Justin Barrett on Today FM now...

Paul Hughes

Originally posted by dathi1
Funny...If Richard Boyd SWP Left wing extremist Barret was on Today FM yez wouldn't be all here jumpin up and down screaming and threatening people with bans for soundbiting. If some stood up and called for a Muslim Irish parliament you get down on your knees and welcome their ideas. You can call for open borders and lefty socialist utopias but when some guy who doesn't like abortion, staunchly roman catholic, isn't too keen on immigration voices his opinion ....he's a godam Nazi!!! I'm not too keen on Barrett's anti secular ideas myself but he's dead right on immigration and crime. Now if we had someone with the calibre of and the late Pim Fortyn or Jorg Haider...I'd vote No1 any day.

Well said dathi1

mike65

*me shakes head*

Mike.

bonkey

Originally posted by dathi1
Funny...If Richard Boyd SWP Left wing extremist Barret was on Today FM yez wouldn't be all here jumpin up and down screaming and threatening people with bans for soundbiting.

Really? And you have some indication to back up your assumption/suggestion of how unbalanced my, Swiss' and Gandalf's moderation is in this regard, do you? Care to show us where we have turned a blind eye on soundbiting? Please also consider that you'd want to be aware of whether the posts in this thread and/or the one you use as a counter-example were reported to us as well.

So...go on. You've accused us of biased moderation, now I'm challenging you to show me that you have a shred of evidence to support this and that its not just some invective that you've decided adds weight to your emotive argument.

If some stood up and called for a Muslim Irish parliament you get down on your knees and welcome their ideas.

Pure speculation, heading towards "pure pullsh1t" in terms of its believability. Or do you have any weight to add to this claim either?

You can call for open borders and lefty socialist utopias but when some guy who doesn't like abortion, staunchly roman catholic, isn't too keen on immigration voices his opinion ....he's a godam Nazi!!!

Brilliant Dathi1.

Tell you what. Go back and read the thread. While doing so, go and find the first reference to Nazi. Found it? Here it is in case you're having problems or are just going to desultorily reply that you have been reading the thread.

So now explain to me....why can people like you make your objections to whatever you object to, but the "lefties" can't do it without people like PaulHughes and yourself inaccurately accusing them of throwing the term "Nazi" around when it was you and those who dsagree with them who introduced the term into the discussion in the first place.

In fact, the term exists in 4 - count them - posts prior to this one. One from Hughes asking that the lefties stop with the nazi crap. One from you asking more or less the same. One from oscarbravo asking where had it been used prior to Hughes mentioning it, and one from Wolff where the term exists validly in context as part of a quoted newspaper article.

Not a single "lefty" has applied that term to anyone in this thread. Not one. But I guess thats not important. No...what important is suggesting that they have...right. At least PaulHughesWH had the "sense" to put it in quotations so that he could wiggle out of his accusation if he had to.

I find it disheartening in the extreme that rather than even trying to defend the guys point of view you have to make up allegations against those you disagree with rather than being able or willing to address the actual points that they're making.

Rational Discussion has apparently found Romantic Ireland.

jc

sceptre

Originally posted by dathi1
Funny...If Richard Boyd SWP Left wing extremist Barret was on Today FM yez wouldn't be all here jumpin up and down screaming and threatening people with bans for soundbiting. If some stood up and called for a Muslim Irish parliament you get down on your knees and welcome their ideas. You can call for open borders and lefty socialist utopias but when some guy who doesn't like abortion, staunchly roman catholic, isn't too keen on immigration voices his opinion ....he's a godam Nazi!!! I'm not too keen on Barrett's anti secular ideas myself but he's dead right on immigration and crime. Now if we had someone with the calibre of and the late Pim Fortyn or Jorg Haider...I'd vote No1 any day.

I'm not familiar with Richard Boyd SWP Left wing extremist Barret but if he's into the auld hate-speech, lies and organising people to act in a threatening manner towards ordinary citizens and financing groups in Scotland through 70 grand cheques from Youth Defence (while denying that there's any funding at all) that make threats of physical violence against people like Justin Barrett appears to be, I'd happily line up to throw metaphorical tomatoes.

Haven't noticed anyone "screaming" but thanks for playing the game anyway. And I've no idea of the relevance of the Muslim parliament reference so some form of explanation in a well-known language might be good.

And I haven't called him a Nazi, I've called him an idiot (see previous thread on Mr Barrett). Even the Irish Times didn't call him a Nazi, they said he liked to hang out with far-right German groups (call them Nazis if you like), keep in contact with far-right German groups and share platforms with far-right German groups. He could have sued if it wasn't true but for some reason he chose not to. He could have sued if any part of the reports was a lie but chose not to. The exucse given was that he didn't know what kind of thing was going on at these conferences at all at all sor. Given that I'm the type of person who calls a spade a shovel, Justin's at least an idiot. He's certainly been an idiot from the early 90s onwards, I'm not too sure about before then. Being an idiot and being a Nazi certainly aren't mutually dependent but then they're not mutually exclusive either.

dathi1

Really? And you have some indication to back up your assumption/suggestion of how unbalanced my, Swiss' and Gandalf's moderation is in this regard, do you? Care to show us where we have turned a blind eye on soundbiting?

He was accused of soundbiting...and had a ban threat above? was he soundbiting?

So...go on. You've accused us of biased moderation,

jumping the gun again bonkey!!!

Pure speculation,

a figure of speech....not to your "logical and accurate" level but we're not all as perfect as you. Speculation is banned also? It must be the alpine air in Bern.

I find it disheartening in the extreme that rather than even trying to defend the guys point of view you have to make up allegations against those you disagree with rather than being able or willing to address the actual points that they're making.

I'll concede for not being JC 100% logical and Accurate on this particular point. ..but if we really had to 100% non flowery with the debates on this forum it would become very boring indeed...then we would be all better off in Switzerland.

I find it disheartening in the extreme that rather than even trying to defend the guys point of view

oh...come on...I did say I agreed with the immigration and crime bit.

Carpo

Originally posted by dathi1
but when some guy who doesn't like abortion, staunchly roman catholic, isn't too keen on immigration voices his opinion ....he's a godam Nazi!!!

This is kinda funny. You complain about people calling him a Nazi (which nobody actually did) but when when you then accuse others of "getting down on thier knees" to someone, speculating on how other would react to a situation with no basis or justification, it becomes...

Originally posted by dathi1
a figure of speech....not to your "logical and accurate" level but we're not all as perfect as you. Speculation is banned also? It must be the alpine air in Bern.

slightly contradictory, neh?

mike65

Funny how a thread can spin out of control....I only
started this as a muse not the precursor to WW3.

Originally posted by PaulHughesWH
I love the Red grasp of freedom of speech, i.e. you have the right to freedom of speech only if you think a certain way.

Oh yes Paul I'm not a RED in fact its the last colour I would use in my political paintbox.

Mike.

sceptre

Originally posted by mike65
Oh yes Paul I'm not a RED in fact its the last colour I would use in my political paintbox.

Quiet, you commie bastard:p. By highlighting that quote of Paul's you weaken his complaint about people referring to non-participants in this forum as Nazis, even if it didn't happen. Never let the truth stand in the way of a good whinge.

dahamsta

Originally posted by dathi1
I'll concede for not being JC 100% logical and Accurate on this particular point. ..but if we really had to 100% non flowery with the debates on this forum it would become very boring indeed...then we would be all better off in Switzerland. oh...come on...I did say I agreed with the immigration and crime bit.

Unfortunately I never chose to debate in school, but I'm pretty sure that if I had, standing up and saying "I tink dat guy is roight" wouldn't have won me any points. Barrett and his ilk don't debate either, they make statements and consistently refuse to back them up or defend them in any reasonable manner -- for example, sceptre has made several attempts to query a number of issues with Barrett and his supporter / alter ego, and his questions have gone unanswered and unaddressed.

Perhaps you would like to answer sceptres questions dathi1? We get that you agree with his policies on immigration and crime, but have you checked out the stuff that sceptre's highlighted? Just in case? Or would it be ok if those points were actually true? At least we'd know where you stand then.

adam

dathi1

Perhaps you would like to answer sceptres questions dathi1? We get that you agree with his policies on immigration and crime, but have you checked out the stuff that sceptre's highlighted? Just in case?

. But my rant...ok it was a rant had nothing to do with sceptre's points. I was merely pointing my frustration at the way everybody seems to jump into the same boat and castigate individuals when it comes to certain issues..especially when they don't fit the neo liberal agenda.

but have you checked out the stuff that sceptre's highlighted?

oh you mean NDP links etc....right I didnt. Just like SF / ira etc....I don't give it much credence. The persons de facto political agenda is all I'm interested in.

sceptre

Originally posted by dathi1
especially when they don't fit the neo liberal agenda

Neoliberalism is probably one of my pet hates as it happens, though the term neoclassical philosophy is probably more accurate due to liberalism being prefix-overloaded.

Cork

Originally posted by dathi1
Funny...If Richard Boyd SWP Left wing extremist Barret was on Today FM yez wouldn't be all here jumpin up and down screaming and threatening people with bans for soundbiting. If some stood up and called for a Muslim Irish parliament you get down on your knees and welcome their ideas. You can call for open borders and lefty socialist utopias but when some guy who doesn't like abortion, staunchly roman catholic, isn't too keen on immigration voices his opinion ....he's a godam Nazi!!! I'm not too keen on Barrett's anti secular ideas myself but he's dead right on immigration and crime. Now if we had someone with the calibre of and the late Pim Fortyn or Jorg Haider...I'd vote No1 any day.

I agree. Justin Barrett is stsnding for election. It is not the first election that he has contested. As a democrat - more power to him.

He has put himself before the people - as a democrat - Let him have his say.

& if people agree with Justin - they can vote for him. It is called democracy.

dahamsta

I knew I should have stood for election. I could say what I want and just tell people that it's ok, because I'm a democrat.

adam

mike65

Originally posted by dahamsta
I knew I should have stood for election. I could say what I want and just tell people that it's ok, because I'm a democrat.

adam

Mike.

spongebob

Originally posted by dathi1
Now if we had someone with the calibre of and the late Pim Fortyn

Pim was far more upmarket than Justin. Puhleeese. Justin dresses like a country pimp outside the Mart in Clones.

M

nlgbbbblth

Originally posted by Paul Hughes
Well done Justin another outstanding performance from JB.

Mike are you against an "Irish Irealnd" ?

PS for those people who have been asking why I hav'nt been posting here, the reason been that unlike some people I actually have to work.

erm,

not sure if you've heard this or not

but it is possible to get the internet on one's home PC

and post from home like I am doing now

I don't have internet access at work

nlgbbbblth

who is this Justin chap anyways?

Ivana Bacik's boyfriend?

gandalf

Originally posted by nlgbbbblth
who is this Justin chap anyways?

Ivana Bacik's boyfriend?

Ugh they would make quite the handsome couple eh. Actually I will vote for Ivana if she promises to take those posters down, I nearly crashed the car today when I saw them!!!

BTW Cork I have no problem with Justin or any citizen of this country running for office, but they better be able to prove to me that they are suitable to serve in that office and from what I know of Justins history and the evasive way he seems to deal with it I would be quite worried if he ever held office in this country or in Europe.

bonkey

Originally posted by dathi1
He was accused of soundbiting...and had a ban threat above? was he soundbiting?

Well ... he was presenting the one-sentence emotive-impact version of an argument as though it explained everything. So yes, I'd say it was soundbiting. Its what we refer to as soundbiting when others engage in it, so I don't see why we shouldn't refer to it as soundbiting here. Unless you're suggesting that we should be applying different standards?

jumping the gun again bonkey!!!

No. I'm not. Here's what you wrote :

yez wouldn't be all here jumpin up and down screaming and threatening people with bans for soundbiting.

See - we did it to him, and you're saying we wouldn't do it to others who held a different political viewpoint.

I'm not jumping any gun - that is accusing us of bias, pure and simple.

But I'm not really surprised that you won't even stand by what you wrote, but instead resort to trying to get a rise out of me with all your pathetic little jibes. Its kinda in keeping with the post I was referring to in the first place.

Speculation is banned also?

You clearly need to refresh your memory on our forum rules. They specifically cover this, and have done since they were first written.

I'll concede for not being JC 100% logical and Accurate on this particular point. ..but if we really had to 100% non flowery with the debates on this forum it would become very boring indeed...then we would be all better off in Switzerland.

Like I already pointed out - unable or unwilling to argue your point, so you go with the emotive...again.

I think its priceless that you present this as some sort of "less boring" way of discussing things. Reads more to me like you're simply trying to score cheap points...and your response only confirms that this is what you're at.

I was merely pointing my frustration at the way everybody seems to jump into the same boat and castigate individuals when it comes to certain issues.

This is what gets me....your rant was you doing exactly what you're moaning in the rant about other people doing.

jc




jc

dathi1

So yes, I'd say it was soundbiting. Its what we refer to as soundbiting when others engage in it, so I don't see why we shouldn't refer to it as soundbiting here

and it renders a ban threat?

See - we did it to him, and you're saying we wouldn't do it to others who held a different political viewpoint.

by in large I've seen lost of soundbites without the threat of bans... in my view no.

Reads more to me like you're simply trying to score cheap points...and your response only confirms that this is what you're at.

Here in Ireland its called taking the piss...its just light humour...lighten up.
I get up early too ye know
anway as for Justin Barret on Today FM...he was quite good over all....as was his contributions during the Nice mark 2 debate.

Ryvita

Originally posted by dathi1
. But my rant...ok it was a rant had nothing to do with sceptre's points. I was merely pointing my frustration at the way everybody seems to jump into the same boat and castigate individuals when it comes to certain issues..especially when they don't fit the neo liberal agenda.

I don't agree with most of what he says. In fact I disagree with them very strongly. This guy has put himself up for the european election so I'm afraid him and his supporters are going to have to deal with the fact that their ideas are going to be debated and disagreed with.

What do you suggest happen? Should we not disagree with him? If I disagree with what he says should I not be able to challenge him/his supporters on this? And more importantly should he/his supporters actually address my concerns? Or does he not want my vote?

Originally posted by dathi1
oh you mean NDP links etc....right I didnt. Just like SF / ira etc....I don't give it much credence. The persons de facto political agenda is all I'm interested in.

Are you actually saying that you don't mind if someone has links to the NDP or to the IRA? That you'll still vote for them if you like what they are saying? Fair enough if you follow the NDP or support the IRA, but if you don't? Do you not think their "political agenda" is not influenced by these other organisations?

Originally posted by dathi1 neo liberal agenda

I am and educated person with a mind of my own. I judge things as I see them. I don't like Justin Barretts politics? I don't think that gives you the right to accuse me and other who disagree with his ideas as having a "neo liberal agenda". Instead of labelling us, why don't you actually address the issues we've raised?

bonkey

Originally posted by Ryvita
Instead of labelling us, why don't you actually address the issues we've raised?

Apparently because its humorous and more interesting.

jc

dathi1

What do you suggest happen? Should we not disagree with him?

absolutley...but threat bans for soundbting with newbies is not the way to do it.

Are you actually saying that you don't mind if someone has links to the NDP or to the IRA?

I think its old hat re hash of a smear campaign during Nice 2....which he done very well considering all the negative publicity. There are plenty of people who vote for Sein Fein ..Ira links or not.

Or does he not want my vote?

that I cant answer

Instead of labelling us, why don't you actually address the issues we've raised?

ok but now and again its nice to let off steam.

Ryvita

Originally posted by dathi1
absolutley...but threat bans for soundbting with newbies is not the way to do it. I think its old hat re hash of a smear campaign during Nice 2....which he done very well considering all the negative publicity.

A smear campaign? Why didn't he sue? He was running a campaign, this damaged his campaign? Why didn't he come out and say it never happened and that he would never have anything to do with the NDP? I'm sorry I don't buy it.

Originally posted by dathi1
There are plenty of people who vote for Sein Fein .. Ira links or not.

If you are voting for Justin Barrett who associates with the NDP then you must accept that he sympathises with their causes. If you do not agree with the NDP then you should not vote for Justin Barrett? Straightforward enough really.

f you agree with far-right politics then by all means go ahead and vote for the guy. I for one hope that you would be in a very small minority.

dathi1

Why didn't he come out and say it never happened and that he would never have anything to do with the NDP

I think he said he attened mettings by the NDP? so the links would be down to attending meetings.

If you do not agree with the NDP then you should not vote for Justin Barrett?

I'll wont be voting for JB on the grounds of his anti secularist policies...however spurious links with the NDP or youth Defence wouldn't prevent me from doing so....especially if I agreed with 70-90% of his policies. I have voted for Sein fein in the past despite their links with parlimiltarisim.

ChipZilla

Why did Justin Barrett change his name from Slevin? I couldn't find anything on the web about it.

sceptre

Originally posted by ChipZilla
Why did Justin Barrett change his name from Slevin? I couldn't find anything on the web about it.

Firstly, I'd like to point out that I only mentioned it in passing in my question list so that anyone who was around at the time of the 1992 USI election would make the clear connection between Justin X and Justin Y, given that I did ask about statements made during that campaign. Secondly, it's nothing sinister, it was his decision to keep his birth surname rather than that of his adoptive parents and I reckon that's his business to be honest.

(in other words, fair enough to ask but not an issue that's anything to do with anything)

ChipZilla

That's fair enough sceptre. I didn't know of the connection between the two names until I read your list, or if he did have something to hide. personally I think he's a despicable little ****, but like you said, his name is his business. Cheers.

PaulHughesWH

What do you define as "far-right" then? Just because some don't allow you people (who don't like to be categorised as "Reds") to impose your world-view on others, doesn't mean you can put us all under the far-right umbrella.

Nationalism was permanently sullied by Hitler and the Nazis, because it gave non-patriots and anti-Catholic elements free reign to discredit anyone who displayed a shred of traditional patriotism. Your main charge against authentic Nationalists is that if we are given a chance, we'll all end up in a society run by bureaucrats, concentration camps and eugenics policies. I'm sorry to disappoint your little fantasies, but thats not the way I think, nor is it the way Justin Barrett thinks.

So while you throw your "far-right" labels, what I am concerned at is this: what happens to those who do not fit into YOUR materialist world view? To all the resolute Catholics and patriots who do not comply with your brand of multiculturalism and disregard for religion? YOUR knee-jerk reactions against people YOU consider to be "far-right" lead to your own little form of oppression. In Russia it led to the Gulag in Siberia. In Austria and Romania it led to true Catholic nationalist movements being trampled on by occultist, racist Nazism and an even more sinister Communism. The message of sane, traditional Nationalism has been lost because of stupid extremes, extremes some of you people are continuing to force upon the world.

Justin Barrett is not extreme, or "far-right", or a Nazi, or anything like that. He is a sane Irish patriot, and is passionate about what he feels is the subjection of Ireland to a new form of colonialism, with more insidious cultural and political aims... i.e., cultural homogenisation, rampant urbanisation, attacks on the family. You people claim to have the last word on the fight against European federalism, when in truth you are nothing but its jackboot. You are all playing your own selfish role in the thought-police, enforcing a politically correct society Brussels dreams of achieving. By supporting abortion, euthanasia, and other similar issues, you aid in the continued destruction of the Catholic religion. By being so gutless in criticising the "open doors" policy after European enlargement, you have successfully allowed Germany, Italy and France to lump their asylum problems on us; as well as endangering Irish jobs by allowing wage discrimination against "the new Europeans." Many of you, I would guess, wouldn't mind seeing the removal of the Irish language from schools across the country, in a politically correct motion to welcome our new arrivals. Not that anyone from Poland would abandon their language (and rightly so) to suit any of us.

Stop advertising the death of Irish culture. Some of us want to keep it.

PaulHughesWH

Originally posted by Ryvita
I don't agree with most of what he says. In fact I disagree with them very strongly. This guy has put himself up for the european election so I'm afraid him and his supporters are going to have to deal with the fact that their ideas are going to be debated and disagreed with.

WHY do you not agree with what he says? The mechanics of not one of Justin's viewpoints have been discussed here satisfactorily. All I see on this site are Nazi, "far-right" jibes, derogatory comments on Justin's appearance and demeanour, and the traditional "racist" retort... Calming down for two minutes and defining racism will reveal to you hotheads that a racist is someone who places their race and culture as superior over others; not someone who works to ensure all races cultures are equally cherished and not homogenised by some false P.C. bureaucracy.

Unless, of course, you all want to continue the "racist" jibes for your own ideological ends? Ryvita, if you are educated and have a mind of your own, why do you and your pals keep posing the same ridiculous "NPD", "IRA" and "far-right" questions instead of looking at the core of what Justin has to say? Are you some kind of a propagandist? Why can you not discuss the REAL issues, or go to Justin's site and inspect his manifesto with an open mind?

Just because he may have spoken at meetings in Germany on pro-life issues doesn't make him some Nazi racial purist. He has often spoken at pro-choice meetings, so by your logic that makes him an abortionist!