First Overclock: 9800Pro (not quite to XT?)

ozmo

Originally posted by Sir Random
I have a Lian-Li sensor on the back of my card and it's idling at ~43c and load ~52c, so I'd imagine it's +50~60c at the core. Temps were about 5c hotter with the stock cooler.

Most guys in this thread are in the mid 60s playing Far Cry:
http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17207819

Apparently, anything under 70c is normal.

Can anyone mention a good Temperature monitor that I can install ( I have a free 3.5 bay and one pci slot and lots of usb free on my shuttle) to monitor the temperature of the 9800Pro.

*I would like one that reports back to WinXP the temperature (via serial or usb?) a display isnt necessary.

The only ones I can find show the temp on a little display - but the pc is so low down and hidden- i'd never see the display if it was out of the ordinary.

Ryo Hazuki

I got my 9800 non pro very cheap, and I softmodded to the Pro Version.

I stuck some copper ramsinks on it, and i overclocked it to 405/736(eff.divide by 2)


I have no problems with stability, its rock solid. Best 200 euro i ever spent.

Adeptus Titanicus

Originally posted by Ryo Hazuki
I have no problems with stability, its rock solid. Best 200 euro i ever spent.

It's nice when things go well ain't it?

neokenzo

Sir Random, did you sand paper the artic cooler's base before putting it on your card?

Sir Random

Originally posted by neokenzo
Sir Random, did you sand paper the artic cooler's base before putting it on your card?

No, but I should have.
As I posted earlier, the VGA Cooler base has grooves from the machining process, and really needs lapping. I was too tired at 4am to bother, so I just rubbed in some AS3 to smooth it over:

silverside

for anyone who wants a heatsink without taking up a pci slot, i have ordered the

titan vga cooler

http://www.thecoolingshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/486

i will let you know how i get on when it arrives

Adeptus Titanicus

Originally posted by Sir Random
The Arctic cooler doesn't include ram sinks. I'm gonna Dremel some old cpu ram sinks and make my own. They should add ~10Mhz to the ram o/c

Was wondering if is was worth ordering something like these. I don't have a dremel They're a little large though, but you do get eight.

El_MUERkO

My PC with the artic cooler, got my 9800 non pro OC'd to 411 stable and it was at 417 when I bitched out so I could of gone higher and remained stable.

ozmo

http://www20.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040414/index.html

Quote: "12.000 points in 3DMark 2003. A score of over 60.000 in AquaMark 3. Over 60fps in Halo at 1600x1200 and more than 50fps in FarCry with High FSAA and 4tap anisotropic filtering at 1024x768 - these are numbers that will bring tears of joy to PC enthusiasts everywhere

You'd have to go back quite a bit in the history of graphics cards to find a performance leap of similar magnitude. "

Adeptus Titanicus

See here for that...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=153608

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=153034

:rolleyes: No need to rub it in!

Sir Random

Lol, I'll be getting a 6800u on release anyway (G/F's Xmas present). My current 9800 is actually hers. I'm just keeping it warm until Sims2 is released

Adeptus Titanicus

LOL. I thought for a sec you were buying HER the 6800u! Hmmmm... It's my Birthday on Sunday..... :cool:

Adeptus Titanicus

VGA Silencer arrived this morning, so a little lapping this evening and it'll be all systems go for an XT flash!


Terms and conditions apply.

ozmo

Originally posted by Adeptus
VGA Silencer arrived this morning, so a little lapping this evening and it'll be all systems go for an XT flash!


Terms and conditions apply.

My new replacment video arrived to day to replace one the Zalman Cooler killed.
I have an Artic Cooler ready for it now - but its got bigger ridges than the Alps.
Any tips for lapping?
How can you ensure it doesnt just get rounded and only touches the chip in the middle - doesnt it have to be microscopically smooth and flat?
(wont be overclocking - just want it quiet)

Sir Random

Use a clean flat surface for lapping (sheet of glass) and finish with the finest grade paper you can get. Most auto-dealers have up to 1200.

Adeptus Titanicus

Yep, like what Sir Random said, with pictures :

http://www.modsynergy.com/Article%206.htm

http://www.bigbruin.com/html/lapping-guide.htm

Adeptus Titanicus

Finally got the Pro flashed to an XT. Nice! Thanks Sir Random!

At stock XT speeds of 412/365 I got a 3DMark03 Score of 6672, up from 6,421
on my original overclock of 411/365! Didn't think it'd make that much of a difference for basically 1MHz. So, overclocked a little more. Got it to 430/385 using ATITool and ran for about 10 mins without errors , stopped it then and ran 3DMark and scored 6937! So close! But there were a few little sparklies on the rhino on the pixel shader... Tweaked it a little more to 432/385, but definitely more sparklies, and only got to 6947...

Close enough to 7k for me!

Sir Random, would be interested in seeing how your mem heatsinks help.

Data, thanks for talking me out of getting the XT originally!

(All values rounded to closest integer)

Woden

Originally posted by Adeptus


(All values rounded to closest integer)

lol at that,

no problem XT was never the way forward

Col_Loki

Must say very nice results there !! Good to see things workin out for ya, u might try running 3dmark again with all other programs shutdown (dont know if that will help but i know results can vary a little and 7k is a nice barrier to break ).

So data artic cooler on the way for you then? Mabye an XT flash? Mobile chip? You know you want it!!

Woden

bah the thought of putting on an arctic cooler and changing to a mobile chip instills me with fear lol

i could get XT though with the stock cooling though i don't know if i'd run it all the time, next upgrade will be another half gig of ram to improve BF: Vietnam loading times and someform of large scale back up device either a dvd burner or an external hdd we'll see.... oh and a 17inch tft but my mam is paying for that

Adeptus Titanicus

Originally posted by Dataisgod
bah the thought of putting on an arctic cooler ... instills me with fear

<VOICE style="Darth Vader" tone="Vaguely Enticing">
You don't know the power of the Dark Side...
</VOICE>

Col_Loki

oh and a 17inch tft but my mam is paying for that

Ahh now i like the sounds of that ....... always a good way to go!!

i could get XT though with the stock cooling though i don't know if i'd run it all the time

Yea i know what you mean i would be worried about it with the stock cooler too. You got a good card and you'd be perfect throwing on the artic cooler and poping up the speed, but then again your already prob playing every game at full specs so ........ lol its not that much of a problem (although benchmarks....). Mobile chip + Thermalright with 92mm enermax fan = 2.4ghz minimum and prob more.......... i gotta get €200 water cooling to get to that :rolleyes: , silly me !!

Woden

Originally posted by COL_LOKI
Ahh now i like the sounds of that ....... always a good way to go!!



Yea i know what you mean i would be worried about it with the stock cooler too. You got a good card and you'd be perfect throwing on the artic cooler and poping up the speed, but then again your already prob playing every game at full specs so ........ lol its not that much of a problem (although benchmarks....). Mobile chip + Thermalright with 92mm enermax fan = 2.4ghz minimum and prob more.......... i gotta get €200 water cooling to get to that :rolleyes: , silly me !!

for benchies i can hit about 440-50/380-90 iirc doesn't make much diff to 01 but about a 1000 in 03, next time i have a clean install i'll try that see what difference it makes.

i bet you'd get 2.6 though with a mobile on water cooling

Woden

Originally posted by Adeptus
<VOICE style="Darth Vader" tone="Vaguely Enticing">
You don't know the power of the Dark Side...
</VOICE>

i can here the calling... must resist....

Adeptus Titanicus

<VOICE style="Borg Drone" tone="Borg Drone">
Resistance is futile.
</VOICE>

Woden

Originally posted by Adeptus
<VOICE style="Borg Drone" tone="Borg Drone">
Resistance is futile.
</VOICE>

lmao at that

Sir Random

Nice one Adeptus
I'm about to have a few beers here, so I might attack the ramsinks about 2am I'm making up some fan shrouds to keep them cool too, I'll post pics when it's done.

neokenzo

I tried flashing to XT but it went terribly wrong. Graphics was all over the place. It did give me about 200-300 more on 3DMark2003. Probably get water cooling and then overclock the card more. Too bad my card R350 and HYnix memory so no way of flashing it to XT

Woden

do people see an actual increase in 3dmark from say a standard pro at 412/365 and a flashed pro at 412/365?

data

neokenzo

Apparently yes Data. When I o'c my card to 425 I got about 6400++ on 3DMark03 but when I flashed it even at 412, it was giving me 6600++.

Adeptus Titanicus

Originally posted by Dataisgod
do people see an actual increase in 3dmark from say a standard pro at 412/365 and a flashed pro at 412/365?

I was wondering about that myself as this is what seemed to happen to me. I just rechecked what my original overclock on the Pro was and it was actually slightly more than the XT stock speed, 414.0/364.5.

At stock XT speeds of 412/365 I got a 3DMark03 Score of 6,672, up from 6,421 on my original overclock of 414/365 on the Pro BIOS. So 2MHz less on the core and I got 251 more? Can anyone explain this?

I feel your will wavering!

(All 3DMark03 Scores are based on a common base CPU speed of 3.6GHz. No Troll were hurt during the generation of these scores. Terms and conditions apply.)

Sir Random

The extra marks come from the R360's better PS2.0 support. The XT BIOS allows these shader optimisations to be used, so DX9 games run faster.

As for the R350 also gaining 3DMarks from the XT BIOS, this is apparently because the R350's lack of hardware support for these optimisations causes artefacts (instead of shading the pixels), which falsely increases the score.


From another post at Rojakpot:

It is no secret that the R360 core has certain shader optimisations over the 9800Pro. Also a 9800XT vs. a 9800Pro at the same clockspeeds, the 9800XT will win clock for clock due to these optimisations. My theory is, on the old core, with the BIOS flash, those optimisations were being called by the different programs (games, benchmarks etc) which resulted in artifacts and artificially increased the scores. Anyone who benchmarks regularly will state how artifacts can both decrease and increase scores.

http://forums.rojakpot.com/viewtopic.php?p=99710

Adeptus Titanicus

Thanks Random, that better PS support makes sense.

BTW, did you manage to stick your memory heatsinks on (hopefully not while drunk? )

Sir Random

I had the card out to do it, but decided against it (sensibly). I don't have any epoxy anyway, so I'll spend some more time getting the fans and stuff ready, then do it all in one go.

El_MUERkO

I'm using a 9800 non-pro so I'm limited by the memory and I wouldnt really want to push the GPU to 425 which is +100 on its stock but... could I flash the bios to 9800XT then clock back the ram and GPU?

Big Chief

is there anyway to find if the core is a R350 or R360 without removing the zalman heat pipe... was a bitch to get on as it is without having to remove it all again ;(

my 9800 pro is currently oc to 400/359 at the minute (if i goto 360 i seem to get small artifacts?) i can push the core further up but as i cant monitor temperature i was a bit dubious to do so? or could i go ahead

currently have zalman heat pipe + fan at the moment on it (the comp has been changed a fair bit since then, but the gfx setup is still the same)

silverside

AFAIK you can use AtiTool to downclock it back to 9800pro stock clock speeds.

Probably worth a try for the ~5% performance boost at the same clock.

El_MUERkO

I use Atitool to OC at present I'm just wondering if theres any issues with doing it.

Sir Random

I've had no problems o/cing with ATI Tool. I wouldn't go by their "find max core/mem" thing though, I prefer to find that myself.

Only the R360 cores actually benefit from the XT BIOS. Most R350s get artifacts/sparklies with the BIOS, even if they can clock much higher than 412/365 with the R350 BIOS.

Some people claim to have R350s working as XTs using the "Gigacube" XT BIOS. Might be worth checking out, but the R350 does not physically support the shader optimisations that are made available through the XT BIOS.

neokenzo

Originally posted by Sir Random
Some people claim to have R350s working as XTs using the "Gigacube" XT BIOS. Might be worth checking out, but the R350 does not physically support the shader optimisations that are made available through the XT BIOS.

The "Gigacube" BIOS you mentioned is not a XT BIOS. Its actually a 9800 Pro BIOS. However, this BIOS will only work if you have a Samsung memory. Some ppl have recorded better overclocking than flashing to an XT BIOS. If anyone is interested, you can get the BIOS here.. Look for Gigacube 9800 Pro 128MB dated 2003-29-08.

neokenzo

Originally posted by El_MUERkO
I'm using a 9800 non-pro so I'm limited by the memory and I wouldnt really want to push the GPU to 425 which is +100 on its stock but... could I flash the bios to 9800XT then clock back the ram and GPU?

XT's core speed is 412 and not 425 and yes you can downclock if you want to. If you dont want to really push your card then why flash it at all? Just overclock it. You will still get the gain you want.

Anyone know where I can get memory heatsink?

El_MUERkO

From previous posts people suggest the XTs bios gives a +5% increase in benchmarks at the same clock speed as a card running on a pro bios, I'm running on a non-pro bios so i'm pretty curious about the possible extra power I could ween out of the card

neokenzo

I'm not sure whether you can flash from a non-pro to XT. That would be quite a jump. What you can do is flash your BIOS to 9800 pro. Try the Gigacube if you have a samsung memory. It will give you almost XT speeds anyways. Then you can overclock it XT speed if you're not satisfied with default speed. Also, you need a better fan and probably some ram heatsink as your card will get hotter.

Beware on flashing though. Not all flashing works. I've heard stories about flashing going really bad. Make sure you read a lot before even attempting. I tried using the XT BIOS but it didnt work becuase I have a R350 core and Hynix memory. Due to that, now my system takes longer to boot. Probably corrupt my boot.ini file.

El_MUERkO

Ah bugger it then I'll leave my card as is, my memory is hynix 3.0ns, I notcie your GPU is OC'd to 400, I've also got an arctic silencer and I'm running at 411 now without issues so I wouldnt be suprised if you can clock higher.

BadCharlie

How can i find out what mem is on my video card ?
Do i have to open up my computer to take a look ?

El_MUERkO

Yep, it should be printed very faintly on the memory of the card.

neokenzo

Originally posted by El_MUERkO
Ah bugger it then I'll leave my card as is, my memory is hynix 3.0ns, I notcie your GPU is OC'd to 400, I've also got an arctic silencer and I'm running at 411 now without issues so I wouldnt be suprised if you can clock higher.

I used to have it up to 420 or so without artifacts but then moment I play Far Cry for about 1 hour or so I start to get graphic corruption. Thus why its at 400. It does its job at 400 so I rather not push it.

El_MUERkO

I got those same issues with Far Cry, I think thats far cry's fault though cause I've played Joint Ops and Painkiller with high detail settings for hours at a time without issues.

Just bumped my memory to 324 and it held stady for 20 minutes on ati tool and a few aquamarks, got 42044

neokenzo

I think its because Far Cry uses a higher graphic engine and thats why the graphics corruption happens.

I was reading some forum where it says if you can overclock your graphic card (SE/AIW/NP/P) to 412/370 stable, ie aquamark and 3DMark03 runs fine and Far Cry runs fine for a couple of hours, there are BIOS's that have been overclocked to XT that you can use.

neokenzo

Originally posted by Big Chief
is there anyway to find if the core is a R350 or R360 without removing the zalman heat pipe... was a bitch to get on as it is without having to remove it all again ;(

my 9800 pro is currently oc to 400/359 at the minute (if i goto 360 i seem to get small artifacts?) i can push the core further up but as i cant monitor temperature i was a bit dubious to do so? or could i go ahead

currently have zalman heat pipe + fan at the moment on it (the comp has been changed a fair bit since then, but the gfx setup is still the same)

I'm afraid to really know what core you are running, you would need to remove the Zalman heat pipe.