[merged] Magnier and McManus now own 29% of Man Utd PLC

Bannor

unconfirmed report but this is in today's Irish Independent:

Irish Independent:

Magnier and McManus to buy 8m more United shares
Wednesday February 11th 2004

JOHN Magnier and JP McManus are today poised to swoop for an eight-million block of Manchester United shares in a move that will put them on the brink of a 30pc holding in the club.

Such a swoop - at a cost of more than £20m - would send tremors through the market and Old Trafford.

And it would significantly increase pressure on manager Alex Ferguson.

The latest buy-up brings Cubic Expression - owned by the Irish multi-millionaires - close to the level of ownership where they would have to make an offer for the rest of the shares, under UK rules.

This latest development comes only days after a group of 30 Manchester United fans disrupted racing at Hereford in protest at what they claimed was the use of the club in the row between Magnier and United boss Ferguson over the stud fees of Rock of Gibraltar.

Despite a series of warnings to the Irish pair, this decision by Cubic to substantially increase their stake will be interpreted as a clear signal that they will not be intimidated in this battle.

Sources say that the group has been quietly acquiring up to 900,000 shares over the past fortnight.

However, today's block-buy represents the biggest single swoop since the £62m paid out for Sky shares last October.

And following several weeks of public fighting between the Magnier and Ferguson camps, it is believed the two sides are taking a renewed look at the situation.

It is understood, however, that despite spurning the offer of Goldmans Sachs banker Jim O'Neill to broker a deal, a calmer approach is now being adopted.

It might boil down to how one side can make an approach to the other through official channels without being seen to lose face.

PJ Cunningham

Villain

Just read this:
"Speculation is mounting that John Magnier and JP McManus are set to make another £20m investment in Manchester United.

The Irish horse racing tycoons, who between them currently own 25.5% of the club, are said to be on the verge of buying a further eight million shares in the Old
Trafford outfit, which would increase their ownership to 28.6%."

Taken from :http://www.teamtalk.com/teamtalk/News/Story_Page/0,7760,770927,00.html

Looks like the boys are going to up the tempo

EDIT/
BANNOR opened one at the same time just close this one thanks.
EDIT

Bannor

SNAP!

Villain

Snap is right lol

Bannor

Man Utd fans target Gold Cup (BBC 11 February 2004)

Man Utd fans have given their backing to Sir Alex Ferguson
Manchester United fans are planning to stage a major protest against the club's principal shareholders at the Cheltenham Festival in March.
The United 4 Action group are hoping up to 250 fans will take part in the demonstration against Irish racing tycoons John Magnier and JP McManus.

The protest is planned to take place on Gold Cup day on Thursday 18 March.

The fans are upset at Magnier's continuing dispute with United manager Sir Alex Ferguson.

Ferguson is suing Magnier over the stud rights to racehorse Rock of Gibraltar.

McManus and Magnier have since caused consternation at Old Trafford by posing 99 questions to the board about the club's transfer dealings.

Cheltenham's managing director Edward Gillespie confirmed he has received a request to stage a demonstration.

United 4 Action founder Sean Murphy said he was waiting for a response from the course, but the protest would go ahead regardless.

"We don't want to cause any disruption but we want to get the message across to John Magnier and JP McManus that we want them to sell their shares in Manchester United and give the club back to the fans, because we don't want them," he said.

"We've been in touch with the authorities at Cheltenham asking for permission to be able to hold a peaceful, vocal protest - at a place they designate.

"If the racecourse doesn't give us permission we will revert to Plan B, which is to protest at a time and place at the track that has already been arranged.

"I'm not going to say where or when that will be - but it will cause huge embarrassment."

United fans disrupted racing at Hereford earlier this month.

About 30 fans burst onto the track, carrying banners declaring "Quit the horseplay Coolmore" and "United not for sale".

Man Utd make fans plea
The club responded by urging its fans not to carry out any more demonstrations.

Embarraasment Eh? When are they going to realise that Man Utd is no longer a privately owned football club but a PLC and therefore they are up for sale! :eek:

tHE vAGGABOND

you'll never beat the irish

JaneyMackers

The plot thickens.

This is all very entertaining.

Ben

GuanYin

Great quote on the BBC Website

"This is as near as you can get to parking your tanks on somebody's lawn."

Ronaldo7

We don't want to cause any disruption but we want to get the message across to John Magnier and JP McManus that we want them to sell their shares in Manchester United and give the club back to the fans,'' said United 4 Action founder Sean Murphy.

These fans are ****ing idiots. I dont know what they are about. I dont want to be associated with them. Why dont they take their finger out and realise that the club is not the fans? The fans mean **** all here. Its a plc which can be taken over at any time. the fans own jack **** shares. They have no say in what happens to it. Thats a serious disadvantage to having a plc. I wish these uemployed idiots would understand that because they are really starting to look idiotic and extremely uneducated and yes that is a problem...:rolleyes:

Villain

Originally posted by Ronaldo7
These fans are ****ing idiots. I dont know what they are about. I dont want to be associated with them. Why dont they take their finger out and realise that the club is not the fans? The fans mean **** all here. Its a plc which can be taken over at any time. the fans own jack **** shares. They have no say in what happens to it. Thats a serious disadvantage to having a plc. I wish these uemployed idiots would understand that because they are really starting to look idiotic and extremely uneducated and yes that is a problem...:rolleyes:

That pretty sums it up really.

If UTD fans have a problem with this they should be complaining about becomming a PLC instead of giving out about who can and can't buy shares now

Dustaz

Hmm, such a dillemma.

On one hand i sympathise with the fans as Magnier and McManus clearly want ferguson out and i think any fan would not want that considering hes the most successful manager in england right now. If it was wenger, paisley, shankley, dario gradi (is he still at crewe btw? lost touch) or ANY well liked and successful manager that was being shafter for non-footballing reasons, any fans would be rightfully upset.

On the other hand, the comedy value of all this is through the roof. For the ABU's, its a no lose situation either a bunch of arrogant idiots, a moany old whining arse (who happens to be a pretty succesful one) or 2 too-rich twats lose out.... More of this please

TwoShedsJackson

Now it has emerged the `United 4 Action' group have asked Cheltenham racecourse executives if they can hold a `peaceful but vocal' protest on Gold Cup day on March 18.

``We don't want to cause any disruption but we want to get the message across to John Magnier and JP McManus that we want them to sell their shares in Manchester United and give the club back to the fans,'' said United 4 Action founder Sean Murphy.

Ah how sweet, he actually thinks Magnier and McManus give a toss what the fans think.

If this guy wants 'his' club back, guess he'll just have to fork out 200 million...

Ronaldo7

Does anyone know where i can get this Sean Murphy guy's emails address, because i want to abuse him verbally. Hes a total retard. The more i read that statement, the angrier i get. Is he stupid? By acting the way he does, he is entertaining everyone including Magnier and McManus. They must be looking at it and going "what a ****ing idiot".

JaneyMackers

I don't think they intend to take over, maybe they do.

But if you look at the value of that horses stud purse. Its about 300mill.

So 20 mil between both of them so only 10 each and the fact they would make a profit if anyone wanted their shares to take over. Its good intimidation tactics i say.


But neither support United, McMAnus has never been to old trafford and magnier only once apparently.

It is hard to see why they would want to take over.

smiaras

This post has been deleted.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Perhaps I will start up a M&M supporters club, buy tickets to some man united games and then run up and down the pitch while the game is going ahead, maybe we could get a few people and have a sit down protest.

This behaviour is very childish by the fans of united. They, at the end of the day, have no hope of stopping M&M if they want to buy up united shares and eventually take over the company. As for the reasons for it, well it is purely Monetarily motivated, they have never made out to be fans of the club and while they were pouring money in by buying shares there was not too much complaint form united fans as they had a chance to increase the transfer kitty. It is only now that they are making waves that United fans are complaining that some people are exercising their rights to have their voice (as major shareholders) heard.

Ronaldo7

McMAnus has never been to old trafford and magnier only once apparently.

Seriously? Jesus, i thought once you have money in there, you would be even slightly interested in watching them...!!!! Thats mad!!!!!!

Bannor

Originally posted by Dustaz
On one hand i sympathise with the fans as Magnier and McManus clearly want ferguson out and i think any fan would not want that considering hes the most successful manager in england right now. If it was wenger, paisley, shankley, dario gradi (is he still at crewe btw? lost touch) or ANY well liked and successful manager that was being shafter for non-footballing reasons, any fans would be rightfully upset.

No sympathy from me what so ever... The reason they want Ferguson out is because the greedy fecker is suing them! I don't think any of the other managers you mention would have done such a thing.

Where it's going to get very interesting is if they take control of the club, Greedo Ferguson will effectively be suing his employers. Can he proceed with such a case or will he have to take a leave of absence to do so? To get his head off the chopping block all he has had to do is drop his case against Magnier and McManus, but he doesn't seem to be willing to do that.

Another interesting facet to them increasing their share holding in the company is the matter of the 99 questions which were asked of the board. The response came on 7 pages with a further 6 pages of addendum totalling to a measly 13 pages covering inconsistencies in the dealings of the club. The board must have thought they could dismiss Magnier and McManus out of hand because they haven't previously involved themselves in the clubs affairs - in contrast it took 127 pages to explain why Rio Ferdinand missed a drug test.

Bannor

Originally posted by Ronaldo7
Seriously? Jesus, i thought once you have money in there, you would be even slightly interested in watching them...!!!! Thats mad!!!!!!

If I remember correctly Magnier is an Arsenal fan and McManus has no interest in football - it's purely a business investment on their part.

tHE vAGGABOND

they have said several times, its a business thing not a 'social' and 'sport' thing

Man U is the worlds biggest club, with fans left, right and centre, every corner of the globe..

it has become mega rich, and will only become richer..

its therefore good to own things that make money, let alone cast iron money making machines like Old T

Dustaz

Originally posted by JaneyMackers
It is hard to see why they would want to take over.

Your right, i cant think of a single reason why they would want to own one of the most profitable soccer clubs in the world.

If I remember correctly Magnier is an Arsenal fan

w00t

Pepe LeFrits

Originally posted by Bannor
If I remember correctly Magnier is an Arsenal fan and McManus has no interest in football - it's purely a business investment on their part.

According to the BBC Magnier is a UTD fan and McManus is an Arsenal fan.

GuanYin

None of this is exactly the sort of thing a player wants happening to his club as the title run in starts...... I wonder will it have an impact on performances.

carryo

If roman abromovits is woth £1.5bn and combined M&M are woth 0.5bn would Chealsea be bigger than Man utd?
At today's standing of 29.9% M&M effectivly control manchester utd. They can take-over the board and overrule most decisions either with, or without, launching a full take-over bid (>29.9%).

So if they get their way, and Chleasea is managed by Erricsson or Fergie next year and ManU has o'neil, houllier or hoddle in charge, will this still be a good thing for the ManU fans and the club?

Of course it alway possible that the dubious origins of the Russian oligarch's wealth will be called into question by the swiss domiciled, carribean registed, irish resident owners of cubic expression.


The bluff and counter-bluff is reaching it's climax - man's poker is being played here.
The city establishement versus the outsiders. The staff (manager and players) are caught up in the crossfire. And the supporters' needs are ignored.

For M&M could the prize turn out to be a poison? They can trade horses and currencies. But ManU is all about the brand and the fans and M&M are not having a positive affect on either.

You can laugh at 35 people protests at a racecourse. Even at a 350 people protest at Cheltenham. But when it comes to Old Trafford ...

Villain

I don't think the brand will be affected as long as the success remains, most fans just want the team winning what go's on in the board room is not of much concern.

It Ferguson was to go, high unlikely I think it would have a short term affect but if a new manager comes in and wins no one will care.

Just my 2 cents

Bannor

Originally posted by carryo
The staff (manager and players) are caught up in the crossfire.

Ferguson isn't caught in the crossfire... he's the prime target. If he hadn't been so greedy and overstepped the mark, Magnier and McManus wouldn't be hunting him down now. So long as Ferguson persists with his case against them they are going to continue to buy up the club - such is the acrimony between them at this stage I suspect they'll only be satisfied with him out of the club.

Nike_Dude

At today's standing of 29.9% M&M effectivly control manchester utd

Magnier and McManus own 28.89% if the buy 1% more they HAVE to launch a take over bid. They cant, at present, overrule the board; but they can demand a seat on it.
Cant see them launching a take over bid, they just want to put more pressure on Fergie. I really cant see a amicable end to this unless Ferguson gives up his claim (which I doubt he will do) and even if he does the bad blood will still remain.

Ronaldo7

Ok so we know ferguson aint gonna step off them...so we can only assume its a matter of time before he is forced to leave by magnier and mcmanus buying up the club? I think this is a warning...they are staying one percent away from takeover mark before they have to make an offer to give Fergie like a last warning...this is nasty business.

Armen Tanzerian

Fair play to the United supporters I say. Great to see a bit of loyalty for a change, compare that to McC**ty's erratic treatment by the Irish so-called supporters (Saipan/Cameroon/Spain/Switzerland - What's he at/he was right/what a genius/McC**ty out). To the point that it's none of the supporters' business, like the man in the TB ad higher ticket prices are their business. Middle class gob****es will never understand what the game means to the working class. When ticket prices are raised (if they go at all) these daytrippers will cut back their attendance and contend themselves with oh-so-witty ripostes to Barry Glendenning.

If you don't understand why the United fans are doing what they are doing, have a listen to Common People by Pulp. See that bird from Greece that studied sculpture at St. Martin's College? That's you that is.

dod

Originally posted by carryo
combined M&M are woth 0.5bn

I think you might want to revise your estimates. By orders of magnitude tbh.

tHE vAGGABOND

I think you might want to revise your estimates. By orders of magnitude

The assets of coolmore stud alone must be worth close to that, some of the best and most 'prolific' horses in the world - and thats just one thing one of them does..

Thanx 4 The Fish

What the fcuk is working class these days ? Is it somebody who works ? Coz that would make a high percentage of the world working class. You just wait until the horsey crew start disrupting football matches in revenge for the attacks on horse racing that have been occurring. I think you will find then that it would be hooligans ruining the national sport etc while at the moment it is loyal fans standing up to the ministrations of a tyranical OWNER OF THE CLUB.

Heres how it is, United needed money and floated on the stock exchange, they did not complain when these guys bought the shares but now that Sir Alex has had a misunderstanding with these guys, they are the bad guys because they want him to drop the action and obviously talking to him has not worked. If Sir Alex got in over his head that is not M&M's fault but the fact that he is pursuing legal action over something that he in all likeliness has bugger all idea about is absurd in the extreme. Perhaps if he concentrated on the footy all would be well again.

G

Originally posted by JaneyMackers
I don't think they intend to take over, maybe they do.

It is hard to see why they would want to take over.

If they oust Ferguson the Man Utd share price should drop sharply. Magnier / McManus could then immediately buy a large block of shares at a deflated price and the sp would bounce back naturally. Installl a good manager e.g. O'Neill and share price would jump again. Then sell out. They'd make a killing.

smiaras

This post has been deleted.

Pepe LeFrits

Billionaire American businessman Malcolm Glazer has raised his stake in Manchester United to 16.31%.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3481701.stm

TwoShedsJackson

"Our message to any potential suitor is exactly the same. Manchester United is not for sale" Independent Manchester United Supporter's Association spokesman Jules Spencer

Someone else who doesn't understand how this whole 'buying shares in a PLC' thing works :rolleyes:

JaneyMackers

Also,

I doubt people can name a stronger GLOBAL brand that you can buy for 600mil.

United brand is worth an aweful lot esp with the US kids playing it en mass these days and their agreement with the Yankees.

Business wise alot of money to be made. And united exploit their brand very very well.

woosaysdan

well M&M arent getting my shares da cu nts

Thanx 4 The Fish

And again I will have to say that I don't think they will lose too much sleep over missing out on the supporters shares, as with alot of companies, alot of shares will be owned by pension funds etc who couldn't care less about the actual business as long as it makes money.

Bannor

Originally posted by kaids
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3481701.stm

Magnier and Glazier are buddies. Magnier and Desmond are also buddies. The combined share holdings of Cubic Expression, Desmond and Glazier is over 50% (closer to 53~54%).

Apparently Desmond had a 'last chance saloon' meeting with Ferguson yesterday to sort things out.

The Muppet

Originally posted by Thanx 4 The Fish
And again I will have to say that I don't think they will lose too much sleep over missing out on the supporters shares, as with alot of companies, alot of shares will be owned by pension funds etc who couldn't care less about the actual business as long as it makes money.

Good point about the pension funds , they are unlikely to be very happy at the prospect of share prices falling because of M&Ms meddling with the club. The last figures I read on Su shares is that they hold 17% of the club and with worldwide Fanbase of approx 5o million people even if only a small percentage are moved enough to Join shareholders united their concerns too will have to be taken seriously. Rupert Murdoch tried to buy united without success.

bdiddy

Originally posted by The Muppet
Rupert Murdoch tried to buy united without success.

Rupert Murdoch couldnt buy the club because of competition laws, cubic expressions dont fall into the same category. The boys are dead right, get Fergie where it hurts most Man U. They still have the opportunity to take a seat on the board and really make him sweat when he wants to make his next big transfer. They dont give a s**t about the club and why should they. buisness is buisness.

Pepe LeFrits

Originally posted by Bannor
Magnier and Glazier are buddies. Magnier and Desmond are also buddies. The combined share holdings of Cubic Expression, Desmond and Glazier is over 50% (closer to 53~54%).

Apparently Desmond had a 'last chance saloon' meeting with Ferguson yesterday to sort things out.

Good point... M&M can't buy any more shares without having to launch a takeover bid, which i don't think they want to do (at this point anyway). Getting other shareholders who are receptive to them or at least neutral to buy more shares strengthens their grip further.

jArgHA

michael d higgins made a funny point when asked about the saga on q&a on monday night, he said the only way that he saw the situation ending would be if the rock of gibraltar became impotent

think he also mentioned something about ferguson being stuck somewhere between a rock and a hard place...

AmenToThat

Originally posted by Bannor
Magnier and Glazier are buddies. Magnier and Desmond are also buddies. The combined share holdings of Cubic Expression, Desmond and Glazier is over 50% (closer to 53~54%).

Apparently Desmond had a 'last chance saloon' meeting with Ferguson yesterday to sort things out.

I think Glazier increasing his shares in the "club" today is very interesting news indeed!
Is he going up against M&M or working in coperation with them?
I think this point will decide the outcome of the battle and it will be very interesting to see how it unfolds in the comming days and weeks........

These Man U fans groups really are incredibly stupid!
They either have no grasp or reality or simply refuse to accept the facts of the running of a company that is quoted on the stock exhange!
Either way I think they are in for a severe dose of reality at some stage over the comming weeks.:D

Bannor

Originally posted by AmenToThat
I think Glazier increasing his shares in the "club" today is very interesting news indeed!
Is he going up against M&M or working in coperation with them?
I think this point will decide the outcome of the battle and it will be very interesting to see how it unfolds in the comming days and weeks........

From what I've heard it was Magnier who brought the under valued global brand that is Manchester United PLC to the attention of Glazier. I doubt he'll go up against Cubic Expression - if they side together along with Desmond they can easily steer the company in a direction to achieve their aims for the brand and there is nothing the rest of the share holders could do to stop them.

dod

http://www.rte.ie/sport/2004/0214/rockofgibraltar.html

Speculation that peace has broken out in the horse-racing feud between Sir Alex Ferguson and John Magnier have been treated with caution on both sides of the Irish Sea. Reports this morning suggest Ferguson has agreed to drop his legal battle over
the stud rights to Rock of Gibraltar in return for two covers a year, each worth £40,000.

It has been claimed that a deal was thrashed out on Wednesday and will be formally confirmed on Monday. If the stories are correct, it would represent a massive climbdown on Ferguson's part as the Scot believed he was entitled to half the entire stud
fees to the record-breaking stallion, who became the first horse in history to win seven consecutive Group One races. Instead of the £100million he might have expected to receive, Ferguson would be unlikely to collect more than £1.5million.

However, sources at both United and Magnier's Coolmore operation insisted this morning they know nothing of the deal and are not preparing for any announcement. Ferguson himself has remained tight-lipped over the issue since revealing that
his son Jason had been forced to call in the police amid allegations that his mail was being stolen and his rubbish bin tampered with.

The long-serving United boss, who recently signed a one-year rolling extension to his current contract that expires in 2005, linked the claims to his row over `the Rock', bringing accusations of possible defamation from the Irish camp. United chief executive David Gill has previously stated that a speedy resolution to the dispute would be 'better for all parties' and would no doubt
welcome an end to the conflict, especially as this week Magnier, together with business partner JP McManus, took his stake in the Old Trafford outfit to 28.9%.

Filed by Brendan Cole