IKEA Dublin

FinoBlad

Last I heard ages ago, IKEA were to comin to Dublin, laws were being waivered to allow them to build.

What ever happened? Does anyone know?

spongebob

Newry is now a suburb of Dublin ?

M

ixoy

I thought the laws weren't being waivered, actually and that B&Q got it in Liffey Valley for some particular reason.

Is this law too antiquated? I mean Mary Hearney and her All-Seeing Eye tells us to choose, that there's value out there, yet her and her cohorts are preventing us getting real value from any superstores by virtue of not allowing them to be built :mad:

FinoBlad

I might be wrong but Newry are pleading to IKEA to locate there not the other way round. IKEA threatened to go to Newry if they couldnt locate here.

RGDATA say no
Champer of commerce say yes
Traffic consultants hired by IKEA rivals predictably say no

This is the last I've read on it;

Ikea claims one Irishstore will be enough by Neil Callanan

Swedish flatpack furniture retailer Ikea believes a single store will be sufficient to meet the needs of Irish consumers for at least five years.
The company is awaiting a decision by the Department of the Environment on whether the 6,000 square metre cap on retail ware-houses should be lifted. Ikea is looking to open an Irish store almost five times that size.

If Ikea is allowed to open here, it intends to purchase a store in the Dublin metropolitan area, creating up to 500 jobs.

In an interview with this newspaper, Ikea's British property manager Scott Cordrey said that the company had already been offered a number of sites by developers around Dublin.

Speculation linking it with a possible site in Newry was incorrect, he said, but it has looked at a couple of sites around Belfast. A store in the North could not, however, serve the entire Irish market, Cordrey said.

Ikea's interest in Ireland is based on the fact that it has one of the fastest growing populations in the EU and the highest per capita rate of household construction in the EU.

The fact that home furnishings are more expensive than elsewhere in the EU is also a factor.

The first site Ikea looked at was in Liffey Valley a number of years ago. However, the developers could not accommodate them.

http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2003/11/09/story918151803.asp

Does onyone have info since november 03?

Nuttzz

Please God NO!!!!!!! it bad enough been dragged around B&Q without been dragged around swedish flatpack hell, keep them out!

Specky

Oddly enough I was in the UK over the weekend and visited an IKEA because somebody showed me some brochures of their kitchen stuff.

Once again I had it drilled home to me how much we in Ireland are being absolutely shafted, horribly, by big mean people with exceptionally large appendages on a daily basis.

No. IKEA is not flat pack hell.

The whole world over, including some very expensive kitchen manufacturers also happen to send out their product packaged in such a way as to facilitate transportation. This has been termed "flat packing". There isn't anything wrong with that.

The IKEA stuff is very good quality and the prices are just jaw-droppingly low.

I will be hiring a van and heading over on the ferry pretty soon to load up, there's no way I'm going to let any more of these Irish companies increase my sphincter circumference any more.

I know before I owned my own home I didn't see the attraction of places like IKEA at all, but just go out and see what people are charging for furniture over here. The quality is mediocre at best, the choice is crap, and the prices are just ludicrous....both parts and labour.

Please please please bring IKEA and bring them soon.

Remember when everyone was bitching about Lidl and Aldi opening over here? Who'd bitching now? The only problem I have is that there aren't enough of them.

It really gets on my tits when people jump to protect Irish companies when these very companies are shagging us up the bum wholeheartedly and laughing as they go.

BuffyBot

No. IKEA is not flat pack hell.

Did you go at the weekend? Not just flat pack hell, but actual hell. I can only imagine one one Ikea for the whole of Ireland would be like :dunno:

koneko

People on the continent shop in IKEA all the time, we've bought tonnes of stuff from them before (where I still lived there) and it's all been top-notch quality.

Borzoi

Originally posted by Specky


The IKEA stuff is very good quality and the prices are just jaw-droppingly low.

Prices in their european stores are lower too.

If you want to buy IKEA stuff tlak to either flatpackers.ie or goo to the Glasgow store, who do have an arrnagement for shipping to here

silent

slightly off topic but what is the reason behind a law to cap a retail operation to 6000sqm? I'm allways bitching about small irish shops and their lack of a selection so this kind of explains to me why (partially) is so. But why?
ikea - bring it on, mostly crap IMHO but some items are nice

Specky

Did you go at the weekend? Not just flat pack hell, but actual hell. I can only imagine one one Ikea for the whole of Ireland would be like

Actually, yes, I did go at a weekend, a bank holiday weekend at that, and it wasn't too bad at all. Went to the store on the M62 just outside Liverpool.

It was busy but it wasn't manic. I have heard nightmare stories about the waits for collection of stuff from the warehouse but to be honest I hear the same sorts of stories about some Irish stores too so I'd rather go somewhere I'm getting a good deal and suffer a long delay than go somewhere for a long delay and also have the added bonus of getting done up the bum really hard in the process.

Prices in their european stores are lower too.

Was in the store in Brussells a few years ago and prices did seem very good. VAT rates could be a major influence on the pricing though.

Victor

Originally posted by Specky
Actually, yes, I did go at a weekend, a bank holiday weekend at that, and it wasn't too bad at all. Went to the store on the M62 just outside Liverpool.

Ah, but how much did the trip cost?

Originally posted by silent
slightly off topic but what is the reason behind a law to cap a retail operation to 6000sqm?

Because they screw the small shops (not in one town, but potentially several counties) royally and when all the small shops close, the mega retailers then have excessive control of the market and shove prices up.

FinoBlad

Because they screw the small shops (not in one town, but potentially several counties) royally and when all the small shops close, the mega retailers then have excessive control of the market and shove prices up.

Seems understandable except the situation is now the small shops charge what they like. Homeowners are being screwed enough imho

Victor

Originally posted by FinoBlad
Seems understandable except the situation is now the small shops charge what they like. Homeowners are being screwed enough imho

You need to understand the differnce between convenience (including laziness and snobbery) and price-sensative retailing.

Specky

Ah, but how much did the trip cost?

Why how silly of me! Thank god you're here to point out the bleedin' obvious Victor.

You obviously haven't been out shopping around for a kitchen lately. I can save many times the cost of the trip by purchasing in the UK.

Because they screw the small shops (not in one town, but potentially several counties) royally and when all the small shops close, the mega retailers then have excessive control of the market and shove prices up.

This is the supermarkets v corner shops argument that gets rolled out every time someone slaps in a planning application for another superstore. For a start it doesn't really apply in this case. If we take kitchens for a start (seeing as how I'm specifically shopping for a kitchen at the moment) most of the "small" kitchen suppliers are buying in their doors from the same manufacturers anyway, pretty much all of which are overseas. These "small" kitchen companies then slap on huge markups and charge exhorbitant labour rates to put the stuff together for you.

Am I concerned that these people should lose their stranglehold on the market? No. Just like if I'm getting ripped off for sausages in my corner shop I don't have much objection to a supermarket moving in and giving me a better deal.

The only way that the large suppliers would move in and put prices up is if the situation remains as it is now with restrictions on who can open their stores. What you suggest will happen has not happened elsewhere, in fact the competition has simply served to drive prices down across the board.

As owner/manager of a small business I have to deal with the problems of competition from larger companies every day. They sometimes do things that I simply cannot compete with because of their scale. However, we can do things that larger organisations would never dream of doing. All businesses must remain similarly agile. Being in business cannot become a license to print money the way it is in some sectors in Ireland at the moment. Competition will benefit us all in the long run.

ixoy

Originally posted by Victor
You need to understand the differnce between convenience (including laziness and snobbery) and price-sensative retailing.

Surely you can use this argument to shut down all chains/big stores? Hey Zara have an outlet in Roches Stores with some cheap clothes - let's close it because the independent retailer down the road can't afford the same system. Hey, I don't like that Tesco - let's shut it down to give Gary the Green Grocer a chance at selling his wares.
Now is there evidence that, by setting up in England, IKEA have forced all other retailers out and jacked up the prices? Because then we could debate the issue.

FinoBlad

Because they screw the small shops (not in one town, but potentially several counties) royally and when all the small shops close, the mega retailers then have excessive control of the market and shove prices up.

Come to think of it Victor, how many hardware/diy shops can you name that B+Q has closed for example?

Genghis

FinoBlad, he might well retort that Wigoders are closing 5 of their 7 branches at the minute. He might argue (as I am sure Wigoders would) that this is down to competition from the 'likes of B&Q'.

I wouldn't. I'd say that Wigoders had failed to react over a number of years to the changes that were taking place in DIY retailing. The 7-day a week, high shelf, large choice and low price model has been successful for almost 20 years. The smaller style, 'neighbourhood' DIY store needs to change if they are to survive - perhaps by offering 'knowledge' or 'experience' (something you won't get from a spotty part-time Woodies employee, for example), perhaps by stocking items in different quantities, perhaps by specialising or by stocking different brands, etc. I don't claim to know the answers, but I am certain Wigoders didn't either.

Specky

Come to think of it Victor, how many hardware/diy shops can you name that B+Q has closed for example?

Actually that's not really the point. I'd imagine that any hardware/diy shops close by the B&Q warehouses have probably did see an effect on their business, maybe shops even closed down (I don't know whether they did or not).

I'd imagine that any of these shops in these areas may have had to adjust their offering, providing better service, wider choice, particular specialisations or just concentrating on the convenience side of things.

The point is that B&Q have not and will not now drive the prices up as a result. I see absolutely no evidence or any convincing argument as to why the consumer loses out as a result of this. Yes there are changes and some small inconveniences (in some sectors) but the nett effect is positive.

BuffyBot

(something you won't get from a spotty part-time Woodies employee, for example)

And a spotty part-time B&Q employee will?

Specky

And a spotty part-time B&Q employee will?

Although B&Q do employ their fair share of "Clearasil Users" they also have a reasonable number of trades people working there too who do actually know what they're talking about.

Borzoi

Originally posted by silent
slightly off topic but what is the reason behind a law to cap a retail operation to 6000sqm?

The original intention of this law was not to protect small retailers, but to protect existing town centres, and the legislation was primarily aimed at stopping MrHypermarket from opening a shop on a green field site that would attract the retail customers out form the town centre thanks to 'lowlow prices' and 'easy access, 1500 free parking spaces' which then expands with more shops. Gradually there is a shift in buying patterns away from the local town to the mall. Town slowly dies, foot traffic is down, noone wants to rent there. Really it's a bit of a death spiral.

The evidance for this scenario can be seen around Blanchardstown. And in most american cities.

This law was the substitute for proper planning here - great eh?

Ro-76

I recently made 2 trips to Ikea to furnish a new apartment.

Despite all the adverse comment i had read about items out of stock etc, I had no difficulty. I took a Ford Transit high roof to Glaggow, and filled it to the roof. I bought a kitchen, couch, armchair, wardrobes, TV unit, dining chairs, 2 beds, chest of drawers, and more. Pretty much everithing was less than half what i would have paid in Ireland. (the kitchen was less than half the cost of a standard cash&carry kitchen, and the Ikea one has solid beech worktops, ceramic porcelain sink etc)

The only thing out of stock was a seat cover, which was in stock the following morning before we left.

I had no problems assembling anything, and the quality seems very good.

Last weekend I was passing through Bristol and wanted to pick up a couple of extra bits for the kitchen. That was a lot more stressful, because the main warehouse for the kitchen stuff is not in the main building, so there was a 90 minute wait for any non-selfservice items. While this is an inconvenience, most irish furniture stores have a 2 month wait at least for most furniture.

I think it would be good if Ikea came to Dublin, or even Newry. For some reason, Irish companies, who are protected from foreign pressures do not go in for competition that much, and prefer to rip us all off, with the odd special offer rather than actual price competition. Take the mobile phone industry for example. we are one of the heaviest users of mobiles in Europe, and still pay more than most other EU countries.

Long live IKEA!

Ro

ReefBreak

Originally posted by Nuttzz
Please God NO!!!!!!! it bad enough been dragged around B&Q without been dragged around swedish flatpack hell, keep them out!

Well, if you don't like it, you don't have to go.

I might be buying a gaff soon. I might just rent a van, drive it over to Cardiff (closest to Holyhead), and drive it back packed full of IKEA stuff. The sooner it comes to Dublin/Newry, the better.

Xterminator

Originally posted by Genghis
I'd say that Wigoders had failed to react over a number of years to the changes that were taking place in DIY retailing. The 7-day a week, high shelf, large choice and low price model has been successful for almost 20 years. The smaller style, 'neighbourhood' DIY store needs to change if they are to survive - perhaps by offering 'knowledge' or 'experience' (something you won't get from a spotty part-time Woodies employee, for example), perhaps by stocking items in different quantities, perhaps by specialising or by stocking different brands, etc. I don't claim to know the answers, but I am certain Wigoders didn't either.

I agree with you.

The local diy stores and smaller multiples could band together in a 'Spar' like group, and use their weight of no's to negotiate decent prices from wholesalers, who presumably given the massive outlets a good price.

These saving could be passed on to the consumer, and would go a long way to reversing the deline of the local DIY store.

Nonone will drive to an out of town store, for 50cents sake, but when things are typically 30% dearer locally, they are just taking the p|ss.

X

okidoki987

Get a Ryanair Wednesday day return cheapie flight to Glasgow
(euro 36 including taxes at the mom).
Shipping 100 GBP for the 1st 2 trolleys (Shipped in a week if you're unlucky).
www.ikea.com
Save yourself at least 50% (after conversion).
Sorted!

ReefBreak

I "Asked Anna" on their website with a "Shipping Ireland" query, and it replied with: "Unfortunately IKEA does not have the facility to be able to ship your goods out of the UK. "

???

spongebob

Originally posted by Ro-76
(the kitchen was less than half the cost of a standard cash&carry kitchen, and the Ikea one has solid beech worktops, ceramic porcelain sink etc)

These Cash n Carry kitchens are not that simple to install and they are difficult to deal with as a company when they balls something up, as they do. I never had a problem with an Ikea flatpack although I have not put one up in almost 10 years. I trust they got better since quality wise.

While this is an inconvenience, most irish furniture stores have a 2 month wait at least for most furniture.

Then they think of ringing ya about that sofa when the van is already outside yer house, you are at work 40 mins away. Ya come home in a hurry and the thing is ****ed around the back with rain leaking through the incomplete plastic cover and nobody there ta help ya carry it in becuase yer man in the van ****ed off.

I think it would be good if Ikea came to Dublin, or even Newry.

I'd see ya there for a coffee and probably end up buying something. Not on a Saturday after 11am though if you don't mind awfully .
M

okidoki987

Ikea DO NOT SHIP to Ireland .
The only way you can get them to ship to Ireland is
to physically go to one of their stores pay for the goods, then bring the goods to the shipping counter where they will arrange delivery to Dublin, Cork or wherever
in Ireland.
That is the only way.

ReefBreak

Soooo what you mean is... they DO ship to Ireland, but you have to be at the store? I have no problem heading over, as long as I know that they will actually ship after I've bought them.

vinnyfitz

I thin I'm with Victor on this one.

A few points

I can't see the Government giving an exemption to the guidelines to IKEA just 'cos they are trendy and Swedish. Either we have a cap or we do not. No exceptions. IKEA could open here tomorrow if they opened a store that conformed with the retail planning guidelines. They could have a very good and profitable store of less than 6,000 square metres. B&Q used to say they could not trade in Ireland due to the cap. Now they are opening a bunch of stores.

We have to make a trade off between having proper spatial planning in Ireland which brings short and long term benefits in terms of traffic, competition, environmental quality etc and, on the other hand, potential savings to consumers from retail superstores. I'm just not convinced that we can't have effective competition without giving in to a planning free for all.

(BTW Is it any surprise that IKEA lobbies to dump our planning cap rather than trading within it when the Swedes see how "flexible" the Irish seem to be about planning?)