Dail Hunger Strike

Villain · 06-05-2004 1:50pm #1

This might be more suitable in the Humanities Forum, but it seems very quite there at the moment.

Anyway I'm sure most people will have heard something about Tom Sweeny the man who along with his son is on hunger strike outside the Dail for the last 21 days.

He was abused by the Patrician Brothers in 2 schools as a child, and he took a high court case against the state and they offered him compensation at the 11th hour preventing the case going to trial.

He then went to the redress board but said he came out feeling worse than ever, they didn't want to hear his story and there wasn't any of the offenders present.

I heard him on the Gerry Ryan show this morning and the man is very angry at what has happened.

He hasn't had food or liquid in 22 days, so if this continues he will die.

Green Party TD Paul Gogarty was dismissed from the Dail after he refused to take his seat until a debate on the issue was held

This man will die unless the Government of today intervenes.

He is looking for the redress board to be changed and an apology from the brothers.

From the Indpendent

"One in Four, a support group for victims of child abuse, has called on the Government to take all the necessary steps to save the life of a man on hunger strike outside the Dail. 57-year-old Tom Sweeney, who was abused as a child in the 1950s and 1960s, began the hunger strike three weeks ago in protest at his treatment by the Residential Institutions Redress Board. Mr Sweeney had originally been offered €113,000 in compensation, but this was reduced to around €70,000 after he chose to tell his story to the board.
Speaking about the matter today, One in Four director Colm O'Gorman said it would be unthinkable if Mr Sweeney was to die because of the Government's failure to act. "What's essential is that [the] Government take whatever steps they need to take to resolve the situation," he said. "I know they have had sensible proposals put forward to them that would end the hunger strike and would allow Tom to get some medical attention and I'd call on the Minister for Education and Science, Mr Dempsey, and indeed the Taoiseach, Mr Ahern, to act urgently on these proposals."

Turner · 06-05-2004 2:30pm

First of all it wasnt about the money... Now it is..

Yeah sure he was abused in the past.... But thats what it is...in the past. He'd want to get on with his life while he's still alive..

Some people really annoy me with their self pity and self harm. Hes willing to throw his healthy body away while theres people dying in hospitals with chronic illnesses. I certainly wouldn't give him any attention.

Mighty_Mouse · 06-05-2004 2:35pm

Yeah sure he was abused in the past.... But thats what it is...in the past.

I see you have a complete understanding of the matter so

Some people really annoy me with their self pity and self harm. Hes willing to throw his healthy body away while theres people dying in hospitals with chronic illnesses.

I'm sure he's just bored with nothing better to do and "REALLY" "REALLY" motivated by money!:rolleyes:

<Sarcasim>

Villain · 06-05-2004 2:41pm

Originally posted by Chief---
First of all it wasnt about the money... Now it is..

Yeah sure he was abused in the past.... But thats what it is...in the past. He'd want to get on with his life while he's still alive..

You obviously didn't hear him on the Ryan show.

IT IS NOT ABOUT THE MONEY

The 1 in 4 group raised that issue not Mr Sweeny, he simply wants a chance to have his story told and have the people who abused him aplogise to him.

Originally posted by Chief---

Some people really annoy me with their self pity and self harm. Hes willing to throw his healthy body away while theres people dying in hospitals with chronic illnesses. I certainly wouldn't give him any attention.

Chief, that a very sad statement, I think you should reseacrh the topic before posting statements like that, sad very sad.:mad:

Turner · 06-05-2004 2:46pm

Is he not on hunger strike because he wants the original sum of E113,000 that he refused in the beginning.

Thats the way it came across to me in the media.

Either way hunger strike is not the way to go about it. He should have some respect for his body.

I personally would have no time for him due to the way he has chosen to highlight the issue.
Im sorry thats just the way i am.

Villain · 06-05-2004 2:48pm

Originally posted by Chief---
Is he not on hunger strike because he wants the original sum of E113,000 that he refused in the beginning.

Thats the way it came across to me in the media.

NOT at all, thats a complete misguided media report if they stated that, 1 in 4 group raised that issue, Mr Sweeny never mentioned that in his interview.

Nuttzz · 06-05-2004 2:59pm

Chief, if you (and the mods) can excuse my crudeness but no amount of money can compensate you for getting a dick up your ass (or elsewhere)

This child (as he was then) was placed into care by the state. The people the state entrusted to look after this child abused him, his rights and their positions. Sex offenders get away too lightly in this country, the catholic church, one of the major land holders in the state, has escaped with a sweet deal from the government.

All abuse victims deserve to receive at least €250k from the church or the employers of the abusers

Turner · 06-05-2004 3:06pm

Aparently its not about money.

I agree, being abused as a child is probably the worst thing that could happen to anybody. Dont get me wrong i have big issues with the church as individuals and as a body.

Its just his way of highlighting the issue that i have a problem with.

Villain · 06-05-2004 3:09pm

Originally posted by Chief---
Aparently its not about money.

I agree being abused as a child is probably the worst thing that could happen to anybody.

Its just his way of highlighting the issue that i have a problem with.

I agree its a big extreme but I doubt his story would be getting the same attention if he had done his protest quitely

Turner · 06-05-2004 3:13pm

But still, harming his body irreversibly.
Is it worth it for publicity ??

Obviously he might not have a healty mind considering the ordeal he went through but should he not be happy that he has a healthy body and not damage that aswell.
Not everybody has one.

swiss · 06-05-2004 3:13pm

He was abused by the Patrician Brothers in 2 schools as a child, and he took a high court case against the state and they offered him compensation at the 11th hour preventing the case going to trial.

Did he take the money? Or if he didn't, why didn't it end up in the high court?

You see, this is the sticking point for me. If he did accept the cash to stop it from going to trial, then his assertions that "it's not about the money" are worthless. The money was clearly worth something to him. He accepted the cash, knowing that it would mean that his case would not be heard.

If he didn't accept the cash, why did he opt for a 'redress board' that would more than likely have involvement with the very institution that was indirectly responsible for his abuse, in lieu of the high court? When that failed, would he not then have gone for the high court - unless of course he had waived that right by taking a settlement.

Maybe I'm missing something here, I'm sure he's been through a harrowing ordeal, but I see it as slightly disingenuous when someone takes to hunger striking, apparantly neglecting our existing mechanisms (i.e the courts) for dealing with these kinds of abuses.

Villain · 06-05-2004 3:19pm

Swiss as far I know the state offered him money which he refused, but he agreed to go to the redress board becasue he thought he would have his chance to tell his story, the 1 in 4 person said on the Ryan show that Mr Sweeny didn't realise what the redress really was, and that the high court case could still proceed as he turned down all money to date.

Basically I think the poor man thought that he would be able to tell his story in the redress board and that people who done this to him would be present.

ALLGOOD · 06-05-2004 3:22pm

Originally posted by Chief---
First of all it wasnt about the money... Now it is..

Yeah sure he was abused in the past.... But thats what it is...in the past. He'd want to get on with his life while he's still alive..

Some people really annoy me with their self pity and self harm. Hes willing to throw his healthy body away while theres people dying in hospitals with chronic illnesses. I certainly wouldn't give him any attention.

Your a dirty ****ing idiot. And a Nazi. Hope you die in a car crash.

<mod edit> 1 week ban for you. </mod edit>

Villain · 06-05-2004 3:35pm

Update from RTE.ie

"A man who has been on hunger strike outside Leinster House for 22 days has been taken into the building on a wheelchair for talks.

Mr Tom Sweeney was brought inside by the Dublin South West Fianna Fáil TD, Charlie O'Connor.

Mr Sweeney is protesting over his treatment by the Residential Institutions Redress Board in relation to abuse he suffered in two institutions.

It is understood that a set of proposals is being put to him.

The proposals arose from a meeting between the four Dublin South-West TDs and the Minister for Education yesterday."

Ryvita · 06-05-2004 3:49pm

Originally posted by Chief---
But still, harming his body irreversibly.
Is it worth it for publicity ??

Obviously he might not have a healty mind considering the ordeal he went through but should he not be happy that he has a healthy body and not damage that aswell.
Not everybody has one.

Publicity?

The guy was abused as a kid and because he wanted to tell his story to the redress bored his compensation (which he more than deserves) was reduced by about 40%.
The people who did this to him weren't even present when he told his story to the board. I don't blame him at all for protesting this way ... he must feel completely powerless.

Have some compassion.

Villain · 06-05-2004 3:59pm

Update from Rte Again:
" A man who has been on hunger strike outside Leinster House for 22 days is considering a set of proposals put to him in an attempt to end his protest.

Tom Sweeney is meeting lawyers at Buswells Hotel, across the road from the Dáil.

He is protesting over his treatment by the Residential Institutions Redress Board in relation to abuse he suffered in two institutions."

06-05-2004 5:23pm

IT IS NOT ABOUT THE MONEY

Why isn't he sitting outside the Highest office for the Church in Ireland then? He and others have seen that the government is quick to pay for the church's mistakes, and he's there for the money. Otherwise he'd be protesting the the Church for the Treatment he received.

Horrible what happened to him, but the State is not to be blamed. Get things straight and target the Church.

Villain · 06-05-2004 5:26pm

Originally posted by klaz
Why isn't he sitting outside the Highest office for the Church in Ireland then? He and others have seen that the government is quick to pay for the church's mistakes, and he's there for the money. Otherwise he'd be protesting the the Church for the Treatment he received.

Horrible what happened to him, but the State is not to be blamed. Get things straight and target the Church.

The state were responsible for the schools, and it was the state who set-up the redress board and limited the churchs liability

Ryvita · 06-05-2004 5:29pm

Originally posted by klaz
... He and others have seen that the government is quick to pay for the church's mistakes, and he's there for the money ...

Is he not entitled to compensation for what happened to him? The state put him in Care and let the Church do what they liked.

Villain · 06-05-2004 5:40pm

Update from RTE once again:

"The man who has been on hunger strike outside Leinster House for 22 days has given up his protest and is taking his case back to the High Court.

Tom Sweeney made his decision following a meeting with his lawyers in Buswells Hotel near Leinster House. "

seamus · 06-05-2004 5:43pm

While it's not a nice state of affairs, I agree with Chief--- in principle.

The man is not highly educated. The State underinformed him about what he would receive from the redress board. So now he has gone to a ridiculous extreme to have himself heard. It's not good that he has, but it's not like he exhausted all avenues open to him. There are ways of having yourself heard that are just as powerful, and don't require you to martyr yourself.

We live in a democracy, not a dictatorship. There's no need to take such a step.

Villain · 06-05-2004 5:48pm

Originally posted by seamus
While it's not a nice state of affairs, I agree with Chief--- in principle.

The man is not highly educated. The State underinformed him about what he would receive from the redress board. So now he has gone to a ridiculous extreme to have himself heard. It's not good that he has, but it's not like he exhausted all avenues open to him. There are ways of having yourself heard that are just as powerful, and don't require you to martyr yourself.

We live in a democracy, not a dictatorship. There's no need to take such a step.

Would he have got to meet with the TD's etc if he hadn't taken this form of protest, I think not. He is heading to the high court where he can have his story told and name those who assaulted and raped him, and get his Justice.

Chief and Seamus I don't think anyone can judge the man for taking this action unless you have suffered the abuse he has and been misled by the state. I think to say that he is in this for the money is simply IGNORANT.

seamus · 06-05-2004 5:54pm

Originally posted by irish1
Would he have got to meet with the TD's etc if he hadn't taken this form of protest, I think not. He is heading to the high court where he can have his story told and name those who assaulted and raped him, and get his Justice.

Well, they're hardly going to let him die on the street....

I think to say that he is in this for the money is simply IGNORANT.

Chief retracted his statement, and I never said he was.

Villain · 06-05-2004 5:59pm

Originally posted by seamus
Well, they're hardly going to let him die on the street....

Exactly so without this course of action would he have met them??

I don't think so, its a pitty that this is what it takes to get noticed by our government

Originally posted by seamus

Chief retracted his statement, and I never said he was.

I didn't think he did all I remember his saying was "Aparently its not about money"

Hardly a retractment, apologies if he did retract it.

Ajnag · 06-05-2004 6:17pm

Keep it in perspective, First up, It is somewhat disturbing that it took 3 weeks for the media to catch on that some guy was starving himself outside the Dail(If they reported before this, Its news to me, Feel free to link).

Second of all, his action was supported by other victims, If his reasons were as shallow as said, then I feel this support would have been absent.

And lastly, so what if he did accept compo, and then felt it was a bad decion.We all **** up on occasion and make bad decisions.Now Imagine the mental state of a victim of institutional abuse, Are they not worthy of the benifit of the doubt ?

seamus · 06-05-2004 6:23pm

Originally posted by irish1
Exactly so without this course of action would he have met them??

I don't think so, its a pitty that this is what it takes to get noticed by our government

That's my point. He went straight for the jugular. What if he had got a group of abusees (word?) together and marched on the dail? Would he have been heard then? We don't know, because he went over the top.

I'm also quite disturbed that this guy was 21 days on the side of the street before RTE took notice. Obviously people just thought that they were homeless people, not hunger strikers, or it would have been brought out straight away. Everyone loves to take pot shots at the Government and this would have been ideal fodder. It just highlights once more that it was a poorly planned over-reaction on his part, since himself and his son obviously just sat there, and didn't make a fuss about it.

Villain · 06-05-2004 6:29pm

Originally posted by seamus
That's my point. He went straight for the jugular. What if he had got a group of abusees (word?) together and marched on the dail? Would he have been heard then? We don't know, because he went over the top.

I'm also quite disturbed that this guy was 21 days on the side of the street before RTE took notice. Obviously people just thought that they were homeless people, not hunger strikers, or it would have been brought out straight away. Everyone loves to take pot shots at the Government and this would have been ideal fodder. It just highlights once more that it was a poorly planned over-reaction on his part, since himself and his son obviously just sat there, and didn't make a fuss about it.

It took the government 21 days of hunger strking and a lot of media pressure to get this resolved, and you think he should have marched on the dail.

Get real man, don't mean to sound offensive but I think it would have taken a lot of marches to get the result he did. Remember this was his 22nd day outside the Dail, took the media to get involved before anything really happened. I think that speaks volumes about our goverment. Fair play to Pat Rabbite and a few others who did speak with him.

06-05-2004 6:43pm

I think to say that he is in this for the money is simply IGNORANT.

You're entitled to your opinion, just as i'm entitled to mine. Oddly enough I don't see us calling you ignorant because you believe what he says his motives are, even though i'm skeptical.

Get real man, don't mean to sound offensive but I think it would have taken a lot of marches to get the result he did. Remember this was his 22nd day outside the Dail, took the media to get involved before anything really happened. I think that speaks volumes about our goverment. Fair play to Pat Rabbite and a few others who did speak with him.

Does anyone know if he tried to promote his Hunger Strike in any way or did he just plonk himself down, and begin without a fuss? Most Hunger strikes that i've heard about had a number of Family members or friends nearby to promote their protest.

I don't know if it speks Volumes about our government but rather our own ability to phase out apparent homeless people. (which most people seem to have done, until someone spoke to him)

Villain · 06-05-2004 6:51pm

Originally posted by klaz
You're entitled to your opinion, just as i'm entitled to mine. Oddly enough I don't see us calling you ignorant because you believe what he says his motives are, even though i'm skeptical.

I didn't call anyone ignorant I said
"I think to say that he is in this for the money is simply IGNORANT"
BTW Ignorant means lack of understanding.

Originally posted by klaz
Does anyone know if he tried to promote his Hunger Strike in any way or did he just plonk himself down, and begin without a fuss? Most Hunger strikes that i've heard about had a number of Family members or friends nearby to promote their protest.

I don't know if it speks Volumes about our government but rather our own ability to phase out apparent homeless people. (which most people seem to have done, until someone spoke to him)

Well in this case theres not much any of us could have done, IMHO I think it does speak volumes about our government

Cork · 06-05-2004 8:16pm

Originally posted by irish1
It took the government 21 days of hunger strking and a lot of media pressure to get this resolved, and you think he should have marched on the dail.

This is totally unfair comment.

Has the relevant minister not been available at clinics etc?

seamus · 06-05-2004 9:15pm

Originally posted by irish1
It took the government 21 days of hunger strking and a lot of media pressure to get this resolved, and you think he should have marched on the dail.

In fairness, we don't know that. We didn't even know he was there until last night. You could be damn sure if anyone in Government knew he was there, they would have brought it up straight away instead of leaving him outside with no food or shelter for 3 weeks. "Get real man" as you would say.

Dail Hunger Strike

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