Budget 2004

Victor

They've put up the index apge here: http://www.finance.gov.ie/budget/budget2004/bud04index.htm

"Next year's Budget will be announced, as has been the custom in recent years, on the first Wednesday of December - Wednesday 3rd December, 2003"

So what are people's wild guesses and wishes as to what it will contain?

daveg

I can't see it being good. Knowing this goverment lots of stealth taxes. PAYE tax probably going up. God knows.... but it wont be good.

Fry

PAYE tax will not be going up, although they have said that PRSI could be going up 1.5%. But who knows, its always a shock anyway.

I used to love the budgets in 99,00,01. More money!
Now I'm NOT!

BigEejit

We are going to be screwed, they are going to hit us with everything possibly bar PAYE ... (I am sure I heard grumblings from McCreevy or someone saying that it is very unlikely .. might have been a "expert" on radio, cant remember) ... this country is going to be that little bit easier to leave

slave1

we may as well bend over in anticipation

my thoughts on politics have always been, there's no point in having a thought, no matter who you vote for the government always get in and in this country there is no difference between the parties, they're all as bad as each other. They get on the gravy train, then when they don't get reelected they get onto the seanate or a fecking MEP or sommit
Gross mismanagement of our country over the years, everytime there's an up they slash taxes to get voted in hwen in reality they would be better off servicing the debt and thinking long term.
IF I got a raise in the morning I'd be increasing my mortgage repayments so I could save interest and get out of debt quicker, the goverment would instead lower their payments and spend like a looper.
My signature has never been appropriate before....

sceptre

Originally posted by BigEejit
they are going to hit us with everything possibly bar PAYE ... (I am sure I heard grumblings from McCreevy or someone saying that it is very unlikely

I'd be amazed if they increase the PAYE rates, though they may fiddle with the bands. They've been saying things like "the Irish people voted for low tax" for too long to change the rates upwards. Of course they'll still do the dog on indirect tax (it's one of those PD cornerstones that FF thinks was their idea)

Hairy Homer

I've been told by our HR person that they are extending BIK to loads of things. Hitting luncheon vouchers has received a bit of press coverage. But I'm told they are also extending BIK to company property that you use at home outside of office hours.

This, I'm told, includes laptop computers and mobile phones.

FFS, we HAVE to bring our laptops home because the local skangers kept breaking into our office and nicking them.

Anyone else heard about this?

Victor

Originally posted by Hairy Homer
I've been told by our HR person that they are extending BIK to loads of things. Hitting luncheon vouchers has received a bit of press coverage. But I'm told they are also extending BIK to company property that you use at home outside of office hours. This, I'm told, includes laptop computers and mobile phones. FFS, we HAVE to bring our laptops home because the local skangers kept breaking into our office and nicking them. Anyone else heard about this?

Everything that isn't "wholly, exclusively & necessarily" as business expense will be charged full BIK from 1/1/2004 - that was in last year's budget. I can't see them charging BIK on laptops (home use doesn't do much wear and tear on a laptop or cost "extra"), but I can see them charging it on personal calls from company phones.

One of the luncheon voucher companies has said it is withdrawing from the Irish market. I can see a boom in "staff entertainment" expenses and other fudges next year to make up for the BIK.

Victor

Old reliables and carbon tax come to mind.
http://home.eircom.net/content/irelandcom/breaking/1638099?view=Eircomnet

Falling inflation may bring more tax - economist
From:ireland.com
Thursday, 9th October, 2003

Ireland's falling inflation rate may lead to higher rates of indirect taxation in the next budget, a leading economist warned today.

Mr Austin Hughes, chief economist with IIB Bank, said lower inflation will lower tax revenues in real terms so the upcoming budget may see hefty increases in indirect taxation.

Irish inflation fell to 2.9 per cent in September, the lowest rate since November 1999. Whether prices continue to fall throughout the rest of the year may depend on the decisions taken in the upcoming budget.

Mr Hughes maintains that as the Minister for Finance, Mr McCreevy, will be keen to ensure that the budget arithmetic doesn't weaken too far, he may decide to meet the shortfall by raising indirect taxes by about €400 million.

In that event, Irish inflation would average about 2.6 per cent in 2004, according to Mr Hughes.

Our man in Havana

Expect lots of new stealth taxes.

star gazer

Mr Austin Hughes, chief economist with IIB Bank, said lower inflation will lower tax revenues in real terms so the upcoming budget may see hefty increases in indirect taxation.

But doesn't it alos make it cheaper for the government to do business too? Considering they probably won't move the tax bands inb line with inflation? It seems to look like a case of looking for the cloud in a silver lining.

McC is going to get the old reliables, squeeze governemnt departments bar educ and health. Benchamrking will bring extra charges from local authorities and reduce services potential from government departments. Each government department will be asked to find ingenious ways to charge people or reduce financial benefits (eg BIK). The OAP will go up significantly again. It's a key political benefit with a lot of votes at stake. Semi state companies will be expected to cough up greater dividends in exchange for the price increases they are getting.

Victor

Speaking of accountants, how about a tax sytem that makes tax advisors redundant by simplifying the tax code as much as possible and only having one income tax system (no separate system for CGT etc.). Put the best minds in the country to work productively, not in tax avoidance.

http://home.eircom.net/content/irelandcom/topstories/1665583?view=Eircomnet

Tough Budget will focus on competitiveness
From:ireland.com
Tuesday, 14th October, 2003

The predicted shortfall in end-of-year tax receipts could be less than expected, but a tough Budget is still on the cards, the Minister for Finance, Mr McCreevy, has said. And he said the emphasis would be on on improving Irish competitiveness.

Speaking yesterday, before addressing the Leinster Society of Chartered Accountants' October lunch in Dublin, Mr McCreevy said the fall in the amount of tax collected by the Exchequer had stopped during the third quarter.

And while he did not say that the shortfall in tax receipts for the year would be less than the €500 million his Department had forecast, the Minister said he expected a further improvement by the end of the month.

He pointed out the collection of self-employed and capital gains taxes would further boost the Exchequer at the end of October.

"The figures for the third quarter did not deteriorate any further and the overall receipts are a lot better than they were at the start of the year," he said.

Mr McCreevy would not be drawn on whether he intended to increase the level of indirect taxation in his December Budget. He said that low taxation had been a successful cornerstone of Government policy, which had ultimately yielded better receipts for the Exchequer.

"Low direct taxation means that you have to get taxes from other sources," he said. "Last year, I increased some indirect taxes, and that money goes to pay nurses, gardaí and teachers."

Mr McCreevy agreed that there were recovery signs in the global economy. However, he made it clear that he wanted to keep the national finances on a tight rein. "I am inclined to take a cautious view of growth prospects," he said.

In his speech, the Minister said the Budget would be strategic rather than reactive.

"What we must do is to ensure that Ireland is first off the blocks when the recovery happens," he said. "The key to achieving this is maintaining and improving our competitiveness."

Mr McCreevy said prudence dictated that the Government make sensible decisions and not put at risk the gains made in recent years.

He acknowledged that the past year had been difficult for the economy. But he argued that the Republic had coped with the downturn. "Today's Irish economy is robust and resilient," he said. "That resilience is particularly important in difficult times and will continue to stand us in good stead in the coming year. Resilience is, however, no excuse for complacency."

He warned that the State had to accept a new economic reality and realise that the days of double-digit growth were over.

Mr McCreevy told the gathering of accountants that the second stage of the legislation that will create the Irish Auditing and Accounting Supervisory Authority would be going before the Seanad later this week.

He said that the Companies (Auditing and Accounting) Bill, 2003, proposed far-reaching reforms of the regulatory structures governing the accountancy professions. "The Bill represents a challenge to the accountancy profession," he said. "It is one which I am confident will be embraced enthusiastically."

ur mentor

Todays Times says Revenue will specifically exclude lap tops, mobile phones and the like from new BIK charges
Paye will stay the same but bands will only move marginally
Fags and drink will go up
Car tax will go up but VRT may come down a bit
banks will get new levy
petrol and diesel will go up
Capital gains taxes may go up to 25%
thats my guess anyway

Victor

http://home.eircom.net/content/irelandcom/topstories/1684089?view=Eircomnet

Revenue lists new items liable for BIK taxes
From:ireland.com
Friday, 17th October, 2003

The Revenue Commissioners last night published the list of non- cash remuneration that will be liable for income tax and PRSI from next January.

Car parking spaces are not included, but the private use of company vans has been included in a move that is unlikely to please employers.

Many workers now face a cut in their take-home pay from January. The new regime will see both employers and employees paying PRSI on a wide range of perks - from health insurance to lunch vouchers and childcare subsidies. In addition, workers will pay the 2 per cent health levy on the monetary value of the benefits.

The Minister for Finance, Mr McCreevy, calculates that the measures will bring in an extra €83 million to the Exchequer but accountants last night predicted that the windfall would be far greater.

Car parking has escaped the clutches of the new regime of taxation on benefit in kind (BIK) despite Mr McCreevy repeated intention to bring it within the tax net.

"This is the first time he has confirmed in writing that it will not happen," said Mr Jim Ryan, tax partner at Ernst & Young, indicating that it is unlikely to feature again in the lifetime of this Government.

KPMG's Mr John Bradley said there were no huge surprises in the rules. Mobile phones, laptops and personal computers provided by employers will not be liable to tax where personal use is incidental. Company share schemes also remain out of the net along with pensions.

However, employers were concerned by measures to tax private use of company vans. IBEC economist Mr Aebhric McGibney said many companies allowed employees to bring company vans home to allow them get where they were required more quickly the following day.

"These vans are purely for work and some are required for people on call," he said. The new rules will leave those using them open to tax for the first time.

Employees also face a jump in the tax on company cars, where the costs are not paid fully by the employer.

Employers face a struggle to implement the new rules by the January 1st deadline. Although the new regime was announced in last year's Budget, it took the Revenue more than seven months to produce an initial draft and the final guidelines were only put on its website yesterday. It will be some time before employers receive copies of the rules under which they will assume all responsibility for determining the tax payable on benefit in kind.

"It is a big issue for employers who now have less than three months to prepare for such a major change," said Mr Ken O'Brien, a director in the tax division at PricewaterhouseCoopers.

Victor

New moronic webpage http://www.finance.gov.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=831

Cork

Originally posted by Bond-James Bond
Expect lots of new stealth taxes.

I am getting so tired of the term "stealth taxes".

People in this country always paid for VHI, ESB, Gas, Bus, Trains, TV Licence etc.

Yet tabloids have been harping on & on about stealth taxes.

Where are these new found taxes?

BigEejit

I am not an accountant/economist but isnt the tax on new passports a brand new, never before seen tax? ... as it only affects a relatively small percentage each year I would class this as a stealth tax

Victor

Originally posted by BigEejit
I am not an accountant/economist but isnt the tax on new passports a brand new, never before seen tax? ... as it only affects a relatively small percentage each year I would class this as a stealth tax

There has always been a charge for passports (I remmeber paying £30 in 1990)- its (a) to cover the administration costs invovled (b) to stop you "losing" them too often. BigEejit seems about right

Victor

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/front/2003/1129/217141677HM1BUDGET.html

McCreevy gets Budget boost of Eur500m from capital tax
Cliff Taylor, Economics Editor

The Minister for Finance's options for Budget day have increased markedly, due mainly to an unexpected surge in capital gains tax revenue.

With savings also coming through on the national debt, pre-Budget figures show that Mr McCreevy now has more scope to plan for welfare increases and modest tax concessions in next Wednesday's package.

The huge inflow of capital gains tax over the past month and strong returns from capital acquisitions tax has left revenue from these sources almost €500 million higher than expected. Because capital gains tax is paid in late October, this windfall has only come to light in today's figures.

The White Paper, which estimates the Exchequer position for 2003 and forecasts trends for 2004 before Budget measures, shows that capital tax buoyancy has offset weakness in other tax receipts.

Total tax revenue is now expected to be €100 million above Budget forecast this year, a dramatic turnaround when just last month the Department of Finance was warning that the shortfall could reach €500 million.

Together with €200 million savings on national debt servicing costs, this means that Government borrowing this year - using the EU measure - is now expected to be just €605 million, €280 million below the Budget forecast. This has improved the outlook for 2004.

Mr McCreevy is expected to increase most social welfare rates in tandem with anticipated inflation of 3 per cent, with bigger increases on pensions and child benefit.

The latest figures are sure to increase pressure on the Government to reverse some planned social welfare cuts and to increase spending on infrastructure. However, so far Mr McCreevy has insisted that the only significant spending increases on Budget day will be in welfare rates.

Labour's finance spokeswoman, Ms Joan Burton, said the White Paper showed that the "austerity programme" being followed by Mr McCreevy was not necessary.

Mr McCreevy is expected to go further than last year in adjusting income tax credits and the standard rate income tax band for inflation. To help pay for this, some excise duty increases are expected, but these will be more modest than the last Budget and are likely to add less than 0.5 per cent to inflation next year. More than €80 million in extra revenue will also be pencilled in for the imposition of PRSI on benefit-in-kind payments.

Before the Budget measures, the White Paper shows that the Department of Finance expects tax revenue to increase by 5 per cent next year, with income tax rising strongly as the jobs market improves. Excises are only expected to rise slightly, partly due to the expected impact of the smoking ban.

Mr McCreevy will start out before the Budget already having to borrow €1,038 million to bridge the gap between spending and revenue. He is expected to limit additional borrowing on Budget day and aim for a deficit of €1,400 to €1,500 million for 2004, about 1 per cent of expected GDP or possibly slightly less and well below most other EU countries.

LizardKing

WATCH THE 04 BUDGET LIVE HERE

Here Here ....

Yoda

Main points of the Budget, from here.

Main Points

• Eight Government departments and 10,300 workers to transfer to 53 centres in 25 counties

• Cigarettes to increase by 25 cents per pack of 20

• Petrol and diesel to increase by 5 cents per litre

• Social welfare payments to increase by €10 per week

• Increase in employee tax credit at basic rate to €1,040 per annum

• Film relief to be extended to December 2008

• Pensions to rise by €10 to €167.30 per week

• Minimum maternity benefit up €10 per week

• Family Income Supplement threshold up €28 a week

•Widows'/widowers' pension to increase by €11.50 per week

• Tax exemption limits for 65 and over up to €15,500 (single) and €31,000 (married)

• Child benefit to increase by €6, and by €8 for third and subsequent children

• Rolling budgets introduced for spending in Government departments

• Extra €30m for school buildings in 2004

• €25m for placements and support services for disabled

• Respite care grant up to €835 per annum

• Tax relief on trade union subscriptions increased from €130 to €200

• Tax reliefs on construction projects under way extended to July 2006

• Contribution of €30 million to Local Government Fund

• Extension of Business Expansion Scheme scheme to December 2006

• Compulsory retirement age of 65 to be removed for civil service

• GDP in 2004 to grow at 3.3%

• New income tax exemption for income received for Gaeltacht summer housing scheme

Introduction of up to 20 per cent of a tax credit for incremental R&D expenditure by companies

• Tax relief for all insurance premia in relation to non-routine dental care

• Exempt annual threshold for farm leases to increase to €7,500 (five to seven years) or €10,000 (seven years or over)

• Farmers' flat-rate VAT addition to increase from 4.3 to 4.4 per cent

trilo

the governement does not give a **** about the health of its people as can be seen from the country's two tier system of health.. the public and the private.

the assholes only care about themselves and the richest in the country.

we need to get them out.. look at other country's such as germany who were able to form a universal health system where access to health care was based on need and not on wealth.

ireland couldnt give a fook... well copnsultants and others who would kick up about this dont give a fooka dn only care about the money they are making out of the private health care...

and is there any change to the public waiting lists in this budget ... i dont think so...

i know who i dont want be in our governement in the next elections.... feciin right wing parties

Paddy20

If you cannot beat them, join them. So I think I will become an official hoodlum/thief/crook, and enter Politics!.

P.:rolleyes:

Capt'n Midnight

Originally posted by Victor
Everything that isn't "wholly, exclusively & necessarily" as business expense will be charged full BIK from 1/1/2004 - that was in last year's budget

AFAIK the rules on BIK haven't really changed - just the way it is collected - previously it was up to the employee to declare the benifit (many didn't !) they received so it is mainly a shift in resposibility - it's now up to the employer to deduce BIK at source.

Our man in Havana

What would be BIK and how much does it cost in tax?

LoneGunM@n

The Taxation Summary from the Institute of Taxation in Ireland states that:

Where an asset owned by an employer is provided for the private use of a director or employee for free or less than full consideration, the benefit-in-kind is computed on the annual value of the use of the asset in addition to current expenditure incurred by the employer in connection with the asset

Each class of asset has it's own calculation for BIK!!

You should take a look @ http://www.revenue.ie/pdf/bikguide.pdf for more information!!

dmeehan

Originally posted by Victor
They've put up the index apge here: http://www.finance.gov.ie/budget/budget2004/bud04index.htm

"Next year's Budget will be announced, as has been the custom in recent years, on the first Wednesday of December - Wednesday 3rd December, 2003"

now that the budget is over i am getting a 404 error on that link:rolleyes:

Victor

Originally posted by dmeehan
now that the budget is over i am getting a 404 error on that link:rolleyes:

Originally posted by Victor
New moronic webpage http://www.finance.gov.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=831

gurramok

Originally posted by LoneGunM@n
The Taxation Summary from the Institute of Taxation in Ireland states that:

Where an asset owned by an employer is provided for the private use of a director or employee for free or less than full consideration, the benefit-in-kind is computed on the annual value of the use of the asset in addition to current expenditure incurred by the employer in connection with the asset

Each class of asset has it's own calculation for BIK!!

You should take a look @ http://www.revenue.ie/pdf/bikguide.pdf for more information!!

Had a look at that link, still gobbledook to me

I get medical insurance paid by employer monthly.

In January, does it mean i have to pay the full total?
OR
Is it taxed at PRSI/PAYE standard rates like normal pay is?
OR
Is some of it paid from my wages via health contribution(2% levy) ?

which is which ?

Victor

Originally posted by gurramok
I get medical insurance paid by employer monthly.

In January, does it mean i have to pay the full total?
OR
Is it taxed at PRSI/PAYE standard rates like normal pay is?
OR
Is some of it paid from my wages via health contribution(2% levy) ?

As best I understand it, say your insurance is woth €1,000 per year, it will be taxed and PRSIed and Health Levied as if that €1,000 was salary, whereas previously it was only taxed. You are still better off as you would need to earn €1,500-€2,000 to pay it yourself.

shoegirl

As far as we have been advised:

1. The standard rate tax relief for vhi/bupa remains, so if you only pay standard rate tax, you only pay the PRSI. If you pay 42%, then the standard rate is deducted, so it is taxed at a reduced rate of about 20%.

2. You also pay PRSI on the entire amount.

Again this depends on what you are earning.

If you earn less than 42k then you pay 4%
More than 42k you pay only 2% (yet another justification for removing the PRSI ceiling - these people can afford it more than those on the lower rate can)

So basically, if your subscription is worth €400 and you earn less than 28k you pay about €24 per year or €2 per month

Earning between 28k and 42k this rises to about 100 but drops slightly if you earn more than 42k due to the reduced PRSI rate.

Unless you are insured on Plan E VHI or BUPA gold the reality is that it will be offset by the small increase in the personal allowance.

Also, for lower rate tax payers its really quite marginal as only a few euro a month.