Western Rail Corridor

Judgement Day

Fair point DW but a total free-for-all which may result from the deregulation of the bus market will finish the railway as operated by CIE/IE. Although it could be argued that many of the current 'rogue' private bus operators will be the biggest losers if more and more licences are issued - in the way that taxi plates were dished out in Dublin.

Any word on the new timetable for the Connolly/Rosslare line? I hear that it is definitely 3 car ICRs and the early morning train from Arklow with a connection to Waterford is to be retained (at least from Enniscorthy) but you still won't be able to return EVER! I also hear that Sligo quay is to be disconnected and the quay sidings lifted as part of the works associated with the Tap Bridge replacement make of that what you will.

KC61

Nostradamus wrote: »

Amazing. But hardly surprising in CIE land. You compare that the RPA and Luas. When Shamrock Rovers were just about to move into their new stadium in Tallaght. Some of the Red Line Luas Carraiges were covered in Shamrock Rovers Team Colours. This was to establish the Red Line as what one takes to see Rovers play. End results tens of thousands of new customers a year for the red line. I went to see Bohs play there a few weeks back and several trams were packed with Bohs supporters going to Tallaght. Now compare that to IE with much more massive stadiums of Croke Park and Landsdowne Road with stations right next to them which they close on match days!

I think CIE have commission a new hanging basket at Ballymote. or should I say "hounging bouskuts"

I understand that it's actually the Gardai that dictate that IE close the stations - not IE themselves.

westtip

Judgement Day wrote: »

Fair point DW I also hear that Sligo quay is to be disconnected and the quay sidings lifted as part of the works associated with the Tap Bridge replacement make of that what you will.

JD I guess it means that the idea of rail freight from Sligo docks as an idea is officially dead never to be resurected; where the sidings used at all for freight off-loading/up-loading? (in the last few years I mean), If not then why the issue? Although I have to say for off loading and moving dirty bulk cargoes such as coal boat to train would seem the better transport option, but I guess its a matter of economies of scale, just how busy is Sligo port these days? What kind of cargoe actually moves through the port on a regular basis?. I never really go down that area. I guess its all relevant to the WRC argument somewhere along the line.

Sponge Bob

Sligo is all silted up is it not is was Westport Quay which is why they closed and abandoned it in 1975 or so

KC61

Sligo Quay certainly has been used to store rolling stock overnight.

Neworder79

New Irish Rail timetables up including:

Galway > Limerick
06:40 08:39
09:45 11:48
12:10 14:08
14:30 16:28
17:25 19:24

Limerick > Galway
09:00 10:59
12:40 14:39
16:10 18:09
18:30 20:25

Journey Time:1 hour(s) 59 minutes
Number of Changes:0
Date: 16/04/2010
Validity:Runs every Monday to Saturday from 30 November until 24 August.


Galway - Cork connection possible with 2 changes, 4h12m saving about 40min vs Portarlington route:

Galway - Limerick* (Railcar)
09:45 11:48
Limerick - Limerick Junction (Railcar)
12:00 12:27
Limerick Junction - Cork (InterCity)
12:50 13:55

crocro

2 hours to travel 100km by train. The bus already does it in 90 minutes and that's before the road is upgraded.

It should be possible in an hour with the M18 finished and some bus lanes in and out of Galway & Limerick.

glineli

And what about anyone who wants to get to Galway for 9am?

Brutal

westtip

Neworder79 wrote: »

New Irish Rail timetables up including:

Galway > Limerick
06:40 08:39
09:45 11:48
12:10 14:08
14:30 16:28
17:25 19:24

Limerick > Galway
09:00 10:59
12:40 14:39
16:10 18:09
18:30 20:25

Journey Time:1 hour(s) 59 minutes
Number of Changes:0
Date: 16/04/2010
Validity:Runs every Monday to Saturday from 30 November until 24 August.


Galway - Cork connection possible with 2 changes, 4h12m saving about 40min vs Portarlington route:

Galway - Limerick* (Railcar)
09:45 11:48
Limerick - Limerick Junction (Railcar)
12:00 12:27
Limerick Junction - Cork (InterCity)
12:50 13:55

Well IE rang me back today and said it probably won't KO until January so believe what you will, and there will be an earlier train into Galway:

Trains ex Ennis at 0639; 1014; 1234; 1459; 1804 (BTW all originating ex Limerick - I only asked about the new section of line)

arriving galway: 0800; 11.30; 13.55: 16.15; 19.25

Trains ex Galway: 0610: 0945: 12.10: 1430: 1735

Arriving Ennis: 0731:10.06: 13.31: 15.51: 18.56 (all onbound to Limerick)

So some differentials in terms of times posted up - my source of information was telephone call from IE today. They said to their knowledge no through trains for Galway - Cork.

How does it all sound for anyone commuting into Galway? I woudln't fancy a train at 20 to seven in the morning from Ennis to Galway in the winter would you to get into Galway at 0800 and then not get back to Ennis again till nearly seven at night

---

long day.

glineli

Its an early start from ennis alright, but i can see why as when you get to Galway there is a good chance you have to get a bus to Dangan, Ballybrit etc.

Any idea on prices?

Chris_533976

Shambles, just as we suspected. First trains arriving in both Galway and Limerick are too late.

Galway - Cork will be an impossible mess.

Bus does Galway to Limerick in 90 mins. The car will be about an hour when the motorways are done.

Galway - Cork is 3h15m by bus. The train is 4h12m assuming absolutely no connection delays. And you may very well be standing from Limerick Junction to Cork.

westtip

Chris they did say there was a train arriving Galway at 0800 to me - did you see that one? and the one getting to ennis at 0731 goes on to Limerick

Jim Martin

westtip wrote: »

Any news on a timetable for the WRC Ennis-Athenry Galway section yet? Just wondered. Heard from a personal IE source today it is unlikely to be up and running pre Christmas - Any other news from anyone else.

When I tried an enquiry on the Irish Rail journey planner for a journey from Ennis to Athenry on 02/01/10, it routed me via Limerick & Portarlington - no mention of the direct route!

westtip

None of the timings I gave are official or on the website - in fact they still don't know when the service will be up and running - see my comments yesterday about product launches and marketing - it really is a shambles - I had called them yesterday and to give them credit they did ring me back today and gave me the timetable I posted above as "provisional, not official and not to be quoted" tee hee - golden rule of PR never give out information to a member of the public unless it is quotable. The source of the information BTW was a very nice lady called xxxxx well I am not going to get her into trouble by giving her name out -

What has struck me though to commute from say Ennis to Galway is about 40 miles - with the new Gort bypass what will the travel time by road 50 minutes? and the convenience of your own schedule, and what about buses on this route? haven't looked at times on these - what are they? How many a day must be more than 5 each way I guess. The train time looks like an hour and 21 minutes for this journey plus the journey time at either end to get to the station and from station to final destination and then only five trains a day each way - you would want your head examining to even think about. Sorry folks who have supported this project, your tenacity and resilience not to ever give up is to be admired... but I think we are already looking at the greatest white elephant in public transport infrastructure and planning of the past 25 years.....Just why did you all fight so hard for this????

Nostradamus

westtip wrote: »

JD I guess it means that the idea of rail freight from Sligo docks as an idea is officially dead never to be resurected; where the sidings used at all for freight off-loading/up-loading? (in the last few years I mean), If not then why the issue? Although I have to say for off loading and moving dirty bulk cargoes such as coal boat to train would seem the better transport option, but I guess its a matter of economies of scale, just how busy is Sligo port these days? What kind of cargoe actually moves through the port on a regular basis?. I never really go down that area. I guess its all relevant to the WRC argument somewhere along the line.

Sligo Docks has not had a freight train serve the deep water quay in many many years. The track ws still there until recently. I visited the freight yard in the Docks back early 90's and it was teeming with freight. Very busy. None of this originated from ships.

On a more realistic note, the railfreight to Sligo Quay actually filled the streets with heavy lorries. Which defeats the arguments always put in favour of railfreight takes lorries off the roads. Still, with the new inner relief road so close to Sligo Docks rail yard this would not be a problem anymore.

Problem is like everywhere else there is no industrial development along the tracks or near the yards. Its all miles away.

Nostradamus

KC61 wrote: »

Sligo Quay certainly has been used to store rolling stock overnight.

Which is why the early trains out of Sligo are like fridges and take hours to heat up.

dowlingm

I'm interested in seeing timings on the service connection that has a chance of actually seeing some passengers - Ennis-Dublin via Athenry

highlydebased

No sign of sixmilebridge in there yet- That said they have yet to build the car park...

BluntGuy

An atrocious timetable for an atrocious project.

That's all that can be said.

Nostradamus

Neworder79 wrote: »

New Irish Rail timetables up including:

Galway > Limerick
06:40 08:39
09:45 11:48
12:10 14:08
14:30 16:28
17:25 19:24

Limerick > Galway
09:00 10:59
12:40 14:39
16:10 18:09
18:30 20:25

Classic 1970's CIE rail timetable.

Judgement Day

Oh, it could have been worse. In 1960 the 09.00 ex Galway took two hours 40 minutes to reach Limerick but that did include 13 stops! How come all the other stations such as the wonderfully named Ardsollus & Quin aren't scheduled to reopen? Also there has been no reopening of Longpavement for all the local skangers - talk about discrimination!

Back then there was a second weekday passenger service in each direction over the so-called WRC and in the Up direction this departed Sligo at 08.50am and arrived in Limerick at 2.35pm - five and three quarter hours later. This left you with a full 40 minutes in Limerick to do your business before heading home!

Nostradamus

The Sligo Champion is gas this week. They have an article by some businessman claiming that Metro North should be scrapped and the WRC built instead as MN is an "white elephant" - of course he thinks it only goes from the Airport to City Centre and never mentions Swords.

Then on the letters page is classic concerned trainspotter on the Mainland trying to pretend he isn't demanding Irish taxpayers fund his holidays in Ireland.

That paper is a scream.

Judgement Day

Nostradamus - any chance you would organise a farewell special down the Sligo Quay branch? Steam heated Cravens please and no IRRS members please despite it being the last rites for the branch.

DWCommuter

Article in Sligo Champion below. Its by no means pro WRC.

http://www.sligochampion.ie/temp/theres-no-bigger-white-elephant-railway-project-than-metro-north-dublin-1934113.html

Sponge Bob

Quite eminently sensible till it mentions a lurid €4bn for Metro North .....it would be €4bn for the complete Dart Interconnector and MN should come in at under €2bn .

westtip

DWCommuter wrote: »

Article in Sligo Champion below. Its by no means pro WRC.

http://www.sligochampion.ie/temp/theres-no-bigger-white-elephant-railway-project-than-metro-north-dublin-1934113.html

derek I don't think you and Nosty can be talking about the same article or are you Nosty? - Derek the article you have provided the link for looks like the weekly column of Felim O'rourke - Ive not looked at the printed copy of the Champion yet this week and the article you provide the link to doesn't show Felims name on it - he writes a pretty good sensible article most weeks and is not a wesht is best man. He has argued very coherently before about the cycle route/greenway for northern WRC. He works a great deal in tourism economics and he realises the potential cash benefits to the area a greenway for the WRC in terms of tourism infrastucture - I think I posted up an article of his on this very subject sometime ago - will hunt it out - worth reading again in connection with this latest article


Is there a link to the article/letters Nosty mentions? Nosty the article Derek has the link for certainly doesn't advocate the WRC and I know for a fact that Felim O'Rourke of the Champion is totally against it - even the next Athenry - Tuam - Claremorris section he thinks would be a complete waste of time and money.

Derek, the article you have linked to actually argues a bloody good case for an extended light rail as opposed to metro north to the airport Nosty did you read this article - don't you think a real case is being made in the current economic climate for what he is saying? He is not saying no rail link to the Airport just a cheaper alternative that may be equally effective - we have to be realistic in this day and age - anyway Derek what do you think of the five trains a day up and down the branch line? .I reckon they will be lucky to get a 75 passengers a day..what do you reckon?

dowlingm

Nostradamus wrote: »

some businessman claiming that Metro North should be scrapped and the WRC built instead as MN is an "white elephant" - of course he thinks it only goes from the Airport to City Centre and never mentions Swords.

Michael O'Leary at it again then? :rolleyes:

Nostradamus

westtip wrote: »

Is there a link to the article/letters Nosty mentions? Nosty the article Derek has the link for certainly doesn't advocate the WRC and I know for a fact that Felim O'Rourke of the Champion is totally against it - even the next Athenry - Tuam - Claremorris section he thinks would be a complete waste of time and money.

That's the article - I forgot mention he wanted the cycle route on WRC instead of MN. It was this carry on I was eluding to:

"Dublin based Economists, such as McCarthy, are very quick to point out the absurdity of building the Western Rail Corridor, and they are correct in that, but they stay silent while the Metro North Project moves ahead."

Why should this even be an issue. Can't they make the argument for a cycle/pathway without constantly resoting WestonTrack style tactics.

The letter from the trainspotter-mole in UK is not on the on-line edition.

Nostradamus

westtip wrote: »

Derek, the article you have linked to actually argues a bloody good case for an extended light rail as opposed to metro north to the airport

Not at all. It would be a huge mistake to not go ahead and build Metro North. It would be the cancelling of the 1973 Dublin Rail Plan all over again.

Metro North must be built TO SWORDS and on to the Northen Line. The whole airport city-centre soundbite is disinfo and purposeful ignorance in order to kill it off. A luas to the Airport should be consider as a future project not as replacement to MN.

MetroNorth has to go ahead. A cycleway through Swinford is not comparing like with like. The article is the Champion has merit but then ends up making an absurd comparision based on the same old "Nobody Shounted Stop" bull**** which has held the entire country back from project being undertaken in the National Interest rather than Parish Pumpism.

MetroNorth even if it only went from the Airport to the City Centre would still carry more passengers a year than the entire Irish rail Inter-City network. Has to be built (along with the DART Underground). To cancel it while having a priest in Mayo cut the ribbon on a cycleway through his parish would just be reapeating the same old horrors which has us in the mess we are today.

Also, what percentage private sector money will be injected into this cycleway compared to MN...?

Comparing a cycleway through Kiltimagh with MN is incredible Paddywackery regardless of the validity of the cycleway. We can and should have both.

westtip

Nosty I think you are probably right - the headline on Felims article didn't help - overall Felim comes out with some fairly sensible stuff in his weekly piece and doesn't pander to the wesht is best brigade. I can't comment on what he has said about MN really - it seemed to read as reasonable sense but maybe he has got his sums and figures wrong, I will give him a call and have a chat with him about it - my guess is he did not write the headline. One thing is for sure he is no supporter of WOT believe me he is aware of the holy zealots and how they work, he was guarding his words about them in the article, believe me he is no fan of any part of the WRC! Thinking about it I think he has lost his way in this article about MN.

The letter you mentioned however is quite remarkable - massively factually incorrect and complete and utter twaddle. The prominence this letter was given and amount of words and space is beyond belief, I can feel a reply may well be coming their way......:D