Whither IOFFL ? : A primer for the 2004 AGM

De Rebel

Most of us are aware of the circumstances which led to the formation of Ireland Off-Line some years ago.
Most of us are aware of the huge accomplishments which we have seen since that time.
Most of us will recognise that while IOFFL did not do it all single-handedly, it certainly was at the very least an influence for the good. I believe its role to have been significantly more important than that.

To summarise the achievements, as I see them:

• Multiple internet connectivity options available from multiple vendors
• Tiered offerings available to suit different pockets/needs
• Eircom’s stranglehold significantly reduced
• DSL based broadband rollout underway
• Flat Rate (partial) options available
• A potential vertically integrated offering, independent of eircom, on the cards (MANs+ESB+MSE+Various ISPs)
• A framework for an alternative service for the geographically challenged (Group Data Schemes)
• A Minister and a Government Department that are aware and that have shown a willingness to listen and to react.
• Most importantly, my 2 monthly eircom bill reduced from €400+ (ISDN based) to €175 (DSLbased). T H A N K S – I O F F L !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is a fantastic achievement for a voluntary organisation. Sure we didn’t achieve it all on our own, but in terms of the objectives of independent lobbying bodies this represents an almost unprecedented level of success.

There is a lot to be done (Further price reductions, Service Improvements, Speed improvements, Increased in the caps, and most of all a big push to improve affordable availability, especially outside urban areas). The remaining battles are the battles that are being fought in every other developed country. But the GREAT battles have been fought and won – Ireland is No Longer Offline.

So, whither IOFFL…………….

Do we need a lobbying group for the making available of Internet Connectivity? DO we change our focus, broadening out to take other issues onboard? Do we have a huge celebratory party from the accumulated profits and wind the whole thing up?

What do you think?????
What are you willing to contribute?????
Are you willing to attend the AGM?????
Are you willing to serve on the incoming committee?????
Will you attend the wind-up booze-up?


I’ll reserve my opinion, though I obviously have one. I’ll be attending the AGM, but stepping down form the committee. I hope that as many of you as possible will either attend the AGM in person or voice your opinion here.

And bear in mind that IOFFL is not some aloof body with an independent existence and a need to self perpetuate. It consists of flesh and blood people who have better things to be doing but who have given of themselves for the greater good. People like Darren*** DonegalMan, Dangger, Xian, SkepticOne, Dahamsta, Sceptre, Dustaz, Muck, MDR, BK, Paddy20, Shinzon and many many more, all of whom have contributed in their own way.


*** One of the most eloquent and dignified pieces of prose I have ever read; and certainly the driver in getting me to spend my time and money assisting in furthering IOFFL’s objectives.

Moriarty

Originally posted by De Rebel
Most of us are aware of the circumstances which led to the formation of Ireland Off-Line some years ago.
Most of us are aware of the huge accomplishments which we have seen since that time.
Most of us will recognise that while IOFFL did not do it all single-handedly, it certainly was at the very least an influence for the good. I believe its role to have been significantly more important than that.

To summarise the achievements, as I see them:

• Multiple internet connectivity options available from multiple vendors
• Tiered offerings available to suit different pockets/needs
• Eircom’s stranglehold significantly reduced
• DSL based broadband rollout underway
• Flat Rate (partial) options available
• A potential vertically integrated offering, independent of eircom, on the cards (MANs+ESB+MSE+Various ISPs)
• A framework for an alternative service for the geographically challenged
• A Minister and a Government Department that are aware and that have shown a willingness to listen and to react.
• Most importantly, my 2 monthly eircom bill reduced from €400+ (ISDN based) to €175 (DSLbased). T H A N K S – I O F F L !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is a fantastic achievement for a voluntary organisation. Sure we didn’t achieve it all on our own, but in terms of the objectives of independent lobbying bodies this represents an almost unprecedented level of success.

There is a lot to be done (Further price reductions, Service Improvements, Speed improvements, Increased in the caps, and most of all a big push to improve availability, especially outside urban areas). The remaining battles are the battles that are being fought in every other developed country. But the GREAT battles have been fought and won – Ireland is No Longer Offline.

I think almost everyone can agree that Ireland Offline has played an important role in the area.

Originally posted by De Rebel
So, whither IOFFL…………….

Do we need a lobbying group for the making available of Internet Connectivity? DO we change our focus, broadening out to take other issues onboard? Do we have a huge celebratory party from the accumulated profits and wind the whole thing up?

What do you think?????

I think that IO should expand their remit into a general consumer internet lobby group. Lately there's been some general telecoms issues (porn diallers being the main example) leaking in here that I think should be outside of any future IO remit - let some other group (perhaps even affiliated to IO if theres enough intrest to set one up?) lobby on general telecoms issues, there's more than enough problems in the internet sector alone to keep us occupied.

Issues that should be dealt with by IO would be caps, quality of service, availability of service, price, speed and additional extras - not neccessarly in that order. I'm sure that I'm also missing out on a few other issues that would be more than relevant.

Originally posted by De Rebel
What are you willing to contribute?????

I can contribure time and, er.. that may be it for the moment. I'm regularly psuedo-broke, so I can't help out with money much if that were needed.

Originally posted by De Rebel
Are you willing to attend the AGM?????

Fingers crossed I'll be there on saturday.

Originally posted by De Rebel
Are you willing to serve on the incoming committee?????

I'm willing if I'm wanted.

Originally posted by De Rebel
Will you attend the wind-up booze-up?

Come on now, in all seriousness how many people do you see refusing a free pissup

Originally posted by De Rebel
I’ll reserve my opinion, though I obviously have one. I’ll be attending the AGM, but stepping down form the committee. I hope that as many of you as possible will either attend the AGM in person or voice your opinion here.

And bear in mind that IOFFL is not some aloof body with an independent existence and a need to self perpetuate. It consists of flesh and blood people who have better things to be doing but who have given of themselves for the greater good. People like Darren*** DonegalMan, Dangger, Xian, SkepticOne, Dahamsta, Sceptre, Dustaz, Muck, MDR, BK, Paddy20, Shinzon and many many more, all of whom have contributed in their own way.


*** One of the most eloquent and dignified pieces of prose I have ever read; and certainly the driver in getting me to spend my time and money assisting in furthering IOFFL’s objectives.

Indeed. I'd be loath to see IO just fizzle out slowly instead of a decision being made to shut up shop if that's what the majority of the membership wanted.

ekehoe

quote:

What do you think?????
What are you willing to contribute?????
Are you willing to attend the AGM?????
Are you willing to serve on the incoming committee?????
Will you attend the wind-up booze-up?

I think we've done brilliantly, but that might be a bit prejudiced. :-)

I do think there are more issues to get to (no, I can't list them, I haven't had my morning tea, and someone is asking me to play trains...). But I'll try to come up with some when I'm consious.

I will be at the AGM, and hopefully staying on the committee :-)

And, I agree...who wouldn't miss a good pissup?

Ronan|Raven

I shall wander up, will be in Roscommon town that morning anyway so not much further to Athlone.

MarcusGarvey

(I won't be able to make it to Athlone so I'll post my views here)

IOFFL has done a great job and I'd personally like to thank everyone that's been involved with them.

I definetly think that IOFFL has influenced a lot and I have no doubt that when EsatBT and Eircom do anything Internet related now they probably think how IOFFL will react to it. UTV already have consumers in mind and we have seen them interact here so we know they're towing the IOFFL line

Like Moriarty, I think that IOFFL should broaden it's scope to become a Consumer Watchdog on Telecom issues. The IOFFL forum is practically that now. It seems that's what the people want from IOFFL. There is definetly a void that needs filling and with IOFFLs existing contacts and links in the Telco area, who better to do it ?

The aims of getting the various competitive packages out there has occured. Getting coverage to everyone that wants it is still an issue and I kind of go against what I think IOFFL was saying where not everyone can get DSL so alternatives should be used.

I think this is giving in slightly and that the aim should tend to an idealistic goal moreso than a practical. Allowing them(Eircom) the 15% means they'll use that as a buffer and will fail to invest in any improvements that could bring the number down to 5% or 1% etc

I also don't think wireless is mature enough right now to be seen as the saviour for rural broadband.

I also think that Comreg should be getting more sh1t every day for their inaction. Comreg is corrupt. The regulator is in the pocket of Eircom and every single thing they do seems to be done in order to make Eircom money. They simply don't give a damn about the consumer or about competition.

I think a major aim of IOFFL if it does continue on is to pressure the Government for an investigation into Comreg and its usefulness to Ireland. The minister should be made aware on a non-stop basis about how much damage Comreg is doing.

I know IOFFL prefers to charm their way when it comes to the government but when it comes to Comreg they have not been sucessful.

That's my piece.

Again I want to say that IOFFL so far has served the Irish people well and we should all acknowledge this.

oscarBravo

I'll be there (not that I have much choice, having committed to giving a presentation! )

I also have my own views on the future direction of The Struggle, and I look forward to hammering them out on Saturday.

Originally posted by MarcusGarvey
I also don't think wireless is mature enough right now to be seen as the saviour for rural broadband.

I'm really curious about this view. I mean, exactly what else is going to provide rural broadband? Satellite? Shyeah, right. Copper? Drive from Westport to Murrisk sometime for a graphic illustration of the state of the copper in rural Ireland. Mature enough? Wireless works - that's all I ask of it.

dahamsta

I agree with Moriarty on IO's remit.

I'll be at the AGM.

I think my bum looks big in committees.

I agree with Moriarty and Elana on beer.

While I can understand MarcusGarvey's frustration with regard to wireless, I think that if anything, wireless is coming to maturity and gaining acceptance at this stage. However, and this is a big however, I think IrelandOffline needs to back off a little and treat it like any other access solution. The reality is that DSL is the primary access solution right now, and it's going to remain so for a few years to come. Preaching the good is admirable, but wasteful.

I disagree strenously with the same poster's comment on ComReg and corruption. Comreg isn't corrupt, it's incompetent, in the same way a highly intelligent individual can often be incompetent in social situations. They have difficult communicating, difficulty interacting, and find it nearly impossible to take an authoritative role; and they're so embarrassed by these difficulties they lie to cover them up. ComReg is, I'm sorry to say, a Nerd.

adam /makes an 'L' on his forehead

spongebob

I see a logical city and country dichotomy for a while.

Cityfolk have to take what eircom give them through a false wholesale system. Thats overpriced 512k . City folk should be getting VDSL and SDSL through a competitive LLU market which allows innnovative product to flourish. This is not happening, eircom are strangling the market. Look no further than the UK at the moment to see how serious the regulator is ...and the BT competition like Tiscali.

County folk need ANYTHING but VSAT, .....that should be Wimax wireless, maybe not as good as the city products but a lot better than 0k Functional Internet at present.

I said before that IoffL should have separate working groups to lobby and act on both those fronts for the next while....with one chair who can switch hats as necessary.

The government allegedly wants us all to have 5mbit as standard by March 2005 .......... the solutions will be different , one wired and one wireless.

M

dahamsta

Answer the question Muck, will we have the opportunity to buy you a pint or not?

spongebob

beers in Seáns ?

M

oscarBravo

By the way: I'll be driving from Ballina on Saturday, and back that afternoon. If anyone wants a lift from around these parts, lemme know.

sceptre

On the IOFFL remit I agree with Moriarty. Apart from the initial access, there is a pile off Net-related issues that IOFFL could concentrate on as long as the remit was defined.

Again, like Moriarty, I can contribute time. At least what time I can. And whatever I bring to the table, which may or may not be worth something. As for money I'm currently negotiating with a group of church mice for a loan so there's not much of that there. Time and bad comedy then.

Highly unlikely I'll be at the AGM unfortunately (wedding weekend, see other thread for no real extra information)

On the committee, I'm willing to serve. While I've finally gained DSL at a reasonable 30 notes a month, there are people who for various reasons (cost and all the reasons for lack of availability) can't get it and may not get it. So I'd like to help out. If the best way to help out is to be on the committee then I'm interested in doing that. "Willing if I'm wanted" is a good enough phrase to sum up the above.

Post meeting boozeup - see above.


Given that I'm unlikely to be there on Saturday, I'd like to thank Christian, the rest f the outgoing committee and everyone who's helped out during the year. I'm aware that while we're still making progress, we're not progressing as fast as we'd like in the areas that we'd like progress to be in. Nevertheless we're still making progress and I'd like to thank you all for the contributions you've made towards that.

dahamsta

Originally posted by sceptre
As for money I'm currently negotiating with a group of church mice for a loan so there's not much of that there.

Any chance I can get their number off you seamus?