Memory query

ixoy

Rightio. I'm looking to build my first PC. I'm thinking of this motherboard:

Asus A7N8X-X mainboard

with a Barton Athlon 2800XP+ chip installed.

The memory bit is where there's one too many options -

should I go for PC2700 or PC3200 (The motherboard is capable of both I assume)? Is there that much of a difference? I want 512MB so, performance wise, is it really better to go 2x256MB or is 1x512MB (the cheaper option) pretty much the same?

And even then, if I go for 2x256 PC3200 (as you'll probably recommend), which version/brand should I go for?

For example Corsair offer two types:
Crucial PC3200 DDR-DIMM 256MB CL3 5ns
and
Crucial PC3200 DDR-DIMM 256MB CL3 ECC

... what's the difference between the two? Which is the better option? Why can't it be easy

Drazhar

If things to do with computers were easy, we IT people would be unemployed, more so!!!

Honestly, i have no idea, i just went for 1 512mb when i upgraded. If im right, and im only going from memory (har har, sorry about the pun) then PC3200 has a FSB of 333hz, where 2700 has 266hz, not 100% but, in all things computers, faster is allways better

Col_Loki

Ram speeds.....

Pc3500 -> 433Mhz
Pc3200 -> 400Mhz
Pc2700 -> 333Mhz
Pc2100 -> 266Mhz

Your processor FSB is 333Mhz, so matching ram would be Pc2700. If you go for Pc3200 thats fine aswell but you really wont be able to take advantage of the extra speed unless you overclock (always a good thing).

The 2x256mb will perform better than 1x512mb as you will be taking advantage of the boards dual DDR facility. On average the performance increase overall is 2-5% on AMD boards.
Its very nice to have 512mb on one Dimm cause you can just pop in another and make it 1gb and have dual DDR workin 2.

Dont go for "EEC" ram thats for server systems error correction stuff. You will see things like "CL2" and "CL2.5" the lower the number the faster your ram timings are (bit quicker).
How about 2xThese ??

If you plan on overclocking or think you mite like to experiment, get Pc3200 Ram and youll be happy later on.

That motherboard is a pretty decent board and wont let you down (have one myself). Ive just recently gotten an Abit NF7 , and its fantastic - would recomend it to anyone.

Any other questions just shoot, am on the boards alot.

Loki

ixoy

Thanks to ye both! I'll probably try PC3200 then, to futuer proof a little. Probably the recommended ones...

I'll take advantage of that help when I suggest a system... Trying to build one for around 900 that includes:
* Decent processor (assuming the 2800XP+ is decent!)
* good motherboard (inbuilt lan, inbuilt sound, inbuilt modem: do little sockets come out of the PC for this? How do they connect if they're not PCI cards?)
* Big harddrive (120GB at least, pref. 160GB)
* DVD drive (pretty cheap)
* Memory, 512MB as stated
* DSL Modem/Router
* Case to hold the above items as well as:CD/RW (from old machine) + Zip Drive (old machine) + 2 HDs (above+one from current machine) + my old graphics card. I don't want to get a floppy drive on principal....

I won't need a new monitor yet or graphics card (purchased one of those last Xmas). Since the principal uses are going to be boradband and gaming, I'll have to pose a few questions when I get back from my holidays....I think that should all be doable for my budget...

eggshapedfred

forget about principals. floppies are dirt cheap and can be very useful (linux boot disks). i know that if the main aim of your pc is broadband and gaming you probably won't be looking at linux but you never know in the future.

don't throw something away cos its unfashionable, throw it away cos it doesnt work....

ixoy

Originally posted by eggshapedfred
forget about principals. floppies are dirt cheap and can be very useful (linux boot disks). i know that if the main aim of your pc is broadband and gaming you probably won't be looking at linux but you never know in the future.

don't throw something away cos its unfashionable, throw it away cos it doesnt work....

Well I might dabble with Linux at some point, alright. My friend is purchasing a laptop, sans floppy drive. So we could get a USB one between us, p'raps. Are USB floppies as capable of being used for bootup? I can't recall how quickly USB drives are recognised on startup.

Col_Loki

* Decent processor (assuming the 2800XP+ is decent!)

Yea its a decent processor, has double the cache of the older ThoroughBred core athlons. Pretty good choice in my opinion (that is if your not overclocking) .

* good motherboard (inbuilt lan, inbuilt sound, inbuilt modem: do little sockets come out of the PC for this? How do they connect if they're not PCI cards?)

The motherboard has the sockets at the back where you would normally plug in your .... say printer or mouse (sockets would be becide them). Almost all the boards come with onboard sound which is normally excellent and supports surround sound. Not many boards come with built in modem so it will cost you about €20 to get a PCI one. As for built in lan , the Asus A7N8X that you were looking at has it & built in sound card which is pretty good.

* Big harddrive (120GB at least, pref. 160GB)

Komplett have there best seller at a very very good price. Its a 120Gb Western Digital 8mb cache hard drive. Would definetly get one of those (well actually im just after getting one).

* DVD drive (pretty cheap)

The DVD drives you will notice some come "bulk" this means you get the bare bones drive - no cables, no software etc. You really dont have to worry about this as the power cable is on ur PSU, the data cable comes with your motherboard and you dont need drivers. You will prob dvd software with either old dvd's , your motherboard, or just get windows media player upgrade & that will play em. Save a bit of money and go bulk IMO.

* Case to hold the above items as well as:CD/RW (from old machine) + Zip Drive (old machine) + 2 HDs (above+one from current machine) + my old graphics card. I don't want to get a floppy drive on principal....

Think you will have no probs with the case holding all that, 2 x 5&1/4" and 1 x 3&1/2" . Would recomend not going for a cheapo case, one around €110-120 with PSU would be advised and save you future pain. Try Elara and check out the lanboy case, clear side pannel and PSU lights it up blue (and its very good quality & cheap).

I dont have a floppy drive either - there completely useless if you have a zip drive - IMO.
Make sure your graphics card is an AGP type and not PCI. If your heavey into games mabye spending €100 yoyo's on a new card like the Ti4200 would be advised.

All in all your system looks pretty nice, if you want to save a few bob get an Xp2500+ & overclock it to run the exact same as an Xp2800+?? Its very easy and safe - money could go toward a graphics card mabye??

Loki

ixoy

Originally posted by COL_LOKI
Yea its a decent processor, has double the cache of the older ThoroughBred core athlons. Pretty good choice in my opinion (that is if your not overclocking) .

Oh, may I ask why it's not good for overclocking? No major desire to try it but I'd like it as an option. I assumed as it was newer...

Komplett have there best seller at a very very good price. Its a 120Gb Western Digital 8mb cache hard drive. Would definetly get one of those (well actually im just after getting one).

That's exactly the model I had been looking at - seems a great bargain. I only said 160MB because a friend is selling one cheaply...

The DVD drives you will notice some come "bulk" this means you get the bare bones drive - no cables, no software etc. You really dont have to worry about this as the power cable is on ur PSU, the data cable comes with your motherboard and you dont need drivers. You will prob dvd software with either old dvd's , your motherboard, or just get windows media player upgrade & that will play em. Save a bit of money and go bulk IMO.

Rightio. My GFX card has DVD playing software as well so it should be OK.

Think you will have no probs with the case holding all that, 2 x 5&1/4" and 1 x 3&1/2" . Would recomend not going for a cheapo case, one around €110-120 with PSU would be advised and save you future pain. Try Elara and check out the lanboy case, clear side pannel and PSU lights it up blue (and its very good quality & cheap).

I like the idea of a clear side panel.... What sort of PSU should I look at? 300W? 360W? 400W?

Make sure your graphics card is an AGP type and not PCI. If your heavey into games mabye spending €100 yoyo's on a new card like the Ti4200 would be advised.

I actually have a decent GFX card. Least I think it's decent. It's a Gainward GeForce 4 Golden Sample Ti4200 AGP 4x. It certainly allowed my humble 650 to play GTA: Vice City in 1280x1024 with 0 slowdown...

All in all your system looks pretty nice, if you want to save a few bob get an Xp2500+ & overclock it to run the exact same as an Xp2800+?? Its very easy and safe - money could go toward a graphics card mabye??

What can you overclock a 2800XP+ to?

Col_Loki

If your planning on overclocking the Xp2500+ and Xp2800+ will reach around the same level - i know its suprising but its true. The Xp2800+ might do just a little better but not enough to warent the €100 price diference. They are both new processors and have the same core just different speeds. With a decent cooler an Xp2500+ will run at a Xp3200+ level with little problems (in most cases), the Xp2800+ is pretty much guarenteed to run at that speed or more.

I wouldnt buy a 160Gb drive, AMD systems are known for having problems recognising a drive >137GB, means you have to buy a new controller - you dont need the hassle. Am pretty sure its only with the VIA chipsets but personally wouldnt chance it.
That 120Gb drive from komplett really is such a sweet drive....

That graphics card is a good one, no need to spend money there as you will have to go for a €250+ one to notice any dramatic diference.

The lanboy case from elara comes with a very good power suply which has fans that light up blue (and thus will shine out your clear side pannel). That power supply will run your system absolutly no probs. Another recomended case is the Sonata, its a silent case with a silent power supply (lanboy power supply is also v.quiet).
Lanboy has a 350W antec TruePower TrueBlue power supply
Sonata has a 380W antec TruePower Power supply.

Xp2500+'s & Xp2800+'s normal overclock is between 2300Mhz & 2500Mhz on very good air cooling. Better speeds will be reached with water or pelt cooling. For under €100 you can have a chip that will perform aswell as a €500 Xp3200+ - sounds nice to me.

Am running an Xp3000+ myself @2400Mhz (Xp3500+), waiting on decent cooling to push it more.

ixoy

Interesting - how messy is overclocking? Is it simply a matter of turning a screw? And when you talk about water coolers and the like, are they expensive/messy to install? I may have a background in computers but they never thought us assembly in Trinity....

BTW, you're the second person to recommend the 2500XP+ instead of the 2800XP+ to save some money for a not marked performance increase....

Col_Loki

Overclocking isnt that bad, its a matter of changing settings in your BIOS . Its a bit of a juggling match to get it perfect, but the performance gains outweigh the bit of trouble. Its pretty hard to get a grasp of overclocking unless you are actually at your computer trying it. Best way to learn is by trying..... can give you quite acurate guidelines (have had an Xp2500+ myself) when you need them.

Would definetly recomend staying away from water coolers for a while, start with a good air cooler and you will definetly be pleased. Alot of messy tubes and that with water cooling, alot to know & watch out for.

Probably the best heatsink out there is the thermalright Slk900 or Slk800. If you get one of those and a good fan you will almost definetly go over the Xp3200+ mark with a 2500+.

Even if your not on for overclocking, would recomend a very easy mod to get your FSB up & take full advantage of your ram. Basicly just keeping the same speed with increased FSB. Whichever system you go for, have no doubt you will be pleased and will get decent performance.

Ps i agree , college teaches you nothing about hardware..... its easy to learn if you spend a bit of time on the boards .