Doug Ellis Staying Put

Neil3030

Will he please just do one. I mean, he's pretty much admitted that his reasons for staying at Villa are more so for the maintaining of mental activiity in his old age, rather than for the good of the club and now he's come out and said that he is staying on to "give guidance to a younger man who comes in”, which pretty much implies that he will still maintain 100% control of things, via whatever poor puppet takes up the job. In an interview with the Sunday Mercury he stated:

I am a great believer in never retiring. I feel it is important to keep your brain active. I think that you live a lot longer that way and I am proud of the fact that I will be 80 next week despite some of the frustrations.”

Who the **** does he think he is? Aston Villa are a premiership football club that should be challenging for Europe, not a medium to replace countdown as some old farts recreation. Have a read of this article on premierleague.com for yourselves.

kmart6

Dont be getting carried away with yourself there,ok there good but not good enough for europe,

What are ye going to do angel stops scoring again where are the goals going to come from.

They could easily sell Vassell to boost transfer fees

Neil3030

I know they are not good enough now and I never said they were. Villa should be challenging for Europe, and i know that the same argument can be used for all clubs but Villa can be segregated from that generalisation based on the fact that they were there before, back when money did not talk, and could be now with a few vital additions to the squad.

That point about Angel proves my point of the necessity for the dismissal of Ellis. Crouch is a disaster, Dublin is better off at full back and I would be happy to see the back of Vassell to be honest with you, because before today he hasn't scored in the league this season.

James R

I'll agree Ellis shouldn't be there but I don't think Villa should be challenging for Europe like you say. Going on that basis clubs like Forest, Spurs, Liverpool etc would all still be at the top.

Villa should concentrate restoring themselves as Birmingham's number one club before they even consider Europe as we all know Europe isn't always the best omen for clubs (hello all Ipswich fans!)

krinpit

I've got to admire David O'Leary after pretty much turning us right around under such tight circumstances. He was given £4m at the start of the season, which he spent on Gavin McCann and that was it - All gone. We've even managed to cope with the axing of the talented Alpay (boy did we miss him in the immediate aftermath) and he seems to be getting the best out of our players, most noticably Gareth Barry, JJloyd Samuel and JP Angel.

Please Doug, shell out some cash in January. Let O'Leary buy at least 3 of his favoured players. Go on, Go on, Go on, Go on, Go on, Go on.

Villain

Villa should be challenging for Europe they are a massive club, Ellis has been running a business for length of time he has been there, and that is what he has seen it as a business, So in his mind you don't go splashing money out when a manager asks for it (Balaban seems to an exception there)

Villa have a great young side, we won the youth cup only 2 seasons ago,
Smauel, Whittingham, Vassel, Moore bro's and many more have a big future in front of them and if they can blend that young talent with some experienced players Villa can become a top six side.

David O'Leary spend 5 million in teh summer on 2 players that are of realy quality I've seen McCann play and he is top drawer, Sorressen is one of the best Keepers in the league, so I think O'Leary could do wel if he is allowed to bring a few new faces.

Angel has hit the form that he bough on, he's a natural goal socer and with the kind of quality balls that Whittingham can deliver he should be able to continue that form.

People have to remeber that in his first season he had a lot of personal problems with his wife and kid not being well, then Turnip head wouldn't give him a chance.

Hope we can hold onto Vassel and Angel I think they can go on to acheive great things.

Go On The VILLA

Helix

angels contract is up in the summer tho isnt it

can you honestly see him signing a new deal?

Villain

Originally posted by Helix
angels contract is up in the summer tho isnt it

can you honestly see him signing a new deal?

Is it??? Don't think so, Yes I can see him signing a new deal why wouldn't he??

Sundy

angels contract not isnt up till 2005 and by then villa hopefully will be a better lookin outfit, but knowing ellis who has only villa's best interests at heart will sell him next week or in the summer.

Helix

Originally posted by irish1
why wouldn't he??

coz unless theres a serious improvement in the team we're not good enough for him

wynters

James R & Kmart

.... Aston Villa are the biggest club in the second biggest city in Britain. There are over 5 million people in the area (15 million+ in the Greater midlands area) which is a massive potential fanbase to tap into should the team start to do well. Villa Park is one of the best stadiums in the country with a great infrastructure and plenty of room for development.

Look at Bayern Leverkusen - Champions League finalists & semi finalists 2 years running, Valencia did even better, even Leeds a few years back..... Villa are potentially bigger than all those clubs, and should be matching, if not bettering their recent achievements in the Champions League.

Villa now also have the best young manager in the country, and some of the most talented youth players in the league - Villa won the F.A. youth Cup last season, Watch out for Liam Ridgewell, Luke & Stefan Moore, and Rob Edwards.... Gareth Barry is still only 22.... Whittingham only 18.

The only thing that's holding Villa back is Doug Ellis. He's been involved with the club since the 60's. In the 2 years that he was not on the board - seasons 80-81 & 81-82, Villa won the league, and in the following season, the European Cup! (back when it really was the Champions Cup) under then manager Ron Saunders.

Brian Little, John Gregory, & Graham Taylor aswell several high profile board members - ex finance director Mark Ansell being the most recent - have all left the club because they could not work with Doug Ellis anymore. I've lost count of the number of managers he's sacked....

Nobody in football, beit managers, agents, players, other club chairmen etc want to deal with Ellis anymore. He's burned too many bridges for the club. There are die hard Villa fans - members of my own family amoung them - who will not go to Villa Park until Doug leaves..... or dies. He still insists on being involved with certain team matters too - flights, accomodation etc. for away games/pre season tours. Stories of his penny pinching are absolutely amazing..... I recall one about him not allowing someone to boil a kettle for a cup of tea, becase Doug had hot water in a flask.

Football has changed since the days when Ellis first took control of the club. Football is now a commercial entity, with the bigger clubs getting bigger, and the smaller clubs getting smaller. If Villa don't act very soon they'll be left behind. A club of their size SHOULD be playing at the highest level.... but nothing will change as long as Ellis runs the club with a corner shop mentality.

I think O'Leary is doing a fantastic job. He inheirited one of the worst Villa sides I can remember. The squad required a major overhaul and in the 7 months since he took charge, Ian Taylor, Alan Wright, Steve Staunton, Alpay, Hassan Kachloul & Bosko Balaban have all been shown the door. It's no secret that Mark Kinsella, Mustafa Hadji & Ulyses De La Cruz are on their way at the end of the season. The futures of Peter Crouch (already farmed out on loan) Lee Hendrie & Ronny Johnsen are also seriously iffy.... Those departures will, and already have signifigantly reduced the wage bill, so there should be money available to sign new players. Will Doug release it? - No.

O'Leary has also got the players available to string a few wins together aswell. 6 wins and a draw from 8 - an away defeat to Man Utd being the only blip - ain't a bad run at all. As I mentioned on another thread - the improvement of the full backs in particular has been nothing short of incredible. O'Leary has also got £9.5 million man Juan Pablo Angel - who Graham Taylor didn't play in favour of Peter Crouch!?! (Ian Ormondroyd anyone???) playing to his full potential.

With the league the way it is at the moment the 4th place Champions League spot is easily attainable for any club brave enough to spend a few quid in the January transfer window. Villa are only 6 points off that 4th spot at the moment after a rocky start to the season. 2 creative midfielders and another striker would make a HUGE difference. They aren't in debt, so they can afford to take a punt. Transfer deals these days aren't cash up front anyway, so a singing or 3 - with the transfer fees paid in instalments over a season or 2 - wouldn't be that difficult at all. £10 million would be enough.

A Champions league spot equals extra revenue.... Villa could do it if only they had a chairman who wasn't a scrooge. He's a díckhéad! His reg plate reads 'HOTSHOT'!Plus he named a stand after himself! Vain or what!? That stand should be renamed the Ron Saunders stand as soon as Doug Ellis dies.

The ingredients to make the club great again are there, all thats needed is the recipe.......

kmart6

Originally posted by wynters
James R & Kmart

.... Aston Villa are the biggest club in the second biggest city in Britain. There are over 5 million people in the area (15 million+ in the Greater midlands area) which is a massive potential fanbase to tap into should the team start to do well. Villa Park is one of the best stadiums in the country with a great infrastructure and plenty of room for development.

Look at Bayern Leverkusen - Champions League finalists & semi finalists 2 years running, Valencia did even better, even Leeds a few years back..... Villa are potentially bigger than all those clubs, and should be matching, if not bettering their recent achievements in the Champions League.

Villa now also have the best young manager in the country, and some of the most talented youth players in the league - Villa won the F.A. youth Cup last season, Watch out for Liam Ridgewell, Luke & Stefan Moore, and Rob Edwards.... Gareth Barry is still only 22.... Whittingham only 18.

The only thing that's holding Villa back is Doug Ellis. He's been involved with the club since the 60's. In the 2 years that he was not on the board - seasons 80-81 & 81-82, Villa won the league, and in the following season, the European Cup! (back when it really was the Champions Cup) under then manager Ron Saunders.

Brian Little, John Gregory, & Graham Taylor aswell several high profile board members - ex finance director Mark Ansell being the most recent - have all left the club because they could not work with Doug Ellis anymore. I've lost count of the number of managers he's sacked....

Nobody in football, beit managers, agents, players, other club chairmen etc want to deal with Ellis anymore. He's burned too many bridges for the club. There are die hard Villa fans - members of my own family amoung them - who will not go to Villa Park until Doug leaves..... or dies. He still insists on being involved with certain team matters too - flights, accomodation etc. for away games/pre season tours. Stories of his penny pinching are absolutely amazing..... I recall one about him not allowing someone to boil a kettle for a cup of tea, becase Doug had hot water in a flask.

Football has changed since the days when Ellis first took control of the club. Football is now a commercial entity, with the bigger clubs getting bigger, and the smaller clubs getting smaller. If Villa don't act very soon they'll be left behind. A club of their size SHOULD be playing at the highest level.... but nothing will change as long as Ellis runs the club with a corner shop mentality.

I think O'Leary is doing a fantastic job. He inheirited one of the worst Villa sides I can remember. The squad required a major overhaul and in the 7 months since he took charge, Ian Taylor, Alan Wright, Steve Staunton, Alpay, Hassan Kachloul & Bosko Balaban have all been shown the door. It's no secret that Mark Kinsella, Mustafa Hadji & Ulyses De La Cruz are on their way at the end of the season. The futures of Peter Crouch (already farmed out on loan) Lee Hendrie & Ronny Johnsen are also seriously iffy.... Those departures will, and already have signifigantly reduced the wage bill, so there should be money available to sign new players. Will Doug release it? - No.

O'Leary has also got the players available to string a few wins together aswell. 6 wins and a draw from 8 - an away defeat to Man Utd being the only blip - ain't a bad run at all. As I mentioned on another thread - the improvement of the full backs in particular has been nothing short of incredible. O'Leary has also got £9.5 million man Juan Pablo Angel - who Graham Taylor didn't play in favour of Peter Crouch!?! (Ian Ormondroyd anyone???) playing to his full potential.

With the league the way it is at the moment the 4th place Champions League spot is easily attainable for any club brave enough to spend a few quid in the January transfer window. Villa are only 6 points off that 4th spot at the moment after a rocky start to the season. 2 creative midfielders and another striker would make a HUGE difference. They aren't in debt, so they can afford to take a punt. Transfer deals these days aren't cash up front anyway, so a singing or 3 - with the transfer fees paid in instalments over a season or 2 - wouldn't be that difficult at all. £10 million would be enough.

A Champions league spot equals extra revenue.... Villa could do it if only they had a chairman who wasn't a scrooge. He's a díckhéad! His reg plate reads 'HOTSHOT'!Plus he named a stand after himself! Vain or what!? That stand should be renamed the Ron Saunders stand as soon as Doug Ellis dies.

The ingredients to make the club great again are there, all thats needed is the recipe.......

So let me get this straight.Your blamin Doug Ellis for everything that is wrong with the club and saying they can get 4th place for theCL.

HAHA,no chance of them getting fourth they dont have the quailty for it and you can not blame one person for all things wrong with a club did ya ever stop to think that yer just not good enough to be getting places

James R

I'll agree with you that Villa have the makings of a great club and David O'Leary is a manager I respect greatly.

However, having a large fan base doesn't entitle you to anything. Going on that basis Liverpool would be in the top 3 and Utd would rule the world.

I agree Ellis is a disaster but Villa don't have the pulling power in my opinion to get big players anymore. That may, and I hope it does, change.
I'd love to see Villa getting into Europe but last season Birmingham were better than them and I think you have to working your way up the ladder and the first rung is to re-establish Villa as the premier club in Birmingham first.

Also was it not Utd won it last season? Beat Boro in the final?

G

Originally posted by wynters
The ingredients to make the club great again are there, all thats needed is the recipe.......

Well put wynters I can't add anything to that.

having a large fan base doesn't entitle you to anything

He's not saying it does, it's the potential. Like past managers, so many Villa fans don't care any more. I have Villa friends in Brum who haven't been to a match for 6 years.

no chance of them getting fourth they dont have the quailty for it and you can not blame one person for all things wrong with a club did ya ever stop to think that yer just not good enough to be getting places

He's not saying that either ye tit. Charlton are in 4th place at the moment and it's anyone's place if they have the ambition to go for it. If Ellis was replaced with someone who had the guts to put 10 or 15mill towards strengthening the squad then we'd have as much a chance as any.

Villain

Originally posted by kmart6
HAHA,no chance of them getting fourth they dont have the quailty for it and you can not blame one person for all things wrong with a club did ya ever stop to think that yer just not good enough to be getting places

HA HA, there is as much chance as Villa getting fouth as any team inbetween 3rd and 3rd from bottom.

I'm not saying they will but they have as much chance as the Pool, Newcastle and Blackburn.

kmart6

Originally posted by irish1
HA HA, there is as much chance as Villa getting fouth as any team inbetween 3rd and 3rd from bottom.

I'm not saying they will but they have as much chance as the Pool, Newcastle and Blackburn.

Ah come on the three teams you mentioned there would beat them into 4th place not to mention the likes of Charlton and Fulham

The Muppet

Kmart I think you,re missing the point that wynters was making. Villa have the fanbas that will easily pay back in gate receipts and merchandising the 10 to 15 million spent on new players if the chairman was courageous enough to take the gamble and sign a few badly needed players .

you can not blame one person for all things wrong with a club did ya ever stop to think that yer just not good enough to be getting places

You can if that one person is an 80 year old chairman who is on record as saying his main interest in the club is to keep his mind active .

kmart6

Originally posted by The Muppet
Kmart I think you,re missing the point that wynters was making. Villa have the fanbas that will easily pay back in gate receipts and merchandising the 10 to 15 million spent on new players if the chairman was courageous enough to take the gamble and sign a few badly needed players.

It's only a potential fanbase is what he is talking about.

People are'nt going to start support Villa just because they buy a few players that might help them finish in the top eight.

Loyal supporter's wont abbandon there club for Villa no matter who they buy

Villain

Originally posted by kmart6
Ah come on the three teams you mentioned there would beat them into 4th place not to mention the likes of Charlton and Fulham

Thats yet to be proven, as I said I'm not saying we will but it is possible, I don't think Newcastle, the pools or blackburns squads are that much better than ours.

But hey time will tell

kmart6

Originally posted by irish1
Thats yet to be proven, as I said I'm not saying we will but it is possible, I don't think Newcastle, the pools or blackburns squads are that much better than ours.

But hey time will tell

Yeh ok they COULD,but I myself doubt it

Dont forget Liverpool are minus a good few key players at the moment

wynters

".... Villa don't have the pulling power to sign any big players anymore......."

Neither did Leeds when O'Leary took over. How long did that last? What Leeds did have was a chairman with ambition - too much as it turned out, but at least Ridsdale understood the concept of 'speculate to accumulate'. They gambled TOO much, but Leeds only missed out on that Champions league place by a point or 2, where would they be now had they qualified that season....... ????

Villa have one of the top 3 stadiums in the country for a reason. It's current capacity is 46,000. Pre-Hillsborough it was around the 60,000 mark, and during the aformentioned glory seasons of 79-83, the ground was packed week in, week out. They have the fanbase. There's no doubt about it. The biggest club in an area of 15 million people should. There's no need to convert fans from other clubs, which is a ridiculous idea anyway.....

Doug Ellis is the reason the ground is half empty each week.... It kills most Villa fans to not attend home games (a lot of those supporters still travel to away games) but the general consensus now is that the only way to get rid of Ellis is to hit him in the pocket. The club is a PLC, so if shareholders and even club sponsors begin to ask serious questions about under performing gate receipts and the negative publicity/image Doug is single handedly creating for the club, well then something might happen.... The pressure is already paying off with Doug stating that he will stand down as the Chief Executive of the club as soon as an 'able replacement' can be found. However, his majority shareholding means that until someone buys him out, we're stuck with him as club chairman.

Realistically I don't think Villa have much chance of the Champions League spot with the team they have. But 2 or 3 quality additions to the squad could give us a real chance. Fulham occupy that 4th spot at the moment and we beat them 3-0 at the weekend. Newcastle are hardly setting the world on fire this season and as long as Houllier is in charge, Liverpool aren't the major force their fans think they are.

Investing a few quid in some quality young players i.e. the likes of Andy Reid, Jermaine Pennant, Alan Smith etc. - players who would have a definate sell on value (thus reducing the gamble factor in signing them in the first place) could push us up the league fairly lively. It's a win win situation for a club with no debts.

Doug is the spanner in the works.