Happy Clicksilver user

oscarBravo

Originally posted by dub45
Here is a very lengthy example (patronising and supercilious in tone as usual in this particular case) of a non Clicksilver customer defending UTV.

I don't actually see it as "defending" anyone; simply pointing out the facts. Feel free to stick your fingers in your ears and go "nah nah I'm not listening" though, which is pretty much what you just did.

Through reductions in the wholesale price of broadband UTV had the option to pass on savings to existing customers.

Maybe you missed the part where they did pass on the savings to those customers who weren't planning on bailing at the earliest opportunity.

All other broadband providers appear to have passed on those savings straight away to their existing customers - UTV only passed on the savings to customers who commited themselves to a further 12 month contract. That is the reality of what happened.

Absolutely. The further reality is that the vast bulk of UTV customers jumped at the chance to save a fortune.

(I dont know what acknowledging the realities of the market place have to do with it).

That much, at least, is obvious.

Any potential customers of UTV should be aware of this.

Oh, I'm sure they are.

oscarBravo

Originally posted by jonski
Do you really think that burying your head in the sand can fix the problem ? , do you really think that posting 600 lines of traceroute for 12 months is not enough to make them acknowledge there is a problem ? Do you really think that if they can't fix this they should pretend that it doesn't exist ? Do you really think I shouldn't be pissed off ?

I wasn't really having a go at you, John - more at dub45 for apparently thinking that posting traceroutes was all it took to fix the problem, and that the fact that the problem wasn't fixed proved that UTV didn't care.

I have had enough of people thinking I have a vendetta against UTV , I have spent my 12 month contract with unplayable pings for the majority with hardly no acknowledgement of a problem . They make an effort for a small while and then forget about it .

I don't think you have a vendetta. I do think that Clicksilver has proved to be a bad fit for your needs. I understand that you'll almost certainly switch providers as soon as you can. I don't believe that UTV ought to put themselves in a position where they lose money on you.

dub45

Originally posted by oscarBravo
I wasn't really having a go at you, John - more at dub45 for apparently thinking that posting traceroutes was all it took to fix the problem, and that the fact that the problem wasn't fixed proved that UTV didn't care. .................

I mentioned that gamers had posted information in the support group because UTV have regulary requested that this be done for example some requests from UTV in the support group over the past few months.

Kieran, could you post an "ipconfig /all" as well as a few pings/traceroutes

Just made there - could I please (sorry....) ask for a few more pings

I do realise that it requires technical knowledge and will to fix problems. I am sure UTV have the former available to them but as for the latter this is UTV's latest response on the 28th June in the support group: (Keep in mind that this issue has been ongoing since Clicksilver started as you read the response)

so I've escalated these
reports, yet again :-( , to our network team for investigation. So far they
have been unable to come back to me with anything that I can pass on as to
the cause (either internally or externally). I will post back as soon as I
have anything.

jonski

Originally posted by oscarBravo
I understand that you'll almost certainly switch providers as soon as you can.

Unfortunately yes , draged it out till the last minute hoping it could be fixed . But I rekon I'm off by the end of this week .

I don't believe that UTV ought to put themselves in a position where they lose money on you.

I kinda hoped they wouldn't have let themselves stay in a position where they would lose me and my money .

John.

tomk

I had a vain hope when I started this thread that at least one other happy UTV customer would join in, contributing some balance and thereby reducing the chances of it becoming yet another predictable argument involving the usual suspects.

Obviously, this has not happened.

Bizmark, Chief, Coyote - please close this thread. I've made my point, and that's all I can do. Those who continually wish to state and restate their positions can start their own threads. I am unlikely to contribute to any future threads here with "UTV" or "Clicksilver" in the subject line, as they are generally hijacked, just as this one was.

dub45

I am sorry that you did not manage to get an orgy of praise for Clicksilver.

But does the fact that only people prepared to defend it passionately are non users of the system not say something about it?

At the moment for speeds Clicksilver is fine. But for lots of people this is first lengthy period of consistency. I would argue that since broadband became available Clicksilver has been the most disrupted of the main providers offerings. You only have to look back on the threads here for instance. One of these major disruptions was Iol's fault.

For pings they are disastrous as far as games users are concerned - for customer service - they can be variable - a lot of the time the support group is very very helpful at the moment it appears to be going through one of its neglected periods.

As regards how they treat customers when savings are available - they are the only ISP who required customers to sign up for another 12 months to avail of the new prices. Some customers had no difficulty with that.

I still find it strange that someone finds it necessary to start a thread to praise UTV!
By all accounts IOL and Eircom customers get pretty consistent speeds and pings with minimal disruptions why do they not find it necessary to start similar threads?:)

And given that your post ended

I'm now going to put on my flameproof pyjamas, sit back, and enjoy the fireworks.

how can you claim that the thread was hijacked?

kin9pin

Sorry if I offend you oscarBravo, but I've been following this thread and it looks to me like you're on a wind up.
dub45 has put forward very good points on why UTV customers MAY decide not to renew their contract. As a non clicksilver customer your sole aim on this thread seems to be provocation. I'm sure if dub45 said black is black you would convince us it is actually white!

Ripwave

Originally posted by dub45
But you are not a customer of UTV if you are so concerned about them and enthusiastic why arent you?

Do you think my username is a coincidence?

Ripwave

Originally posted by jonski
And do you not think that people that were 50/50 , well this just pushed them over ?

Get real - if you were 50/50, you'd go for the savings. The only people who had a problem with the new contract were those who did not want to continue with UTV.

Ripwave

Originally posted by dub45
I am sure if wholesale prices had goine up UTV would have managed to pass them on very quickly to all of their customers.

And I'm sure you would have insisted on sticking with the terms of your existing contract!

jonski

Originally posted by Ripwave
Get real - if you were 50/50, you'd go for the savings. The only people who had a problem with the new contract were those who did not want to continue with UTV.

I was 50/50 , even more , If the ping issue was sorted I would have continued with UTV no question , it is the only problem I have with them .

dub45

Originally posted by Ripwave
Do you think my username is a coincidence?

Oddly enough I dont spend time analysing peoples usernames. You are not a customer oF UTV and you are defending them thats my point.

dub45

Originally posted by Ripwave
And I'm sure you would have insisted on sticking with the terms of your existing contract!

I would of course but I am sure UTV in their infinite wisdom had provided for such eventualities.

oscarBravo

Originally posted by kin9pin
Sorry if I offend you oscarBravo,

I'm surprisingly difficult to offend.

but I've been following this thread and it looks to me like you're on a wind up.

Then maybe you should follow the thread more closely:

dub45 has put forward very good points on why UTV customers MAY decide not to renew their contract.

Point out the post where I said they shouldn't.

As a non clicksilver customer your sole aim on this thread seems to be provocation.

My sole aim is to point out that dub45 keeps posting his opinions as if they were facts.

I'm sure if dub45 said black is black you would convince us it is actually white!

See, there's the difference. "black is black" is a self-evident fact. "UTV pulled a fast one its as simple as that!" is not, and I feel obliged to challenge it.

dub45

Originally posted by oscarBravo
I'm surprisingly difficult to offend. Then maybe you should follow the thread more closely: Point out the post where I said they shouldn't. My sole aim is to point out that dub45 keeps posting his opinions as if they were facts. See, there's the difference. "black is black" is a self-evident fact. "UTV pulled a fast one its as simple as that!" is not, and I feel obliged to challenge it.

In my opinion UTV pulled a fast one. The FACT that mainly non cusomers are passionate in their defence of that action continues to strike me as very strange indeed.

jonski

IF! the ping issue was sorted , just so ye don't think that i am dreaming this up

http://www.jonstapleton.utvinternet.com/ping.htm


like that since 8:15 tonight and still that way @ 11:20

been the same for the last 2 weeks.

Ripwave

Originally posted by jonski
I was 50/50 , even more , If the ping issue was sorted I would have continued with UTV no question , it is the only problem I have with them .

Jon, you've made it abundantly clear that you would NOT be continuing with UTV based on the service you had been receiving up to then. That's not 50/50, and your position wasn't affected in the slightest by UTVs decision to offer new, lower priced 12-month contracts to those who wanted them.

You'd rather pay €40/month for a service that works for you than €30/month for a service that you don't find satisfactory (and I think even you'll admit that you're in a minority in that regard - most people aren't gamers don't have your ping problems). I'm not arguing with your decision - you've been entirely open and forthright about it, and, unlike dub45, you've made it abundantly clear that you don't have it in for UTV, and that, for other users, it might be a completely satisfactory solution.

jonski

I know what you are saying Ripwave , but after the easter outage the pings seemed to improve and stablize , when UTV came out with the new price I decided to hold off and see how things went , and yes , even though I didn't really like the 'sign up for another 12 months ' idea , it wouldn't have bothered me enough to make me not sign .


god damn it I'm a big child and I want to play games!!!!!!!

ps: off for the rest of the week so i can play during the day

John

andrew163

I am a clicksilver customer. In my experience, UTV's good points and bad points:

Good points:
- Fairly reliable speed. 50KB/s to 55KB/s on most web servers, and in P2P tools. There were problems with this in the past but they've been sorted.
- Downtime has reduced dramatically. They seem to have handled that problem.
- Good customer service via phone and email
- They give you an option of which action to take when you use up your monthly cap

Bad points:
- Pings are worse than dialup most of the time, making it impossible for online gaming (see jonski's posted screenshot). Which quite alot of users do. When they're at their best, you get 47ms to jolt.co.uk, and even worse to anything in Ireland because their traffic is routed through London first. 63ms to boards and gaming365.ie. Pings are also very unstable when they're at their best, jumping between 47ms and 110ms. This issue is ongoing for a very long time and needs to be fixed. Unless they fix it, it will only get worse as more new users come online.
- They don't seem to have a clue what's causing the pings or how to fix it.
- The contract thing, imo, was a nasty move... but ill let dub45 battle that one out
- The default USB modem they send out isn't great for anything but a basic single-user configuration. IOL and eircom both send you routers for free. UTV charge you €50 to get the router on sign-up or €75 to upgrade from USB.

just my 2c.

oscarBravo

Originally posted by andrew163
- The contract thing, imo, was a nasty move... but ill let dub45 battle that one out

No, please, jump in! dub45 can use all the help he can get. So far, all I've been able to establish is that UTV "pulled a fast one," and his evidence for that "fact" is that non-Clicksilver users are defending UTV. :dunno:

dub45

I really think UTV should start a support group for those who it would appear would love to be with UTV but for some reason cannot.

Virtual Clicksilver - for those who would love to surf with us but who canont for some reason - the world can be so unfair - but we cherish you and your support (The radio ad to be read in a soft Daniel O'Donnell type voice of course)

For those people who love UTV because they are not Eircom - who never have had to put up with UTV's inadequacies and jump to their defence no matter what - those same people who would, I would guess, have happily joined in and slaughtered Eircom and IOL if they have not passed on the wholesale savings. Who would never tire I would guess of complaining if those same providers had similar ping problems as UTV and did not correct them

dub45

Originally posted by oscarBravo
......... So far, all I've been able to establish is that UTV "pulled a fast one," and his evidence for that "fact" is that non-Clicksilver users are defending UTV. :dunno:

I am glad that you have established that and that you have noticed that non clicksiler users are defending UTV thats remarkably perceptive on your part.

dub45

Originally posted by Ripwave
,

....unlike dub45, you've made it abundantly clear that you don't have it in for UTV, and that, for other users, it might be a completely satisfactory solution.

How can recounting UTV's behaviour be described as 'having it in' for them? Is there something wrong with stating a fact about UTV? Are we supposed to keep it secret that they did not pass on savings that were available to them unless you signed up for a further 12 month contract unlike other providers?

oscarBravo

Originally posted by dub45
For those people who love UTV because they are not Eircom - who never have had to put up with UTV's inadequacies

I'll go out on a limb here and assume this is aimed at least partly at me.

I was a UTV customer from September 2002 until about a week ago. I was happy. I didn't have Clicksilver (only because I couldn't), but if I had, I wouldn't have given a toss about pings.

and jump to their defence no matter what - those same people who would, I would guess, have happily joined in and slaughtered Eircom and IOL if they have not passed on the wholesale savings.

This is the IOL/EsatBT who are still charging €340 a month for the same service I'm paying Netsource €160 a month for? Methinks your ire would be better directed elsewhere...

Who would never tire I would guess of complaining if those same providers had similar ping problems as UTV and did not correct them

I don't care about pings. I haven't defended UTV's pings.

I have, on the other hand, repeatedly pointed out that UTV charge a tenner a month less than anyone else. "Not passing on the wholesale savings"? Right.

How can recounting UTV's behaviour be described as 'having it in' for them? Is there something wrong with stating a fact about UTV? Are we supposed to keep it secret that they did not pass on savings that were available to them unless you signed up for a further 12 month contract unlike other providers?

Go on, finish it: "...unlike other providers who charge €120 more for the duration of that 12-month contract."

dub45

Yawn!!!!! and at least state the complete position - UTV are currently charging some of their customers more that it would cost those customers to be with Eircom.

And I will say it again UTV did not pass on the wholesale savings available to them to customers unless those customers signed up for a further 12 month contract with them. That is a fact history etc. As a result of that decision some UTV customers are currently paying more than Eircom customers for their broadband.

dahamsta

Originally posted by dub45
Yawn!!!!!

Wow! I'm convinced!

Moriarty

Maybe he's given up.

We can only hope.

dub45

Originally posted by Moriarty
Maybe he's given up.

We can only hope.

Sorry to dash your hopes it was a work in progress:) No one is forcing you to read the thread, dont forget - its good for insomniacs though!

oscarBravo

Originally posted by dub45
UTV are currently charging some of their customers more that it would cost those customers to be with Eircom.

All of whom were made aware of their options, and none of whom are being charged a penny more than they signed up for at the beginning of their current contract.

And I will say it again UTV did not pass on the wholesale savings available to them to customers unless those customers signed up for a further 12 month contract with them.

Translation: UTV made a business decision not to lose money on those customers who, in effect, signaled their intention not to stay with the company; and to pass on the wholesale savings - and then some - to the rest.

That is a fact.

As a result of that decision some UTV customers are currently paying more than Eircom customers for their broadband.

As a result of whose decision, precisely? Oh yes, their own.

Keep digging, I've got all day.

Apologies to anyone I'm contributing to boring to tears, but you never know - it might get interesting.

jonski

ye could just agree to differ:eek: