Minutes of the IrelandOffline 2003 AGM

MDR

Minutes of the IrelandOffline 2003 AGM
Date: 26th Of July 2003
Time: 2pm to 5pm
Location: Clarendon Bar, 32 Clarendon Street, Dublin
Attendees:

Micheal Everson
Paul Cunnane
Ray Kinsella
John Barker
Donal Walsh
Paul Kane
James Griffin
James Melody
Micheal Meegan
John Hacket
Brian Kidney
David Long
Séamus Ryan
Elana Kehoe
Brendan Kehoe
Christain Cooke
Simon Nugent
David Stewart

Overview:

The AGM commenced with the chairmen's review of the year. David Long, the outgoing chairman, gave an overview of the progress made over the past year in the provision of affordable Internet access. The following issues were discussed: -

- The advent of FRIACO and the impact the resulting residential Internet products are having on the market.

- The subsequent reduction in the price of Eircom's wholesale bit-stream offering and the impact this had on prices to the consumer, also facilitating the entry of new operators into the market.

- The ever-increasing pace in the rollout of wireless technologies and the strategy being pursued by the wireless operators.

- The trialing of a new technology by the ESB, broadband over power lines and the advantages and the disadvantages of this technology.

- The continuing rollout of the government’s 'Metropolitan Area Network' (MAN) project, the likely timetable for completion and the
timescales/methodology for awarding the 'Managed Service Entity' (MSE) contract to run the network.

- The possible relationships that may form between the MAN project and the ESB's newly constructed fibre 'figure of eight', also the impact the 'Point of presence' size required by the ESB is having on small operators hoping to use the ESB's network.

- The release of the new Universal Service Obligation (USO) by Comreg, the on going discussions between Eircom and Comreg on establishing the terms of 'Functional Internet Access', the minimum bit-rate it could imply, the likely results of these discussions, the likely state of Eircom's network and therefore their ability to comply with the USO.

To close David took time to thank the outgoing committee and previous committees for their contribution to the recent successes enjoyed by IrelandOffline, and introduced Christian Cooke’s presentation of the ‘Future Direction of IrelandOffline’.

Christian Cooke gave an overview of the proposed IrelandOffline campaign strategy for the coming year: -

- When formed last September, the new committee decided that its strategy should be to focus on one issue that would drive development in all areas and that this issue should be ‘flat rate’.

- A focusing on alternative technologies was advocated, as being the best strategy to move forward IrelandOffline’s goals this year.

- This focusing would occur in light of issues such as the marketing
strategy being pursued by Eircom, the likely state of Eircom's network and Eircom's likely reaction to competition in the market.

- The strategy of focussing on one issue has been shown to be effective and Christian proposed that the same strategy should be used again next year by focussing on one issue that we agree will drive development in all areas.

- These alternative technologies focus on the 'last mile' delivery of
affordable robust Internet access to the consumer. Particular emphasis was paid to wireless technologies, as it was believed in the long term to offer the most scalability, flexibility and value for money.

- Instances of already successfully implemented projects in Ireland using these ‘alternative technologies’ where citied, including the particular advantages of these technologies in rural areas.

- It was proposed that these new technologies would complement other projects already underway such as the government’s MAN project and the ESB's 'fibre figure of eight'.

- It was proposed IrelandOffline resources should be further focused on lobbying, with a view to gaining government support for 'alternative last mile infrastructure’ with less emphasis being placed on other tasks such as responses to Comreg consultations.

The committee and members then engaged in a question and answer session. A synopsises of this discussion follows below: -

- Paul Cunnane - suggested that the 'alternative last mile' approach presented a way of pressuring Eircom through competition into improving their prices and services.

- Paul Kane - supported the idea of making the 'alternative last mile' campaign IrelandOffline's focus for the coming year.

- David Long - asserted that IrelandOffline should strive to meet as many vendors of 'alternative last mile' infrastructure as possible.

- Brendan Kehoe - voiced his belief that once a committee has been elected, members should not need know every detail of the actions of that committee.

- Brian Kidney - believes we can push the Dept of Communications and Minister Ahern into putting pressure on Comreg and Eircom, as we have seen with FRIACO. Furthermore he believes that Eircom would just fight any move tooth and nail and drag it out in court for years, even if concessions where won, in the end Eircom will always control the network and therefore
the minimum price and services are offered over it.

- Mike Megan - asserted his belief that competition was often viewed by ComReg and others in terms of allowing new and existing alternative telecom companies to make money off of Eircom's network.

- John Hacket - asserted his belief that Comreg has no brief to push the introduction of new services and that therefore attacking Comreg was futile. He also stated his belief that lobbying was the most effective way for IrelandOffline to achieve its objectives and the focus of its lobbying efforts should be the Minister, the Department and the Dail Committee

The questions and answers session concluded with a vote on the strategy to be pursued by IrelandOffline over the coming year. The membership endorsed the strategy as proposed by Christian Cooke in his presentation.

The elections for a new committee followed, with the old committee and chairperson stepping down. The results of elections are as follows: -

Existing Committee Members Returned

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Christian Cooke (Chairman)
David Long (Public Relations)
Ray Kinsella (Committee Member)
James Griffin (Committee Member)
Justin Mason (Committee Member)
Fergus McDonald (Committee Member)

New Committee Members

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John Hackett (Committee Member)
Brian Kidney (Committee Member)
Elana Kehoe (Committee Member)
Michael Everson (Committee Member)
Paul Cunnane (Committee Member)
Mike Meegan (Committee Member)
Donal Walsh (Committee Member)
Paul Kane (Committee Member)

Outgoing Members

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None

The AGM concluded at this point with members filing out to the bar for further discussion and refreshments. The committee would like to extend their thanks to all those who attended and looks forward to another successful year.

Regards

Ray Kinsella
IrelandOffline Committee

Paddy20

Thanks MDR,

Very interesting and concise. Nice to see that David is remaining in a Public Relations role for IOFFL.

The list of personal names of the committee, would not mean very much to me at this stage as I probably only know their IOFFL forum names or handles which tend to be anonymous, therefore I can not match them.

Paddy20.

oscarBravo

I know a number of the committee would rather keep their boards and real world identities distinct, but I don't have a problem saying that I'm Paul Cunnane.

(You could have found that out easily enough anyway, but I might as well save you the bother...)

gandalf

Well as a lot of people from boards have met me in real-life I have no problems identifying myself either - Paul Kane.

Gandalf

MDR

"We see our role as essentially defensive in nature. While our armies are advancing so fast and everyone's knocking themselves out to be heroes, we are holding ourselves in reserve in case the Krauts mount a counteroffensive which threatens Paris...or maybe even New York. Then we can move in and stop them. But for 1.6 million dollars, we could become heroes for three days."

Completely OTT, but .... oddball .... kellys heroes ... brillant film .... 'thats what you get for sending out all them negative waves, ah oddball I ain't nothin but postive thoughts about that bridge since we left'.

jesus_thats_gre

I think it is deadly what you lads are doing. I would love to get involved in something like this, I really believe that the work you do now is going to have a really positive effect on this country in the long term. Too many people have been dragging their feet for too long about issues that ye have addressed in the last year.

Paddy20

MDR,

Eh!, What? you have lost me completely. What they putting in
the Jungle juice round your way these days?..

I think I need some!.

Paddy20.;)

gandalf

Naw Paddy MDR is going on about my Sig which is a quote from that brilliant WW2 Clint Eastwood film Kellys Heroes

jesus_thats_gre you can do something now. Start writing to the papers, your local TD's, councillers and European representitives (elections next year boys) about how the current situation with regard to Communications infrastructure in this country is costing jobs and investment.

Gandalf.

jesus_thats_gre

Odly enough, my best mate knows Dermot Aherne very well He already had a long conversation about broadband in a very frank manner. Seemed to work, he said he would make it a personal goal of his to improve it, seems to have done.

sceptre

Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
he would make it a personal goal of his to improve it, seems to have done.

Aye, and he deserves credit for being the first one to get off his heinie and do something about it

mumble, mumble, should have been done years ago, still too slow

I look at it this way: "something done, a crazy amount still to do"

MDR

Aye, and he deserves credit for being the first one to get off his heinie and do something about it

here here

thegills

MDR,

I would appreciate if you could perhaps expand on the following items please;

- The trialing of a new technology by the ESB, broadband over power lines and the advantages and the disadvantages of this technology.

- The possible relationships that may form between the MAN project and the ESB's newly constructed fibre 'figure of eight', also the impact the 'Point of presence' size required by the ESB is having on small operators hoping to use the ESB's network.

Regards

thegills

MDR

thegills

The trialing of a new technology by the ESB, broadband over power lines and the advantages and the disadvantages of this technology.

Now bear with me I may not have total recall on this matter, Dave may be better placed when he returns to expand. It is the IrelandOffline committee understanding the ESB, under the direction (or pressure) of Minister Ahern is to trial broadband over powerlines. We had only scetchy information about the actual tecnhology itself, only really that a successful trial has been carried out in scottland. It seems to be well suited to the provision of broadband to rural areas and it has theorical max of 2megs a second, which mean it won't be very scaleable for Ireland's future needs.

The possible relationships that may form between the MAN project and the ESB's newly constructed fibre 'figure of eight',

Now my basic understanding of this is that, the managed service entity (MSE) will be responsibe for purchasing in bulk backhaul from the MAN projects to Irelands International Links in Dublin, in order to keep costs down. The ESB's new fibre figure of eight, obviousily fits this roll perfectily, however the MSE I don't think there is under any legal or otherwise obligation other than to get the best deal. Nonetheless it will interesting to see where the MSE gets its backhaul from, and what sort of prices they pay.

also the impact the 'Point of presence' size required by the ESB is having on small operators hoping to use the ESB's network.

From what I understand, the ESB requires that minimum bandwidth you can purchase from them is 155 megs (or something mad huge like that). The problem with this is that it doesn't encourage local ISPs (based on wireless technologies) to be formed in the population centres their fibre passes through, as no local ISP is gonna be able to afford that sort of bandwidth. The ideal size to enourage these sort of venture is thought to be a 'Point of presence' of around 2 megs ... So IOFFL will be lobbing to reduce this POP size to encourage small operators ...

thegills

MDA,
There is no real onus on the MSE to link all of the MAN's.
The ESB n/w does not service all of the MAN's so an alternative such as Aurora will be needed. ESB AFAIK are pitching quite high for STM-1's also.

The ideal size to enourage these sort of venture is thought to be a 'Point of presence' of around 2 megs ... So IOFFL will be lobbing to reduce this POP size to encourage small operators ...

Perhaps encourage ESB to use DWDM and perhaps reduce the price an STM-1 to make it more attractive to smaller OLO's. Hibernia in Dublin have unlimited international access and will be telling customers that they can buy an STM-1 from them at the same price they paid previously for an E1.

spongebob

Originally posted by MDR

Now bear with me I may not have total recall on this matter, Dave may be better placed when he returns to expand. It is the IrelandOffline committee understanding the ESB, under the direction (or pressure) of Minister Ahern is to trial broadband over powerlines.
<snip>
It seems to be well suited to the provision of broadband to rural areas and it has theorical max of 2megs a second, which mean it won't be very scaleable for Ireland's future needs.

The trials will start in September (or they will be formally launched....not the same thing I know )

Tuam and Portlaoise are on the list. Thats all I know of.

See Here

The 155mbit entry level is indeed a head scratcher. We are a year away from a proper system to break these into manageable chunks.....between 25 and 50mbit is what is needed as a Port size IMO

M

thegills

Tuam and Portlaoise are on the list

I think it's only Tuam (Cloon Sub-station)

thegills