Should honorary degrees be abolished?

simu

I think the whole honorary degree thing is a bit of a joke. Last year in UCC, an honorary degree was given to Roy Keane, this year to James Bond, er I mean Pierce Brosnan. I don't see the point. Sure, they've done some impressive things in their fields but what has this got to do with the university?

There's probably some PC idea along the lines of making universities seem less forbidding and alien to outsiders behind this but I think that such an aim would be better achieved by improving conditions at schools in poor areas and so on. These conferrings also create publicity for unis but wouldn't it be better for them to achieve publicity based on outstanding work by students and staff?

So, what do ye think? Is it time to end this practice of awarding honorary degrees?

Bungalow Bill

Well it is simply a gesture, its not as if Roy is going to start practicing law now or anything!!

IMO it doesn't belittle a real degree or anything so I say why not

simu

I know it doesn't compare to a real degree but I still don't see the point.

Lioness

i agree
brosnan woz given an honorary law degree. wot the hell does he know about law??!
fair enough give him a drama/theatre one..

Stark

I think they should definitely be abolished. It's just blatant hinting - "Please give us money" on the part of the university. Makes a joke of real degrees. An honoury degree should be something like giving an honory science degree to a guy who's never been to college but still makes great discoveries in science or something.

Red Alert

they're a complete joke and their real purpose is clearly to bring in cash for the universities as well as allowing various know-alls like the registrars to hobnob with celebs and politicians. :mad:

vector

whats with honorary doctorates vs honary degrees?

simu

Originally posted by vector
whats with honorary doctorates vs honary degrees?

A doctorate is a type of degree. Some people only get presented with honorary master's degrees afaik.

deRanged

I think they are necessary for a few reasons.
- Universities need the publicity (money). All the colleges are seriously cash-strapped atm, if this means they get some money then it's a good thing.
- it's important to reward important members of the community - Tim Severin got one last year. I thought it was great that he got one.
- It brings people to college and helps promote a bit of unity with
the community. It promotes 'access'.

An honorary degree is all about recognising the person's contribution in their field - not in the academic field necessarily. By that I mean that they give someone like Pierce Brosnan an honorary doctorate in laws (I think it was) not because he's a great amateur lawyer but to recognise what he's done with his life.

This is coming from someone who's 2 years into working towards a Ph.D in UCC. I'm looking at 2 more years before finishing - all things going well. I think the honorary degree thing is great.

simu

If somebody is donating money to a university, the thought of the benefits their money will provide to the university should be reward enough. If donors want more recognition, then the uni could print a list of those who donated money every year and have a reception for the donors at its launch.

People such as Tim Severin are already admired for their deeds irrespective of the decision of a bunch of bureaucrats in unis to honour them. If they insist on awarding honorary doctorates to people, why shouldn't graduates and staff of the uni have at least some say in this - as a graduate of UCC, I find it embarassing that Pierce Brosnan was awarded an honorourary degree. There are Oscars and other such awards to honour actors. What next? Honorary doctorates for Boyzone for rejuvenating the Irish pop music industry?

Plus, from what I've seen of candidates for honorary doctorates, they are generally chosen in an arbitrary way or depending on the politics of people in charge of nominations.

Does it promote access? I don't see how. Are all the working class children of the country going to take a sudden interest in university education because they saw pictures of a bunch of celebrities getting honorary degrees? If anything, this promotes the idea that all you have to doto have a "successful" life is get famous.

deRanged

Originally posted by simu
the uni could print a list of those who donated money every year and have a reception for the donors at its launch.

They do all that, they've always done that and yet the numbers of donors is dropping off. They need to replace them. They need money.
Yes it's cynical, yes it's commercial. But that's just it - this is business. The university needs money - it needs to be run like a business to survive.

People such as Tim Severin are already admired for their deeds irrespective of the decision of a bunch of bureaucrats in unis to honour them.

All the people getting degrees are already respected. What point are you making?
Are you saying that he was respected enough already and therefore
had his quota?
Did the degree remove some of his respect?
Was it meaningless to the people concerned?

Should we no longer have civic receptions for returning athletes?
"Sure they got the medal or saw the top of everest. That's enough for them"

, I find it embarassing that Pierce Brosnan was awarded an honorourary degree.

Why? Seriously - I'm curious. Initially I thought it was a bit silly having him there but then I noticed that the crowds were there to see him - not the other 3 or 4 people. In fact I can't even remember who they were. Also without him there I don't think there'd have been even nearly as much media coverage.

Plus, from what I've seen of candidates for honorary doctorates, they are generally chosen in an arbitrary way or depending on the politics of people in charge of nominations.

very true. it might be nice if grads and staff and students had some input. some sort of ballot perhaps.

As for access - it was on tv and in lots of newspapers. People all over the country heard about UCC. UCC looked very good in the pictures - makes it look like a nice place to be. It's great advertising.

simu

"Sure they got the medal or saw the top of everest. That's enough for them"

This is what I think. I don't see the point of celebrations. What can I say - I'm weird!

Why? Seriously - I'm curious. Initially I thought it was a bit silly having him there but then I noticed that the crowds were there to see him - not the other 3 or 4 people. In fact I can't even remember who they were. Also without him there I don't think there'd have been even nearly as much media coverage.

I've always associated universities with intellectual curiosity, producing original, complex thoughts and other such qualities. I was disabused somewhat of this notion when I actually went to uni (!) but I still think it's important for unis to place an emphasis on such qualities. Pierce Brosnan, to my mind, does not display any of said qualities.

I'm happy when crowds were going to unis to hear lectures, to learn, to do new things etc but if they're only going there to see famous people I see it as yet another example of the mindless celebrity culture that appears to be permeating every aspect of our lives.

As for access - it was on tv and in lots of newspapers. People all over the country heard about UCC. UCC looked very good in the pictures - makes it look like a nice place to be. It's great advertising.

I'd prefer if UCC could attract students whose intellectual capacities were higher than being capable of thinking "Wow, I'll go to that college - sure James Bond went there" tbh. Besides, UCC already gets a lot of publicity in newspapers for reasons more relevant to its actual purpose - its research departments, the quality of teaching there and so on.

very true. it might be nice if grads and staff and students had some input. some sort of ballot perhaps.

Back to being realistic, that's probably more likely to happen than having the whole rigamarole banned. Then the students (and even staff) could subvert the whole thang by nominating and electing, hmm, say Bosco or Captain Birdseye or some such character!:ninja:

Unpossible

Have to agree with simu,

How that langer Roy Keane was given one is beyond me (then again it was cork, apparently he is some kind of god there).

As for access, giving a film star a degree is not going to help joe soap get into college, nor is it going to help someone trying to make a course choice (hey cool James Bond has a degree in Law, im going to do law too can't be that hard)


Lets be honest its shameless advertising for the college, its a chance for staff to get their mugs on tv and in the paper and for Roy Keane to fool himself into believing hes someone important/intelligent (does mydistain for Roy show? does he even have a leaving cert?)


my (badly spelt) .02c


Now back to my football career, gotta earn that degree

Naos

Originally posted by Stark
I think they should definitely be abolished. It's just blatant hinting - "Please give us money" on the part of the university. Makes a joke of real degrees. An honoury degree should be something like giving an honory science degree to a guy who's never been to college but still makes great discoveries in science or something.

i'd second ur motion sir.

Xerxes

ya they sould get rid of them, the average student spends about 17/18 years in the education system to get a degree and people like pierce swing by UCC for the day (I think it was his first time there ever) and get one. I know these honorary degrees are meaningless but they do take something away from a person that has worked hard for one.