Penalties on BB contracts if you move house?

Dr Bolouswki

I finally got my line passed for BB (involved numerous calls of complaint to eircom) - now I get onto UTV to sign up and they tell me if I want to move the account (I'm moving in 4 months) that I have to pay a 150 euro transfer fee and an extra months rental? And also that if I can't get BB on my new phone I have to pay the remaining contract on the BB, which is for a minumum of 12 months?

Anyone have any experience of how Eircom, Esat or UTV react if you cancel BB before the 12 months? I'd imagine I'm safe enough to get it for the 4 months, cancel, and just get it again in my new gaff?

Any ideas?

rymus

ohh thats just beautiful! I've just had my UTV bb for about 2 weeks now and I was given the news that I'm to move house in Feb. I'm certainly not paying any bloody fine or fee or whatever they want to call it.

Something that just sprung to mind actually... Since I joined up over the Internet using my credit card I didn't actually physically sign anything. If youre in the same boat then it's worth checking out what the situation is. If you sent in a direct debit form your signature will be on that but the only signature they'll have of mine is from my old XL account. I'm sure at some stage Malcolm will reply giving all the in's and out's so I'll wait for that.

Moving house is expensive and stressful enough without getting ridden by your ISP for actually wanting to keep their service.

dahamsta

I'll be moving in February so I'll be saying to UTV: It's like this, you can either keep me as a slightly less profitable customer or write me off as a bad debt. I hope they'll choose wisely.

adam

thomasb

There is a cost to the ISP in enabling your new house line for DSL. It's not unreasonable for the ISP to expect you to cover that loss.

_Kaiser_

This is why 12 month contracts dont work for something like this - as they discriminate against those who don't own their own home or live with parents - plus what if you CAN'T get broadband in your new house?

3 month contracts (like I believe UTVip XL is/was?) are much more practical and avoid this whole mess.

Captain Trips

Originally posted by rymus

Something that just sprung to mind actually... Since I joined up over the Internet using my credit card I didn't actually physically sign anything. If youre in the same boat then it's worth checking out what the situation is.

I don't think that makes a difference. The T&C were pretty clear when they said 12 month minimum contract so you knew your obligations before going into the deal, and using CC is like anything else - buy a CD, have the CD for a while and want to give it back - payed with CC but hey didn't sign anything so why do I have to pay! I don't think the world works like that. You'd have to convince a judge that you weren't aware of the 12 month minimum contract. But, you *have* to have read them before you can sign up, even if you just skipped them and clicked next.

rymus

yeah, because when I want to buy a CD I have to agree to a 12 month contract... those two situations are exactly the same. When was the last time you had to sign a 12 month contract while buying a CD?

Anyway, I dont want to 'give it back', I just think the crazy charge they put on moving DSL is bollocks. They know full well they'll have my business for at least 12 months so why charge over the odds just because I'm moving house?

I'll make sure wherever I'll be moving to has good LOS for wireless BB because what I'd end up paying eircom to install a line & utv to move my dsl would get me an installation of wireless and a months rental.

The whole thing stinks of Eircom. It's like UTV have ripped a page out of the "Eircom guide to screwing customers" and are practicing it for themselves.

rob1891

It's like this, you can either keep me as a slightly less profitable customer or write me off as a bad debt. I hope they'll choose wisely.

would it be possible that this would filter down to your credit rating. Assuming they wouldn't be bothered taking you to small claims court, the risk to your rating is the only thing that I'd be worried about.

Ripwave

Originally posted by rymus
yeah, because when I want to buy a CD I have to agree to a 12 month contract... those two situations are exactly the same. When was the last time you had to sign a 12 month contract while buying a CD?

When's the last time you signed a credit card slip when you bought something over the internet. Did that stop the vendor from getting money out of your account?

Anyway, I dont want to 'give it back', I just think the crazy charge they put on moving DSL is bollocks. They know full well they'll have my business for at least 12 months so why charge over the odds just because I'm moving house?

Right, so they should assign the extra work involved to someone who doesn't want to be paid for it?

There's extra work involved in handling your move. If you don't pay for it, someone else will.

rymus

theres no need for to get ones panties in a wad. No I dont expect them to do something for free, nor do I expect that someone else pay for my line change. The main issue here is the fact they charge €150 PLUS an extra months rental. I am willing to accept a charge but not the bones of €200 for the priviledge of remaining a UTV customer.

Dr Bolouswki

i gotta go with ryhmus _ i Mean - UTV had me int he bag until I heard this... if the fee was something reasonable like €50 I'd just pay it - €195 is a bit much to 'buy' my loyalty...

As for length of phone contracts and credit ratings - I really hope they are not related... are they?

MrPinK

Well I dunno about credit ratings, but I'd imagine eircom or esat wouldn't exactly be too eager to sign you up if you had broke your last radsl contract.

rymus

I dunno... I'd say eircom would take anyone they thought they could make a few euros out of

Spud_Gun

That is scandlous! Effectively, you are being charged with being loyal to UTV? That makes no sense whatsoever. As far as I am aware, IOL simply charge you the connection fee and nothing else. But 2 different sales people told me 2 different things (good ole IOL), one that you didn't have to sign a new 12 month contract, and the other said that you did have to sign a new 12 month contract (I believe the latter). To sign a new contract and pay for the exchange work is acceptable (though I still think the current price is too much), but to then stick an additional months fee on that for no reason is ridiculous, without guarenteeing that the connection will work is just extortionate, literally! Whatever happened to the customer is always right? This seems to be a case of 'Quick, the customer is trying to get away'.

There should be no contracts. Competition and service seems to stop once the contract is signed and thats crap. If ISP's want to keep a customer then ISP's should impress them. There should also be a flat fee for moving house and/or changing ISP's! My dream BB future!

thomasb

150 euros will barely cover the cost of enabling the new line. Not to mention the fact that there's a wholesale charge for cancelling an existing DSL service.

rymus

do eircom customers get charged the same?

rymus

After a somewhat productive trawl through the eircom site (specifically the wholesale section) I noticed the following in a price list.

1.3 Connection Charges

Standard Port Connection - €150
Promotional Port... - €20 (ends Dec 31st)

....

1.6 Port Transfer Charge

Transfer (per port) - €60

Unless I'm hugely confused on this matter, I am transferring my connection, not disconnecting and beginning a whole new RADSL connection. Or at least that seems like the way it should be. Does anyone want to enlighten me as to the difference between a port transfer and a port connection? Is it really as simple as it sounds? If so, looks like someone is trying to pull a fast one.

Price list in PDF form is available here

dahamsta

Thomas should be able to answer that one, but I'd imagine Eircom will consider it a completely new port. In essence that's what it is tbh.

adam

rymus

<spleen vent>
this is starting to turn into a slapstick comedy now... While talking to someone in the admin team a while ago (about a completely different matter I might add) I threw in a last line about moving a clicksilver account.

Granted that the €150 seems non-negotiable I went on further to enquire about the reason for being charged the extra months rental.

After much err'ing and hmm'ing from the other end of the phone, what she finally came out with was "We need to charge one months rental because we need one months notice to cancel the contract in order to start a new one".

At the moment I'm thinking my options are

1. Grin and bear it. Pay the €300+ to get a phone line installed and move my DSL. Take the chance that the new line will pass and I wont have to buy out the contract (another €400+)

2. Ring credit card crowd and tell them to stop payment on anything that looks like UTV or Clicksilver. Inform UTV that I'm disgusted and won't be giving them anymore money. Recieve several pseudo-threatening letters from 'customer care' and finally a few from debt collectors. Move somewhere nice and high up to get wireless bb.

Even if I did end up in the small claims court it would cost less than moving the DSL to a line that turned out to be a dud...
</spleen vent>

dahamsta

Originally posted by rymus
"We need to charge one months rental because we need one months notice to cancel the contract in order to start a new one".

Which is part of the industry scam that's been going on for years. Think about this for a second: How many comms contracts have you signed up to? Eircom, mobiles, telephony, etc. Every one of them requires that you pay a month up-front as security, which is fair enough. Now, have have ever gotten the month back when you quit? Bet your ass you didn't -- no-one does, unless you ask. Scam, scam, scam.

adam

thomasb

It is a new port.

The 60 euro "transfer" fee is where a customer moves from ISP A to ISP B. This doesn't require rewiring, but does maybe require a reconfig and some internal paper pushing within Eircom.

Enabling your new line is going to cost UTV 150 euro in February (unless Eircom keep the new install charge) and its prefectly reasonable to pass the cost on to you.

rymus

thanks thomas, confirmed what I was thinking. Maybe a bit of haggling with UTV on the issue of the 1 months extra rental then...