New PC , need help

T-b0n3

looking to upgrade to new rig soon , got sum money saved up + birthday money on way etc.
this will be the first attemp at building my own comp hence , need the help :>
trying to keep the budget at bout 1000yoyos aint to rigid tho.
mainly a gaming pc. this wut i got so far, pls give suggestions , point out my errors etc. and aint to interesed in overclocking , probs f*ck it up tbh

Intel Pentium 4 2.6GHz (800FSB) with HT Technology - Retail (CP-025-IN)
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Intel_CPUs_15.html
bout 188 yoyos

Creative Sound Blaster Audigy 2 - OEM (SC-015-CL)
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/creative_soundcards.html
77euro

Kingston HyperX 512MB (2x256MB) DDR PC2700 (KHX2700K2/512) CAS2.0 Dual Channel Kit (MY-005-KS)
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Kingston.html
E122

Sapphire ATI Radeon 9600XT 256MB DDR TV-Out/DVI & Half Life 2 Bundle - Retail (GX-040-SP)
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/sapphire_ati_graphics_cards.html
190yoyos


Also my comp atm is a dell comp , p4 1.8 384ram geoforce2 mx400 , bout how much culd i sell for?

ta in advance , adam

bus77

Ive heard that PC3200 ram matches up perfect with the 800 fsp on those pentiums.

T-b0n3

kk n1 ta ill ave a look

unkel

Originally posted by bus77
Ive heard that PC3200 ram matches up perfect with the 800 fsp on those pentiums.

No. The whole point about the pentium 4c is that it is extremely easy to overclock. With a decent motherboard (you don't mention any - why?) and good ram you can easily get a 25% overclock even with standard (stock) cooling

If you want a pc to run at the speed of a pentium 4c 3000, you buy a pentium 4c 2400 and overclock it. Your memory needs to be min PC4000 for this or you can try overclocking very good PC3700+ memory

Having said all that you state that it is mainly for gaming. In that case you'd be a fool not to go for an athlon 64 bit cpu and motherboard

PS my answer to the above quote would be yes, perfect if you had no intention to overclock

T-b0n3

well aint just for gaming but mainly , and if overclocking is that easy i may as well i suppose ( altho heard that takes life expectantcy off comp and more chance of breakdown etc? that true? )

and an amd64bit best for gaming?

reason i didnt mention mobo is cuz i really dont have much of a clue and know u lot know better :>

adam

bus77

A p4 2.6 is fast, personaly I dont see the need to overclock. Its not coz Its hard either, the simple reason is... it's the road to the mad house.

The minute you start makin little tweaks to the fsb ect you start checkin scores on systmark to see just how much faster it is, the quick start up time you were perfectly happy with before, becomes an ice age, every little half second system hang becomes a minute in yur head as your constanly thinking "Could this be a bit faster?"

Unkel is a perfect example of this illness.
The reason why he recomends an amd64bit is because thats what HE wants , he has a top of the range system but he's already lookin at what the guy accross the street has.
People who get into overclockin are NEVER happy with their systems.

unkel

Originally posted by T-b0n3
altho heard that takes life expectantcy off comp and more chance of breakdown etc? that true?

The point about OCing your system is that you OC it as far as it can go without compromising your needs. By definition then, it will not crash your system more than without OCing. If you overclock by increasing the voltage sent to your cpu, then yes, it will decrease the life of the cpu. This is a relative thing however. Let's put in an example. If you increase the voltage of a P4 from 1.5v to 1.7v, the life expectancy might go down from 20 to 4 years. In 4 years time this cpu will have an economic value of about €10 independent of it having been overclocked or not

My two cents on the theory of (economic) relativity anyway

Originally posted by T-b0n3
and an amd64bit best for gaming?

YES - beating intel hands down

Woden

T-b0n3 your system is probably fine, why are you upgrading apart from the fact you have the money?

my advice spend €200 now on a decent graphics card radeon 9600XT and your system will last another year no bother. then with €200 less in your pocket in a years time you will be able to buy a better system with €200 less then you could now with the €200 extra

the only problem with your current system is the graphics

if your dead set on upgrading, go to www.overclockers.co.uk go to the forums and ask them to spec you a system for £700 put in any individual requirements you have etc. and they'll pull you together a nice system

data

unkel

Dohhhh, my last post crossed yours bus77 - but let me reply to your post here

Originally posted by bus77
Unkel is a perfect example of this illness.
The reason why he recomends an amd64bit is because thats what HE wants , he has a top of the range system but he's already lookin at what the guy accross the street has.

No you're wrong here, but please read on, I considered going either P4c or amd 64 bit. Chose the former. I'm not much of a gamer and I reckoned the P4c with substantial overclock would be more aligned with what I was looking for, especially fast encoding and hyperthreading

Originally posted by bus77
A p4 2.6 is fast, personaly I dont see the need to overclock. Its not coz Its hard either, the simple reason is... it's the road to the mad house.

The minute you start makin little tweaks to the fsb ect you start checkin scores on systmark to see just how much faster it is, the quick start up time you were perfectly happy with before, becomes an ice age, every little half second system hang becomes a minute in yur head as your constanly thinking "Could this be a bit faster?"

[Humble]
Very sound and wise words there bus77 - food for contemplation for myself. I do need a solid and very fast system, but I could do without having an obsession about how far I can possibly take it. I admit I have already spent way too much time trying to clock the system to the very limit - What the hell for indeed? I'll stick to an easy and solid overclock that would satisfy my needs

I was disappointed to not having reached the 4GHz mark stable, but WTF, who cares. I'm doing myself more harm than good with this attitude. Thanks again bus77 for your post
[/Humble]

T-b0n3

yes ur right one reason 4 my upgrade is becuz i have the money but as u sed i need a new gfx card ne way , and my sound card sucks etc. figured easy to just do full upgrade and sell this one off and get a few bob for it while its actually worth a bit.

How much wuld u think i culd get for this comp anyway? (estimate)

and while the amd 64bit is ahead of intel in games , is it much behind on other things? like is the pro bigger then the con? like HT? and wut one u mean ? amd 64bit 3000/3200 or the FX1 cuz thats like 550sterling on overclockers :E

ta for all help so far keep it up
adam

Dempsey

If your sticking with the 2.6c id recommend the Abit IC7-G MAX2, Abit IC-7G MAX3 or the Asus P4C800-E Deluxe. They are the only three boards that should be on your shortlist. Get P3200 RAM aswell, dont touch anything lower than it and make sure your buying a matching pair. To use Hyper Threading you'll need Xp Home or XP Pro. or else you'll have to disable it. W2K runs like a 3 legged dog with HT.

As for 64-bit CPU's, Id stay away from them until next christmas. intel v amd will be in full flow again and they will be mainstream by then and they wont cost as much.

T-b0n3

aight cheers , any ideas on case , i like the thermeltake ones tbh , but alot of peeps saying lanfire look tacty etc , and the others are huge and way loads. wut u suggest?

and ne ideas how much i culd sell mu current rig for?

cheers , adam

Dempsey

Post the full spec of what your selling and we'll see what you should expect for it.

What do you want in a case? eg Side Panel, load of cooling, flash colour, lightweight, LCD display, CCFL's, expansion ability, easy access, etc

I had a quick look around and if I had the money id go for a Globalwin GAT-001 v.2 Aluminium Case (CA-008-GL) and you'll have to get a seperate PSU, Id recommend a Antec TruePower 430W PSU

Its high cost but you'll be smiling from ear to ear with it.

T-b0n3

its a dell dimension 4400 wiv p4 1.8
256k sound down wiv floppy drive
384MB 266mhz DDR RAM memory
40GB IDE (5400 RPM) Hard Drive
24 x CDRW and 16 X DVD
UK/IRISH - 17in Value midnight gret (E771A) Moniter
64MB GeoForce2 MX400 wiv TVOUT Video Card
Harmon Kardon 395 Midnight grey speakers
Lux- V.92 data/fax/voice internal modem

Cost me1863.41 from Dell bout 1.5 years ago (april 02)
(all read of order form thingy)

yea dempsey that case looks nice, ta.

p4 or amd 64bit tho ? :E

cheers adam

Dempsey

Stick with the P4's. better performance/cost ratio than the 64-bit CPU's

Dunno what price id put on your system. Check the for sale forum and see what people are selling systems for

T-b0n3

k cheers again .

PSU
be quiet! Power Supply Unit 370W Colorline Ultra Silent PFC
http://www.hitide.ie/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/102
E74.90 euro

this gud buy? or ne thing better?

ne ideas on ram ? PC4000 at least? bout 512? or wuld i need a gig
cpu cooler/ fans ?

adam

unkel

If you're spending €75 on a PSU, you can't do better than buying a Fortron 400W. It's nearly identical to the Zalman 400W but a bit cheaper. Both actually produce 450W. Google for where you can buy it

The ram needs to be PC4000 minimum to get your 1000FSB, if you want to experiment clocking higher, you'd be better of with PC4200 and / or memory that is still fully guaranteed under overclock. I bought a few weeks ago after doing solid research of reviews on the web and found that the OCZ EL 4200 is the very best available (matched kit 2*256MB for €216 from shop4memory.co.uk in Celbridge, they ship for free). If you need 1GB, you'll have to dig deep m8

T-b0n3

kk cheers unkel advice taken

btw i aint ever tried but how u overclock? easy for a nub?
and i cant fu*k it up? e break comp/parts ?

adam

M@lice

I heard that the best price/performance ratio is still with the amd non 64. So i was thinkin if you were to get this instead of the p4 you could use the cash you save to get a radeon 9800 Which gives you a chance of softmoddin to 9800 pro. I'd say any1 here who had to choose between amd 9800 pro and p4 9600 would go with the former. Now i could stand to b corrected and i know there's no guarantee you could softmod but i'd certainly give it a go. I'm not sure which 9800 it is to get either. the standard or the se. Maybe sum1 else can tell you that.

Dempsey

Originally posted by T-b0n3
kk cheers unkel advice taken

btw i aint ever tried but how u overclock? easy for a nub?
and i cant fu*k it up? e break comp/parts ?

adam

Overclocking stresses components more thus reducing the MTBF(Mean Time Between Failure). The only way to avoid damaging stuff, you'll need better heat disapation. You'll need to montior your temperatures while putting the system under full load if the temperature gets too high you'll need to reduce the overclock or get better cooling. Dont have components running near their max. temp on the spec sheets. (eg P4 max temp is 75'C but ya shouldnt be going over 60'C)

Sorry, What I mean was that the P4 has a better Performance/Cost Ratio than the Athlon64. The Athlon Xp 2600+ offers the best Performance/Cost Ratio full stop

T-b0n3

but u think its worth doing? as i havent done it b4 and aint too sure how , or is the chance of me breaking sumthing stilll very slim?

ne thoughts on moniters? tft vs crt ? :E

adam

Dempsey

I havent gotten around to overclocking myself because ill need to get a better Heatsinkfan and ill need to invest in some thermal paste so ill wont be answering that question for ya.

I have a 17" TFT, i find it handy when movin the pc from location to location, very small and light. Picture will be more or less the same but a TFT is easier on your eyes. If ya have the cash get yourself a TFT instead but there is nothing wrong with CRT's.

T-b0n3

for gaming tho?
it make much of a diff? and wut specs wuld i need , refresh rate etc.

thx's again adam

silverside

adam,

I would find your posts a lot easier to read if you used normal English instead of text-speak.

Sir Random

P4s are great for o/cing but unless you have good quality ram that can handle high fsb with tight timings, the performance increase will be restricted. Ideally PC3200/PC3500 with winbond BH5 chips (if you can find any) or CH5.

A lot depends on what mobo you get. As suggested already, either an Abit IC7 Max3 or an Asus P4C800-E Deluxe, but you'll need to understand ram timings and be prepared to try multiple settings of PAT/GAT to find your setup's sweetspot.

T-b0n3

kk cheers 4 all help lads.

ideas on moniter?

adam

unkel

Originally posted by silverside
adam,

I would find your posts a lot easier to read if you used normal English instead of text-speak.

Couldn't agree more with you silverside. FFS let's all communicate properly and avoid the headache

That text-speak sh*te makes you sound like an 11 year old :mad:

zAbbo

Originally posted by T-b0n3
for gaming tho?
it make much of a diff? and wut specs wuld i need , refresh rate etc.

thx's again adam

makes you sound like a right fag

unkel

T-b0n3,

If your main consideration is gaming, then your best options are based on:

1. athlon 2500 o/c to 3200 with 9800 pro or xt
2. athlon 64 with 9800 pro or xt

As for monitor, I'd strongly recommend top of the range 21"CRT. It will be a while yet for a TFT to beat this, although it will happen

T-b0n3

k cheers unkel illl look into that

helpful comments bazH , ta

adam

unkel

so you're not taking into consideration the suggestions about your communications then are you?