working in the big bad "Industry" ??

l3rian

the situation sounds bleak.

I'm going into 4th year doing comp science and maths, what would be a good plan for me next year?

Gavin

a masters as the man says !

l3rian

a masters sounds like a good plan. Anyone here done a masters? what exam results do they ask for on the application form?

cravian

I did a PhD and have been working as an IT contractor around europe for about 6 years. It's a nice life, but you get to like the money too much and you suddenly find that you don't take holidays and forget where you put your life.

Also, you tend to get the bum jobs - even though you're an expert in your field.

I'm just packed it in to look for something more rewarding in the soul department for a few years to get a perspective and get my life back.

FYI I'm a unix, c++, comms kind of person.

In my experience IT really is selling out to the main as was said before.

l3rian

Hi cravian

Is there much work in the IT industry around europe? like Germany for instance?

I like what you said about the finance department taking over, it doesn't look to bleak anymore.

What masters would you recommend for someone who wants good money, and doesnt mind doing any bum jobs?

cravian

hi again,

I can only speak for myself really - I did a Masters in Communications Systems, purely because I was interested in networking and low level comms then went on to a PhD in Maths and Computing dealing with Image Compression.

After all that I ended up fixing broken code in the back end of mobile networks

I'd say the most important thing about any post graduate qualification is that it's in a subject in which you have a personal interest (so you get motivated) and it's a subject in which you don't know too much about already (as it can become tedious if you're not learning most of the time).

If you're an IT degree person, think about specializing in something you like the look of maybe.

Workwise check out something like jobserve on http://www.it.jobserve.com or one of the other similar sites - perhaps if it's ireland you're specifically interested in try http://www.recruitireland.com. From what i've seen although Germany is officially in recession there's still jobs to be had there, also in Switzerland though it's hard to get a work permit as they're not in the EU (lucky sods, ho ho).

I'm sure given a little more time the IT industry in general will pick up as ever. As was suggested (by gom), for the time being perhaps a post grad qualification is a good idea.

Good luck on your journey!

Typedef

In my experience IT really is selling out to the main as was said before.

Dump of assembler code for function main:
0x804db50 <main>: push %ebp
0x804db51 <main+1>: mov %esp,%ebp
0x804db53 <main+3>: push %edi
0x804db54 <main+4>: push %esi
0x804db55 <main+5>: push %ebx
0x804db56 <main+6>: sub $0x764,%esp

For sale....


But seriously. In the last place I worked in, there was exactly one guy who had a masters in programming. One guy had his BSc in Cs, and aside from that, out of 15 developers, not one of us had anything except experience in the industry as qualification (and some non University certs of some description or another).

I really think that doing a masters to get a job programming is overkill.

My last interview, I had to point out to the interviewer I hadn't been to college, since he passed a comment about me "wanting to go back", where upon he checked my CV and said.
"Actually, I'd only looked at your experience to date".

What else can I say. Yes a degree can be a huge benefit... in getting in on the bottom rung, which is something you have to be prepaired to do in your first job.

Nobody is going to hire a graduate in a Senior position, with zero experience. You have to have 'some' experience else you are low man on the totem pole.
My last company hire most of it's programming team from FAS, or from various non-Tertiary courses, for the simple reason that the guys will do the same work, but, cheaper and are much more likely to do things the companies way... as opposed to what said programmer thinks is the 'best' way.

Yeah, you have to be prepaired to swallow your pride, until you get experience, so forget about what 'you' think a degree should mean in the market place, because experience is worth a hell of a lot more or the willingness to do the dog work, by virtue of the fact you're the low guy on the totem pole.

Oh and since I have become a rollerblader... I have to say... rollerblades 'are leet' and increase technical ability tenfold!

Trojan

If you've got a business degree, an MSc would be useful, but if you're already qualified in the area, a Masters is overkill like the boy said.

Some companies, particularly the bigger ones, just will not hire someone at engineer level if they don't have a degree. It could be a degree in Music for all they care, but they must have a degree. After that, it's down to knowledge & experience.

If you can, get industry work experience during your summer breaks - don't get a bar job like the great unwashed - find someone who knows someone who's willing to pay you 100 euros a week to do simple database admin if necessary. Just get out there and get stuff to put on your cv.

The industry isn't bad, but you can end up in positions where you've very little human contact, dealing with machines only for weeks on end - that can be very difficult unless you're the epitome of geekiness.