Updrading PC

GoneShootin

As an xmas treat for myself I thought I would bring my system up in spec a bit.

Im looking at the following :

MEMORY (rambus) (shop4memory)

2x128 = €119
2x512 = €222

CPU (komplett)

2.4 = €70.60
2.6 = €95.59
2.7 = €111.32

GFX

Radeon 9600 Pro 256Mb = €156.10
Other 9600 PRO Cards.


My major concern is the gfx card. I am a medium player of games that require heavy specs, so ultimate performance is not required. There are so many vartiations of the 9600 PRO that I am a bit confused as to what direction to take. I have heard good things about the 9600 PRO, hence the choice....

Current Syetem

Dell Computer Corporation Dimension 8100

1400 megahertz Intel Pentium 4
8 kilobyte primary memory cache
256 kilobyte secondary memory cache
Bus Clock: 100 megahertz
BIOS: Dell Computer Corporation A06 04/20/2001

384 Megabytes Installed Memory
128 Megabyte Module Size - 2 Installed
64 Megabyte Module Size - 2 Installed

NVIDIA GeForce2 Ultra 64Mb

Any help would be greatly appreciated

zAbbo

you`re in for some bad news

uberpixie

here comes the bad news.

As far as I remember early P4s go as far as 2ghz before Intel changed cores/bus speeds.

So chances are your motherboard will only go as far as 2ghz P4: wont be compatible with later p4s.


So what you can do is try and find a 2ghz p4!
189.26 euro price of 2ghz from peats.ie, 185 euro form elara. The 2ghz not for sale on komplett.ie, dabs.com or overclockers.co.uk.

200 odd euro might seem expensive, but might be cheaper and less hassle in the long run because otherwise you are talking about a new motherboard,case and psu for starters.(dell case,psu and mobo dont work with anything else)

Trying to find a mobo that supports rambus ram these days would be a barrel of laughs too: chances are you change the mobo you need to buy new pc3200 ddr ram.


That would be the only real spanner in the works. Ram and gfx card should be fine to upgrade though.


If i were you i would seriously consider buying the 2ghz p4 at 185 euro. It is a ****e price but less hassle and cheaper than essentially building a new system.

A 2ghz p4 + 512/1024mb of rambus ram + 9600 pro = gaming goodness

zAbbo

Socket 423 or Socket 478 will be the key to the CPU upgrade

GoneShootin

Originally posted by uberpixie
As far as I remember early P4s go as far as 2ghz before Intel changed cores/bus speeds.

Ah bollix ! That IS bad news

Originally posted by uberpixie
2ghz p4 + 512/1024mb of rambus ram + 9600 pro = gaming goodness

Ill have to see if the cost of the processor is worth the jump from 1.4 to 2. It probably is with the extra RAM.

Thanks alot uberpixie....


edit

btw, could anyone point me in the direction of a 9600 PRO Gfx Card ? Theres loads of em out there and I dont know which variation to take...

RicardoSmith

Powerleap do socket 423 to 478 convertors. This seems allow to run a 2.4ghz chip. The best 9600 is the 128mb 9600XT. Forget the 256mb card its not quicker, only dearer. Don't get more than 512mb of ram for gaming. Your machine isn't cutting edge so no point spending a fortune on it. You won't get it back when you go to sell.

Another option is the 9800seAIW card which is the same speed as the 9600XT but has lots of Video in/out functionality. Theres also a chance this card can be modded to 9800pro speeds which is huge speed boost. Since they are the same price as the 9600XT more features and at worst as fast as the 9600xt the 9800seAIW is THEE card to get at the moment.

The cheapest upgrade route for you is to buy a 2nd gear from the UK forums and build a machine yourself. Then sell the Dell. You'll be able to get a 2.5ghz class machine that may even be able to overclock to near 3ghz levels for not too much money. You probably wouldn't be comfortable doing that. If your not comfortable doing that then I'd be happy to give you hand with it.

I'm about to sell my P4, 1.8@2.4ghz 512mb ram, GF4ti4200 card, that was all bought second hand. has worked flawlessly for over a year. I've bought a 2500xp chip and 2nd hand motherboard nForce2 board that should overclock to near 3200xp speeds. half the fun of PC is the swapping around of components you do. I deal a fair bit on the UK forums so if you need a hand with just let us know. Its easy to get ripped off, but theres a few golden rules that will take a lot of the risk out of it.

OfflerCrocGod

Originally posted by uberpixie
here comes the bad news.

As far as I remember early P4s go as far as 2ghz before Intel changed cores/bus speeds.

So chances are your motherboard will only go as far as 2ghz P4: wont be compatible with later p4s.

I'm confused why shouldn't a faster CPU work in his present board if the Socket is the same?. So his FSB is only 100Mhz the newer CPU will run at that instead of 133 166 or 200Mhz, surely they can underclock!.

astrofool

that will probably be sdram, rdram couldn't be configured in 384 and the p4 1.7 was about the minimum dell when they moved to ddr.

hmm looking at it, it might well be rdram (2*128 and 2*64), no point upgrading the ram then, 384 is probably more than enough for what u can do on it, for the same price as just the rdram u can probably get a motherboard/cpu/ram combo (tho that would also need a new case).

Morale of the story is: Dell's are sh*te, especially when you want to upgrade them

Dempsey

What Chipset is your board? That will determine how far ya can upgrade to.

RicardoSmith

Originally posted by OfflerCrocGod
I'm confused why shouldn't a faster CPU work in his present board if the Socket is the same?. So his FSB is only 100Mhz the newer CPU will run at that instead of 133 166 or 200Mhz, surely they can underclock!.

Socket 423 P4's are all only 400fsb. A faster 423 P4 will work fine. Theres also an adapter (PowerLeap) that allows him to use 533 P4's aswell.

The problem is that its not very cost effective upgrading these older P4's. It nearly cheaper buying a standard 478 motherboard, cpu and ram.

GoneShootin

Ara to hell with it, its not worth the hassle. Ill wait till next summer and buy a new system. Im not gonna be making the most out of the machine till I finish college neway.

Ta for the help though guys, you saved me a bit of money.

OfflerCrocGod

Originally posted by RicardoSmith
Socket 423 P4's are all only 400fsb. A faster 423 P4 will work fine. Theres also an adapter (PowerLeap) that allows him to use 533 P4's aswell.

The problem is that its not very cost effective upgrading these older P4's. It nearly cheaper buying a standard 478 motherboard, cpu and ram.

That is sh1t!!:eek:, well thank god I never buy Intel why the hell cant the CPU just slow down the FSB, Intel probably dont want ppl to get cheap upgrades or keep second-hand stuff with new MBs, disgusting:mad:.

Mutant_Fruit

me pats my amd chipset. This baby can go up to 400mhz fsb. bwuh hu ha haaa. its a pity i only got a 266mhz processor (fsb that is)

RicardoSmith

Originally posted by OfflerCrocGod
That is sh1t!!:eek:, well thank god I never buy Intel why the hell cant the CPU just slow down the FSB, Intel probably dont want ppl to get cheap upgrades or keep second-hand stuff with new MBs, disgusting:mad:.

Well it depends on the motherboard not the CPU. YOU can slow down the fsb but when you can buy the right CPU for cheaper why would you buy a more expensive CPU to run it slower? That doesn't make sense.

GoneShootin - you'd probably see a big difference with 9600XT 128mb on its own. The ram and extra CPU would make some difference also but the graphics card is the big one. It would be held back a little by your PC but might get you those extra frames per sec in games and higer resolutions. If it were me I find 2nd hand ram and bring it up to 512mb and then I'd do the CPU last, and then only if I found a good deal on one 2nd hand. Occasionally Rambus and 423 chips pop up on the OcUK forums. But I wouldn't spent big money on them.The old Rambus RAM and 423 P4 CPU you won't bring to any new system you get in the future. But the graphics card will be fine. So its worth getting that as you can keep it for your next machine. Keep the GF2 so you can sell the Dell with it. I stuck a GF4ti4200 in an old 1Ghz machine and I noticed a big difference. The 9600XT is about the same and even a little bit faster than a ti4200 in new games so I reckon you'd see a decent jump in performance in your games.

CyberGhost

Rambus is faster than DDR400 isn't it?

ozt9vdujny3srf

Originally posted by CyberGhost
Rambus is faster than DDR400 isn't it?

nope

RicardoSmith

Originally posted by CyberGhost
Rambus is faster than DDR400 isn't it?

MY understanding is that it depends on the rambus. Theres about 4 types of different speeds. But DDR400 is almost as good as the best Rambus and much faster than the slower Rambus.

astrofool

dual ddr is better than any commercially available rambus out there, regardless.

SiS are trying to get a quad channel rambus chipset out, but it's being aimed at the server market, much like the old serverworks chipsets were (they did quad channel with sdram if I remember correctly).

RicardoSmith

Originally posted by astrofool
dual ddr is better than any commercially available rambus out there, regardless.

SiS are trying to get a quad channel rambus chipset out, but it's being aimed at the server market, much like the old serverworks chipsets were (they did quad channel with sdram if I remember correctly).

Stop blinding us with science. What do you mean by "better". Anyone know the specs on both?

joePC

I would recommend staying away from Ranbus memory,

Dual DDR offers much better proformance with AMD or Intel processors than Rambus

My advice Build a new PC from scrach upgrading an old Dell is like cutting yourself it only ends in tears......

All you can do is upgrade the RAM as for the CPU dont bother 400Mhz fsb P4's stay clear away they stink......

Get a new MB/cpu/case/graphics card/ & use your old Dell parts to make up the rest.

& go with AMD much better (Price/Preformance Ratio)

Thanks joePC

astrofool

in a nutshell, much lower latency with more bandwidth (thats 865/875 compared to the 850 chipset).

If you want more than that there are loads of tech websites out there that will explain it in more detail (i.e. why rambus has high latency etc.).