Western Rail Corridor

westtip

corktina wrote: »

id be reasonably ceertain that Mecca isnt in Ireland and therefore isnt relevant to a discussion on Irish Cities...could be wrong of course...

For West On Track Mecca = Claremorris - sure don't you know that.

unit 1

Please stop this carping, its going to happen and will suceed because its there, just like knock (a foggy boggy place) GMIT and countless other white elephants. Its benefits will be enjoyed by future generations who will probably why it will have taken so long to get to Derry, yes i said Derry.

corktina

oh dear....will my socks never dry???

westtip

unit 1 wrote: »

Please stop this carping, its going to happen and will suceed because its there, just like knock (a foggy boggy place) GMIT and countless other white elephants. Its benefits will be enjoyed by future generations who will probably why it will have taken so long to get to Derry, yes i said Derry.

Now now no need to get upset ane emotional about it all - yes it will happen for phase 1 - I am afraid the usage level will be unsustainable and the second phase will be kicked into touch - the comparisons with Knock airport are ill founded Monsignor Horan saw the future - Air Travel - the WRC sees the past train travel from town to town in the bog. You are of course living in Never Never Land when you talk about the line to Derry - so I suggest you keep taking the pills.

murphaph

unit 1 wrote: »

Please stop this carping, its going to happen and will suceed because its there, just like knock (a foggy boggy place) GMIT and countless other white elephants. Its benefits will be enjoyed by future generations who will probably why it will have taken so long to get to Derry, yes i said Derry.

Knock (and the other regional airports) is an indictment of EVERYTHING that is wrong with 'planning' in Ireland.

corktina

westtip wrote: »

Now now no need to get upset ane emotional about it all - yes it will happen for phase 1 - I am afraid the usage level will be unsustainable and the second phase will be kicked into touch - the comparisons with Knock airport are ill founded Monsignor Horan saw the future - Air Travel - the WRC sees the past train travel from town to town in the bog. You are of course living in Never Never Land when you talk about the line to Derry - so I suggest you keep taking the pills.

as far as I can see the secind phase ahs already been kicked into touch, and phase one already has an uncertain future seeing as the opening has been put back to next year and there are no crews to man the trains...

Badger2009

Phase 2 won't happen anytime soon - if ever. West on Track was lucky to get it this far. It just won't be used with travel times of 2 hrs between Galway and Limerick, You'll be able drive it in half that!

Carawaystick

corktina wrote: »

id be reasonably ceertain that Mecca isnt in Ireland and therefore isnt relevant to a discussion on Irish Cities...could be wrong of course...

Well you never mentioned you were talking about Irish cities specifically

corktina wrote:

you can be town with a Cathedral but you cant be a City WITHOUT a cathedral.

and before that:

corktina wrote:

I believe a city is determined by having a Cathedral isnt ti? Always thought so....

Anyway back to somewhat on topic, I heard a story that the landowner that allowed the rail line through his lands, stipulated that at least a train a day would stop at Woodlawn. which still happens even though the landowners are long dead and gone - but sher that's the cie way.

http://www.grantonline.com/grant-family-individuals/places/Woodlawn/woodlawn.htm
Seems to suggest there could be some semblance of truth to the yarn.

westtip

Badger2009 wrote: »

Phase 2 won't happen anytime soon - if ever. West on Track was lucky to get it this far. It just won't be used with travel times of 2 hrs between Galway and Limerick, You'll be able drive it in half that!

WRC DOA

good piece in the Sligo Champion about the WRC by Felim O'Rourke - can't seem to find it on the Champion website but anyone in the area with an interest shoud pick up a copy.

Peter

Was a piece on the front page of yesterdays Tuam Herald about the WRC, will post a transcript l8r if I get chance but basically says a decision will be made on Phase 2 within the next 2 months and WOT/Tuam Chamber of Commerce have a meeting next week in the Ard Ri in Tuam.

westtip

Peter wrote: »

and WOT/Tuam Chamber of Commerce have a meeting next week in the Ard Ri in Tuam.

Neither bodies will have any influence on the inevitable decision - the threat of the IMF and the cost of NAMA will

unit 1

re ennis dc versus rail no contest does this mean lack of chaos on m1 mean no need to rebuild the viaduct in dublin?

invincibleirish

unit 1 wrote: »

re ennis dc versus rail no contest does this mean lack of chaos on m1 mean no need to rebuild the viaduct in dublin?

I see what you did there very clever.

The Ennis-Lim line has weekly ridership of 600.

Malahide viaduct has 10,000 passengers over it per day.

The M1 has 100k plus traffic movements on it per day, the N18 has high teens/low 20's.

Maybe we should stop playing silly games and comparing small town Ennis to large urban area Dublin?

DWCommuter

invincibleirish wrote: »

I see what you did there very clever.

No I don't think it was clever, just thick.

Victor

Can we stick to the WRC discussion?

DWCommuter

I am sticking to it. Some gob****e made a rediculous comparison regarding the WRC and I said it was thick. Much like most of what WOT and their internet warriors preach.

Its all pure WRC Victor. Warts and all. Sure Unit 1 can fling an insult back at me. I won't mind. The comparison is still thick. Lets not get like Politics.ie.:D

Sponge Bob

No idea how many services per day each way, no fewer than 8 trains per day in each direction are required in my opinion .

http://www.galwaynews.ie/8705-galway-v-limerick-price-wars-track

Iarnród Éireann has confirmed that services on the direct rail-link between Limerick and Galway, will be opened in early December and the business communities in both cities are gearing up to lure customers to their city to cash in on the lucrative shopping bonanza in the run-up to Christmas.

westtip

unit 1 wrote: »

re ennis dc versus rail no contest does this mean lack of chaos on m1 mean no need to rebuild the viaduct in dublin?

DW I agree with you, the stupidity of this analagy is quite remarkable.

westtip

Sponge Bob wrote: »

No idea how many services per day each way, no fewer than 8 trains per day in each direction are required in my opinion .

http://www.galwaynews.ie/8705-galway-v-limerick-price-wars-track

It all reminds me of that wonderful film with that wonderful song:

"Somewhere over the rainbow....." Tis all highly entertaining - I do hope they have enough ticket barriers at Galway and Limerick to cope with the marauding throngs of credit card waving xmas shoppers - this is more entertaining than any comedy show!!

Peter

Make or break time on the Tuam rail connection says Chamber of Commerce

A VITAL decision on whether Tuam railway station will reopen in the near future is imminent and the local Chamber of Commerce is calling for an all-out lobbying campaign to put pressure on the government to live up to a promise to have the town back on track by 2011.
Tuam Chamber of Commerce are to hold a meeting in the town next week to discuss what strategy to take regarding reconnecting Tuam to the national rail network.
A guest speaker from the West on Track group which has been campaigning on the Western Rail Corridor issue for a number of years will address the meeting in the Ard Ri Hotel on Tuesday next, September 8, at 8pm.
In a statement a spokesperson for the Chamber said: "A decision will be taken in the next 8 weeks on whether or not to rebuild the railway line to Tuam. The Ennis to Athenry section of the Western Rail Corridor has cost €1.5m per km and therefore the extension of the line to Tuam will only cost €30m to rebuild. Compare this with a cost of €21m per km for the Navan Railway line and it is clear that this investment represents value for money.
We have an opportunity to have this line re-opened in a year but what is needed now for the people of Tuam, from business to local elected representatives to the citizens of our town, is to put pressure on central Government to deliver on their promises. Now is the time to raise our voices in unison to fight for the infrastructure that our HUB town badly needs."
The organisers of the meeting are calling on all interested parties to turn up to the meeting and show their support for this vital piece of infrastructure for Tuam and the region.

From last Wednesday's Tuam Herald

corktina

on this topic lots of practical points have been raised which I have never heard countered by WOT or thier pals.It seems that there are no staff (let alone trains) to run the Ennis Galway section, so where do they think even more resources are going to come from?

btw...i LOVE the only 30 million bit....have they not heard that we are skint?

Judgement Day

corktina wrote: »

on this topic lots of practical points have been raised which I have never heard countered by WOT or thier pals.It seems that there are no staff (let alone trains) to run the Ennis Galway section, so where do they think even more resources are going to come from?

btw...i LOVE the only 30 million bit....have they not heard that we are skint?

I would be interested to know where you are getting your info from - is it anecdotal (staff gossip) or factual?

Nostradamus

Peter wrote: »

the extension of the line to Tuam will only cost €30m to rebuild.

Could anyone tell me when they started adding flouride to Tuam water supply? I think they may have added to much with the last refil.

westtip

Nostradamus wrote: »

Could anyone tell me when they started adding flouride to Tuam water supply? I think they may have added to much with the last refil.

30 million ha ha, and what about the cost of subvention per passenger when and if this crazy idea is enacted - 30 million could be better spent on a new fleet of buses, lets say ten new buses at 100k each and use the 29 million to subvent a bus every half hour to galway for go knows how long.....

Then the people of Tuam can stop whingeing about public transport connections to Galway, they don;t NEED this railway.

Zoney

Navan's the size of Ennis, Tuam is about an eighth of the size.

Now I'm still in favour of having the intention to connect Tuam at some stage in the future, but it's not happening anytime soon, not a priority. Better to focus on getting Limerick-Ennis-Galway to be a realistic service.

gunbarrel

Zoney wrote: »

Navan's the size of Ennis, Tuam is about an eighth of the size.

Now I'm still in favour of having the intention to connect Tuam at some stage in the future, but it's not happening anytime soon, not a priority. Better to focus on getting Limerick-Ennis-Galway to be a realistic service.

While I agree with your point, there is no need to exaggerate it.

Ennis has just short of 25,000, Navan has the same and Tuam area (comparable size) is around the 7,000 +. But certainly it should not be a priority and not just because of its size but because there is no town of any size between Galway and Tuam. Galway Co. Co. should be told to sort that out first.

Peter

westtip wrote: »

30 million ha ha, and what about the cost of subvention per passenger when and if this crazy idea is enacted - 30 million could be better spent on a new fleet of buses, lets say ten new buses at 100k each and use the 29 million to subvent a bus every half hour to galway for go knows how long.....

Then the people of Tuam can stop whingeing about public transport connections to Galway, they don;t NEED this railway.

I don't think CIE will ever increase the bus service in Tuam, no need really as Burke's pretty much have the market wrapped up. Not sure what the situ is now but around 5 years ago when I used them on a daily basis they had around 7-8 buses (including the Milltown, Dunmore & GMIT ones) leave Tuam for Galway every morning and there was a good crowd on all of them. They also had a 2 hourly service throughout the day with a good few buses again with the evening commuters and a late 9pm service during the college term.

Now if the railway does open it will be Burkes that it will really be competing with and the fares are going to have to be competitive with http://www.burkesbus.com/fare.php Assuming that the train can be competitive on price I think it could probably poach quite a few of the daily students from NUIG and those that are working around the Eyre Square area, Shop St., etc. It would have the benefit over Burkes of avoiding the Claregalway(not as bad now by bus admittedly) and Tuam traffic jams as well as not stopping every mile or 2 to let people on and off which all considerably add to the journey time. (Can the train do the journey in less than 1hr 15mins?) I think it would also do fairly good numbers on Friday & Sunday evening commuter trips of students as well as casual shoppers at the weekend especially teenagers.

Now who will it not get?- anyone living on the Galway side outskirts of Tuam and further on and those who are working in the factories in the Ballybann-Ballybrit area. Burkes will always have these.
Does this leave enough people to make the service viable?-If they have 2 trains leave Tuam every morning at say 7 & 8am & leave Galway at 5 & 6pm I think enough would probably use it.

westtip

Peter wrote: »

I don't think CIE will ever increase the bus service in Tuam, no need really as Burke's pretty much have the market wrapped up. Not sure what the situ is now but around 5 years ago when I used them on a daily basis they had around 7-8 buses (including the Milltown, Dunmore & GMIT ones) leave Tuam for Galway every morning and there was a good crowd on all of them. They also had a 2 hourly service throughout the day with a good few buses again with the evening commuters and a late 9pm service during the college term.

Now if the railway does open it will be Burkes that it will really be competing with and the fares are going to have to be competitive with http://www.burkesbus.com/fare.php Assuming that the train can be competitive on price I think it could probably poach quite a few of the daily students from NUIG and those that are working around the Eyre Square area, Shop St., etc. It would have the benefit over Burkes of avoiding the Claregalway(not as bad now by bus admittedly) and Tuam traffic jams as well as not stopping every mile or 2 to let people on and off which all considerably add to the journey time. (Can the train do the journey in less than 1hr 15mins?) I think it would also do fairly good numbers on Friday & Sunday evening commuter trips of students as well as casual shoppers at the weekend especially teenagers.

Now who will it not get?- anyone living on the Galway side outskirts of Tuam and further on and those who are working in the factories in the Ballybann-Ballybrit area. Burkes will always have these.
Does this leave enough people to make the service viable?-If they have 2 trains leave Tuam every morning at say 7 & 8am & leave Galway at 5 & 6pm I think enough would probably use it.

So you think 30 million should be spent to provide four trains a day for a service that could be adequately met by a good bus service - 4 trains a day would mean this line is massively under utilised in terms of the number of trains it could physically take - however as you rightly point out the demand for any more than four trains a day does not exist - ergo the fact this is a complete waste of money, the facile arguments put forward by West on Track that it would be good value for money because the capital cost can be done quite cheaply on a cost per mile/km basis compared with other projects is totally meaningless - it is only good vfm if the dam railway service is needed and the track's true capacity can be fully utilised - on an ongoing basis of the cost of subvention this project is totally uncalled for.

And if you think CIE/BE won't increase the bus service Why the F**k would they be of the mind that they as a company should also provide a massively subvented loss making railway service - Why? please do enlighten us all!!

Now for want of repetition please do take the trouble to read the comments made by Minister Dempsey on this matter back on May 1st and on the day the Middleton line was opened - basically to paraphrase: if the first phase of WRC is not used enough the rest won't open - so off you go to your meeting with the chamber of commerce and west on track and apply as much pressure as you want, but here is a FACT If phase 1 doesn't work - phase 2 and certainly phase 3 won't happen, and in these changed times since T21 was launched in a fanfare of optimism and seemingly fiscal surety; WOT have to face facts, the times they are a changing and the songsheet has changed too.

Hey ho on we go.

westtip

gunbarrel wrote: »

While I agree with your point, there is no need to exaggerate it.

Ennis has just short of 25,000, Navan has the same and Tuam area (comparable size) is around the 7,000 +. But certainly it should not be a priority and not just because of its size but because there is no town of any size between Galway and Tuam. Galway Co. Co. should be told to sort that out first.

Its not an exaggeration its a fact.

gunbarrel

westtip wrote: »

Its not an exaggeration its a fact.

No it is not a fact it is an exagerration. Zoney said:

Navan's the size of Ennis, Tuam is about an eighth of the size.

Now anyone with basic maths can see that 7,000+ does not go into 25,000 eigth times so please get your facts right.