Serious speeds problems Utv

Stephen

380kbps from UTV speedtest. Not terribly bad considering the time of day I suppose.

andrew163

Originally posted by DMT
ZyXEL advanced properites

how do u get into that?

Kramer

Hehe, 5Mbit :eek:



:ninja:

Stephen

clear your cache

PiE

Originally posted by andrew163
how do u get into that?

Double click the systray icon, hold ctrl+shift and click the blue Zyxel logo.

Couch Potato

pings gone from 60ms to 180ms to www.boards.ie..

Why does this happen- is it due to contention ?

dub45

Originally posted by Couch Potato
pings gone from 60ms to 180ms to www.boards.ie..

Why does this happen- is it due to contention ?

No there is a major fault with some Esat equipment they have been telling some of their cusomters about it and its reported here

Xcellor

Originally posted by Couch Potato
pings gone from 60ms to 180ms to www.boards.ie..

Why does this happen- is it due to contention ?

No. No and No. Nothing to do with contention all to do with bad network engineers.

If anyone else asks is it contention I will scream. Coz like you don't just go from having perfect speeds on a 48:1 contention ratio to crap speeds and poor pings on a 24:1 ratio... It makes no sense.

So let me repeat myself. No nothing to do with contention all to do with bad network engineers.

X

Couch Potato

Originally posted by Couch Potato
pings gone from 60ms to 180ms to www.boards.ie..

Why does this happen- is it due to contention ?

sorry meant to say I am on utv 24:1 ...

Couch Potato

What drives the pings up then ?

PiE

Nevada/Energis' incompetence.

andrew163

UTV's stupidity for using a network provider that doesn't work half the time

mickger

They just don't have a clue at UTV. It was a sad day when they entered Ireland as an internet provider. There just a joke at this stage

PiE

Actually, it was a life-saver the day UTV entered the Irish market.

If you think Esat/Eircom would have lowered prices so dramatically if UTV weren't here, you don't know them very well.

Just because the service is shit now, doesn't mean you should disregard the good they've done.

dub45

Originally posted by PiE
Actually, it was a life-saver the day UTV entered the Irish market.

If you think Esat/Eircom would have lowered prices so dramatically if UTV weren't here, you don't know them very well.

Just because the service is shit now, doesn't mean you should disregard the good they've done.

I dont really know if UTV are a factor in the pricing. UTV announced their current range of prices after the others had announced theirs. And requiring their current customers to commit to a new 12 month contract to avail of the new low prices was something only UTV stooped to! I am paying more to UTV now for clicksilver 48:1
than Eircoms equivalent product becuase I am reluctant to commit for another 12 months to a service that at the moment no one in their right mind would commit to.

And Eircom don't seem to be afraid of UTV's prices judging by the wide margins between. The only way UTV can make an ongoing real contribution to the bb market and thereby really affect the others is provide a solid dependable product with good customer service at a good price - in other words what they did on dial up. In my experience they have failed lamentably to do that with Clicksilver.

kin9pin

Just checking through the utv t&c's. One thing they point to is their code of practice, which is "Under Review" when you click the link......figures.
But I did notice this:
"19.1 This Agreement shall be governed by and construed in accordance with Northern Ireland Law and, subject to Clause 19.9 herein, the parties hereby agree to submit to the exclusive jurisdiction of the High Court of Northern Ireland in respect of any dispute or matter arising out of or in connection with the Agreement."

"Northern Ireland Law" Is that applicable here? Is this a get out clause? Unfortunately they seem to have every other excuse covered, basically saying that they cannot be held responsible for lack of service and that they will not guarantee that faults can be fixed!

Wish I'd read them before signing up :dunno:

dub45

Its not just UTV they are all the same - effectively when you buy broadband you are buying a pig in a poke its as simple as that! I attempted to raise this issue in the early days of bb but nobody was interested.

dglancy

I use Eircom as my BB provider and I never have had any of the problems that Esat/UTV customers report.

Seeing as everybody is using the same local-loop phone lines and DSLAM switches in the exchange it would seem that the issue is either Esat/UTV network's backhaul connection to Eircom exchanges or something funny happening with Eircom's implementation of the L2TP protocol which routes your traffic to the correct ISP.

As I am with eircom.net - I'm not sure if my traffic is routed via L2TP (i.e. is eircom.net treated as an independent ISP the same way as Esat/UTV is, or is it treated a little bit special). Does anybody out there know?

It would be interesting to see if I switched BB provider to say UTV on the same phoneline/exchange - would I begin experiencing these problems?

mickger

Martin from UTV has been posting in the newsgroup over the last 3 or 4 hours and it makes interesting reading. Check it out

Stephen

For those who haven't got access to the UTV groups:

Am just off the phone. I've been told that the problems affecting ourselvesand IOL BB
users are due to a capacity issue surrounding the DSL interconnect. Phrases like "bad capacity planning" etc. were used. At this stage Bill Murphy is currently involved and trying to speed Eircom in upgrading the capacity of the connection. I'm expecting a call back soon to let me know when this is going to occur.

It goes without saying that we're sorry for the problems affecting our DSL service. And I agree with you that it is our problem and we are doing all we can to get it sorted. I think somebody asked earlier on if this was affecting our UK DSL service - absolutely not, this has been running fine for the last 2-3 years.

Martin.

> While of course we appreciate your reply it raises just as many questions as
> it answers if not more;
>
> This is the third night in a row that this has happened how can that be with
> so many people affected.?

A question we're asking them Sean. The new hardware, the tuning of the hardware
and the replacement of the core processing engine have helped fix the issue regarding logons, but has not addressed speed and pings issue. We have no visibility of the interconnect back to Eircom (although I'm going to insist on this now - this is not something
that is normally done though), so it really is up to Esat to be monitoring these graphs.

> Whats causing the problem to happen almost exactly at the same time every
> night with the same effects bad speeds bad pings - what changes to bring it
> in to play? (wrong choice of words for the gamers apologies!)

Peak period for us is the evening between 8-11pm. All this traffic is causing the slowdowns which will affect downloads and games. It strikes me that both Eircom and EsatBT have not really handled the DSL rollout very well. No surprise with Eircom, but from EsatBT
whose parent company have a lot of experience in this area......

> What was the repari stuff that happened today - was that a seperate issue to
> this?

Yes. Basically just pouring more horsepower into the router to enable it to cope with loads. Obviously its not much use having all that capacity on the router if
your interconnect with Eircom isn't big enough to hand over the traffic (although its not just the pure IP
routing that requires the horsepower, its the tunneling).

> Why are UTV only finding out now the cause of a problem that as I said above
> is now in its third night?

We are not privy to all the stats on our providers network. The information we were supplying
and received tended to point to the router. All our connections are showing pleanty of free capacity
and we were nowhere near hitting our limits on outgoing bandwidth or our connection through
to Esat.

> Does anyone out there really have a clue whats going on? According to
> boards IOL/Esat are telling some of their customers that they have no
> confidence in their technical people and are thinking of outsourcing!

Can't really comment on this one. The tech guys I have been dealing with throughout this have
all been quite savvy, but obviously there are serious issues if you basically allow yourself to run out of bandwidth. I'm not saying DSL is easy (from the incumbent's point of view, its difficult enough), but all we do is authenticate users, give them an IP and terminate them on our network - not rocket science, the router config is very short. We certainly shouldn't be having the problems we're seeing now. In the UK, BT just handed us a preconfigured router and told us to power it up and connect it to the network. We don't even have admin access to it!

If the PVC is upgraded, this should be the last of our issues. The replacement of the Nortel shasta box now means that we have confidence in the hardware Esat are terminating us on.

Not too sure, but I do know that things really only reached the "next level" in the last few hours with Bill being brought onboard etc. The PVC upgrade is a software change that may take 2 weeks worth of forms, but in reality 10 minutes to perform.

Martin.

No, the latest is that it will be done tonight or early tomorrow morning. As soon as I get more info I'll post it here. As IOL is being so badly affected, this isn't
really something that either of us can afford to let run on any further.

Martin.

radiospan

Thanks for that, Stephen.

Very insightful.

Hopefully we can see an improvement soon.

Gonzo

does all the above mean that the current eircom backhaul of 2mb or wotever it is in each exchange is nowhere near adequate to power at least 4 different providers on each exchange throughout the country of Southern Ireland? And that its on Eircoms heads to now fix this problem by upgrading the bandwidth in all the exchanges to a similar level to UK exchanges of say 10mb per exchange so that all providers have ample bandwidth to support their networks? If what im thinking is thru then and eircom do have no other option but to massively increase the bandwidth for each dsl exchange then possibley this would make all networks and future dsl providers have proper good dsl services and that all networks can support a much higher cap of around 1gig a day similar to UK thus giving eircom, IOL, UTV, Netsource, Digiweb all very similar stable services that all customers can rely on?

dub45

Originally posted by Gonzo
does all the above mean that the current eircom backhaul of 2mb or wotever it is in each exchange is nowhere near adequate to power at least 4 different providers on each exchange throughout the country of Southern Ireland? And that its on Eircoms heads to now fix this problem by upgrading the bandwidth in all the exchanges to a similar level to UK exchanges of say 10mb per exchange so that all providers have ample bandwidth to support their networks? If what im thinking is thru then and eircom do have no other option but to massively increase the bandwidth for each dsl exchange then possibley this would make all networks and future dsl providers have proper good dsl services and that all networks can support a much higher cap of around 1gig a day similar to UK thus giving eircom, IOL, UTV, Netsource, Digiweb all very similar stable services that all customers can rely on?

I am not a technical person but I dont get the impression this problem is at exchange level I think its where IOL/Esat crosses over to Eircom. As an ecomomist would put it - its a macro issue rather than a micro one. I may be totally wrongI am sure some of the teccies can fill us in

Richard Dower

2MB is supposed to support 192 users at 48:1...we were all on that and never had a problem. We're now on 24:1 and it's gone to s_hite.

I think it is something within the network, backhaul or something between the Esat hardware and Eircom hardware. Something is not pushing data up and down as it should be.

I also don't belive it's dependent on the amount of users online at a certain time, that suggest contention...that's a smokescreen for something else.
Clearly hardware and software upgrades need to be done, Eircom need an ass kicking to resolve the issue with other ISP and stop tryna sabotage the competition with anti competitive practices!



:mad:

dub45

Originally posted by Richard Dower
2MB is supposed to support 192 users at 48:1...we were all on that and never had a problem. We're now on 24:1 and it's gone to s_hite.

I think it is something within the network, backhaul or something between the Esat hardware and Eircom hardware. Something is not pushing data up and down as it should be.

I also don't belive it's dependent on the amount of users online at a certain time, that suggest contention...that's a smokescreen for something else.
Clearly hardware and software upgrades need to be done, Eircom need an ass kicking to resolve the issue with other ISP and stop tryna sabotage the competition with anti competitive practices!



:mad:

I agree with you in that its hard to imagine that theres a signficantly bigger amount of users on line this week than there was last week.

I keep labouring this point where is the evidence for the allegation you make agains Eircom? Wild and baseless allegations do not help the situation and only take the pressure off the other ISP's. If you can produce evidence of what you allege let us have it and let us forward it to the regulator in the meantime it only muddies the waters. And again I emphasise I have not got the teenciest bit of liking for Eircom.

Most of the blame in this case appears to be on Esat if we are to go by UTV's statements on the issue.

kin9pin

Originally posted by dub45
Most of the blame in this case appears to be on Esat if we are to go by UTV's statements on the issue.

True, but our contract is not with Esat. UTV are selling it so they have an obligation to sell a working product. Any complaints should go to UTV.

dub45

Originally posted by kin9pin
True, but our contract is not with Esat. UTV are selling it so they have an obligation to sell a working product. Any complaints should go to UTV.

If only you knew how often I have said that very thing in the past in the UTV support group!:rolleyes: I was only making the point that in this case that the actual physical cause (if what I can decipher of the various posts) lies on the Esat side.

mickger

Martin from the UTV newsgroup just posted in there and said. its looking like the problems won't be fixed till Monday, basically because Eircon won't get off the arses and do it at the weekend. Thats typical of the Evil Eircon Empire shower.

dub45

Originally posted by mickger
Martin from the UTV newsgroup just posted in there and said. its looking like the problems won't be fixed till Monday, basically because Eircon won't get off the arses and do it at the weekend. Thats typical of the Evil Eircon Empire shower.

Once again its taking the easy option blaming Eircom. If this post here is to be belived and why shouldnt it be Bill forgot to order the extra capacity in time for all those new customers. Now if ESAT/UTV come along on a Friday night and started demanding extra capacity to save their bacon and I was Mr Eircom I think I would be telling them what to do with themselves.

This (latest!) problem began on Wednesday night and nothing appears to have been done until Friday night who is to blame for that?

radiospan

Seems worse than ever today. Pings have never been so bad:

Pinging [url]www.boards.ie[/url] [82.195.131.128] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 82.195.131.128: bytes=32 time=205ms TTL=54
Reply from 82.195.131.128: bytes=32 time=205ms TTL=54
Reply from 82.195.131.128: bytes=32 time=217ms TTL=54
Reply from 82.195.131.128: bytes=32 time=171ms TTL=54

Ping statistics for 82.195.131.128:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 171ms, Maximum = 217ms, Average = 199ms

C:\>ping clarity.jolt.co.uk

Pinging clarity.jolt.co.uk [195.149.21.11] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 195.149.21.11: bytes=32 time=177ms TTL=56
Reply from 195.149.21.11: bytes=32 time=180ms TTL=56
Request timed out.
Reply from 195.149.21.11: bytes=32 time=188ms TTL=56

Ping statistics for 195.149.21.11:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 3, Lost = 1 (25% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 177ms, Maximum = 188ms, Average = 181ms