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The Brigadier

Councillor Martin Christie makes statement on suspension from SF
Tuesday, June 22

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Councillor Martin Christie speaking from Blanchardstown this morning about his suspension from Sinn Féin apologised for any embarrassment to his family and to the party. Councillor Christie said

"During a previous employment a number of years ago I inappropriately failed to register the sale of a supply of goods to the value of 1700EURO. This was a moment of stupidity, which was completely out of character and which I have regretted ever since.



"I made a mistake that I corrected immediately by paying the amount back in full and then parted from the company on good terms. No charges or criminal proceedings were ever undertaken.

"I genuinely believed that it was a situation from the past that had been fully and appropriately dealt with and which was now behind me. I apologise for any embarrassment to my family and to Sinn Féin.

"Sinn Féin has suspended me from the party while they look into this matter and pending the outcome of this inquiry I will not be making any further public comment. "

Well after the elections it takes only a few days for the Sinn Fein sleaze to start coming out. How much more is in there.

I find it Ironic that with Sinn Fein taking great steps to point out the sleaze of other parties and to differentiate themselves as offering something else to the disenfranchised it appears they are as suceptible as any other political party.

I found it Ironic as well to read in yesterday's evening Herald that Sinn Fein justice spokesman Aengus O'Snodaigh's wife was involved in a drunken altercation outside Spirit nightclub on Saturday night. Reports of abuse being hurled at Gardai.

What is going to happen next???

Boston

Originally posted by The Brigadier
Well after the elections it takes only a few days for the Sinn Fein sleaze to start coming out. How much more is in there.

I find it Ironic that with Sinn Fein taking great steps to point out the sleaze of other parties and to differentiate themselves as offering something else to the disenfranchised it appears they are as suceptible as any other political party.

I found it Ironic as well to read in yesterday's evening Herald that Sinn Fein justice spokesman Aengus O'Snodaigh's wife was involved in a drunken altercation outside Spirit nightclub on Saturday night. Reports of abuse being hurled at Gardai.

What is going to happen next???

If all politicans followed the above example, Ireland owuld be in a better state. Whats your point. Fair play sinn fein.

BuffyBot

Sinn Fein justice spokesman Aengus O'Snodaigh's wife was involved in a drunken altercation outside Spirit nightclub on Saturday night. Reports of abuse being hurled at Gardai.

I fail to see how politicians following this example would help Ireland become a better state

Boston

Originally posted by BuffyBot
I fail to see how politicians following this example would help Ireland become a better state

That is unfound and for all me know is complete ****e, so I wasn't commenting on it. I was more talkig nabout how your man resigned.

The Brigadier

Go to the herald offices and check the issue in question.

Aengus hasn't tried to sue them.....and he hasn't issued a denial...what does that tell you?

Boston

Originally posted by The Brigadier
Go to the herald offices and check the issue in question.

Aengus hasn't tried to sue them.....and he hasn't issued a denial...what does that tell you?

Tells me that maybe the man doesn't want the attract more attention to his family. It also tells me that the herald is a rag. You didn't mention anybody being charged, so basically its takign a cheap shot at someones family cause they don't like their politics.

The Brigadier

Well make up your own mind....however I doubt if it was Minister McDowell's wife in the same situation Gerry and the boys would have wasted much time dragging it up..

sceptre

Originally posted by Boston
That is unfound and for all me know is complete ****e, so I wasn't commenting on it. I was more talkig nabout how your man resigned.

I can't see anything above about yer man resigning. He's been suspended.

The Brigadier

Can I take this opportunity to make it perfectly clear that I am not in any way claiming Sinn Fein to be more corrupt than any other political party.

What I am saying is that with Sinn Fein spending so much time slinging mud at the Government over sleaze and reaching out for voters sick of this very same slease they really need to make sure they keep themselves whiter than white.

A Sinn Fein TD/MEP/Councillor is no more unlikely to take a backhander or get caught with his/her pants down than any other political figure.

Boston

Originally posted by sceptre
I can't see anything above about yer man resigning. He's been suspended.

Waht ever, he's gone and thats something FF and FG have proven slow to take action on in the past. You can't fault sinn fein on this. The Brigadier, Gerry wouldn't have a say, he has sweet FA to do with anything here. I really think you're being bias. Who knows how SF would react, all we know is how you are reacting.

Boston

Originally posted by The Brigadier
they really need to make sure they keep themselves whiter than white.

And they kicked out someone who was bent, How can you see that as anythign but a good thing. You're going to get this type of thing one way or another, what matters is how the party responses to it.

gandalf

I have no great love for Sinn Fein but to be honest they will have to make more of an effort to get to the FF level. Until they start running down people drunk driving I am willing to give them a chance to explain themselves.

Then again it depends what they were doing in "another" organisation that they are in "no way" connected with now in tha past as well, if you know what I mean.

chewy

so he money resting in his account but he sorted it out at the time why does he need to resign people have done worse?

Fionnan

"I have no great love for Sinn Fein but to be honest they will have to make more of an effort to get to the FF level. Until they start running down people drunk driving I am willing to give them a chance to explain themselves. "


FF have a long way to fall before they start blowing up civilians with bombs(women=kids too), kneecappings, smuggling and protection rackets, armed robberies etc.

bonkey

Originally posted by The Brigadier
What I am saying is that with Sinn Fein spending so much time slinging mud at the Government over sleaze and reaching out for voters sick of this very same slease they really need to make sure they keep themselves whiter than white.

A Sinn Fein TD/MEP/Councillor is no more unlikely to take a backhander or get caught with his/her pants down than any other political figure.

But they have never claimed to be whiter than white, have they? What they have claimed - ot my understanding of it - is that they will not tolerate any level of corruption (or possible corruption) within their ranks.

Unlike FF, FG, et al, who have been busy making hem-ing and haw-ing noises for the past decade and more as scandal after scandal has broken, and who typically take the stance of "arrah, shur, we can't do anything until we spend millions on a tribunal to find if he might have done something wrong, at which point we'll ask for an apology or something".

Sinn Fein are trying to show that their stance is as close to zero tolerance as practical. There is a question surrounding the particulars of this case, and pending its resolution they have suspended Mr. Christie.

Think about it Brigadier. If the major parties in the Dail took the same stance - of suspending their members pending the outcome of investigations into the issues that have surfaced, you can be damn sure there'd be less of the more familiar foot-dragging, excuse-making bullsh1t that pervades almost every single on of the all-too-often-occurring potentially-scandalous issues.

jc

The Brigadier

Originally posted by chewy
so he money resting in his account but he sorted it out at the time why does he need to resign people have done worse?

No he pocketed £1700, got caught and paid it back.

Bonkey, as for understandings of the situation, it is my understanding that one of Sinn Fein's big election strategies was to point out all the corruption in politics today and take the moral high ground.

Certainly a Sinn Fein member is just as much open to corruption as a FF/FG/Lab/PD member.

bonkey

Originally posted by The Brigadier
No he pocketed £1700, got caught and paid it back.

Is there evidence that he got caught and paid it back, or is this just an assumption on your part? His own statement doesn't imply that he paid it back because he got caught in any way shape or form. Now, I wouldn't expect it to imply any such thing, but I'm wondering where you are getting yoru information for this prejudgement from.

Bonkey, as for understandings of the situation, it is my understanding that one of Sinn Fein's big election strategies was to point out all the corruption in politics today and take the moral high ground.

Yes. The party took the moral high ground that - as a party - it would not condone such actions by its members, although apparently the other parties have no problems doing so. It pointed out the corruption the other parties were happy to ignore. It has now shown that it will not walk the same path - it will not turn a blind eye and ignore a similar situation.

Certainly a Sinn Fein member is just as much open to corruption as a FF/FG/Lab/PD member.

Have they ever claimed otherwise? I seriously doubt it, because its a ridiculous statement to make. They claimed that they - as a party - would not tolerate corruption, not that their members were somehow immune to it.

Its the difference between dealing with a problem once made aware of it, and turning a blind eye, not of being immune vs being susceptible to the problem in the first place.

Sinn Fein have no ability to do anything about the corruption in other parties directly, but they are making sure that the party in question can never fall back on the "oh, we were never aware of that... " excuse.

Ultimately, your objection seems to be that Sinn Fein claimed its members were purer than the members of other parties. I'm not convinced they ever made such a thing - they claimed instead that their party does not tolerate corruption, unlike other parties.

Their actions in this case would bear that out exactly, and it is entirely consistent with them pointing out the corruption - or potential corruption - that other parties in turn are turning a blind eye to.

You may see nothing difference between one party turning a blind eye to the misdemeanours of its members, and another one not doing so, but I'm pretty sure that if the names of the parties and those comitting the questionable acts were removed and just the situations described, you'd see it far more clearly.

jc

Originally posted by bonkey


Unlike FF, FG, et al, who have been busy making hem-ing and haw-ing noises for the past decade and more as scandal after scandal has broken, and who typically take the stance of "arrah, shur, we can't do anything until we spend millions on a tribunal to find if he might have done something wrong, at which point we'll ask for an apology or something".

I dunno if thats a fair example to take Bonkey as if you want to go back ten years (or more) in the case of Sinn Féin you really do get into their unambigious links with Bombings shootings et al
It's only lately that they have attempted to sterilise those links post and during the peace process.
Similarally the established parties in a similar time frame are doing or mores the point having to do likewise with their corruption due to the transperency of the tribunals.

bonkey

Originally posted by Earthman
Similarally the established parties in a similar time frame are doing or mores the point having to do likewise with their corruption due to the transperency of the tribunals.

Really?

I wasn't aware that every single politican investigated by the tribunals had been suspended by their parties pending the resolutions of said tribunals.

I guess I'm more out of touch than I thought.

jc

Originally posted by bonkey
Really?

I wasn't aware that every single politican investigated by the tribunals had been suspended by their parties pending the resolutions of said tribunals.

I guess I'm more out of touch than I thought.

jc

Hmmm,
Ray Burke,michael Lowry,Liam Lawlor,Michael collins and Beverly cooper might update you on how difficult it is to remain in one of the established parties these days when exposed as being involved in something shady...
My point simply was that the members of the established parties are finding that probity is paramount now or you end up in front of a tribunal as the accused .
Go back ten years or more in both the case of SF and the established parties and that was not the case.

Of course this may or may not matter a damn to the electorate for as you know,It hasn't stopped Michael Lowry topping the poll or a convicted gunrunner like Martin ferris either.

Villain

Well I say fair play to Sinn Fein for acting in the manner they did, if FF and FG had acted in such a manner years ago perhaps the tribunals would have been finished by now.

I think Mr Melody has shown us a great example of how a party should act.

Mighty_Mouse

Well make up your own mind....however I doubt if it was Minister McDowell's wife in the same situation Gerry and the boys would have wasted much time dragging it up..

Yes McDowell just claims that the Gardai are corrupt and have been harassing his family then fails to substantiate it!

I dont see what the problem is here Brigadair. I think its another example of desperate anti-republicans latching on to any tiny incident in order to take shots at Sinn Fein. It was a minor incident in the mans past before he joined the party which is being appropriately dealth with . It took FF 6 years to get rid of Beverly and what about the likes of Lawlor, Haughey, Berti "dont remember" Ahern? ? If there was even the percentage of honest in the larger parties as shown by Sinn Fein the country would be better off.

As for O'Snodaigh's wife? Who knows what happened but its hardly a reflection on Sinn Fein or front page news? How does it rate against knocking someone down drunk driving and refusing to even offer an apology for it?

BUMP!

I'm not SF or anything but I would like to point out that it was only 1700. I know that the point of the story is that it was illegal but tbh if thats the biggest skeleton in the mans closet I would wait to hear him out. You just dont know - they might have been struggling for money or it might have been an oversight or it might have been one of those things that a young head thinks is a good idea at the time....

Its hardly in the same league as failing to register some of those fat brown envelopes that land in peoples pockets!!!

Hasn't anyone here ever done anything in a moment of haste and then regretted it? Ddoes it make you a bad person or just someone who made a mistake?? Again I'm not SF or anything, I am just trying to bring a bit of perspective to the whole thread...

Paddyo

I think his error was that he did not tell Sinn Fein that he stole the money - not the fact that he did it.

If everyone in Sinn Fein who stole money, robbed banks etc was to be suspended they might have very few people left in the party.

Paddyo

gandalf

Originally posted by Fionnan
"I have no great love for Sinn Fein but to be honest they will have to make more of an effort to get to the FF level. Until they start running down people drunk driving I am willing to give them a chance to explain themselves. "


FF have a long way to fall before they start blowing up civilians with bombs(women=kids too), kneecappings, smuggling and protection rackets, armed robberies etc.

You obviously didn't read the rest of my post.

Then again it depends what they were doing in "another" organisation that they are in "no way" connected with now in tha past as well, if you know what I mean.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Villain

Originally posted by daveirl
What? I thought it was that his son was assaulted and the Gardai or a guard leaked the story to the media and McDowell was rightly pissed off. That's a bit different to the story you outline above.

Or did I miss something?

He made accusations in a general not just relating to his sons case.

Cork

Originally posted by irish1
Well I say fair play to Sinn Fein

Sure, If only FG and FF had links to an illegal army going around with baseball bats?

If only more people in Northern Ireland had the vision of the SDLP and John Hume.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Villain

Originally posted by daveirl
Interesting, that one passed me right by. Fair enough. Don't have any links?

http://www.irishexaminer.com/text/story.asp?j=376544802195&p=3765448x3y8x&n=376544803257

Thats just what a quick search turned up, I remember he promising to bring in legislation but not sure of the date.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.