Religion in Schools

Liquorice

There may have been a thread like this before, but anyway.
What do you all think about religion being a Junior Cert subject? It's compulsory in my school, a Catholic school, so I shouldn't be complaining about having to do religion, but I don't see why it's a Junior Cert subject, religion doesn't really have much educational value, except in morality, but even so, it shouldn't be a Junior Cert subject. If it must be, I don't see why we must be fed pro-Catholic propaganda, and why we can't just learn about world religions. I would have nothing against doing it without it being a Junior Certificate subject, but that's only because, as I mentioned before, my school is a Catholic school, and I knew that when I started there.
I mentioned morality earlier, and I don't object to morality being taught in schools if the schools are stated as being Catholic/Presbyterian/Muslim etc. schools, because all religions have their own morals. But to teach morality as part of a Junior Cert subject is wrong, because even within specific religions people will have different morals and there's no 'set' set of morals for our country, except things like 'don't kill others' and 'don't steal'.

Zukustious

Yeah I think religion should be taught in schools. I'm all for the spreading of wisdom to the young 'uns. However, it'd be a lot nicer if they taught more than they do. Spread it out to all the other religions, so the icklies can get a good idea of what the best one for them is, if they so choose. I also believe athieism should be covered. I know it's not technically a religion, but it is a way of thinking how things are.

How can you examine someone on what they believe?

claire h

I was under the impression that the Junior Cert religion course covered aspects of *all* religions, not just Catholicism. If that's the case then I think it's a good idea - can't hurt, and it's probably considered a waffly subject along the lines of CSPE (ah, happy memories!) but I also think because religion has been a non-examined subject for so long, you do tend to have the teachers who just want to spout pro-Catholic propaganda and refuse to listen to anyone's ideas and make you want to throw large objects at their heads. (Quote from my fifth-year religion teacher re: a non-Catholic spiritual idea someone brought up: "Right, but can you *prove* it?" :rolleyes: )

Liquorice

The course does cover world religions, but it's more or less a chapter or two each and small mentions elsewhere. The course also cobers religion in general, such as reasons for belief, prayer etc., but I still don't agree with it being a Junior Cert subject.

Boston

You think thats bad, soon it will be a leaving cert subject. Saw the recommendation myself, and the sylibus. My religion teacher was a queer anyway, left me warped for light telling us of his twisted sexual antics and his bizare drinkign habites.

article6

It shouldn't be an exam subject - that stops you from watching Shrek in class. (Yeah, I had such a brilliant religion teacher.)

I can't see the point of examining it at Junior Cert, and certainly not at Leaving Cert, on account of my view that it's about your own personal thoughts on the matter, and a set syllabus is counterproductive. Of course all of these school matters are irrelevant to me now. Ah ha ha ha ha ha. Ha.

Sleazus

Okay, what I'm about to say will reveal me as a closet right-winger, and some of you may not like it, but here goes...

Seen as most schools were set up by Catholic Orders, I feel they should have some sway in what they are allowed to teach. Let's face it, the Catholic Church set up schools for the purpose of enforcing the belief system of children. The Jesuits didn't travel the world teaching in the spirit of charity and good will. Education naturally forwards the views of the educators. However, if you don't like it, you can always find another school theat better suits your concerns and beliefs.

Furthermore, one of the main principals the heroes of the Rising faught for, was that of a Catholic Ireland. You don't have to be Catholic, you have the freedom to do what you will with your life. Frankly, I'm Catholic, but I believe the Church is a bunch of right-wing nuts. However, the men who secured this freedom for our country did so in the belief that they were dying for a a Catholic Ireland. We don't have to like it or convert to it, but we owe it to them to respect it. Ireland is a Catholic Country and that is so tied in with our history that you can't attempt to rip it out just because you don't want it there.

So hey, teach the subject. If you really feel that strongly about it, just don't show up at the exam. Don't expect the world to change because you think it should. Just avoid that which you find offensive.

And please don't throw the abuse commited by the Catholic Church back at me. As I said above, the majority of the Church consists of right-wing nuts who are so far disconnected from reality that they are likely to accept the National Enquirer as fact. The religion itself is what is being taught.

By the way, I did dress up as Jesus for the Second Disco, but I figure God has a sense of humour. Look at the world, eh?

claire h

Well, Religion for the LC is going to be an optional subject, which makes a difference - it's compulsory in most schools for the JC now, isn't it?

I think having it as an exam subject means that people do take it seriously, and being educated about other religions is always a positive thing. So if kids do finish the syllabus and do the exam and have *learnt* something about that - then, yeah, I'm all for it. But from the sounds of it, that's not entirely what's happening.

However, if you don't like it, you can always find another school that better suits your concerns and beliefs.

See, almost every single school in this country *is* a religious one. And certainly the ones that are considered 'good' schools are religious ones. And you shouldn't have to choose between getting the best education you can, and being able to express your beliefs in school.

Spenguin

I go to a school where we have only learned about Jesus and how he lived and how he died so far. Pretty much nothing else. I don't think you should be forced to learn religion as a junior cert subject. People should have the right to choose at least.

Dalamar

It's a stupid idea to teach in schools period. The book the some schools used these years "All About Faith" was frankly utter sh*te. Utter sh*te written by one devout to the point of stupidity chatholic person. So, starting from that, it's Chatolic doctrine down your throats from the start. It barely covers other religions.

As a junior cert subject, the eduaction minister (or whoever decided on it) should be shot.

Aliminator

It is possible to get exemptions to religion, just like irish.
i did it.

Spog

I think religion should be taught in schools, but not in the Catholic way i.e. we are great and this is where all the other religions went wrong. Maybe its just how ive been taught but it sucks anyway!

NeoSlicerZ

I hated having to sit through religion classes in school , absolutely boring.

halenger

Well in my school we spent 5th and 6th year talking about World religions in detail...

You're too young and impressionable before the JC. You might all of a sudden pick up and change religion-perhaps weekly(as you go through the different religions in class).

Kidding... No idea why but maybe they wanna make sure you know about your own religion before you learn about the rest of them!

halenger

Alim: only in your schools and similar ones.

I highly doubt you'd get an exemption in any Catholic school or Protestent school or whatever religion school since you're supposed to be of that religion to be IN that school.

malecO

I never had to do it for the junior cert. muahahaha.
Although I still had to do it as a non-examined subject. My first year teacher was sound enough, my 2nd year one was a narrow-minded biotch and my 3rd year teacher was an even bigger narrow-minded biotch who would always tell us to shut up when certain ideas were expressed.

Raphael

Originally posted by halenger
Alim: only in your schools and similar ones.

I highly doubt you'd get an exemption in any Catholic school or Protestent school or whatever religion school since you're supposed to be of that religion to be IN that school.

Matter of interest Halenger i go to a Christian Brothers school and 3 of my best friends who are an Athiest, a Protestant, and a Jehovah's Witness all get off RE so i'm afraid your wrong

Sorry

twirly sponge

Originally posted by article6
It shouldn't be an exam subject - that stops you from watching Shrek in class. (Yeah, I had such a brilliant religion teacher.)

In first year all we did was watch videos and do brainteasers. And my religion teacher was a priest.

And yeah, you dont have to do religion if you dont want to in my school, there are a good few non-Catholics who dont do it. And my brother didnt do it even though he is Catholic, my parents told the school they didnt want him to do religion, but he was in 5th year so it wasnt an exam subject anyway.

Havelock

Morality and world beliefs should be taught in a "religion" class. Thought its subject name should be Philosophy. It would be better if you got a grounding in the mainstream world beliefs and even non-beliefs. But it won't happen here, the churchs have a hold on the schools they would be very reluctant to give up. Its hould not be an exam subject as not everyone would be interested in it.

John Player

hehe i saw someone say they uste to watch shrek in class, we watched loads of stuff,

sister act
fawlty towers
final destination
philadelphia

cant think of ne more offhand, our religion teacher was a priest and no one in the class would ever listen to him jsut talk instead, only way to shut us up was to let us watch vids hehe

luke

halenger

Originally posted by Jaffer
so i'm afraid your wrong

Sorry

Well I'm telling ya how my school was. So I'm not wrong. They're just lucky!

Man U babe

When I was in 6th year i had a 78 year old nun teaching us religion. Lots of fire and brimstone.i got kicked out of her class for 4 weeks for not going to confession before christmas. (crazy all-girls convent school btw). She dragged me back into her class when she found out i was using this time to sit in the school library playing me game boy.:p

I dont agree with the teaching of religion in schools. i believe that religion is a personal matter which shouldnt be forced on anyone. If you choose to believe in god/allah/buddhism/judaism/hinduism thats fine, but thats a matter for you and your soul, not something for the department of education to test you on.
Tbh id prefer if theyd reform the exam system rather than waste their time introducing RE for the JC.

mentalimplosion

Originally posted by Man U babe
(crazy all-girls convent school btw).

which crazy all girls convent school? was it in donnybrook and does it have THE BEST MINOR A HOCKEY TEAM EVER?

as you all should remember from discussion this year (it was me who brought up the topic), this is a topic i am EXTREMELY strong minded on (what with me letter in the paper and all). i'm in a convent school and love it to bits. except religion class.

each school selects parts from the syllabus to teach its students. in my school er, whoops, let's leave out anything relating to world religions other than judaism and catholicism. ok, ok, we'll bring them to a mosque. that should do.

my response... eh, no. i'm nonreligious and am sick of hearing about how crappy us heathens are and etc. ok, i'm way too tired to launch a big angry speech.
but i'll write when i have more energy. oh btw, this year we get to watch an abortion in class.


:mad:

Aliminator

Originally posted by mentalimplosion
in my school er, whoops, let's leave out anything relating to world religions other than judaism and catholicism.

no wonder the majority of people in this country are so ignorant to other religions. The architects of state have you eating out of their hands (e.g. CNN. Sky News. all spreaders of a censored view)

and what exactly do you guys learn about Islam? i'm just wondering.....pray tell.

It wasn't me!

If a school chooses to teach it that's something they do. It shouldn't be compulsory, especially for exams. I mean, how can they test you on something you accept to be true or not. The only feasible way of examining people on it would be to question them on the beliefs of every religion except their own. Something to ponder upon kiddies

On a lighter note, My year are the last ones who don't have to do RE for Junior Cert. And it's optional (So far) for the leaving cert so I'll never have to do a state exam on it!

Also, how can a standardized state test ask questions on religion when the country is not entirely one religion.

Ah Feck It! I'm off to create a SPAM THREAD!!!!!!

Barry Aldwell

/me loads anti spammer rifle

/me remembers that rifles don't work over the internet

/me decides to spam in spam thread

Liquorice

Originally posted by Aliminator
and what exactly do you guys learn about Islam? i'm just wondering.....pray tell.

Just the story of Muhammed's life, the five articles of faith, the Five Pillars, a bit about the mosques and the Muslim way of life. That's what's in the book. But our year got taken to the Mosque in Clonskeagh and we got to ask questions about Islam and we got a proper insight into Islam, rather than the indifference in the book. I mean, it would be great if the entire book was indifferent, but it's pro-Catholic and indifferent to everything else. It talks about aspects of the Catholic faith as if they were DEFINITELY true, but about aspects of other faiths as if it's not very likely that they're true.

Man U babe

Originally posted by mentalimplosion
which crazy all girls convent school? was it in donnybrook and does it have THE BEST MINOR A HOCKEY TEAM EVER?

Oh god no.

Aliminator

Excellent. a learned one in my religion. finally. someone who would not believe the blatant muppetry on TV.

Typedef

"Wise man say, forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza" - Michaelangelo - Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles

"Religion is the opium of the masses" - Karl Marx
http://www.awitness.org/news/november_2001/opiate_religion_marx.html

Since god has not been proved to exist and in fact the so-called proof of god has been eroding exponentially over the last 200 years, religion belongs, well away from anyplace that teaches fact.

Green Hand Guy

One religion teacher in my school actually told us to beware of people in other religions. He then went on to make a big anti-islamic speech which absolutely disgusted me. I don't think religion should be compulsory but the least they could do is give us non-racist religion teachers.