships are critical as there will be a number of areas that this will cover including, customer support, asset management, product detail, support etc.
These guys just cannot see the need to have SQL Server over MySQL.
My reasoning for it is that I have worked on a similar project using SQL Server, ASP & VB6.
.NET will incorporate the ASP & VB side of things and speed up developement, MySQL as far as I can see is not sufficent and will increase the timescale of the project due to the need for coding of tasks that could be carried out on SQL Server.

Admittedly it will be good to have .NET but unless this place hits the wall then it makes not odds to me.

This product will be sold as part of an add-on to another non software product so the licensing issue will come up, but talking to them here on Friday, they reckon if no one says anything then they will not have to buy licenses.

The Corinthian

Right. That’s all a little clearer then.

Much if not most of the application business logic would be at the database tier. Hence it does make sense, on a basis of efficiency, to use a database that supports precompiled stored procedures, transactions and the like.

SQL Server may appear the way to go, but this is where business requirements kick in. If you intend to sell this application for less that €5k (targeting the smaller SME’s) then the licence fee for SQL Server will knock it’s use on its head, forcing you to use MySQL or another free database, such as PostgreSQL (which does support precompiled stored procedures, transactions and the like, but is *nix based and would probably have to run as Cygwin port if used on Win32 - so not an attractive option either).

I would not recommend selling a product that includes unlicensed software. You might get away with it with the odd bespoke development, but you will eventually get caught with a product. And crucified.

The question of VB6 vs. .NET is a little different. I’m no great fan of .NET, but in this case if you go for the VB6 option, you’re going to have legacy support and maintenance issues within three to five years. Again this is a business requirements issue, whereby it may already be accepted that the lifespan of version 1 of your product will be only a few years and that time/cost to market is of greater importance.

They should nonetheless be aware that the product, if built using VB6, may well require significant if not complete redevelopment as it will become increasingly difficult (and expensive) to maintain as VB5/6 moves to become a legacy platform.

The most likely solution may well be a compromise - .NET with MySQL (with perhaps DB logic stored in a COM/DCOM based middleware tier). This would probably satisfy the necessary business requirements as well as create a scalable application that will not be based upon a legacy technology within five years.

A compromise will also most probably satisfy the necessary political requirement of allowing your IT manager to save face in the argument. That is ultimately the clincher to such discussions.

bonkey

Originally posted by yop
Where did I say I can't explain why I want it? I know why it is better, all I want is more opinions.

I asked for opinions not drivel.

Well, the first thing I try to do when asking for information is to present what I know, so that I can avoid being retold it - wasting both the time of the person who's gonna go to the trouble of answering my qestion, and my time in reading it.

I made the mistake of assuming you would work in a similar manner. Clearly not.

My apologies.

SP's, triggers and relationships are critical

Well MySQL isn't even an option then, as it doesnt support all of these. Also, for a "real" business app (as this would appear to be), there is just no room for a DB system which doesnt have full transactional support.

The VB6/ASP vs VB.NET is - as has been pointed out - slightly trickier to be convincing on....but here your best bet is probably to draw on your experience with VB6/ASP (As you pointed out) and explain why certain time-losses will not be incurred under .NET. Compatability and supportability in the coming years should also be the other factor here.

Originally poster by The Corinthian
SQL Server may appear the way to go, but this is where business requirements kick in. If you intend to sell this application for less that €5k (targeting the smaller SME’s) then the licence fee for SQL Server will knock it’s use on its head,

True, but at that stage, you could probably consider using SQL Server Desktop Edition (or MSDE, or whatever they call it these days).

Alternately, if your boss *really* insists a free database, and you want support for the functionality mentioned, and for it to run on Windows, have a look at sapDB.

jc

yop

The middle tier could be an option alright, maybe getting one or the other maybe my compromise in this case.
I do think that the DB side of things in this case is more important and when the time comes for redeveloping the VB6 side of things then that will be a couple of years, should be interesting

thanks lads