Number Portability and Prices

BigEejit

I searched and there are dozens of threads on number portability, mostly full of conjecture ... but what I want to know is will call charges change? and will prepay phones get cheaper? (or dearer)

jesus_thats_gre

Its impossible to predict whether call charges will drop significantly. Meteor's dropped big time recently, whether this was to do with FMNP I am not sure. It probably was to get ready for it nice and early.

I have noticed operators introducing a number of initiatives to keep customers by offering upgrades, free rental and free minutes or call credit. I feel prices will only really begin to drop once customers begin to shift in large numbers. They are employing numerous methods to try and keep a customers.

An interesting tactic they have employed are the introduction of self service features and personalised services. Vodafone's myVodafone web site as an example of what they are doing. Banks are doing the same thing with their phone banking and online banking services. Moving bank would be more hassle than its worth, having to change all ur DDs, Standing orders, credit cards, pin numbers and so on just is not worth it sometimes.

Vodafone and O2 are trying to do the same with their email services, Instant Messaging and other such services. These services have not been launched solely to improve revenues. You can keep your number, but you cant keep your email address and so on. This is very important to some people.

Thats just my opinion.

cupthehand

can u go from Vodafone ready to go to O2 speakeasy and keep the whole same no.?
and if so how do u go about this do u have to get a new sim card etc....?

jesus_thats_gre

I am nearly 100% sure you will be able to bring any number over. I am also nearly sure you will need to get a new sim card!

mooman_00

Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
I am nearly 100% sure you will be able to bring any number over. I am also nearly sure you will need to get a new sim card!

afaik and im probably wrong but the way it has been so far is that you can change any number(contract) from one provider over to a bill pay number(contract) of another provider ie. speakeasy over to vodaphone bill pay or vodaphone bill pay over to o2 bill pay. However i dont think you can change a pay as go number(contract) over to a speakeasy number(contract). Also you have to get a new sim card as you old one is 'owened' by your previous provider and only recgonisible by their network.

What exactly is worrying about having to get a new simcard if its only the number you want to keep? All you have to do is transfer the numbers from your phonebook.

cupthehand

Enquired about this earlier and it seems that full cross network transfer of pre-paid no's will be available from the end of July

Emmo

You can now move any number range provisioned on any network onto another network for post or prepaid services.

You will need to get a new sim card but your phone and phone number will be the same.

Emmo

DaithiSurfer

what about a vodaphone hpone that is locked to vodaphone.
Can i get it unlocked by the new provider?

Is this portability where you are for example, a voda customer and 087 and you switch to O2 or Meteor but you get to keep the prefix aswell ie, your number still starts 087 in that case?
mm

mooman_00

Originally posted by Man
Is this portability where you are for example, a voda customer and 087 and you switch to O2 or Meteor but you get to keep the prefix aswell ie, your number still starts 087 in that case?
mm

i wouldnt think so, i dont think you could have an 086/085 087 number on a different network......you change the sim card to get the new prefix 086/085 and ditch the 087 prefix.

Id like to know what catches they'll have for moving ie 'move to the 087 network for free*'

*warning : involves the submission of the rights to your soul

jesus_thats_gre

Full number portability means you can be on the O2 network and still keep your old 087 number and visa versa...

It has been operating in the UK now for sometime and it seems to have had a significant effect on reducing call charges. Mind you, the UK's market is so much bigger, some would argue that this had a massive impact on charges coming down. One benefit is that you can simply calls your operators customer care and say that you wish to make use of FMNP and transfer to a different network. They will offer you quite alot to change your mind, I would hold out for an upgrade myself

cupthehand

Originally posted by mooman_00
i wouldnt think so, i dont think you could have an 086/085 087 number on a different network......you change the sim card to get the new prefix 086/085 and ditch the 087 prefix.

Id like to know what catches they'll have for moving ie 'move to the 087 network for free*'

*warning : involves the submission of the rights to your soul

No u can definetly have a Vodafone (087) no. on an O2 (086) phone and vice versa so its full portability

v10

- Yes you can switch to any other network and keep the whole number including prefix. i.e 087 won't necessarily mean the Vodafone network and 086 won't mean o2 etc.

- You can bring a Prepaid to Bill and Vice Versa and obviously prepaid to prepaid and Bill to Bill accross networks.

- There won't be credit checks across networks, so if you run up a bill with o2, you can switch to Vodafone without the debt being a problem ... but obviously you can't go back to o2 so it may catch up with you one day. This doesn't apply to customers with more than one line as the network can choose not to let you change in this case(if there is outstanding debt).

- It will probably drive handset prices up as the networks try to discourage changing networks for the sake of a new handset.

- If your phone is locked to a network, thats your problem.. you can either have it unlocked by the network it's locked to (usally depends on how much you've spent) or you can buy a new phone.

- You will lose any credit you had on a prepaid number.

- The networks are legally not allowed to contact personal customers after a customer has chosen to change network to try to keep them.

- You will need a new sim card if you change and obviously there will still be a 12 month contract on bill phones.

- Thats all I can think of .....

JTMan

There seems to be some confusion out there as to FMNP. I have asked in several stores about transfering my pre-paid 085 meteor number to 02. About half say that you can transfer a pre-paid number and the other half say you can only do it with bill. the carphonewarehouse told me that comreg said that you can only transfer with bill phones. Is this true?

Also what do you need to give the provider to transfer your phone?

Meteor recently announced that they already have implemented FNMP so does that mean that I don't have to wait till July 23rd to leave Meteor?

Thanks

cupthehand

Originally posted by Fungus
Meteor recently announced that they already have implemented FNMP so does that mean that I don't have to wait till July 23rd to leave Meteor?

Thanks [/B]

Has that date of July 23rd been officially announced....?

okonski

Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
It has been operating in the UK now for sometime and it seems to have had a significant effect on reducing call charges.

Do you have any factual basis for this assumption? FMNP in the UK has been a complete disaster. Originally claimed to be the ultimate enabler to give consuimers freedom, it has been used by an estimated 2% of mobile users, and because the statistics count a second port BACK to the original network as a secontd port (when it is a cancellation of the first) it is little wonder only the die-hards bother.

Add the fact FMNP adds problems with billing (for the caller) when dialling what appears to be an on-net call (087-087) but is actually Vodafone to O2, you get charges cross-net and take a 500% incease in the call charge. Fair? Of course not!

I've discovered that when a users upgrades to a new phone, they much prefer the idea of a new number as it unloads any backage of disgruntled partners, spam SMS etc etc- and also says to friends 'I've a new phone!'

The only network to benefit to any degree would be Meteor - and the cost of provisioning the service far outweighs the benefit. Before, you knew what your call charges are - now, you don't. I call that a backward step - NOT progress.

jesus_thats_gre

There will be some sort of audible warning in place that will warn users of cross network call charges when calling someone who has made use of FMNP.

Webmonkey

I believe it will not be a disaster.

Your right there will be a tone when you dial the number and it belongs to another network. Its a ding in between the tones. It is very easy to here and you won't ring without hearing it. (I've heard it)

You get to keep your number - 086,087,085. Thats why it is "FULL MOBILE NUMBER PORTABILITY" (FMNP)

This is great to the consumer as if they say own a business and have their van/car spray painted with their number on it - well they don't have to go changing it just because they change networks now.

Once you "PORTING IN" to a new network you will be issued with a new sim card. If you have your old sim card in your fone you will receive a text stating you to please enter your new sim to be able to send/receive calls.

When "PORTING OUT" of a network - The network will not be able to nice talk you into giving you a 1 year contract if you stay with us. It will be illegal. They have new guidelines for the customercare , same goes for dealers now.

It will take some time before everyone gets used of the fact. Dealers will also have problems but if I dealer does not go by the guidelines they will get sued and the other dealers will learn from them - Thats what the ComReg are hoping for.

Be prepared for vast amounts of advertising from July 25th. YOu will see the networks competeing greatly by advertising new offers, it will be on tv, radio, banners, billboards EVERYWHERE!

Also once u move onto the new network you will be treated as a "New Customer" so you will avail of all the special offers. Your credit will also be moved on from your old network provider.
Ok i bet your thinkin? What stopping me from moving from network to network and gaining credit, well The networks will keep a record of you and you will not avail of the special offers if you come back to the same network but it is possible to avail of the 3 network special offers - but thats it then. Also there is a 14 day 'float' . You must be on the network for 14 days before you can move again.

Ok how long will it take if you want to move networks. Go into your dealer - you must fil out the CAF (Customers Authorisation Form) first of all and then the dealer will tell you to come back in a few hours. (This is the amount of time that it takes to move networks)

You CAN move from Prepaid to Bill and vica-versa if you are moving network.

You will no longer be able to Partially Port your number now e.g I have a number 086 1234567 and want it in the format of 087 1234567. This is no longer available after July 25th so if you want that do it before the date!

Businesses will also be able to Port bulk amount of numbers (Multiline). If you are an employee and want to switch networks you will have to get a letter from the company authorising you to switch.

This WILL mean things will get very competitive and FMNP will Happen no matter what now. A network already rang up the ComReg and asked them if they could delay it till after the 25th and ComReg say well not really unless you want to pay a big fine. So basically it will be illegal if the networks arn't supporting FMNP or not ready at the set date.

Hope this explains things a bit more...

./Webmonkey

cupthehand

Originally posted by Webmonkey

Ok how long will it take if you want to move networks. Go into your dealer - you must fil out the CAF (Customers Authorisation Form) first of all and then the dealer will tell you to come back in a few hours. (This is the amount of time that it takes to move networks)

./Webmonkey

Do you go to the dealership u are leaving or the one you are joing to fill out the CAF and is July 25th the earliest this can be done?

worst name ever

Thats the sort of thing that I wanted to hear Webmonkey .. fair play for digging up the information

Webmonkey

Originally posted by cupthehand
Do you go to the dealership u are leaving or the one you are joing to fill out the CAF and is July 25th the earliest this can be done?

You will go to to dealer you bought the phone off as they will have to ring up O2 to forward on the contract to the new network. The networks will sort everything out, all you have to do is go in to the dealer you bought the phone off - It doesn't have to be the actual dealer you bought it off but it would be better. As long as they do the network you are on at the moment that will be fine. Once the dealer phones up the network and gives them the go ahead the whole process should only take 2 hours really at most I would say. Be prepared to be called back in the store within few hours. The networks will sort all the rest out then. It will take time for the dealers to get used of the process but ah well we will get used of it eventually.

And yes July 25th Will be the earliest as the networks won't be able to do anything until after its launch on this date.

No problemo worth name other. Just thought id leave people know whats happening.

./Webmonkey

okonski

Originally posted by Webmonkey
I believe it will not be a disaster.

Your right there will be a tone when you dial the number and it belongs to another network. Its a ding in between the tones. It is very easy to here and you won't ring without hearing it. (I've heard it):D

Let's be realistic - it's not been a success anywhere - why the evangelical belief when custom and practice elsewhere dictates otherwise?

As for the 'ding' - are you being serious, that such a noise is enough to alert consumers that their call-in-progress could be 500% dearer? A pre-connection message would be the only acceptable solution- a 'ding' could mean anything, depending on the phone and the likleyhood of infamiliarity it could be anything from call waiting, low battery or a myriad of other in-call tones 99% of the mobile public cannot identify.

This will blow up in the face of the regulators and billing departments of the networks as people call a halt to call increases by stealth.

As for credit checking, what makes you think the network has to release your number if you've got a debit balance? They can block any transfer due to non-payment, and the recipient network will credit check an inbound customer's credit whether they have the baggage of a transferred number or not.

As Danuta Gray said, FMNP does nothing to increase consumer choice, and a new number with a new phone is usually preferrable - I don;t see that changing in the short, medium or long term.

Webmonkey

As Danuta Gray said, FMNP does nothing to increase consumer choice, and a new number with a new phone is usually preferrable - I don;t see that changing in the short, medium or long term.

Yes it does, What bout people that have giving their phone number to everyone, have it on their company vans. What if they want to change contract/network?

I believe that it will benifit them.

Fidelis

Originally posted by Webmonkey
Your credit will also be moved on from your old network provider

I can tell you now that you will lose your Prepaid credit if you port to another network from Vodafone, I would assume that this is the case for all operators. Otherwise, it sounds like a nightmare for the billing dept.

Just incase it hasn't been mentioned, FMNP is free of charge.

The porting procedure should take no longer than 2 hours for single line & up to 8 hours for multiple lines, the latter being for business purposes. During this porting time period, you can still receive calls and send & receive SMS's, but outgoing calls are not possible until the porting is complete to your new network.

You can chose to have your porting deferred. e.g. request your port today but have it to activate in 2 weeks time. During the porting, there is a short window of time where the customer can change their mind and cancel the port, but this has to be allowed by the recipient operator (the one you're porting to).

In an effort to attract customers, I would hope that the operators cut call & SMS costs rather than milking the likes of 'Free Voicemail' and 'Cheaper Roaming'. The majority of customers simply don't care much for these services.

Webmonkey

Originally posted by okonski
Let's be realistic - it's not been a success anywhere - why the evangelical belief when custom and practice elsewhere dictates otherwise?

Just because it isn't a success 'anywhere' else does not mean it won't work here.

As for the 'ding' - are you being serious, that such a noise is enough to alert consumers that their call-in-progress could be 500% dearer? A pre-connection message would be the only acceptable solution- a 'ding' could mean anything, depending on the phone and the likleyhood of infamiliarity it could be anything from call waiting, low battery or a myriad of other in-call tones 99% of the mobile public cannot identify.

Have you heard this ring? Its very obvious and isn't annoying. People will get pissed off if they have to listen to a message in the start and don't say press the # key or anything to skip because thats even more annoying. The tone is very clear.

This will blow up in the face of the regulators and billing departments of the networks as people call a halt to call increases by stealth.

As for credit checking, what makes you think the network has to release your number if you've got a debit balance? They can block any transfer due to non-payment, and the recipient network will credit check an inbound customer's credit whether they have the baggage of a transferred number or not.

I don' t quite understand what you mean here?

Thanx,
./Webmonkey

jesus_thats_gre

For most people, the introduction of FNMP will not offer many advantages.

There are some business users however that do depend on their mobile number and this has caused them to stick with the same operator for the past 5 or 6 years. FMNP will finally give them the oppurtunity to move operator and keep their number.




As for the beep, this is more than enough to warn someone of a cross network call. If anyone has had experience with Prepaid services and their out of credit messages, you will know how annoying these messages can be. Being told you have less than €3 credit everytime you make a call drove me insane.




A network will not allow you to disconnect or transfer your number if you have an outstanding balance on your account.




I think in the long term call charges and sms charges will gradually come down. Vodafone's Friends for Less seems to be the beginning of this trend but you never know with Vodafone.