Charging for web work; how long is a piece of string?

dangerman

Hi, couldn't decide which forum to post this in work/this one, figured this one would have more people viewing it who know more and have decent advise.

Basically I have a big company wanting me to do a few days work for them, simply taking a HTML based tool they've created and adding in some graphics.

- Come up with a few different colour schemes etc. to make their tool look very nice for clients.

It will literally be a few jpeg's and some table colourings and I'd say I'll spend max 3 days on it. - The hardest bit will be coming up with ideas for making it look cool.

Anyone want to take a ballpark figure at how much I should charge? I'm at a complete loss on this one. I have several years relevant experience etc. but I haven't done brief contract work like this before. I'm afraid that the figure that pops into my head: 500 euro, is either too high or far too low. I guess a daily rate would make sense in this case. I worked a while ago on an interactive cdrom and got 100 a day for that; so 300 - i'm just aware that this company is used to paying out serious cash to ad agencies & graphic designers.

Any ideas? For the sake of arguement, lets say its
5x jpegs and then the jpegs done up in 3 or 4 different colour schemes/styles. Next week I have to go in and look at the tool and discuss it with them and they said they'd like a quote there and then - just afraid of that moment where I pop a number at them and whether they go 'thats grand' or they go 'eh...what?'

Any advice very much appreciated.

dahamsta

If they go "eh what", you simply drop the price. And remember that they could well go "eh what" if you charge too little too. I find that the bigger the company, the more likely this is to happen.

If you're any good, I'd recommend going higher. Think about it: If you're good you should have no problem charging (at least!) €50/hour, which is €400/day. But obviously there are other factors, like getting future work out of them, referrals, etc.

You're probably being too generous with €500 for three days work. My advice, and it is only advice, would be to aim for €750 minimum. If you're any good.

EDIT: Oh, and forget about what the actual work IS. If they really want you to do the work, they appreciate your skills, in which case all that counts is how long it takes.

adam

RicardoSmith

I'd say 200-300 a day myself. But if you are really good and don't really need the work, then obviously charge and arm and a leg, you just might get it.

dangerman

Thanks for the advice guys.

I'd say 200-300 a day myself. But if you are really good and don't really need the work, then obviously charge and arm and a leg, you just might get it.

I honestly considered this, just going in and asking for a huge sum. But it's quite risky. I want to er on the side of caution simply because I want to secure repeat work.

I'm thinking around 200-300 a day like ricardo said. 400 a day just sounds so high for just a bit of pixel pushing? I mean if I was jsp/javabeaning etc. then yeh ok.

I get your point dahamsta about it doesn't matter what the work is, just how long it will take, but I just can't shake the above.

So the plan then; offer a reasonable rate and then completely blow 'em away with mad skillz etc.

RicardoSmith

Have to say that I rarely get repeat work from places I do a cut rate. So if you are doing the job make sure that you get enough money to make it worthwhile, after you cover your expenses, tax, time and have added a profit to it. Bill subsequent work as it comes. Don't take into account future work that you haven't got. It may never happen.

As soon as someone mentions the possibility of future work to me when discussing a job, the works CHEAP SKATE and SKINFLINT come to mind. Believe it when you have a deposit for it in the bank, and the cheque has cleared.

I'm very careful and I still get taken for a ride occasionally. Theres some companies that seem to do all their work by hiring freelancers and then not paying them.

dangerman

yikes, see now your talking about a world I know very little about - as I mentioned I haven't done this kind of short contract stuff before.

In this case I know the woman involved in hiring me so I think there's little chance of underhandedness. But I take your point about under-charging. - I definately don't want to create the impression of 'mates-rates' because that would be unprofessional.

I work as an IT trainer, and I may just take the rate I get from that and translate that to 320 a day. From what you've been saying this sounds like the most sensible thing to do.

There's a few web consultants in work I'm going to ask them about it as well.

Thanks again.

tylerdurden

I'm thinking around 200-300 a day like ricardo said. 400 a day just sounds so high for just a bit of pixel pushing? I mean if I was jsp/javabeaning etc. then yeh ok.

Aren't you devaluing the creative process there somewhat? As you said the hardest part will be coming up with the ideas. That's what you're charging for...

I find if you don't charge (properly) for your work the majority of people don't value it.

An approach I take sometimes is to say "I think you should spend X on this to do it properly. What's your budget?"

Then you can negotiate from there. You have stated your price, but opened the door for negotiation. This works well in situations where you don't wish to scare custom away.

It is always a piece of string type question - let's face it you could spend days perfecting something or shove it out in a matter of hours warts and all if so needed.

You can also offer a range of solutions at different prices. If you can provide the solution for them then I think 200 a day is low. I think 300 a day is low too, but not as outrageously so!

Good luck.
TD

jank

What exactly are you doing again, just getting a few images and incorperating it into some package they have there


So its basicly photoshop or is it

im just curious thats all

dangerman

I'm pretty much set on charging the same I do for IT training; 320 a day.

Jank; I'm not 100% sure as I haven't been in to see the product yet, but yes, It seems as if they want to come up with a few schemes and styles for their existing product. So just photoshop. I've no idea yet if they want to keep it strict corporate colours etc. or if i'll have lots of freedom etc.

Thanks again for the advice guys. Granted I was way off target with my initial feelings, so this has helped no end.

The Corinthian

The going rate for design and basic HTML rate appears to be between € 250 and € 500 per day at the moment for freelancers and beyond that both RicardoSmith and dahamsta seem to have made good suggestions that would cover pretty much everything.

However, other than the rate how you charge is a strategic issue. Try to avoid any set price and judge everything in terms of estimates - if they demand for a set price, add a reasonable safety time margin. Set out in writing (email) a spec of what you are willing to deliver (number of design concepts, functionality, etc.), point by numbered point. When, inevitably, they look to make changes and drag things out, immediately advise them in writing (email) that this is a change request (referencing that it does not appear on the agreed spec) and you’ll be charging extra for it.

The above is applicable in all contracts, but in particular for large organisations where competing committees, middle managers and the inevitable office politics that pervades means that they’ll be changing their minds for months. And the last thing you want is to support their indecision for free.

dangerman

Just to bring this thread to a close...

I had the meeting with the client today and it went really well, and we settled on 320 a day. Only a few days work as expected, but it could snowball.

Thanks a million to all you guys who gave advice, it really made a big difference to my attitude going into the place today.

And now, I suppose, queue jokes about fees for advice /how many beers I owe you all.

dahamsta

Why thank you TC!

Well done dangerman, good to hear you went for it and pulled it off. You owe me a beer.

adam