Motor tax arrears

dahamsta

The tax on a car I'm interested in expired in February, will I be responsible for arrears if I buy the car?

adam

jayok

Nope. If you check the tax application form on the back it specifically covers this item and say you are only liable from when you actually buy the car.

Check out

http://www.dublincity.ie/services/forms/frmdocs/RF100A.doc

which states

C5 Section 5 is used to calculate the amounts of Motor Tax and Arrears (if any) which are payable. Please follow the instructions at 5.1 to 5.6 below. Note that Motor Tax discs are issued for periods of 3, 6, or 12 whole calendar months and are not issued in respect of months already elapsed. ARREARS must be paid for elapsed months after the expiry of the last Motor Tax disc (5.4 below), unless a Change of Ownership or Non-Use Period applies (5.2, 5.3 below).


Jayo.

Guy:Incognito

afaik you just tax it from when its registered to you. i was left a car by my father when he wen t to spain a couple of years back but wasnt driving it for a while, i knew in advance that itd be off the road for about 6 months so my mother(whos has been handleing the household finances and car stuff etc since day 1, so is generally well enough up on these things) told me to leave it in my dads name till i was going to start using it otherwise id be liable for the back tax. Ended up selling it in the end so never found out.

Short answer is no:D

dahamsta

Fantastic, thanks lads.

adam

unkel

Small thing to add: the tax due to be paid by the new owner starts on the first day of the month of ownership, i.e. if you buy on the 31st July, you have to pay for the whole month of July

What motor is it Adam? Your tax concern mean it has a nice big engine?

TommyK

Hi,

You should know that, because motor tax only runs on a monthly basis, no account will be taken of when during that month the date of sale to you was.

Even if the date of sale was on the last day of the month, you will have to account for that *entire* month either by paying arrears or getting a non-use declaration from the Gardai.

Tommy.

dahamsta

Originally posted by unkel
Small thing to add: the tax due to be paid by the new owner starts on the first day of the month of ownership, i.e. if you buy on the 31st July, you have to pay for the whole month of July

Yeah, if I buy it'll be in the next few days, so that's ok.

What motor is it Adam? Your tax concern mean it has a nice big engine?

525i

adam

unkel

Originally posted by dahamsta
525i

Hope all goes well buying it

a_ominous

Adam, just make sure you don't get a 528i by mistake; couldn't stand another one of them lads on the forums

Cosworth

Originally posted by Stekelly
afaik you just tax it from when its registered to you. i was left a car by my father when he wen t to spain a couple of years back but wasnt driving it for a while, i knew in advance that itd be off the road for about 6 months so my mother(whos has been handleing the household finances and car stuff etc since day 1, so is generally well enough up on these things) told me to leave it in my dads name till i was going to start using it otherwise id be liable for the back tax. Ended up selling it in the end so never found out.

Short answer is no:D

Not true.
you are only liable for the tax if the car is in use on public roads.
If you have a car at home on your own property not in use even tough it is in your name you are not liable for any arrears.
Gary

unkel

Indeed, you'll have to have a Garda sign a standard form with the period the car has been off the road

TommyK

Originally posted by Cosworth
Not true.
you are only liable for the tax if the car is in use on public roads.
If you have a car at home on your own property not in use even tough it is in your name you are not liable for any arrears.
Gary

True, but you'll still need a Garda stamp covering month already elapsed - the M.T.O. will *not* just take you word for it. I believe they have regular visits from a Revenue Auditor who will order them to recall the disc if those type of things are not in order (I guess the Auditors job is to make sure you're not underpaying any tax due).

Tommy..

3cups

Originally posted by a_ominous
Adam, just make sure you don't get a 528i by mistake; couldn't stand another one of them lads on the forums

I hears ya man I hears ya!! Lykee.

Borzoi

Originally posted by TommyK
True, but you'll still need a Garda stamp covering month already elapsed -

True, but in my experience the gaurds are very easy to deal with in this regard, just a matter of a quick trip down to the station for them to sign off on the form

The Muppet

The Gada have no problem stamping these as all they are doing is witnessing your declaration. You are liable for Road Tax from the day you purchase the car even though it takes up to a month to get it registered in your name.

TommyK

Originally posted by The Muppet
The Gada have no problem stamping these as all they are doing is witnessing your declaration. You are liable for Road Tax from the day you purchase the car even though it takes up to a month to get it registered in your name.

You are liable from the *month* that the date of sale falls in, not the day (i.e. if you submit a date of sale as 31/05/04, the you pay tax for the month of may (all of it) onwards.

PBC_1966

Having to take a trip to the police station sounds an unnecessary complication.

Until recently in England, if you wanted to take a car off the road for a while you just didn't renew the tax when it ran out, or you would send the old disc in for a partial refund if a month or more was still left on it.

The rules changed just a short while ago: You are now supposed to sign a "Statutory Off-Road Notification" section on the renewal form, but there's no need to have the declaration witnessed or anything like that. Just sign it and send it back.

Our man in Havana

Don't the Road Tax Gestapo send you a £80 fine if you don't renew your road tax?

PBC_1966

Yes , that's the new penalty introduced recently, backed with stupid ad campaigns. You risk the fine if you don't either (a) renew or (b) send back the "SORN" declaration.

It's raised concerns over cases such as somebody being out of the country for several months and coming back to find not only the tax reminder but also a fine, plus a summons for non-payment of the fine, etc.

echomadman

You are liable for Road Tax from the day you purchase the car even though it takes up to a month to get it registered in your name.

A fucking month, are you serious?

Can you legally drive/insure the vehicle before you recieve the registration in your name?

dahamsta

Originally posted by echomadman
Can you legally drive/insure the vehicle before you recieve the registration in your name?

Yip.

adam

TommyK

Originally posted by echomadman
A fucking month, are you serious?

Can you legally drive/insure the vehicle before you recieve the registration in your name?

It doesn't take a month.

If you have a pre-93 vehicle, you can do it right away at the M.T.O.

If you have a post-93 vehicle, just it to Shannon and it usually comes back in about a week or 10 days.

And you can drive/insure it if the vehicle is already in your name but you just haven't got the new documents yet (Ask the M.T.O. - they'll confirm if it's in your name). You CAN'T drive/insure it until it's transferred to your name though.

Tommy.

Our man in Havana

You CAN'T drive/insure it until it's transferred to your name though.

Oh Yes you can!

Remember that the registered owner may not be the beneficial owner? So long as you own it you can insure it. Own in this sense is being the beneficial owner. You become the registered owner in due course.

dahamsta

I'm insured in my car and it hasn't officially transferred to my name yet, i.e. I haven't received the amended Vehicle Licenceing Certificate yet. If you hold the VLC, you can get insured. Getting a Residents Permit is harder than getting insurance in fact, since they require a signed and stamped Vehicle Enquiry form from the tax office, whereas the insurers don't.

adam

Our man in Havana

You do get a few smart ass insurers that want a copy of the VLC.

sceptre

Originally posted by dahamsta
Getting a Residents Permit is harder than getting insurance in fact, since they require a signed and stamped Vehicle Enquiry form from the tax office, whereas the insurers don't.

That's interesting. In Limerick they just take a peek at the VLC (they may photocopy it, can't remember) and check that you're registered to vote at the address.

TommyK

Originally posted by Bond-007
Oh Yes you can!

Remember that the registered owner may not be the beneficial owner? So long as you own it you can insure it. Own in this sense is being the beneficial owner. You become the registered owner in due course.

If you are driving a car that is not registered in your name - it's still in the previous owners name - then aren't you technically driving *someone elses* car!?

I would'nt like to be making a claim in that case! - You can bet the insurer will try to use that to wiggle out of paying up . . . "So, you're telling me that car you were driving wasn't *really* yours, eh? Right. Pi** off then, no money for you sunshine!".

Tommy.

P.S. - And if your driving it when its not in your name, the last owner will get and tickets or fines that you incur . . . And if you kill someone with it, the Gardai will be knocking on the last owners door . . . etc.

I really don't think the whole change of ownership process exists just to piss you off, ye know!

seamus

Originally posted by PBC_1966
Having to take a trip to the police station sounds an unnecessary complication.

Until recently in England, if you wanted to take a car off the road for a while you just didn't renew the tax when it ran out, or you would send the old disc in for a partial refund if a month or more was still left on it.

The rules changed just a short while ago: You are now supposed to sign a "Statutory Off-Road Notification" section on the renewal form, but there's no need to have the declaration witnessed or anything like that. Just sign it and send it back.

We Irish are a nation of chancers. If we realised that we could just say the car wasn't on the road, without any kind of verification (which is the spirit of this regulation - goes back to small town Gardai knowing everyone), then almost everyone who was a month or two overdue with their tax would do this. There's no avoiding it, the Irish are just always willing to screw the system, even when they are the system :rolleyes:

If you are driving a car that is not registered in your name - it's still in the previous owners name - then aren't you technically driving *someone elses* car!?

I think in this case, the issue of possession -v- ownership comes into play. We need someone here who knows a little about such laws, but afaik, once someone has possession of the car, and no-one is making any claims as to it belonging to someone else, then the cars is theirs. Registration of the car may be a formality in this case. But that's definitely not sure.

I really don't think the whole change of ownership process exists just to piss you off, ye know!

The only problem being that it's not exactly foolproof. You fill in some name and address to register the car. Anyone could easily orchestrate it to register a car neither in their name or address, yet drive around legally.

Victor

Originally posted by sceptre
That's interesting. In Limerick they just take a peek at the VLC (they may photocopy it, can't remember) and check that you're registered to vote at the address.

In Dublin, they just need to be reassured you live there and produce car insurance to say that you live there (I ould know better and will check).

PBC_1966

Originally posted by dahamsta
I'm insured in my car and it hasn't officially transferred to my name yet, i.e. I haven't received the amended Vehicle Licenceing Certificate yet. If you hold the VLC, you can get insured. Getting a Residents Permit is harder than getting insurance in fact, since they require a signed and stamped Vehicle Enquiry form from the tax office, whereas the insurers don't.

adam

Am I missing something? What does a residence permit have to do with registering a vehicle?

seamus

Originally posted by PBC_1966
Am I missing something? What does a residence permit have to do with registering a vehicle?

That got me too. I think that's not a misspelling, he means Resident's permit, as in an Irish Driving Licence. Maybe not.