New UTV Broadband prices

Moriarty

It doesn't drop directly from 512kbit down to 256kbit, it scales to as much as the line will handle. Your connection will be somewhere between 256kbit and 512kbit, but wont necessarly be just one or the other. I'm unsure of the exact available stepping.

Cork

Is this broadband package available thru out the country?

Are there modem, installation costs etc?

must u take the UTV phone package with broadband?

rymus

Originally posted by Malcolm
There is a downgrade charge for switching from the 24 to 1 service to the 48 to 1 service of €30.

Is there a similar upgrade charge to go from the 48:1 to the 24:1?

sceptre

Originally posted by Cork
Is this broadband package available thru out the country?

Are there modem, installation costs etc?

must u take the UTV phone package with broadband?

All answered on the first page of the website linked to on page one of this thread.
www.utvclicksilver.com

The answers are "yes, if you can get broadband (checker available on the site)", "not for modem, yes for installation (€99, see the site)", "yes (see the site)"

This thread will be a lot more choherent than the FRIACO one (and we'll be more likely to get answers to the unusual questions from UTV) if people read the FAQ on the site first.

I'm interested in the answer to rymus's question myself as I've almost decided to just get this in.

Malcolm

Originally posted by sceptre
All answered on the first page of the website linked to on page one of this thread.
www.utvclicksilver.com

The answers are "yes, if you can get broadband (checker available on the site)", "not for modem, yes for installation (€99, see the site)", "yes (see the site)"

This thread will be a lot more choherent than the FRIACO one (and we'll be more likely to get answers to the unusual questions from UTV) if people read the FAQ on the site first.

I'm interested in the answer to rymus's question myself as I've almost decided to just get this in.

There is no charge to upgrade to the 24:1 package.

Malcolm Thompson
UTV Internet

Valentia

If, for whatever reason customers do not wish to change their service and enter into a new tariff then they can remain on their existing contract at the €47.50 tariff per month.

I think this is very unfair Malcolm. The €30 product is surely the same product made cheaper by the change in the wholesale drop. I have been a UTV customer from the start and have (had) no intention of moving but I feel very uncomfortable about this. I plan on going for the upgraded package so it wouldn't effect me anyway. Please rethink running the new deal concurrently with the old contract. It seems grossly unfair otherwise.

Kramer

Originally posted by Valentia
Please rethink running the new deal concurrently with the old contract. It seems grossly unfair otherwise.

Indeed it does

Basically being penalised for your past custom/loyalty. Curious also as to why this was delayed by a week, conveniently permitting UTV to charge the full existing rate until April 1st. I assume the wholesale rates are reduced from now & errorcon implimented their new charges from March 1st. The sceptic in me thinks the delay was deliberate. €17.50 x #X customers for March should add up to a tidy sum.

I've also been with UTV from the beginning, got Clicksilver the day the exchange was enabled last November & now am being asked to commit until April 2005.

More than happy to have DSL but very disappointed at the regular downtime, ongoing router issues (proxy anyone) & of late, poor customer service.

Looks like I'll be paying €17.50 over the odds for DSL till my contract expires - probably moving before the end of the year & can't commit till April 2005.

A disappointed Clicksilver user

dub45

Maybe this thread should be moved to RIP OFF IRELAND? :rolleyes:

Can you imagine the outcry on boards if Eircom tried a stunt like this?

P.S Valentia we have actually agreed on something at last:D

dahamsta

Gotta say I'm between a rock and a hard place meself with this. I'll be moving in the next few months and I'm already worried about having to argue with UTV about how much it'll cost to move my DSL connection. Pushing the contract out to a full 12 months at this stage is something I'd really like to avoid, yet it seems that the only other option available to me is to continue paying the higher price.

(I'd probably end up on the higher priced package anyway, but I would've preferred to avoid that until I moved. And isn't there a price differential anyway?)

All that being said, I still gotta say fair dues for the aggressive pricing. I hope you'll respond to feedback as you have in the past.

adam

jonski

Originally posted by Valentia
Please rethink running the new deal concurrently with the old contract. It seems grossly unfair otherwise.

I also agree on this point . UTV seem unable to sort out their ping problems and therefore gamers will not be willing to sign up for another 12 months . Show some goodwill , drop us to the lower priced product and use the time left on the contracts to sort out the ping/proxy issues .

I have 3 choices
1/ sign for another 12 months
2/ pay over the odds
3/ find a way out of my contract

I don't fancy any

John.

Malcolm

Originally posted by Valentia
I think this is very unfair Malcolm. The €30 product is surely the same product made cheaper by the change in the wholesale drop. I have been a UTV customer from the start and have (had) no intention of moving but I feel very uncomfortable about this. I plan on going for the upgraded package so it wouldn't effect me anyway. Please rethink running the new deal concurrently with the old contract. It seems grossly unfair otherwise.

From a UTV Internet perspective we are giving all existing customers as much choice as possible to accommodate their specific needs. We simply cannot reduce the price to €29.99 without customers entering into a new 12 month contract due to the extremely high costs in the initial activation that UTV Internet have had to bear.

The first customers activated had a €99 set-up fee and for that fee we had to supply a modem and pay an eircom installation fee of €181.50; or for customers from October to date we had to pay an eircom installation fee of up to €25 plus a modem and these customers got free installation, free modem and one months rental free.

Each broadband offer is based on a minimum 12 months contract and it is therefore unreasonable that a customer could get free installation, a free modem and one months rental free and then see the price reduced to a lower rate without committing to a new 12 month contract.

We always been upfront about the costs involved in bringing these products to market and the need for UTV Internet to make a profit to ensure that the products are sustainable.

We have worked very hard to bring competitive pricing and sustainable products to the market and this can be seen by the variety of products and pricing now available to consumers. We are not forcing new contracts on people but giving them choice.

In respect of people moving house, we have always dealt with these on a case by case basis. If customers move to another enabled area and wish to renew their service with UTV Internet we have strived to work out an agreement to accommodate them.


Malcolm Thompson
UTV Internet

dub45

The first customers activated had a €99 set-up fee and for that fee we had to supply a modem and pay an eircom installation fee of €181.50; or for customers from October to date we had to pay an eircom installation fee of up to €25 plus a modem and these customers got free installation, free modem and one months rental free.

UTV did not 'have' to supply a modem or charge a below cost set up fee that is the way they chose to compete in the market. UTV chose to compete on certain grounds they are not a charity and are in it to make a profit just like Eircom and they must have considered that competing in that way would be profitable.

They are also now choosing not to pass on their wholesale savings for the first month of the new wholesale prices.

The first customers activated are the ones without whom there would not be a clicksilver service and dont forget that many of them were messed about big time by UTV.

It is ofen forgotten now but look back on the support newsgroup and see how much of a mess there was in the initial set up of Clicksilver on UTV's part.

The only choice being given to existing customers who may be having second thoughts about sticking with UTV, as a result of UTV's poor service particularly recently, is to go with a new contract for 12 months or pay over the odds for the remainder of your contract.

Who's to say that with rapid developements now happening with broadband that in six months time there wont be another development which will necessitate being tied into a futher 12 month contract?

Now again if Eircom were to pull that sort of stunt can you imagine the outcry on boards?

Note there is no mention anywhere so far of UTV putting in extra resources to deal with the new business which will inevitably follow on from the sub 30 euro pricing and UTV admitted last year that they were underresourced to deal with what they had taken on.

silent

well said dub45

I'd like to add that I'm certainly not happy about the necessity of tying to another 12 months. Basically we current UTV subscribers get the same deal as new customers even though they have to spend a lot less on us - we need no new modem and splitters, no new installation and a reduced (if one at all) fee that utv pays to eircom compared to a new user. Yet we are expected to pay the same and be tied to the same 12 month contract. I say no. Either allow us to continue our current 12 months and try to keep us by providing a good service or you see a large number of current users very angry.

Given the amount of problems with clicksilver in the last months and some severe issues, not to forget the ongoing pings issue and lack of support and care from utv themselves I'd say that many people are not going to take such a service much longer. Hell, I'd be gone in a heartbeat if only the other operators had capable billing (esat) or slightly better product (eircom).

UTV is still the best ISP in ireland IMHO however the margin to your competion is getting slimmer and given the track record of problems in the past months does not inspire a lot of confidence to stay with you for the present users.

Urban Weigl

They are also now choosing not to pass on their wholesale savings for the first month of the new wholesale prices.

First off 29.99 is by far the lowest price of any ADSL provider in Ireland. Secondly, Eircom are actually CHARGING them (or any ISP for that matter) to change to the cheaper wholesale price. I think that is the reason why they are charging people (a very low fee) to change to the new package.

If Eircom on the other hand had changed the wholesale price instead of changing the contention and introducing a totally new broadband wholesale price (which ISP's would need to switch users to individually and also bill those ISP's for doing that), I am sure they would have done what you are suggesting.

So really, you should be calling Eircom to complain, rather than UTV, from my understanding of things.

Valentia

While I fully congratulate UTV on their initiative to introduce a sub €30 product I still don't understand why a new contract is necessary. Aren't UTV able to adopt this price because of the drop in wholesale prices? Am I missing something? OK their margins may have tightened a bit on the old product but that surely is their choice in a competitive market.

I don't understand your logic Martin. It seems to me that by insisting on keeping people that don't want to start a new 12 months contract on the old price that the extra money is cream for UTV and increases their margin on these accounts enormously. Surely you hadn't budgeted for that. I fail to see how allowing people migrate under their old contract will seriously effect your returns if those returns are based on the wholeprice at a given time. Is it just me or what?

Is the new €30 product the same as the old product with the margins squeezed a bit?

Ripwave

Originally posted by Valentia
I don't understand your logic Martin. It seems to me that by insisting on keeping people that don't want to start a new 12 months contract on the old price that the extra money is cream for UTV and increases their margin on these accounts enormously. Surely you hadn't budgeted for that.

The "payback" for the upfront investment UTV have to make for each new customer isn't paid off over 12 months. So any customer who indicates that they don't intend to stay beyond the initial 12 months would normally cost UTV money. In this case, UTV have an opportunity to recoup some of their losses by retaining the wholesale savings.

Some people aren't happy unless they have something to complain about.

jonski

Originally posted by Ripwave
Some people aren't happy unless they have something to complain about.

This may or may not be true depending on the circumstances . I don't fancy signing up for a further 12 months if i can't ping servers properly to play my games ( which is why I got b/b in the first place).
Nor do I fancy paying over the odds for the next 4 months just because I was loyal and stayed with UTV last year .

John.

dahamsta

Originally posted by Ripwave
Some people aren't happy unless they have something to complain about.

I don't think that's fair Ripwave. One particular comment (by silent) is very valid imho: Existing contract holders are already paying for / have paid for most of their modems and (assuming that UTV isn't being billed to transfer customer to these new accounts) setup fees via their monthly fees. If UTV is paying less per month for these customers, the price on the existing product should come down a little; and the term contracts on switched products should be shorter. Comparing an existing customer and a new customer is like comparing apples and oranges.

Martin, good to hear that house moves are taken on a case by case basis, thanks for clarifying that. Can you confirm or deny that UTV has to pay a transfer fee for existing customers (to the new products)?

adam

Valentia

In this case, UTV have an opportunity to recoup some of their losses by retaining the wholesale savings.

Opportunistic is a word that comes to mind.

Some people aren't happy unless they have something to complain about.

I think this may be true in some cases but to associate it with my comment is unfair. I don't usually use a public forum to sort out problems. I do that through support but has Martin himself has taken this thread a a means of communicating with his customers I think it is appropriate to comment here. As I have said I believe the €30 product is the same as the present one so the contract should be concurrent.

the corpo

i'm a little uncomfortable about the contract situation also.
i'm more than happy to pay the fee to drop down to the 29.99 option but i don't think tying me to a new contract with utv is fair.
being one of those customers who paid the 99 connection fee shortly before it was waived this now seem a penalty too far

LoBo

As far as I can work out if you are a current clicksilver customer you don't have to pay €30 to switch to the 'new' clicksilver service (€29.99/mth). The downgrade fee sounds like it is only for folks who choose Clicksilver Plus now, and later want to swap to the 29.99 option.

Some good points about existing customers swapping not needing a new modem etc. Would love to hear whether UTV have to pay Eircom a fee just to swap us current Clicksilver users to the new 29.99 service or not too.

I think the Apr 1 starting date is actually pretty handy as it gives us all of March to decide which service to switch to (or not, if you don't like the 12 mth contract).

silent

I just noticed one thing - if you as a utv user go to your account and choose new services - you see the new offerings and can pick them. However what I'm confused about is this bit

if you decide to upgrade youre Clicksilver subscription to a new clicksilver service you will be bound to a further 12 month minimum term contract.

doesn't the word further imply in this case a meaning of in addition to your existing contract? or am I understanding it the wrong way?
however in the next lines under the offerings it does say that you will start a new 12 month contract.
I'd be glad if UTV could clarify this as well - ideally in an open forum like this

Ripwave

Originally posted by jonski
This may or may not be true depending on the circumstances . I don't fancy signing up for a further 12 months if i can't ping servers properly to play my games ( which is why I got b/b in the first place).
Nor do I fancy paying over the odds for the next 4 months just because I was loyal and stayed with UTV last year .

Which is it, John, were you "loyal" (to the cheapest DSL offer in town), or were you tied down by a 12 month contract?

You want to have your cake and eat it too. If you're planning to leave, then why should UTV cut you a break? If you're planning to stay, then why are you complaining about 12 month commitment?

UTV loses money on customers who quit after 12 months, because they amortize their upfront costs over 3 or more years. The vast majority of their customers will be more than happy with these price cuts - why should they have to subsidise those of you who want to cut and run?

Ripwave

Originally posted by dahamsta
I don't think that's fair Ripwave. One particular comment (by silent) is very valid imho: Existing contract holders are already paying for / have paid for most of their modems

Not by a long shot. The costs are amortized over more than 12 months.

jonski

Originally posted by Ripwave
Which is it, John, were you "loyal" (to the cheapest DSL offer in town), or were you tied down by a 12 month contract?

You want to have your cake and eat it too. If you're planning to leave, then why should UTV cut you a break? If you're planning to stay, then why are you complaining about 12 month commitment?

UTV loses money on customers who quit after 12 months, because they amortize their upfront costs over 3 or more years. The vast majority of their customers will be more than happy with these price cuts - why should they have to subsidise those of you who want to cut and run?

1/Loyal to UTV , I was a UTVIP customer , and waited for them to offer DSL
2/Don't really want to leave , but if you read my post completely you will have noticed that I have b/b for games ...UTV have developed a really bad ping and pkt loss problem that they seem unable to fix
3/not "want to cut and run " but want a service they thought they were paying for.

Ripwave old buddy , you seem to be missing the point .If I didn't have a ping problem I would never even consider leaving UTV . I know most of the ppl there by first name and they know me , I like these ppl ,and I like this company. I would much prefer to get the problem sorted , hence I will be at home tonight when Martin calls to try to run tests and help in anyway i can .

lets not open a hornets nest here and try and stick to facts and not assumptions.

John

Ripwave

Originally posted by jonski
lets not open a hornets nest here and try and stick to facts and not assumptions.

I'm not making any assumptions - you're complaining about a new 12 month contract because you don't plan to be with UTV for another 12 months. Why should UTV give you a break if you're leaving, before they've recouped the costs they incurred to get you onto the service in the first place?

jonski

Originally posted by Ripwave
I'm not making any assumptions - you're complaining about a new 12 month contract because you don't plan to be with UTV for another 12 months. Why should UTV give you a break if you're leaving, before they've recouped the costs they incurred to get you onto the service in the first place?

I'm complaining about a new 12 month contract because the don't seem to be able to provide the service I'm paying for in the first place .I paid full price to join up and if I remember correctly the trade price for the modem at the time was about 30 euro , I went for the self install option , so how much money exactly did they loose out on me .

And if they did loose money should they not have considered this and kept their service level up ?

John.

Ripwave

Originally posted by jonski
I'm complaining about a new 12 month contract because the don't seem to be able to provide the service I'm paying for in the first place.

Read your Contract, John. If UTV aren't providing what the contract says they should provide, then you won't be in breach of contract if you cancel. If they are providing what they're contracted to provide, then you're getting what you paid for.

jonski

Originally posted by Ripwave
Read your Contract, John. If UTV aren't providing what the contract says they should provide, then you won't be in breach of contract if you cancel. If they are providing what they're contracted to provide, then you're getting what you paid for.

A valid point Ripwave , It probably doesn't guarantee anything about ping's or pkt loss . And as such I am probably getting what I am paying for .

dahamsta

Originally posted by Ripwave
Not by a long shot. The costs are amortized over more than 12 months.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd like to see your facts and figures for this.

adam