IRISH NATIONAL TEAM (long)

DeVore

You KNOW if *I* say "long" its gonna be "War and Peace"

Ok, people having been saying that until Jay came along there was no action on the National Team. Thats not true, the action was happening alright but it was well behind the scenes and by a few ppl who were sick of committees/arguments/politics and decided to look into it quietly without all the hype etc. The WDT is coming up end of this year and we'd like to enter a team.
We didnt figure on new energetic blood, who might actually get up off their **** without asking anyone and actually DO something like get a game with Clan 9. (even if pings were totally silly)

So, its time to let people know our plans for a National Quake Team.
Its earlier then I would have like but if we keep it secret any longer it risks over-running other ppls work and god knows we need to work together on this.

The situation is this. There is the opportunity for us to go to France to play the national team of France. This isnt something that has popped up over night. We've been working on it for quite some time.

This requires four things.
1. A team. Prolly the easiest bit.
2. An organiser or perhaps 2.
3. Pre-publicity to facilitate getting ....
4. ... A sponsor.


Taking these things in order:
1. The team selection has always been problematic. Everyone has different opinions about other players' abilities. But someone somewhere has to make an "in or out" decision on the team members. Particular since we cant just fly a team the size of the old hibs team out to Paris and pick it on the day.
We also dont have the luxury of choosing people from a number of clear lan parties. We have one... QP... and one point of data isnt a great stick by which to judge.
I'll come back to how I'll solve this in a min.

2. At the mo there is just me as organiser with Von as scout to the French camp. I've asked a few ppl in a round about manner for opinions and a few ppl have had full knowledge whats been going on but not too many. I've started this and I intend to see it through. I dont mean to stand on anyones toes (particularly Jay and Beast) but I want to see this happen. Unless things change I am appointing myself Manager-in-attendance because of the timing and position I find myself in (more below)

3. Prepublicity. You will find that we will have a bit more media coverage in the next 6 weeks to increase the visibility of Irish Quake. Unless we have good publicity we wont have anything to "sell" to bigger companies.
This means being on our best behaviour.
I got word today of coverage by a major newspaper who want to run a piece on us (the national team and competitive quake in general) but they simply WILL not talk to committees or the like. I've been down this road with them before on a separate thing and hence I made some enquiries and they turned up trumps in the publicity dept.

4. A sponsor. The problem is that until we commit to going we have nothing really to sell to the big companies. Before we commit to going we need backing. Catch 22.
The way I see around this is the same way I saw around QP. I'll stick my hand in my pocket, take a firm grip on my money and hold on to it tightly hoping noone takes it away from me for quake-debts.
In this case its a little different.
As you are all reasonably aware, Gerry (aka Vex) and I setup a web company this year and we are going to market the company pretty soon. We have a enough money to finance a VERY select number to go to france if a sponsor doesnt show up. This means we can say we have done it before for the next time.
If a sponsor DOES show up then the price of risking our cash is that we get partial sponsorship in the style of a PlanetQuakeesque web page with reviews of the games as each of them happened (ala Clan 9 v DR). Ie we would do live reports on the spinsol.com site of the matches and the whole trip. If I cant find us a sponsor then we will fund the trip entirely. In reality it is highly unlikely we will find a full sponsor for such an event in the 7 weeks left before the Lan. (its on the 28th ish of Feb afaik)

Back to the team selection, since I'm putting our (:)) money where my mouth is I have hefty views on which players are the best team players etc. I dont mean to say I'm picking the team. Not by any means but I have a team in mind that I would want to see beaten or threatened by a team/player before I would change my mind.
That team is 4 from Tomb, Bunny, Beast, Koopa, Von.
There are a lot of players I would love to take too, Lorcan, Mickah,Slann, Overlord, Zero etc.
And undoubtedly some of ye are sitting there saying ... the old reliables... but if any team can give that team a "moment of pause" on e1m2 or dm3 then I'm open to having my mind changed.

That team is pretty much ready to play alcomers with a little notice and ill get a few trusted ppl to watch it and report.

Its not perfect but its the best we can do.

So, phew, thats it as best I can put it.
Its an opportunity we can grasp or squander really. What do y'all think?

DeVore.

DeVore

I posted this late last night and already its 5 down the list so I'm replying to myself to jump it back up.

No I dont regularly talk to myself either.

Dev.

Bunnor

NO

Cloud

Good men DeV / Von.

Seems like a long time since the old Hibs team started off and hope this will be an incentive to all the good players (not just CW, cop on Black Pawn) to get organised at last.

Best of luck with it!

J.
--
P.S. The smilies have returned <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/tongue.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":P">

Black Pawn

Cop myself on???

What trip u come down off ???

From the games i have seen played no one comes close to the team play of CW.

And I like u are entitled to an opinion.

Keep Hibernians and whatever else out of it - why not have the best irish team represent ireland - give them the kudos they deserve

I am sick of the "omg" awe crap which goes on on the CA and war servers when one of CW turn up - oh lets split them up! we cant let them be on the same team cos they will win -- I wonder why

I like watching them play cos the have a unique ability in ireland - cherish it - dont start the usual irish crap of saying "give everyone a chance" and try and pull a good thing apart

I wonder if any team selected out of the other irish players could beat them?

I seriously doubt it

Prove me wrong if u think different - let some challengers take em on and show what they are worth -

I am only an less than average player and dont aspire to be much more.

But i like watching good teamplayers its a pleasure - like the impromtu teamplay of UNt vs TLP at qp who argueably had better players..

Its only a few weeks until that said game - get CW training now for it - and kick Froggy Butt!

Suds

Creeper

Who is this BlackPawn muppet?

Cloud

> Keep Hibernians and whatever else out of it > - why not have the best irish team > represent ireland - give them the kudos > they deserve

You're talking about the best Irish clan, not the best Irish team we have.

I don't think a team made up of just CW is the best team we can offer, there are plenty more very good players around who could train with some of those CW ninjas if needs be, Mickah, Koopa, Bunny, etc., or should we just leave them out?! It doesn't have to be CW or the rest FFS, a combination of the best is what we want.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but then again you are still a relative newbie in the Irish Quake scene, so perhaps you should watch some old demos and get a feel for the other players / teams out there.

J.
--
I haven't come off any "trip" thanks very much.

LoLth

HOLD IT!!!!

OK. This was going quite well and was a very enjoyable thread, right up until the argument started to overshadow the debate (especially the appearance of the word Muppet, you know well what reaction that word evokes!)

Blackpawn does have a point. Fair enough he seems to be a fan of CW, but at least he has a reason for his support. They have great teamplay, and most likely they do indeed play brilliantly as a clan team. Cloud also has a valid point. It is a CLAN and NOT a national team. Look at soccer or rugby. Players who normally kick the living hell out of each other (well not in soccer 'cos they fall over if they get looked at - but that's another argument) while playing for their club play side by side and train together to form a team. I don't know if it is a fact but I would believe that a national team is as good as a club team. (Ireland's rugby tour of NZ proves this wrong, but The all black's tour of Ireland proves it right. Ireland did beat a fair few of the clubs, but Young Munster (I think) beat the all blacks. Same with Soccer testimonials).

I'm getting off point. There is an argument for having the best CLAN (whoever wins ICQL) represent the country,they certainly would put up a fight in competition and we would all KNOW that they can play a good game as a team, but that would be turning a blind eye to the other talent available. A truly NATIONAL team should be the best individual players in Ireland. (Maybe they could all end up being the CW boys!). These 'best' should then train and learn tactics and playing styles together. If someone cannot or will not learn to play in the team then that individual should be excluded (after warnings) or relegated to the sub bench. That would be a National team. If it turns out that our national team is a carbon copy of our best clan well, fair enough. As long as the selection is not only fair but also SEEN to be fair.

hmmm. Have I actually made a point in all that? What I am trying to say is clear to me but I think I need to work on a better explanation.

Hope it has been of some input,

J.

regi

Um here's a thought. Say by general consensus, we have a group of eight players who make the Hibs team. Two managers to decide team selection, DeVore and Vonsta. Why not ask them to temporarily leave their old clans for the duration of their stay in the Hibs. Get them to play challenges against the irish clans a lot for practice, and UK clans too. Get a bit of team pride and familiarity going. Let them remain honourary members of the old clans till they stop playing internationals. The main point being that they play more with each other than before. Forget old clan animosity <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/smile.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":)"> If the lads are going to kick ass for Ireland, let them play together at all opportunities.


Dan

SickBoy

BlackPawn has a point but I have to agree with Cloud on this one. CW are the best Team players in Ireland and thats a well known fact but I'm sure CW have a weak link as all clans do. So u look for a team without a weak link and thats what u get from choosing the best players from all Irish clans. Maybe they wont have the same understanding as CW do of each other come time to play the tourney but I'm 100% sure that its better to have the best Irish players represent Ireland rather than the best Irish clan represent us.

SB...

Hobbes

I would of said CT rather then CW. Both teams are good. Want to know why? Because they play as a team. However after seeing CT play at IQCL all only just being out the night before and still under various influences just raped all the competition. But that's my opinion. I've been so long I wouldn't know who's best anymore. However skill doesn't always mean best team player.

Anyway, back on topic. Devore I recall mailing something on a sponser? what happend with that? I have some ideas, how much is involved? How many are going? For how long? Give us a shout next time I'm in IRC.

DeVore

1. I did think long and hard about teamplay before chosing my dream team. And if you look closely at the team you will see that it really is most of CW plus bunny. Koopa is along cos he's a great player but also so that we have a dueler with us and I DEFY anyone to tell me he wasnt STREETS ahead of everyone but bunny at QP in duels. Bunny fits nicely with the CW lads as they have played together a lot and bunny and von are very similar in tactics. Von is arguably the person people will pick as the weakest link in this team.
I could argue that Von has put more time then anyone into this venture but thats an insult to Von. Von is the tactics man for CW and his experience internationally shows this. He is a HELL of a teamplayer and that counts more then being able to do funky rocket jumps. I could have picked Mickah, Slann, Jay, Overlord, Lorcan instead and people could argue that many of them are better war players but something happens when more then one CW player is on the same team, I dunno what it is but its leathal. They simply seem to multiply each others skill. Once I had decided that Tomb and BEAST were in my dream team, Von's "stock" rose exponentially. I dont see a replacement who will bind *that* specific team together into a fighting force better then Von.

I DIDNT start by saying I want CW and some hangers and I DO like the look of a team like Mickah Lorcan Slan and Overlord, but they just wont be as coheasive as tomb beast bunny von and koopa (if we used him in a war).
Since time is an issue to get the players used to each other then how the team would play TODAY if we were playing the French is important because to be honest between here and there we will only get to polish specific tactics for certain levels.

Anyway, the lads are up to play all comers so if you wanna have an go and you think yer hard enough then give it a go.

More later, I'll start a new topic soon <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/smile.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":)">

DeV

Mickah

Dev is right, putting CW's together seems to multiply frags, but thats only cos they've got nearly all capped irish players in 1 clan playing together week after week.

When cream of irtish quakers train together week after week yer teamplay is bound to come together as CW's does.

Whereas the other candidates coming from different clans which contain weak teamplayers probably only need a few sessions with players of their own standard to shine.

I'm sure if Lorcan (if he used team-talk), Jay or myself were put in with CW or an Irish team for a few weeks we'd be well able to play as good as any CW member.

Mickah

Zero

yeah I think it's a bit silly saying CW should represent the country. by saying that you're saying you think bunny or someone like him SHOULDNT be there?
I mean if you take a team of CW, say Tomb, Beast, Von, and another. Now stick the likes of Bunny, Mickah or Overlord in there instead of the fourth CW and look at the team you have.
If you want my five players, it would be 5 out of Tomb, Beast, Bunny, Von, Mickah, and Jay.

Either way it's up to Dev and Von.

DeVore

WAH!
Its not.
I want the best team. I'm mates with a lot of the CW lads its true but I also count Zero, OL, Jay, and many others as mates too. This isnt about me and my mates going on a trip for a laugh. I want the best team and I think Von and CW do too.

If I was just picking a team to go for a laugh it would be CG <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/tongue.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":P">pp

I really wish I could pick others like slaan. OMG slaan on a lan is scary. There are 8 or so ppl who are ALL reasonably interchangable at the top, it depends on the day, the level , lots of things.
The deciding factor should be team play.

I am NOT saying "its my ball and I'll call the shots". About such things as publicity and funding , yes I AM going to call the shots there as I know what I'm doing in business and I know the sources to tap for publicity but as far as the team goes I am only expressing my dream team. I am open to change but I have considered it fairly carefully.

I apologise to the players we will have to leave behind (whoever that is) but finance is a cruel master.

DeVore.

Black Pawn

My opinion counts little bbut here goes

taking nothing from the people you mentioned lets just face it CW are Irelands National Team - no squad who goes up against them will win.

So forget the muppeting and team selection - they play with each other all the time - so keep it thus.

Whereas there are Ninja's of great ability out there I dont think that splittin a working team is good and they play well together.

So one vote for CW to represent ireland..!!!

I am sure many will follow if they think sensibly.,.

Jay

OM NYOM NYOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That is sooo fukkin cooool!.

It's well over due that an Irish team competes professionally(spelt dodgy!) on an international level.

Going to France!!! WOW!!....can i cum?!!

Okay to be serious.....

Yeah Dev, U and Von are deffo the guys to pick the team..undoubtedly.
I think that CW are a great combination of players and most of them should be on the team...ie Tomb and Beast.

Mickah, said that basically if u stick another good player in their midst, throw in some praccy, and the team would be just as good....he is right.

However..most of it comes down to "just KNOWING what to do" at all times. It's that ingredient that makes CW so effective.... along with their experience.

It is hard for one or two ppl to just pick an international team..... I mean toes get trod on and ppl feel left out. But Dev.... we all have the confidence in u and Von so JUST DO IT, f@ck em!

Righty....my top player suggestion.. (u did ask for opinions!)

Beast
Tomb
Bunny
Von
Mickah
Anjo
Slaan
Koopa
Lorcan
can i put me in there too??

Okay now we need to decide Who...exactly who ...are the best war players....

>>Koopa is more of a dueller...(he's going anyway for that reason right?)
>>Slaan is LETHAL ..and on a lan..he is OMG!! but does he play many team games.. just wondering..cos I havent seen him lately..
>>Mickah, Anjo, Lorcan, Me.....we're good...but need to be given the chance to play on an active team regularly...we can all be moulded... I dunno..
>>Von...bestest tactician..I've ever seen in action...ever. But is he the weaker one of the better players in CW?? (someone..dev i think said it earlier..)

That leaves Beast, Tomb, and Bunny.
They would be my first choice...in that order.

That just leaves a gap of one person... I suggest just trying each of the above players one by one... till u find who u want. Most likely be Von tho, or Slaan.

How many are actually going??.....someone said four ...someone said eight... but it all comes down to finance......

One last thing...... BUNNY.....get ure a?se online more often!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I miss u man!! kiss kiss hehehe NOT!!

By the way when are u guys coming down?..end of Jan? after exams? g'Lads!

Dev, Von.........fair b@lls to ye!
and once more OM NYOM NYOM!!!!!!

Koopa

yeah im coming down end of exams dave(end of jan <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/smile.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":)">)

this is in reply to black-pawns post..
lots of the good irish players dont have good machines when they play online, eg. bunny, me(<IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/tongue.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":P">), beast, slaan, and a few more.
Notice the difference between blade on his old p166 and blade on his new celeron 300?

My machine (p200) slows down in big moshes a lot, wonder what the likes of bunny(p100) and scarab(p166) do in a war..
so there, thats my excuse for not liking wars.

wait and see if i improve slightly when i get my 333 working <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/smile.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":)">

blah, etc.

Koopa

sdfsdfdfd fu(king smileys go awayyyyyyyy please

oh yeah, id pick the team out of(in no order):
Bunny
Beast (oi be watchin' you...)
Tomb
Overlord (spawn more overlords..)
Von
Jay(he's getting fu(king good on e1m2)
Mickah
Slaan

depending on who can go , etc.

MindPhuck

Sounds great, again, fair play tom.

I know I wont be on the team (cos im too good <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/smile.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":)">) but I'll certainly be at the event one way or another. I know a couple of people who could be interested in giving us some form of sponsorship and I'll gladly help out here and ask about.

Eric.

Scarab

Sam are you in college loike, or just up at 8.30 posting to the boards. If you are in, im loike in the library upstairs .... beside the books i think <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/smile.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":)">, or in the pool room or qg28. And you have a Duel Pentium 2 overclocked to 700 mhz cooled in liquid nitrogen yah big lyin arab <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/tongue.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":P">

Woohoooooo exams !!!!

earthworm_jim

Good stuff!

all the players mentioned above are class .. dev you're dead right - beast, bunny, tomb, von and anyone from a dozen other irish players would knock any other team in the country senseless (actually, my granny could take the last slot). Koopa for duels would do nicely <IMG SRC="http://lacerta.ucg.ie/boards/smile.gif&quot; WIDTH=15 HEIGHT=15 BORDER=0 ALT=":)">

G'MAN DEV AND G'WAN the HIBS!!

ewj.

LoLth

Jiiiiiiiiiiiiiim!

You not dead yet? :-P

Koopa

hahah TAKE IT eoin..
"i am in the library beside the books" haha aahahah ah
i posted that before going to sleep like, bloody peak rate ....
actually, no, i went and actually finished the single player missions in starcraft just after that..went to sleep at 11.. got up at 2 to go into town to meet slaanesh... (slaan u bastid u didnt turn up wah..) and now i am stuck in the hamlab .. with a headache....
will kill slaan when i see him...mmmm kiillllll slaaaann.....