Motorbike Test... help !!

pyrogenx

I intend to get a motorbike, what size will depend on the following matters.
The cost of the insurance and what size of a bike i will need to do the full A licence.

Right now im 20 years of age and i have a provisional licence for all bikes up to A, so thats full motorbike. I want to get any motorbike that i can do this A licence with.

The question is, when im doing the driving test, what size does the bike im using for this have to be? Am i allowed to use a smaller bike for the test like a 50cc or a 125cc or does it have to be "big" 250cc bike?

I will appreciate any suggestions!

pyrogenx

rymus

back when I was doing my test, to do the A test you had to have a bike of 250cc or more. The cost of the insurance will obviously vary on your age, sex, address & driving experience (NCB). It also depends on what type of 250cc bike you go for. For example a 250cc cruiser will be far cheaper to insure than a 250cc sports bike or dual purpose bike.


You're probably better off getting a 250cc that wont crucify you with insurance for the first year or two then move to something bigger when you pass the test.

Ring Hibernian to get quotes for bike insurance. Aon Bike Care are brokers for hibernian but I don't think they'll do business with you if you aren't getting the bike from a dealer.

Gurgle

There's an A1 provisional up to 125cc / 11kw, a restricted A provisional up to 25kw.

AFAIK, you do the 'A' test on any bike over 150cc (restricted to 25kW), then you have to wait 2 years after passing before the restriction is gone.

Also, last time I checked, the insurance companies give no discount for your bike being restricted.

pyrogenx

Thanx for that info.
Before christmas i was checking the hibernian online quotation site and i got quotes the likes of 3600euro for a 250cc racebike now its 4500euro all third party of course, since that full com would cost more for the first year than any bike could possibly be worth.
And i've also checked other bikes like Suzuki Marauder 250cc ( don't like does type of bikes at all tough) and its still the same : 4500quid. yet the bike only has 20hp!

I really really hope that carol nash will be much cheaper! otherwise i'll have work just for my bike.
Could ye give me any models of bikes that should be far cheaper than the above? Really don't cruser, i don't care too much tough as long as the bike isn't too heavy.

pyrogenx

oh yeah!

whats the story with getting a 500cc bike and restricting it down to 34hp ? Do insurance companys still do this? If i will be paying something like freaking 4500euro at least i'll want a proper bike. I know that this can be done but does the insurance still take me with a 500cc bike.

Yamad Kuntya

forget all about XXXcc its power to weight ratio you need to focus on. Ins companys don't discount for restriction coz if its not restr. then ins policy is null and void. All sports bikes from 250cc up will be loaded as a matter of course. Bikes from honda 33bhp or lower
Rebel 250
GB250
Steed 400
CB400
FT500
XL500S
XL500R
BROS400
GB400TT
NV400C
VRX400
MAGNA250
CB250RS
CB250NH
XLR250
XLR250Degree
XR250

Yamad Kuntya

all the models you'll have hassle free ins quotes with, without restricting at all AFAIK
http://www.bat-motorcycles.com/33bhp.asp

Yamad Kuntya

ASAIK you can sit your A test on anything over 150cc, you can do it on a 150cc scooter(why would you tho??) but it will be recorded on your licence "no gears" to reflect auto bike

Gurgle

I really really hope that carol nash will be much cheaper

AFAIK, Carole Nash won't quote anyone under 23.

Also, for comparison a 400cc sports bike is group 8-9, while a 400cc cruiser is group 4.

Insurance = Extortion

pyrogenx

Well i was checking on the hibernian web site and i got quotes for a few crusers and they cost for whatever reason the same as race bikes and scamblers.
There is a guy on boards.ie that got a quote from carol nash and he's 22years old.

If i do decide to fork out the money, my MAIN question will be : Will hibernian insure me with a restricted 500cc bike or not ???

Did anyone here get a restricted bike before?

a_ominous

Yup, Hibernian will insure a restricted bike. BUT in most cases they won't recognise it when it comes to the grouping.
I know a guy with a Bandit 600. Bought factory restricted new. An unrestricted GSF600 is group 10, but the restricted engine brings it down to group 5. Unless it's a factory-fitted restrictor, Hibernian won't take it into consideration so you'll end up paying for a higher powered bike, because AFAIK the shop-fitted restrictor kits are easy to remove.

General opinion seems to be CN won't insure people under 23. But if you've got a riding experience and a vaild NCB, they will cover you. But I think only for third party cover. Also need a garage for FC cover.

As a 20yo you'll be fleeced for insurance. Feck I'm old and feel Hib owe me a few kisses at this stage. Normally when I being fscked I get a kiss.
Oh BTW the rates _have_ gone up since Xmas. I was talking to a Hib person last week trying to wrangle more discounts and I was told the rates had gone up recently. Seems Hib aren't interested in people with RoSPA certs. I wonder if the incresed premiums has anything to do with a lack of trained riders out there? So why would _anyone_ want to reward safe, responsible riders???

a_ominous

@pyrogenx, as mentioned by rymus a sports 250cc will be in a different insurance group than a 250cc cruiser. It's all to do with power to weight ratio and mentioned on your licence (<=0.16 kW/kg).
NSRs and RSs are lightweight bikes that put out less than 33BHP (25kW) but exceed the power to weight ratio of 0.16kW/kg This is why a NSR125 is group 5/6 but a Marauder 125 is group 2.

As a 20yo, I'd suggest you might try the following. I'm assuming you're in Dublin from the premium. Is a scooter out of the question? It would allow you to get the experience and hence build up NCB. The waiting lists for a driving test in Dublin is about a year (check for yourself). You could hire a suitable bike from ISM for 120yoyos for the test without having to pay thousands for insurance over the year.

I _hate_ paying for insurance. I know I have to so I do, but it still doesn't make it any easier. But for the sorts of money you're talking about for insurance would be a fair chunk of change towards a mortgage (I'm twice your age, so forgive me ) a bloody good holiday; a large motorbike. I think you'd be better off putting you money aside for a year, get a scooter, some lessons and you'll be smiling this time next year. Biking is more fun than being stuck in a car or traffic any day. Even when it's raining. Believe.
Ride safe, ride free.

dee mm

a_ominous is right dont get ahead of yourself, buy a bike thats cheap to run, let the bigger bikes wait, bikes are about fun, two wheels better!:)

Cake Fiend

You can forget about a sports bike for a start, unless you're minted. You'll get ridden more than the bike itself for insurance. Maybe have a look at some naked/muscle bikes, they look a bit more sporty than traditional cruisers. Although the low-power models tend to look a bit silly. I'm not a cruiser fan either, but there are some pretty sweet cruisers out there - check out the lower-powered Suzukis and Yamahas. Wouldn't mind a black Virago or Marauder meself. Maybe you could import a Bandit 250 or some such (although they look mingin' IMO). Whatever you get, it'll be silly money to insure in Dublin.

a_ominous

Originally posted by a_ominous
NSRs and RSs are lightweight bikes that put out less than 33BHP (25kW) but exceed the power to weight ratio of 0.16kW/kg This is why a NSR125 is group 5/6 but a Marauder 125 is group 2.

I've just had a look at Bikeworld's website and the NSR125 is listed as a group 7 bike. Sheesh! it's worse than I though captain!

pyrogenx

Actually im not in dublin, im located in athlone (westmeath). Here the insurance isn't as mental dear as in dublin, but its still too dear.
So do i get this right- Even if i drive a 50cc bike for a year, i will still get a full year of experience/discount on a 500cc or 250cc motorbike ?

Thank you very much for all this help, i really appreciate it !

pyrogenx

rymus

Originally posted by a_ominous
I've just had a look at Bikeworld's website and the NSR125 is listed as a group 7 bike. Sheesh! it's worse than I though captain!

mothera gawd... frightening when you consider that that my 1300cc bike is also a group 7. The horror

Cake Fiend

I'd say it was because the NSR was very popular among younger bikers, having a very high power-to-weight ratio but still being learner-legal (125cc). Loads of people had serious crashes on them a few years ago, often fatal (the things can pass 100mph unrestricted), which is suspected to have prompted the rise to Group 7.

I was considering buying one a couple of years ago, until I saw what Hibernian were looking to get for TPO - E4000-odd for a 20-year-old. This is pretty silly, seeing as there are 18-year-olds driving the same bikes in England for about a grand Sterling. I noticed a lot of them around Cork city, where the insurance seems to be about half of that in Dublin.

Having said that, you can now get restricted models from 2002 on (must be factory restricted I suppose) which are far cheaper to insure. In fact, I can't even get a quote off the hibernian direct website anymore for a driver under the age of 25 on an unrestricted NSR. ****. I'll get one when I move to England.

Pyrogenx, something like a CBR250 (or the new CBR125, the 4-stroke replacement for the NSR125) might be in your price range in westmeath, and AFAIK the 250 surpass the requirements for a full A licence. Sweet bikes too.

a_ominous

Originally posted by pyrogenx
Actually im not in dublin, im located in athlone (westmeath). Here the insurance isn't as mental dear as in dublin, but its still too dear.
So do i get this right- Even if i drive a 50cc bike for a year, i will still get a full year of experience/discount on a 500cc or 250cc motorbike ?

Thank you very much for all this help, i really appreciate it !

pyrogenx

Hi Pyro, AFAIK there is qualification of NCD, be it on a 50 cc or a 250cc. You'll be asked how many years' NCD you have. That's as far as the insurance goes. As for practical things, you'll have a lower investment with a scooter. Should be able to pick one up 2nd hand cheaply, watch out for ones that have been thrashed. A shop bought one might be better as you should get a warranty, from 3-6 months. Is there an ISM branch in Athlone that will hire out a bike? Don't appear to be any IRTA guys in Westmeath but some in Roscommon and they might travel to you.

BTW what do you want the bike for? Commuting? Pleasure? Mixture? Commuting in towns, go for a smaller bike. Pleasure - then probably open roads and a bit of a bigger bike as the weight should reduce risk of being blown into another lane.

pyrogenx

Hello a_ominous!

Here is interesting news!! I just rang up hibernian and they told me that they don't wont insure any restricted at all on provisional license.
The insurance company's in this country are the biggest scam i've ever seen in my life.
I even told them that the bike is factory restricted and they didn't even ask me what type of bike it is or my age. They said i'd have to go into branch personally and they don't do motorbikes at the main branch or something.
Oh yeah here something, ya man been an operator of hibernian actually told me try carol nash! What is going on in there business.
I just can't get over the incompetence of some people.


Anyway, now im completly confused and don't know what to do.
All im asking them for is insurance for a 500 or 600cc bike that factory restricted to 33bhp. I've heard of several others that had that very insurance before, so it must be possible. OR NOT ?

Any suggestions a_ominous or somebody else?

pyrogenx

Here is another question. With an irish provisional, can i outside the country even if its only for a holiday ?

seanybiker

pyrogenx wrote:

Well i was checking on the hibernian web site and i got quotes for a few crusers and they cost for whatever reason the same as race bikes and scamblers.
There is a guy on boards.ie that got a quote from carol nash and he's 22years old.

If i do decide to fork out the money, my MAIN question will be : Will hibernian insure me with a restricted 500cc bike or not ???

Did anyone here get a restricted bike before?

I got a quote off of Carole ash and I'm 22. I heard htat you need one year NCB before htye quote you.

Hibernian quoted me 2100 on a xv250 and Carole nash quoted me 1684. I know what one I'll be taking.

LegacyUser

Whats wrong with a Yamaha TDR or Honda Varadero 125?? I'm 19 with a year's no claims on a provisional license living in Kildare and my insurance is €1850 a year, which isn't too bad at all.

They're both Group 2 and good for 70 - 75 mph, which is plenty for a learner bike IMO.

seanybiker

Spogpean wrote:

Whats wrong with a Yamaha TDR or Honda Varadero 125?? I'm 19 with a year's no claims on a provisional license living in Kildare and my insurance is €1850 a year, which isn't too bad at all.

They're both Group 2 and good for 70 - 75 mph, which is plenty for a learner bike IMO.

Personnally I wouldnt like the TDR's but the Varadero is a lovely bike. thats not a bad quote for your age boi. and the vardero looks bigger than a 125 which is nice

seanybiker

pyrogenx wrote:

Here is another question. With an irish provisional, can i outside the country even if its only for a holiday ?

nope you need a full licence for that

LegacyUser

seanybiker wrote:

Personnally I wouldnt like the TDR's but the Varadero is a lovely bike. thats not a bad quote for your age boi. and the vardero looks bigger than a 125 which is nice

Yup I've got a Dero. Great bike for my age. You actually get respect on the road from other drivers cuz they think its a bigger cc!!

I don't really like TDR's either, the front headlights look really shítty on em. The handlebar is way too skinny, its about as wide as a moped!!

Varadero's are cheaper also, I bought mine in December 04 for €1800 (01 reg) and I haven't had a problem with it. Its also a 4-stroke which=less maintenence.

TDR's are slightly better for acceleration (they're 2 strokes) but they're more expensive and uglier. Varadero all the way!!

seanybiker

Spogpean wrote:

Yup I've got a Dero. Great bike for my age. You actually get respect on the road from other drivers cuz they think its a bigger cc!!

I don't really like TDR's either, the front headlights look really shítty on em. The handlebar is way too skinny, its about as wide as a moped!!

Varadero's are cheaper also, I bought mine in December 04 for €1800 (01 reg) and I haven't had a problem with it. Its also a 4-stroke which=less maintenence.

TDR's are slightly better for acceleration (they're 2 strokes) but they're more expensive and uglier. Varadero all the way!!

Good man urself stick with the 4-strokes. €1800 is really cheap for that boi. nice one. Me neighbour was hoping to get a vardero but he cant get enough money for the ones on sale around here. the lads are looking for loadsa money for them. so a fella down the road from the house is selling a TDR and me mate really wants it. he dont know anything about bikes so I have to keep on telling its a grand bike even though I dont like em meself but he seems to so lave him off