doom 3 slipping?

Matt Simis

Originally posted by CivilServant

Yeah that may be true but when the dust settles anyone who likes pc gaming in any way will have both. In the long run I think HL2 will sell more because of the better engine but we'll have to wait and see what id can come up with in the meantime.

Can't wait for HL3, photorealistic characters is 2-3 years away?!

Not trying to get off topic, but D3 has the better engine. The most fantastic part of the [HL2] Source engine is the physics model, which is actually licensed from Havok (www.havok.com - a company setup by two Irish guys). Same Physics engine can and is used in many other games (mainly upcoming).

Sure the characters look great as well and the game most likely will be excellent, but Doom3 is going for a true, realtime Cinematic look and feel. Half Life2 looks like the pinnacle of current generation FPS games and design... Doom3 should at least look like something new.



Matt

monument

Originally posted by Matt Simis
Not trying to get off topic, but D3 has the better engine. The most fantastic part of the [HL2] Source engine is the physics model, which is actually licensed from Havok (www.havok.com - a company setup by two Irish guys). Same Physics engine can and is used in many other games (mainly upcoming).

Sure the characters look great as well and the game most likely will be excellent, but Doom3 is going for a true, realtime Cinematic look and feel. Half Life2 looks like the pinnacle of current generation FPS games and design... Doom3 should at least look like something new.



Matt

Yes, and Havok 2 was done with the help and feed back from Valve.

Retr0gamer

I much prefer the HL2 engine over the Doom 3 one. The HL2 engine can do far more interaction with the enviroments and some huge levels. Some of the effects in the engine will not be seen in the Doom 3 engine. The tech demo really impressed me. Doom 3 is meant to look good and thats about al it does although it does it well. The levels are meant to be tiny consisting of corridors and tiny outdoor spaces. There is just so much more that the source engine can do compared to the Doom 3 engine.

zAbbo

Retr0gamer, have you played HL2 or Doom3 ?

Retr0gamer

I've played the alpha of Doom 3 and seen all the videos of Doom 3 and HL2. The technology test of HL2 impressed me more than than anything I've seen on the Doom 3 engine. It looks like the mod community will be biggest for HL2 because it looks far more customisable and flexible. The car bit in the E3 demo is an example. Expect a racing mod fairly soon after it is released. From what i played in the Doom 3 alpha and judging on how much ram that game eats up i'd say the levels will be far smaller than the huge open spaces and cities of HL2.

KdjaCL

HL2 will sell more copies but D3 will sell more licences.
But i cant see them being massive sellers not with that "optimal specs" crap ID posted.
Hl2 wont be far behind in graphics and specs req:
And not many people have or will pay to get those types of specs.

G4 or higher with 128mb ..LMAO

kdjac

Matt Simis

Originally posted by monument
Yes, and Havok 2 was done with the help and feed back from Valve.

Yes... that is true, but doesnt contradict anything Ive said. Intel work with SIs and motherboard vendors (more so in years gone by) for their new CPUs, nVidia work with their partners to develop new GPUs.. but at the end of the day the IP is Intels, nVidia and Havoks. Cooperation is desirable sometimes.

Ill reserve judgement on which is "better" until I can see them both. Im merely stating that IDs plan is more grandiose than Valves.



Matt

Matt Simis

Originally posted by KdjaC
HL2 will sell more copies but D3 will sell more licences.
But i cant see them being massive sellers not with that "optimal specs" crap ID posted.
Hl2 wont be far behind in graphics and specs req:
And not many people have or will pay to get those types of specs.

G4 or higher with 128mb ..LMAO

kdjac

Geforce4s will be what, at least 2 years old when D3 is out? Are you honestly saying that you think when they're out people who want the game either wont pay the pittance it costs for a 9600Radeon\5600FX or already have GF4+ level graphics?

When Im specing\building PCs for people, the minimum GFX I put in is a GF4 Ti. (or now its DX9 counterpart, the FX 5600)



Matt

monument

Yes and I'm merely stating that they helped them. There’s no need to always be contradicting people

And I've never stated which is best, as I'll also wait untill I've seen both.

KdjaCL

Matt the reason (imo) that HL did so well is that any PC can play it even gameboys (probably not but you get the point).
Not a lot of people will upgrade their pcs in such a large fashion for 2 games (yes i know it will be the new standard ) but its a lot to ask.
By this i mean general gamer buys a PC from PC World etc: have a look in their for a PC that might even run the demo for doom 3.

Hence methinks it neither will sell well.

kdjac

BLITZ_Molloy

The Doom3 engine really isn't that impressive. It can't handle many characters on screen at once and you can forget about large outdoor levels. Everything is going to be sci-fi tunnels.

The way I see it Quake 3 and Half Life sold millions of units over several years. The first months sales aren't that vital.

Matt Simis

Originally posted by KdjaC
Matt the reason (imo) that HL did so well is that any PC can play it even gameboys (probably not but you get the point).
Not a lot of people will upgrade their pcs in such a large fashion for 2 games (yes i know it will be the new standard ) but its a lot to ask.
By this i mean general gamer buys a PC from PC World etc: have a look in their for a PC that might even run the demo for doom 3.

Hence methinks it neither will sell well.

kdjac

I may quote you to that one day, far off in the future.



Matt

Giblet

Actually, you may not know this but for 25 fps gameplay with bumpmapping off, the min specs for DoomIII are *DrumRoll*

Geforce 256, 1Ghz, 256 ram.

The alpha was an unfinished version and only optimised to one computer.

If you do think that only top spec computers are going to be playing these games, then you obviously haven't been keeping up with current technology.

The average entry level system in a year will be about 2.4Ghz, with at least a GF4 MX, and 256 or 512 ram!

And I've seen even the puny GF4 MX run the alpha at 40fps. With 512 Dual Channel ram you'll be laughing.

CivilServant

Yes doom and id will always have a tremendous following with the flippin fantastic history of games they've already made, everyone was thinkin that doom3 is going to be the next big thing. But then HL2 showed up and I read somewhere that it sort of brings up a point about how teamsizes can affect the size and ultimately quality of a game.

I think id have done marvellously well to bring out something like doom3 with all the programming tomfoolery that only carmack and his gang can produce. But nowadays the sizes of team that work on games could be in the hundreds and then you've got outsourced software too (havok physics engine). Versus the 20-30 strong team at id. They seem to be very particular who they let in and don't want to expand to much and loose that coherency in programming and game direction.

There's only so much that a small team can do. I'm not thinking david and goliath here but that might not be far from the truth. As to Matt Simis' point, surely you were impressed at the tech demos, realism and scope of HL2. It blew everything away at E3.

I still have my fingers crossed for doom3 and will keep my opinion about their engine to myself until I see the actual product. Makes more sense really.

Matt Simis

Originally posted by CivilServant


There's only so much that a small team can do. I'm not thinking david and goliath here but that might not be far from the truth. As to Matt Simis' point, surely you were impressed at the tech demos, realism and scope of HL2. It blew everything away at E3.

I still have my fingers crossed for doom3 and will keep my opinion about their engine to myself until I see the actual product. Makes more sense really.

I was impressed at the character models and general graphics. However, even the original Operation Flashpoint had more realism and "scope" (Im sure its sequel will have more so). Stalker seems to combine GFX and realism very nicely. Unfortunately a lot of people seem to be suffering from "HL blindness" and are fixated on one game\engine.


Matt

Retr0gamer

Finally saw the stalker video during the weekend. The engine is very impressive. I think it handles organic enviroments far better than the other engines I've seen. However I'm not too sure about the mutants. i'd prefer if there were more real people to kill. The change from video to game engine was very impressive.

CivilServant

Yeah I agree with you about HL blindness I think you can get specific treatment for it now.

Doom3 and Stalker OL. I was impressed with Stalker when I first seen it last year, but a lot has happened since then. HL2 in my opinion is a massive leap for fps' in general. Creating a realism that hasn't been seen since going from doom to quake.

I don't think I'm suffering from HL blindness, I just think it's going to be a fantastic game and so do a lot of other people.

Matt Simis

Originally posted by CivilServant
Yeah I agree with you about HL blindness I think you can get specific treatment for it now.

Doom3 and Stalker OL. I was impressed with Stalker when I first seen it last year, but a lot has happened since then. HL2 in my opinion is a massive leap for fps' in general. Creating a realism that hasn't been seen since going from doom to quake.

I don't think I'm suffering from HL blindness, I just think it's going to be a fantastic game and so do a lot of other people.

Yeah, Im sure HL2 will be. Its almost a given at this stage. Stalker on the otherhand could\should be great, lot of big, "new" things they are trying to do. It could be the best FPS\RPG ever, or it could be a big mess.

Stalkers story revolves around your interaction with the miltary and other stalkers in an environment filled with mutants, so plenty of human killing (if you want apparently). Infact the latest video (which was quite good) was 99% AI Teams vs Human and AI teams.



Matt