Nicky Butt - a steal at £2.5 million

therecklessone

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/n/newcastle_united/3928073.stm

If he does go for £2.5 million its a great bit of business for the Toon. I just wish Santini and Arnensen were showing a bit of interest...

Raskolnikov

I think Ferguson is foolish for letting him go, especially for that price. Keane certainly won't be playing 50 odd games next season and the players who can play a similar holding role to him (Fletcher, Kleberson and Djemba-Djemba) just aren't as good as Butt.

smemon

i agree, has always given 100% for utd and was perhaps unfairly frozen out after the world cup. vast experience and medals in all comps means he's a steal at 2.5m.

a side like n'castle would be perfect for him if he got 1st team football. himself and kluivert could give them that x factor to win them some silverware.

mayordenis

i cant believe he went for that much. if heskey can get 5+ million. it makes ya wonder.

kida

Hes has been a bit stale since the WC, methinks it went to his head a little and he thought he was better than he is. He didn't appear to be grafting as hard.

Will do a good job for whoever sings him as it will be the kick up the ass he needs.

Dewey

I cant belive United are letting him go for £2.5million. I thought £5million would of been ok but £2.5million is way to cheap. He has been a great servent to United and i hope he does well at Newcastle. But i'm worried about who will play the holding Midfeilder when Keano isnt playing. Miller is more attacking but i think Fletcher could do a good job there.

BKtje

Ferguson doesnt see him in his plans and outta respect for years of service hes letting him go cheap.
Means more clubs will come in for him and he'll have the chance to joina decent side.

I think its ferguson respecting what Butts done for em.

sikes

not sure if he is the type of player spurs need anymore...we have just signed mendes and davis both of which are a fair bit younger than butt...

its a steal tho...

Big Ears

I had heard £4 million earlier today , but this news is fantastic .

if Newcastle can know pick up Trabelsi for a resonable fee(some prices quaoted for him are as low as £4 million) , they'll be signing quality proven players on the cheap .

Maybe Newcastle can put more of a fight up to the other 4 big clubs than people think .

after all injury ruined they're last season(the worst injury list in the league , possibly the worst of any English side in the Premiership and the Nationwide divisions) and they still finsihed 5th .

if Woody stays fit(30+ league games) I cant see Newcastle lower than 3 .
If he plays less than 20 league games , I think we will finnish 6th or 7th .

donhughberto

Big Ears

Nicely put, i agree its time for Newcastle to do better, surely adding Butt and Kluivert will mean the club is able to put dampers on the top three without finishing in the top three, it should at least keep the pool down for another year. Shearer deserves to bow out in style.

Watch out for Boro all the same, some MAD signings over there, wage bill must get the tax man warming the hands.

Good luck to Nicky as he has giiven us loyal service and been class for all 11 years at Utd, he is a great player and wil be missed, 2.5 is madness even in todays market.

The Muppet

Good Luck to Butt , he has not been at his best since the world cup where he was arguably Englands best player. Maybe that was because of the uncertaninty over his future and a move to a side where he would be guarenteed first team football could see an improvement in his form. 2.5 million is nothing for him considering the price tags of lesser players but as was already said Fergie is rewarding him for his service and such a low price tag will allow clubs offfer him better terms.

Big Nelly

Originally posted by Big Ears
if Newcastle can know pick up Trabelsi for a resonable fee(some prices quaoted for him are as low as £4 million) , they'll be signing quality proven players on the cheap .

Trabelsi is gone to Arsenal! Ajax confirmed last week

In regards to Butt its very strange they r letting him go so cheaply! Birmingham offered 5mil in Jan and now 6months later and he is let go for half of that? maybe tryin to raise money for Rooney! also Butt is on a big wage I think.....

In regards to replacing Keane, I think Djemba-Djemba(or Jam sandwich:-)) will start to shine this season.....seen him once or twice last season and had a few decent games...nothin spectacular......plenty of cover anyway for Utd......I think Ferguson see Fletcher to take the Keane role on as well...he was great against Arsenal last season in FA Cup!

Nuttzz

as your man said in lock stock and two smoking barrels

"It's a deal, it's a steal, it's the Sale of the f'cking Century!"

midget lord

Originally posted by neilbrady79
Trabelsi is gone to Arsenal! Ajax confirmed last week

that deal has hit problems.


Butts a very average player, id prefer to have fletcher in my squad. Good on the ball and decent going forward. Dont forget that Millers is also there now and fergie has him eyed for CM.

TwoShedsJackson

Originally posted by midget lord
Butts a very average player, id prefer to have fletcher in my squad.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:


This is a great signing for Newcastle. Hopefully the Trabelsi to Arsenal deal falls through and Newcastle get him or Stephen Carr, the defence is crying out for a proper right back.

midget lord

from the :rolleyes i assume you would prefer Butt?

Bannor

Originally posted by Dewey
I cant belive United are letting him go for £2.5million. I thought £5million would of been ok but £2.5million is way to cheap.

I read he only has a year left on his contract with Man Utd.

cournioni

I think £2.5million is fair enough. He done nothing for United last season. If anything I reckon he was United's worst player after Forlan last season. He couldn't pass the ball or anything. I think its sad to see him go as he was one of the players that came through the ranks, but I think its time he left.

He's not going to do anything for United next season and he might as well get a few games in somewhere else. I don't know what TSJ is rolling his eyes for because he'll soon find out what an average player Butt is.

Butt is definately not a steal at £2.5million, I think alot of United fans will agree with that.

Big Ears

Originally posted by TwoShedsJackson
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:


This is a great signing for Newcastle. Hopefully the Trabelsi to Arsenal deal falls through and Newcastle get him or Stephen Carr, the defence is crying out for a proper right back.

ya especially with Griffin gone to portsmouth on a free .

I know he wasnt the first choice right-back but the defence was thin before Newcastle need a few defenders .

Bernard has come on in leaps and bounds the past few years but there isnt much cover for him .

when woody is injured we need better cover as playing OBrien and Bramble in the same side is suicide .(lets hope he plays most of the games this year , as he was outstanding last year)

Hughes is a decent right back but can be caught out , and id much prefer the quality Trabelsi has to offer .

Hughes wouldnt be a bad second choice right back , and he can play on the left if needs be .

so I think all Newcastle need is another central defender aswell as Trabelsi and Newcastle will be up among the top 4 teams .

midget lord

Originally posted by Big Ears

so I think all Newcastle need is another central defender aswell as Trabelsi and Newcastle will be up among the top 4 teams .

at the exclusion of who?

Big Ears

Originally posted by midget lord
at the exclusion of who?

Chelsea or Man United .

TwoShedsJackson

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER
I think £2.5million is fair enough. He done nothing for United last season. If anything I reckon he was United's worst player after Forlan last season. He couldn't pass the ball or anything. I think its sad to see him go as he was one of the players that came through the ranks, but I think its time he left.

He's not going to do anything for United next season and he might as well get a few games in somewhere else. I don't know what TSJ is rolling his eyes for because he'll soon find out what an average player Butt is.

Butt is definately not a steal at £2.5million, I think alot of United fans will agree with that.

Maybe if you were able to cast your mind back more than one season you could remember how good Butt was for Manchester United :rolleyes: He's a quality defensive midfielder, and just what Newcastle need to help take the strain off the mostly crap defence.

Big Ears

I agree whole heartedly with two sheds .

The reason Butt has sometimes performed poor might have a lot to do with not playing very much .

leeroybrown

This should be a good move for Butt. It's no wonder he has wanted to leave. It's been ages since he got a consistent run of first team foorball. He will be ideal for Newcastle too, a good defensive midfielder who can pass to sit behind an otherwise attacking midfield.

cournioni

Originally posted by TwoShedsJackson
Maybe if you were able to cast your mind back more than one season you could remember how good Butt was for Manchester United :rolleyes: He's a quality defensive midfielder, and just what Newcastle need to help take the strain off the mostly crap defence.

Yeah, that is one season ago. Sure Cantona could have said that about his bad year in 1997, but he was smart and left on top of his game. Butt is past it. And the key word there is "was a quality midfielder".

kida

Butt hasn't layed well for United since the WC - he has hardly looked interested anytime he has played he kept trying long passes which he is not capable of. he is a ball winner and a short passer, nothing more.

He had the ability, whether he still has is Newcastles gamble.

LegacyUser

Butt is the perfect player for Newcastle! I think he is a class player and the fact he can tackle brilliantly and make nice short passes is all they need him for!

Big Ears

well considering Gary Speed (34) was sold for £750,000 and Butt(29) was bought for £2,500,000 , to replace him , this deal just sounds better and better .

and what a great servant Speed has been to Newcastle too .

TwoShedsJackson

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER
Yeah, that is one season ago. Sure Cantona could have said that about his bad year in 1997, but he was smart and left on top of his game. Butt is past it. And the key word there is "was a quality midfielder".

Oh yes Eric 'I'm amazing against Ipswich or Crystal Palace but never did a thing in Europe and was basically directly responsible (along with Ginola) for France not qualifying for the 1994 World Cup' Cantona. He left before he was totally found out.

cournioni

Originally posted by TwoShedsJackson
Oh yes Eric 'I'm amazing against Ipswich or Crystal Palace but never did a thing in Europe and was basically directly responsible (along with Ginola) for France not qualifying for the 1994 World Cup' Cantona. He left before he was totally found out.

:rolleyes:

Big Ears

Originally posted by TwoShedsJackson
Oh yes Eric 'I'm amazing against Ipswich or Crystal Palace but never did a thing in Europe and was basically directly responsible (along with Ginola) for France not qualifying for the 1994 World Cup' Cantona. He left before he was totally found out.

come to think of it you're right :eek: .

DapperGent

To be perfectly honest I never thought Cantona was that great either. Good player and a great linker of midfield and attack but I think he was overrated due to the fact that players like him were new to the English game at the time.

Good but no legend.

On topic £2.5m is a fair enough price for a player that needs to prove himself again. It's a good signing for Newcastle more becuase they desperately need some experience more than anything else. If they could now land Carr or Trabelsi and add a solid centre back (preferrably one over 30 with a bit of a track record) I'd fancy them for a good season. Jesus but Bobby Robson needs to stop buying 18-20 year olds.

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by Raskolnikov
I think Ferguson is foolish for letting him go, especially for that price. Keane certainly won't be playing 50 odd games next season and the players who can play a similar holding role to him (Fletcher, Kleberson and Djemba-Djemba) just aren't as good as Butt.

I disagree. As an avid Man U fan watching Butt take the field is like watching a crash about to happen. It's awful. The guy just can't pass the ball. The frequency with which he gives away the ball is just incredible. He might make a good signing for Newcastle, as they're quite short in that area, but he's just not good enough to play regularly at OT. I'd even rather see P. Neville take the slot in the centre than Nicky.

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by TwoShedsJackson
Maybe if you were able to cast your mind back more than one season you could remember how good Butt was for Manchester United :rolleyes: He's a quality defensive midfielder, and just what Newcastle need to help take the strain off the mostly crap defence.

Are you a Man U fan TwoSheds? To be honest, Nicky has never been a regular at OT, and he's never deserved to be. Yes he's a local lad, and was the first of the bunch (excluding Giggs) from the youth team to break through. But he reached a certain level and could not get any better. His technique is simply not good enough for a team that wants to win titles and European cups. As I've stated previously he gives the ball away with frightening ease.

The change may well do him good - certain players go a bit stale, and upon leaving get a new lease of life. I would say when G. Speed left Leeds, that would be one good example.

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by leeroybrown
This should be a good move for Butt. It's no wonder he has wanted to leave. It's been ages since he got a consistent run of first team foorball. He will be ideal for Newcastle too, a good defensive midfielder who can pass to sit behind an otherwise attacking midfield.

Can pass? His passing is atrocious. At best he's a 5 yard passer.

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by TwoShedsJackson
Oh yes Eric 'I'm amazing against Ipswich or Crystal Palace but never did a thing in Europe and was basically directly responsible (along with Ginola) for France not qualifying for the 1994 World Cup' Cantona. He left before he was totally found out.

I actually agree with you totally. Again I ask - Utd fan? But definitely about Cantona - I think he was the catalyst for Utd's recent level of success, but as a player he was definitely extremely overrated. I know this will be controversial amongst my fellow devils, but he literally never did a stroke in Europe.

Big Nelly

Originally posted by dirkey_wynne
I actually agree with you totally. Again I ask - Utd fan? But definitely about Cantona - I think he was the catalyst for Utd's recent level of success, but as a player he was definitely extremely overrated. I know this will be controversial amongst my fellow devils, but he literally never did a stroke in Europe.

Is that why about a year or 2 ago all Utd fans voted him there greatest player ever? correct me if I am wrong but I am 95% sure that was the outcome....he was presented wit an award at Old Trafford and everything!!

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by neilbrady79
Is that why about a year or 2 ago all Utd fans voted him there greatest player ever? correct me if I am wrong but I am 95% sure that was the outcome....he was presented wit an award at Old Trafford and everything!!

You are not correct. He won an award yes, but not "all Utd fans" voted. In fact I'd be so bold as to say it was mostly fans up to the age of about 18 who voted. I'm just stating my opinion. I agree that he was a catalyst, as I said, but as an individual player he wasn't as good as people said.

Big Nelly

Originally posted by dirkey_wynne
You are not correct. He won an award yes, but not "all Utd fans" voted. In fact I'd be so bold as to say it was mostly fans up to the age of about 18 who voted. I'm just stating my opinion. I agree that he was a catalyst, as I said, but as an individual player he wasn't as good as people said.

How am I not correct if he won the award? it was voted by Utd fans wasnt it? I didnt ask for age groups! Cantona was a gud player at that time for Utd(pity Shef Wed didnt snap him up when he was on trial there before Leeds) but Utd fans have only started sayin he was terrible since Keane pointed it out in his book

In regards to Butt, he is a very useful player! I seem to remember in the CL semi against Dormoud a few years ago he was Utd best player! also for the last 7-8 years has been the backup for Keane.....who played in CL final??

Newcastle have got a bargain and if the Alex Ferguson says so as well who is to disagree......also Newcastle have put 5 mil on Miguel who is twice the player Ferreira is and Chelsea paided 13.2mil....is Robson gets his man v gud business

TwoShedsJackson

Originally posted by dirkey_wynne
Are you a Man U fan TwoSheds?

Nope - Newcastle If Cantona was a truly great player I would happily acknowledge it, I don't care who he did or didn't play for. The fact remains he was vastly over-rated, and the cult status he acquired after attacking that Palace supporter, and that series of about eight games he scored the winning goal in that got them the title one year has now taken on some sort of ridiculous mythical proportions.

As for Cantona being voted Utd's greatest player ever, it is abundantly obvious that it was 18 year olds and glory hunters who've been supporting Man U since 1993 that voted that one in - I could ask if they've heard of Charlton, Best etc. etc. but I suppose it's a rhetorical question :rolleyes:

The Muppet

Originally posted by dirkey_wynne
I actually agree with you totally. Again I ask - Utd fan? But definitely about Cantona - I think he was the catalyst for Utd's recent level of success, but as a player he was definitely extremely overrated. I know this will be controversial amongst my fellow devils, but he literally never did a stroke in Europe.

It's unfair to blame cantona for uniteds lack of european success . If you remember at that time United had more that the regulation number of foreign players in their first team and so could neveer field their strongest team in the competition.


Cantona was a great player its not by luck that he won a championship medal every full season he played in England with 2 different clubs. His Influence on the whole team can not be exaggerated and played a major part in the decade that followed.
True he drifted in and out of games and didn,t tackle too much (except the odd fan) but when he was playing you knew that he could produce a bit of magic that would win you the game.

Cantona is a United Legend and the fans still chant about him .

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by neilbrady79
How am I not correct if he won the award? it was voted by Utd fans wasnt it? I didnt ask for age groups! Cantona was a gud player at that time for Utd(pity Shef Wed didnt snap him up when he was on trial there before Leeds) but Utd fans have only started sayin he was terrible since Keane pointed it out in his book

In regards to Butt, he is a very useful player! I seem to remember in the CL semi against Dormoud a few years ago he was Utd best player! also for the last 7-8 years has been the backup for Keane.....who played in CL final??

Newcastle have got a bargain and if the Alex Ferguson says so as well who is to disagree......also Newcastle have put 5 mil on Miguel who is twice the player Ferreira is and Chelsea paided 13.2mil....is Robson gets his man v gud business

You are wrong as you stated that "all Utd fans voted" which is not correct. Yes, SOME Utd fans voted him that way. Not all. Do you honestly believe he's a better player than Best, Law, Charlton, Keane, Schmeichel, Robson, Whiteside - need I go on? I've felt this way about Cantona all along, and wasn't in the slightest bit sad when he retired, as he was starting to be found out, and I knew we needed a new direction in Europe.

So Butt is a great player as he got his place in the CL final by default eh?! I didn't say he wasn't a bargain for Newcastle, what I said was that he's just not good enough for Utd. He cannot pass the ball. He will do a good job for the Toon, but we have better players to do a job for Utd.

Semi final against Dortmund? That's more than a few years ago mate. As for what Fergie said - don't you think his actions speak louder than his words? He hasn't considered him a first team player for a long time - choosing to play a full back ahead of him last year. And he's selling him. I think that says it all really.

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by The Muppet
It's unfair to blame cantona for uniteds lack of european success . If you remember at that time United had more that the regulation number of foreign players in their first team and so could neveer field their strongest team in the competition.


Cantona was a great player its not by luck that he won a championship medal every full season he played in England with 2 different clubs. His Influence on the whole team can not be exaggerated and played a major part in the decade that followed.
True he drifted in and out of games and didn,t tackle too much (except the odd fan) but when he was playing you knew that he could produce a bit of magic that would win you the game.

Cantona is a United Legend and the fans still chant about him .

I didn't blame him for our lack of success in Europe. What I said was that he didn't do a thing in Europe. And I stand by it. He stood out in England at that time as the defending was not that great. When marked by the top players - in fact, not even the top players in Europe he was always subdued. This is no coincidence either.

I agree that he was the catalyst for the titles, and brought the club to a new level. But how successful was he elsewhere? Not very. He couldn't even get in the French national side - at that time that said a lot. He was in the right place, at the right time.

However to put him above players like Robson, Keane, Best, Charlton etc, in the all time list for Utd, that's just a sick joke.

cournioni

But the thing is, is Nicky Butt any better than Cantona ever was... The answer is no.

Cantona when he went stale quit when he was ahead. Butt is carrying on, I'm saying that it isn't such a good idea and I think that he isn't worth £2.5million more like £1m.

eirebhoy

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER
Cantona when he went stale quit when he was ahead. Butt is carrying on, I'm saying that it isn't such a good idea

So you want a 29 year old to quit his job just so he'll be remember as a better player?

cournioni

Well I meant that he should have went somewhere like Scotland where his declining ability wouldn't be recognised as much as it will be at Newcastle. Cantona was round about that age when he retired.

LegacyUser

TwoShedsJackson, you are being pretty damn unfair if you ask me. And I do not even have to start giving examples. Everything you are saying is pretty harsh.

The Muppet

Originally posted by dirkey_wynne
But how successful was he elsewhere? Not very. He couldn't even get in the French national side - at that time that said a lot. He was in the right place, at the right time.

Cantona won Championsihp winners medal at Marseill 1991 , Championship winners medal with Leeds 1992, and championship winners medal with Manchester United 1993 and every successive full season he played in the premiership thereafter. The only blip being when he was suspended for most of the season and interestinly United did not win the league that season losing out by a point to blackburn. Anyone that says having Cantona in your team wouldn't be worth at least an extra point a season doesn,t know what they are talking about.

I dont see why you have to look any further than that to see influence Eric had on the teams in which he played. His lack of international appearances was because of a personality clash with the manager and had nothing to do with his footballing abilities so to cite that as evidence that he was somehow lacking as a player ignores the facts..

Originally posted by dirkey_wynne
[B

However to put him above players like Robson, Keane, Best, Charlton etc, in the all time list for Utd, that's just a sick joke. [/B]

I didn,t see anyone put him above those players. To rufute a point made earlier in this thread I said "Cantona is a United Legend". Thats an undisputable fact and if anyone wants to dispute it I suggest they log onto any of the dedicated united fan forums and see what the vast majorty of united fans think of him. Why should he be compare with the players above? They are all vastly different players and United Legends in their own right and Le God is right up there with them. A True United Legend.

midget lord

all this is immaterial banter, Djibril Cisse is the new god

TwoShedsJackson

Originally posted by cheesedude
TwoShedsJackson, you are being pretty damn unfair if you ask me. And I do not even have to start giving examples. Everything you are saying is pretty harsh.

Please do give examples. I don't deny Cantona was a good player, nor that he is a United legend, whether he deserves that or not. All I'm saying is he was enormously over-rated.

But the thing is, is Nicky Butt any better than Cantona ever was... The answer is no.

They play in different roles, in different positions - Cantona should come out of retirement as a defensive midfielder so this could be settled.

dirkey_wynne

Originally posted by The Muppet
Cantona won Championsihp winners medal at Marseill 1991 , Championship winners medal with Leeds 1992, and championship winners medal with Manchester United 1993 and every successive full season he played in the premiership thereafter. The only blip being when he was suspended for most of the season and interestinly United did not win the league that season losing out by a point to blackburn. Anyone that says having Cantona in your team wouldn't be worth at least an extra point a season doesn,t know what they are talking about.

I dont see why you have to look any further than that to see influence Eric had on the teams in which he played. His lack of international appearances was because of a personality clash with the manager and had nothing to do with his footballing abilities so to cite that as evidence that he was somehow lacking as a player ignores the facts..

I didn,t see anyone put him above those players. To rufute a point made earlier in this thread I said "Cantona is a United Legend". Thats an undisputable fact and if anyone wants to dispute it I suggest they log onto any of the dedicated united fan forums and see what the vast majorty of united fans think of him. Why should he be compare with the players above? They are all vastly different players and United Legends in their own right and Le God is right up there with them. A True United Legend.

I was talking about in England in general. He won one medal elsewhere. The reason he stood out so highly is because the English defending was poor at this time, and as previously stated they were not used to these types of players. Hence Eric was found out in Europe. Deny that if you will....

Yes he had a massive influence on the teams. Personally I feel this was more due to his attitude than his ability. He was a good footballer, but not the best ever. He trained hard and he looked after himself. He was also not afraid to try different things - flicks, passes etc. This is what rubbed off on the team of the time. Do you disagree?

You didn't see anyone put him above these players??? Well then these players must have been exempt from that poll where "all Utd fans" voted for Cantona as the best of all time! In my book that is putting him above all these players.

I never said he wasn't a legend. I said that his actual footballing ability has grown into mythical proportions. Watch his last season at OT and tell me his influence wasn't diminishing - he was being increasingly found out. Just as he had been time and time again in Europe.