New stadium@lansdown road is a sham!

Qadhafi

Those stupid rugby people have came up with a new proposal for lansdowne road. Its all wrong!! to small and a bad design. We need at least 65,000 for soccer check out this disaster at : hudderfield mess

look at the side they are all open, there is going to be no atmosphere there!!! NO !



IRFU unveils plan for new stadium
The Irish Independent
11-Dec-03
*****************************
THE IRFU yesterday unveiled its plan for a revamped Lansdowne Road to host rugby and soccer internationals.

It envisages a bowl-shaped 50,000-capacity, all-seater facility similar in design to the McAlpine Stadium in Huddersfield.

The cost is estimated at €250m. The IRFU is supplying the site but the Government contribution is still to be determined.

IRFU chief executive Philip Browne and ground development committee chairman Noel Murphy met Sports Minister John O'Donoghue at Government Buildings to present the technical report prepared by consultants Ove Arup and Partners. The minister will pass the IRFU's proposal on to the Office of Public Works for their assessment with more meetings between the Government, the IRFU and the FAI set for next week.

In replacing a 50,000-capacity stadium with one of similar size, albeit in a different bowl design, planning issues should be minimal.

The new playing arena will retain the same north-south aspect, thereby ensuring Lansdowne Rugby Club will remain untouched.

Whether a maximum capacity of 50,000 is enough to satisfy the needs of the FAI is still unclear.

Imposter

Originally posted by Qadhafi
Those stupid rugby people have came up with a new proposal for lansdowne road. Its all wrong!! to small and a bad design. We need at least 65,000 for soccer

Then let soccer build there own. Or fund the cost of the extra 15,000.

look at the side they are all open, there is going to be no atmosphere there!!! NO !

It's up to the fans to generate that. The stadium design shouldn't make a huge difference.

eirebhoy

Originally posted by Imposter
Then let soccer build there own. Or fund the cost of the extra 15,000.

We will be getting our own if the reports in yesterdays Herald are true.

TwoShedsJackson

Originally posted by eirebhoy
if the reports in yesterdays Herald are true.

That's about the biggest IF possible, seeing as the Herald will print any old shite.

Mossy Monk

Originally posted by Qadhafi
check out this disaster at : hudderfield mess

what's wrong with the McAlpine :rolleyes:

the atmosphere in that place is excellent at least when they have a decent crowd. i was there the night they beat West Ham in the first leg of a league cup game a few years back

jesus_thats_gre

Exactly, whats wrong with that style stadium?

eirebhoy

Originally posted by TwoShedsJackson
That's about the biggest IF possible, seeing as the Herald will print any old shite.

I wish i could get a link to the article or even this mans name because their is loads of quotes by him saying how he will get it built as long as the government provide the land and infrasturcture.

For those you don't know what I am talking about here is what I said in another thread:

To be breif, read the Evening Herald. Someone wants to build a national stadium. I forget his name but I think he is the owner of Bravo and set up the worlds biggest ever sponsorshiop deal between Coca Cola and FIFA. He contacted the government about this a year ago and they still haven't contacted him back except for a few brief phone calls. There's a few quotes from him in the Herald and he is a rich, rich man. He wants to get a Chinese construction company to build it and it will take two years. He also owns a stadium in Franfurt. His father is Irish.

If this guy lives up to his word this is going to be a lot better than the Bertie Bowl and even Croker!!!

eirebhoy

Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
Exactly, whats wrong with that style stadium?

That is what I am trying to figure out too. I wasn't even expecting a 50,000 seater so this is great news to me.

Qadhafi

this really is a selfish move by the IRFU and a sham at that. its better than the existing facilites but then that wouldnt be hard.

We need a 65,000 stadium there, maybe not now but for the future development. Bunching all the supporters along the sides of the pitch is not with international best practice. Within a few years of opening everyone will be pointing out this fact and we will still have a windy lansdowne road.

The IRFU have plenty of other space in which they can develop for offices minor games etc. The pitch needs to be moved 90 degrees and we can get 65,000 no bother!


That fella in the hearld is probably talking sh1t, how many times have we heard stories like that before?

eirebhoy

Originally posted by Qadhafi
we can get 65,000 no bother!

I really don't think we could and it would probably cost the same as building the abbotstown stadium.

That fella in the hearld is probably talking sh1t, how many times have we heard stories like that before?

Well I don't think a very well respected man would lie about wanting to build a stadium. If I had his money I would probably be thinking about building a stadium myself. Does anyone have yesterdays evening herald so I can find out his name or do a google to find out who set up the sponsership deal between Coca Cola and FIFA.

eirebhoy

Originally posted by eirebhoy
or do a google to find out who set up the sponsership deal between Coca Cola and FIFA.

I just googled and found out his name, Its patrick nally, the chief executive officer of Bravo.

http://www.ftconferences.com/mini_site/ft_busofsport/speakers.htm

Patrick Nally was the pioneer of international sports marketing and sponsorship, packaging rights and forging relationships between sport and major multinational companies. As a result the FIFA World Cup Intersoccer Package, the IAAF Track and Field programme, the Davis Cup of Tennis and the World Ski Cup still follow the marketing principles he devised.

His major international sports projects include:
* The marketing of the 1978, 1982 and 1986 Soccer World Cup Competitions in Argentina, Spain and Mexico, and establishing the dedicated company in the United States to host the World Cup in 1994.
* The negotiation of the world's single largest sponsorship deal between FIFA and Coca-Cola for all aspects of soccer development, including the World Cup. This programme stills runs today.
* Repackaging the ITF's Davis and Federation Cups in Tennis and securing NEC as the main sponsor.
* The creation and marketing of both the World Championships and World Cup in athletics, and the Rugby World Cup.
* The creation of marketing programmes involving international swimming, skiing, cycling and gymnastics.

In addition, he reintroduced the European/South American Cup (Toyota Cup), has worked with UEFA on the European Championships, European Cup and European Cup Winners Cup, and provided many soccer teams with major sponsorships.

Patrick was involved in the creation of the General Association of International Sports Federations (GAISF) and secured for it a permanent home in Monte Carlo, and through this association, he has dealt directly with most international sports federations.

His most recent music projects include the creation of three full production stage musicals - 'Casper', 'The Mask' and 'Spider-Man', which were staged at the Butlins family entertainment resorts for two 30 week seasons. 'Casper' also enjoyed a 13 week run at the Shaftesbury Theatre in the West End of London and a North American summer theatre tour. Mr Nally is also producing the Big Red Musical, 'Theatre of Dreams' based on the story of Manchester United Football Club.

Past music projects have included:
* The Three Tenors concert (Pavarotti, Domingo and Carreras) in Rome.
* A series of concerts by Leonard Bernstein sponsored by Ebel.
* The Concert of Europe series, including tours by The Rolling Stones Tour, David Bowie, Police, Madonna, Prince and Pink Floyd.

Mr Nally also created the largest independent sports television production company in the UK, and pioneered the use of new technology within major event activity (big screens, historical television footage, computer graphics), and other techniques to create special productions and present new show formats, such as the Casa Diva tribute to Maria Callas at the Acropolis, Athens.

His expertise for conceiving and successfully implementing complex development and marketing strategies is recognised world-wide.

Most recently, to meet the needs of the modern day, and working closely with a team of specialist professionals, he has developed a practical solution to finance the build, ownership and operation of new high tech multipurpose sport and entertainment arenas and stadia, the retrofit of existing venues, and the complementary use of "smart" technology.

Do you think he would lie about building a stadium?

Imposter

Originally posted by Qadhafi
this really is a selfish move by the IRFU and a sham at that.

Why? It's the IRFU that are proposing this not the FAI. Therefore it's up to them what they do. Or are the FAI part-funding it?

We need a 65,000 stadium there, maybe not now but for the future development.

Future development of what? If it's grss roots soccer a big stadium might being in some extra money but it needs to be spent properly at the lower levels of the game. If it's to develop the national team please explain how this is?

Bunching all the supporters along the sides of the pitch is not with international best practice. Within a few years of opening everyone will be pointing out this fact and we will still have a windy lansdowne road.

What is international best practice? No matter what type of stadium is built it will be windy. Unless of course it's moved to spain or something!:rolleyes:

The IRFU have plenty of other space in which they can develop for offices minor games etc. The pitch needs to be moved 90 degrees and we can get 65,000 no bother!

Landsdowne rugby club own that and not the IRFU afaik. and why not an 80,000 or 100,000 stadium?

regeneration

Originally posted by Qadhafi
We need a 65,000 stadium there, maybe not now but for the future development.

Future development of soccer in Ireland depends on the development of grass roots youth level and the national leagure, not building large stadia.
Plus a 65,000 seater stadium would not be filled at every match; pretend the stadium was finished tomorrw - for the world cup qualifiers, we'd fill it for France, and possibly Switzerland, but no way would we get capacity for Israel & Cyprus.
Fran Roony seems to be doing the right thing and trying to push the development of the game here.

mike65

The Huddersfield design is just fine - what I think of as
"Stadium Lite" bright and er breezy! There is NO need for a 65,000 seater venue esp if a deal can be done with Croker for 5 days use per year...also the proposal IS by the IRFU the FAI have been involved but they're basicly along for the ride...

The plan is for a bowl-shaped 50,000-capacity, all-seater stadium similar in design to the McAlpine Stadium in Huddersfield and the Hong Kong Stadium, home to the long-established Sevens tournament. The cost is estimated at €250m with the IRFU obviously supplying the site but with the government contribution still to be determined. It would make an ideal long-term home for rugby and soccer.

Although it has come right down to the wire, in declaring their hand the IRFU have ended much of the speculation concerning Lansdowne, Newlands, Ringsend and indeed Abbotstown, the original preferred venue which the minister has still not ruled out of the equation.

In replacing a 50,000 capacity stadium with one of similar capacity, albeit a different bowl design, planning issues should be minimal. The new playing arena will retain the same north-south aspect, thereby ensuring Lansdowne Rugby Club will remain untouched, save for the inconvenience when the old structure is being demolished and replaced by the new.

In addition the bowl design allows - as at the McAlpine - that the high points be located in the middle of the East and West stands thereby leaving the north (Havelock Square) and south (Lansdowne Road) ends much the same as they are now. The east and west high points will be one tier only. Even more pertinently, it makes for minimal disruption to the residents at either end of the Dublin 4 ground.

The new stadium allows for the relevant infrastructure to serve the Union's needs in terms of administrative offices, etc. In addition, all the corporate requirements so essential to modern day sporting survival will be present in abundance.

Mike.

Qadhafi

[quote....and why not an 80,000 or 100,000 stadium?
[/quote]

80,000 good point, but 65,000 will do.

so were going to have a real small WINDY stadium with a few thousand people at either end. Not the sea of Green of supporters urging their team on to victory!

They could have used a better design. It doesnt look like a national stadium, it look like something dragged out of a depressed north east english town, for a 1st division club.

The bigger the stadium the more revenue we can pull in

who is patrick nally, we have been waiting on this project for the last 5 years and there has been no offers from him before?

it will be intresting to see the FAI's proposals

dRNk SAnTA

...80,000 good point, but 65,000 will do....

...it will be intresting to see the FAI's proposals...

50,000 is a nice size, as someone already said, there won't be the demand for games like Cyprus or the Faroe Islands. Whats wrong with this size? This stadium + the opening of croke park for major internationals would be the perfect mix, we're only a small country, theres no need for two mammoth stadiums.

Yes it would be nice if there was a sea of green around the the players, it would also be nice if they build a 150,000 seater stadium with a nice big roof and reclining leather chairs for all us adoring fans, but how about adding a little logic to your statements - they're keeping the north and south stands single tier so as to avoid complaints from neighbors in the planning application. You have to be prepared to comprimise, do you want a new stadium or not?

While you seem to be the expert saying 'duh why don't they rotate the pitch, theres plenty of room, its so obvious', why don't you leave the planning to actual engineers. I'm sure cost is a big factor in all this, and I believe the IRFU (I dont know if the FAI are included) have just over €100 million to put into this stadium, meaning the cost to the exchequer would only be €150 million, thats great value when compared to the original abbotstown dream costing a few hundred million.

Also, it says in todays Irish Times that the IRFU have full support of the FAI so I doubt the FAI are now going to announce a different proposal. But then again, it is the FAI....

tHE vAGGABOND

I've been in the McAlpine Stadium and it’s grand. Its streets better than the ancient relic we have now! Not every stadium has to look like Old Trafford. How you can say there will be no atmosphere with 50,000 'boys in green' there is amazing. Have you been to a big English soccer ground, full most of them are like morgues? A good example is White Hart Lane, a big 2 tier all round 45k odd stadium, and dead to the world if spurs are winning or losing bar a few hundred supporters behind one goal, and the tiny corner of away supporters. I can’t say Old Trafford or Anfield are that different. I was at a champions league semi final at Old Trafford and *cough* England game at Anfield and it was dead quiet. It’s about the people there, not the design of the ground.

Remember Eircom Park was only 35,000 in its design. It’s a fact that for all but the biggest games there will be loads of tickets floating about. Joe Public can’t get tickets for soccer and rugby games as all tickets go to corporate people who pay top dollar for them and people who are active members of clubs. When I was an active rugby player at home I always got tickets for games, and my mate who plays soccer in crumlin never seems to have a bother getting tickets for games except when its a massive game like a championship play off.

Fact is lads we don’t have the cash to build a mega stadium. As it is this project is going nowhere unless the government pay for a large percentage of it - and given the money problems the government has that is by no means definite.

eirebhoy

Originally posted by tHE vAGGABOND
Joe Public can’t get tickets for soccer and rugby games as all tickets go to corporate people who pay top dollar for them

...or get them for free.

tHE vAGGABOND

very few people get tickets for free, someone pays for them at some stage. If guinness (as an example picked from the sky) give the FAI a boat full of cash dont they deserve to get add's in the programmes and a fist full of tickets..

I dont understand the bitterness a lot of people have toward corporate money. Someone has to pay all the bills for the FAI and gate reciepts dont cover it. Remember as it is the FAI have to pay the rugby union a chunk of cash to use Lansdsdowne Road in the first place! Someone has to pay for Fran Rooney's corporate jet and long lunches

eirebhoy

Well, my cousin works in an office a few doors from the FAI and he gets tickets for all the home games for free, I don't know who he works for though. And my sister works for Permanent TSB and she gets tickets for the rugby. You may be right though, it probably is sponsorship.

tHE vAGGABOND

Permanent TSB are one of the IRFU's biggest sponsors, giving them millions annually

DapperGent

Another issue is that as stadiums increase in size their cost increases almost exponentially.

Moving up from 50,000 to 65,000 could conceivabley double the cost of the stadium redevelopment.

A 50,000 almost city centre all seater stadium is the absolute business, I hope it gets the go ahead.

eirebhoy

Qadhafi, Huddersfield's stadium has a capacity of 24,000, Lansdowne will be double that so it is hard to judge what it will look like. It will look more like this.

cournioni

A 55,000 to 60,000 seater stadium would do the job. Any more or any less would be a waste of time.

I like the design of Hong Kong stadium though.

SteM

I'd agree. A Lansdowne Road stadium that holds 50,000 to 60,000 would be fine for what we need. Just look at the problems the GAA are having with Croke Park at the moment. According to the Indo today they'll have to pay another 10 million yoyos to do up the Hogan Stand that that was devloped less than 10 years ago! The IRFU and FAI should not overstretch themselves like the GAA seem to have done.

SAXA

I think alot of that 10 million is for upkeep of the corporate red carpet area and such which will be a cost in any stadium big or small. Just read that CP has to have 32000 people in it to pay for opening it. phew

SteM

Originally posted by SAXA
I think alot of that 10 million is for upkeep of the corporate red carpet area and such which will be a cost in any stadium big or small. Just read that CP has to have 32000 people in it to pay for opening it. phew

Yeah, but my point was the bigger the stadium the the more the up keep. People have to remember that Dublin's only a small capital city. Re-devloping Lansdowne Road to 50,000 capicity makes much more sense than building a totally new stadium.

SAXA

agree

45 - 50000 redeveloped Ldown Rd with corporate area is the way forward.

Don't like those corporate jackasses but need their money unfortunately.

astrofool

bowl stadiums are not great for atmosphere. Alot of american football stadiums are of the bowl type, and if anyone remembers back to usa '94 they'll know how muted they can be as a sporting venue. Football stadiums need the enclosure to really create an atmosphere, tbh, we should be looking at what the welsh did AND COPY IT EXACTLY cos the millenium stadium is f*cking excellent.

SAXA

And bankrupt Irish rugby for the forseeable future

Thats what happened in Wales. The WRU was pennyless and their once mighty clubs virtually fell apart


See that FAI waNT some ownership of the new ground. Some cheek.
They pay some of the redeveloment cost and buy the right of joint managment .
but ownership of a grounds and land that thye do not own just typically of the FAI

Mumha

Rooney has some neck hasn't he ? Not a chance. The IRFU have the 80 Million on hand as it is, and so could pay the total contribution. The FAI shouldn't have to pay the rental but that is it.

Qadhafi

Rooney dismisses reports of FAI/IRFU rift over Lansdowne Road
Filed at: Wednesday , December 17 2003 14:53PM
Filed by James Boylan
RTE
****************************************
Reports of a row between the FAI and the IRFU over the potential redevelopment of Lansdowne Road have been dismissed by the soccer body's chief executive, Fran Rooney.

A delegation from both governing bodies met with the Minister for Sport, John O'Donoghue, yesterday to discuss the building of a brand new stadium at the Dublin 4 site, with both associations prepared to donate one third of the total cost of the estimated €250 million project.

But reports today suggested that there was a difference of opinion between the two over the exact details of the ownership of any new stadium that might be built, with question marks arising over the FAI's future rent contributions under the new proposals.

However, speaking on RTÉ Radio One's Pat Kenny Show today, Rooney sought to dispel any notion that the associations were at odds over any issue, let alone his association's tenancy:

"There's no issue here at all," Rooney said. "The most important thing to remember here is that the FAI and the IRFU have a great relationship – it's going back almost thirty years now. The only issue we ever have is dealing with fixture clashes and again we resolve those professionally," he added.

Rooney continued: "What we have here now is we're going to build a new stadium. Obviously the IRFU are providing the ground, but the plan is very clear that we will both pay rent, both the IRFU and the FAI, into a management company. The management company will then operate the grounds and make it available to both associations or anybody else who wants to use it.

"It'll (the stadium) be owned by the consortium, which will include the IRFU, the FAI and the Government, all of whom are putting up money for this. The land will obviously continued to be owned by the IRFU and will be in the future if the stadium is knocked down in 50 years' time. But in terms of the stadium and the management of the stadium it'll be a consortium."

Meanwhile, Rooney today said that the use of Croke Park is not a long term solution for the hosting of football or rugby internationals. He said he was extremely disappointed with the Government that a decision on building a new national stadium had yet to be made and he called on the Taoiseach to use his power and authority within cabinet to resolve the issue as quickly as possible.

Qadhafi

The hong kong stadium is ok, nothing special. If it came down to it and it was it or the existing set up then its better than nothing.



It was built for a city with a low intrest in sport, would something like this really be built in Europe ?