ntl cable PHATband has landed in Dublin 15!!

pyxxel

Yo folks,

Just thought I'd share this with you.

After many months of humming and hawwing (?!) I wanted to get a IRish Broadband connection (512/512). The usual thing happened, "it'll be two more weeks", then anothe two, then "end of next month, definitely", then I had enough, cancelled & went on holidays. My plans were to go for Netsource as my dial-up was with them and they had been very good, really.

Returned from hols mid-July & found a letter from ntl in the post (we are cable TV customers):

"....happy to announce that broadband is now available in your area..." :eek:

Two weeks later, after waking up from my coma, I gave them a call, this was Wednesday last week. The lady was TERRIBLY helpful, I was truly impressed. She said "yes, you can have it", I said "when", she said "how does next week sound to you?"

Eh, wha?

OK, it took me 2 days to talk wifey into it. Placed the order on Friday afternoon. Got cable modem installed Wednesday morning this week. All 3 networked computers in the house had access that evening!

I went for the Broadband Max package, €50 per month, 1.5 Mbps, contention 17:1, 30 GB cap, yummmmm!! Checking the speed on http://www.utv.ie/speedtest/ gives me 1.3 to 1.4 Mbps, which is OK considering you loose some with TCP/IP and ATM overheads (as stated on the page).

Guys, I'm sooooo happy I cannot begin to explain to ye's. I had waited so long, got frustrated with the modem speeds so many times..... I'll keep you posted how this is going to go, whether service levels are keeping up like this, but for the moment I'm chuffed with my PHATband connection!!

-pyxxel

Oh, another thing: Compared to Eircom's and Esat's websites, ntl give you full information on all packages in one clear, straight-forward table - here: http://www.ntl.com/locales/ie/en/athome/internet_cable.html - as well as excellent faqs and info pages.

Clover

what part of dublin 15 are you in ? , i'm in huntstown myself.

have not been an ntl customer for a few years but would go back if the broadband was available in my area.

carrotcake

do a speed test at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/robin.d.h.walker/speedtest.html

Kur4mA

GAAAAH!!!

Wake up man and tell us where in D15 you are!!! :eek: I'm in hartstown and would drop my netsource connection in a heartbeat for this.

pyxxel

...at least let me sleep out me hangover folks!

OK, I'm in Ongar, which is pretty much half way between Clonsilla & Clonee. It's a fairly new estate. It's about a mile from Clonsilla train station, general direction Windermere, Allendale (?), near the 39 bus terminus.

Huntstown isn't too far away from me, but as with everything, new features are getting phased in area by area afaik.

Just give them a call on 1800 234 234 (the number on the website I gave), they should be open even on Sundays.

-pyxxel

pyxxel

carrotcake wrote:

do a speed test at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/robin.d.h.walker/speedtest.html

Thanks for the link. Here are the results:

Sun, 15 Aug 2004 15:49:30 UTC
1st 128K took 770 ms = 170223 Bytes/sec = approx 1416 kbits/sec
2nd 128K took 710 ms = 184608 Bytes/sec = approx 1536 kbits/sec
3rd 128K took 720 ms = 182044 Bytes/sec = approx 1515 kbits/sec
4th 128K took 760 ms = 172463 Bytes/sec = approx 1435 kbits/sec

:cool:
-pyxxel

pyxxel

...so they're matching eircom's and esat's promotional offers.

The friendly NTL lady also told me I can downgrade the speed anytime I like if it's getting too fast... naah, too expensive for me - so of course we all sign up for max speed first off while we get the 3 months free right?

-pyxxel

Repli

WOOOOOOOOOOO
I live in hartstown too but the only thing id be wary of is ongar is a new development (1 or 2 years old?) so the cable they laid may have already been suitable for broadband ?

Repli

ahh crap - just checked my account number on http://www.ntl.com/locales/ie/en/sales/ and it said basic tv + digital tv are the only 2 services available to me

pyxxel

Repli wrote:

ahh crap - just checked my account number on http://www.ntl.com/locales/ie/en/sales/ and it said basic tv + digital tv are the only 2 services available to me

Ah dang.... but at least you know things are moving.

We moved here in Dec. 2002 and only one month ago got notice that cable internet is now available here. It also appears as a small note on the left side of your NTL bill should you happen to be a customer already.

BTW, tried my ntl acc. no. too just now, it does state broadband is available for me, which is kinda accurate as I got it

I'd say it does no harm asking over the phone anyway, maybe they can give you a timeframe. (Altough after they had started offering bb in Lucan I kept ringing them ever so often to find out about us here, and never got any conclusive answer - "no news" was the only reply I got).

The way I understand it, basically once you can get digital TV the line is good for broadband too, it's just a matter of hooking it up to the service. Other than ADSL over phone lines, line quality and physical distance from exchange don't come into it (someone correct me if I'm wrong) - in fact there IS no such thing as an exchange.

So, technically there are few barriers, it's more down to business plans: They schedule different areas for different months, so they can keep installing and don't end up with a bottleneck and long wait times, frustrating potential customers... it's just a different way of rolling it out I reckon.

Fingers crossed!
-pyxxel

Repli

damn my hopes are crushed now i will ring them anyway

Moriarty

pyxxel-8 wrote:

.. line quality and physical distance from exchange don't come into it (someone correct me if I'm wrong) - in fact there IS no such thing as an exchange.

Cable broadband is dependant on line quality and distance just like DSL is, but they're usually irrelevant to the end user because if the network is up to the standard of supplying digital tv it'll work for cable internet aswell. You can check your signal strength by logging into your cable modem, it's listed somewhere in there (in decibels).

The closest thing to an exchange in the cable system are local nodes. They're usually in each estate, under a manhole. All the coax cable for the estate goes to that hole in the ground, where the data is converted and handed over onto a fibre optic link for backhaul back to the cable companys main datacentre.

pyxxel

So while we have someone knowledgeable reading this thread:

Is there a difference in top capacity/bandwidth between cable (coax+fibre-optical) and phone (copper) wires? Which system can handle higher amounts of traffic?

Repli: I don't think you should give up all hope - it may be just 1 or 2 months away. Heck, we had to wait over six months!!! for a standard phone line, after we had moved here!! Gosh, we all know what waiting means, what?

Patience is supposed to be a virtue - we're so damn full of virtue by now it's coming out from our ears.....

-pyxxel

pyxxel

Just took the speed test again--

Sun, 15 Aug 2004 22:17:48 UTC
1st 128K took 710 ms = 184608 Bytes/sec = approx 1536 kbits/sec
2nd 128K took 720 ms = 182044 Bytes/sec = approx 1515 kbits/sec
3rd 128K took 710 ms = 184608 Bytes/sec = approx 1536 kbits/sec
4th 128K took 720 ms = 182044 Bytes/sec = approx 1515 kbits/sec

SWEEEEET!! :cool:

-pyxxel

Moriarty

It depends really. With a classical cable network, DSL (when you're close to the exchange) would win out.. but a lot of companys are begining to deploy Fibre To The Home or Curb (FTTH/FTTC) which is a hybrid network that uses fibre optics for most of the network, and then use coax for the last few tens of meters to get to the individual homes/apartments. Those networks can supply 100mbit no problem and I reckon they could probably get close to a gigabit if they wanted to.

seamus

pyxxel-8 wrote:

Is there a difference in top capacity/bandwidth between cable (coax+fibre-optical) and phone (copper) wires? Which system can handle higher amounts of traffic?

Well, we'll leave fibre optical out for the moment. Currently the speed at which one can transmit over fibre is limited by the receiving technology - i.e. how quickly we can convert the light into electronic impulses. We don't really know the theoretical limit.

DSL is a relatively new technology, whereas coax is a relative grandaddy.

The main difference is that with Cable, you are sharing your line with everyone else on your road, usually. Connections are in series, and if everyone is downloading to maximum capacity, then the system is at capacity. People will lose out. DSL is contended at the exchange. So while the bandwidth from your line to the exchange is yours, the line coming from the exchange (the backhaul) is shared between a number of people. Everyone downloading at full capacity will get their fair share of that bandwidth.

The main difference is that for DSL, it's much easier to upgrade the amount of bandwidth needed at the exchange, or change the contention for that bandwidth, than it is for cable.

AFAIK.

Repli

zaph wrote:

Repli, let's know how you get on with ntl. I'm waiting for all the legal stuff to be done on a house I've just bought in Hartstown and it would be great if I could get BB set up at the same time as I set up my account for the tv.

No problem

Calibos

Being able to receive digital tv does not mean you can receive BB too. We've got NTL Digital here in Bray but not BB.

What I wouldn't give for 1.5mbit @ €50 with 30gb cap. Have DSL with Utv for the last 2 months. I'd nearly buy myself out of contract if NTL upgraded Bray tomorrow!!

OfflerCrocGod

pyxxel-8 you don't know how lucky you are! I'm in Hartstown tommorow I'll phone up NTL and ask them when they are upgrading here (they afto everywhere else is being upgraded!) I'm just going to keep on pestering them until I get my 1.5Mb

Nietzschean

seamus wrote:

Well, we'll leave fibre optical out for the moment. Currently the speed at which one can transmit over fibre is limited by the receiving technology - i.e. how quickly we can convert the light into electronic impulses. We don't really know the theoretical limit.

didn't they work out the theoretical limit based on when the noise on the line due to so much data degrades the signal beyond a useable level?

John R

pyxxel-8 wrote:

The way I understand it, basically once you can get digital TV the line is good for broadband too, it's just a matter of hooking it up to the service. Other than ADSL over phone lines, line quality and physical distance from exchange don't come into it (someone correct me if I'm wrong) - in fact there IS no such thing as an exchange.

Unfortunately not. Having digital tv is no indicator of BB compatibility. The majority (around 90% AFAIK) of ntl homes can get digital tv. BB is a different matter, it requires 2 way traffic and right now most of the ntl network is completely incapable of this, it was simply not designed for it. The core of their network is ready but the coax in most areas requires upgrades and replacement. Particularly in the original RTE Relay areas the entire network will have to be replaced, 30 year old coax with endless breaks and repairs, rusting junction boxes and countless illegal hacks.

Unless you are living in a recent (5 year old or less) housing estate or complex I wouldn't have to worry about having to break a 1 year DSL contract. If you live in one of the original areas (easily recognisable by having the entire network running along the front of your houses) another two years would be a safe bet.

pyxxel

Hummm..........

So, baaad news it seems - we should be used to that now, but how can you get used to this....

Guys, I really feel for yee's, I honestly do. I know I'm priviledged having it, and at this speed... well let me tell ye's, I've been using the Internet for 20 years now (yes I am that old!), first only with e-mail and irc.....there was no web... then for the last 10 years, ever since the WWW started, the speed was ALWAYS an issue. 10 years is too long a wait in this day & age.

But do keep pestering them, keep them on their heels!!

-pyxxel

LookingFor

It's available on my street now too (though I didn't get a letter..people came round to the door instead), but I'm not sure if I can bring myself to fork out a couple of hundred yoyos to get out of my contract with UTV/Eircom. Can you get those first 3 months free with NTL even if you had BB before with a telecom? If you can, I might wait until the price for cancelling the contract comes down to €150, as the free 3 month period would then cancel out the termination fee That'd mean getting it at around December (still a long wait when you know you COULD have 1.5Mb now!). How long is the contract period with NTL? Having been stung once, I'm more wary now, even with as nice a product as NTL's

Tony

Moriarty wrote:

Cable broadband is dependant on line quality and distance just like DSL is, but they're usually irrelevant to the end user because if the network is up to the standard of supplying digital tv it'll work for cable internet aswell.

I must disagree, digital TV can be sent over coax which does not have a fibre optic backbone which NTL has done in some areas so dont presume that if you have digital TV you can automatically get broadband although in newer areas this would nearly always be the case. There is really no comparison in terms of infrastructure between DSL and cable and NTl usually house the local node in a green cabinet simillar in appearance to the Eircom street cabinets.

Tony

Tony

pyxxel-8 wrote:

So while we have someone knowledgeable reading this thread:

Is there a difference in top capacity/bandwidth between cable (coax+fibre-optical) and phone (copper) wires? Which system can handle higher amounts of traffic?



-pyxxel

Coax a higher capacity by a long way and is also backed up by a fibre optic backbone which has enormous bandwidth.

Tony

Blaster99

Eircom and everyone else has a fibre-optic backbone too, so nothing unique there. I presume the complexity with cable is that you can't stray too far from the house you're feeding which means you have to provide fibre-optic all over the place and digging is presumably difficult/expernsive in Ireland, like anything else infrastructure related? RADSL is obviously ok up to many km's which means it's quite cheap to deploy.

Or what is the problem that's causing NTL to roll out so slowly?

pyxxel

LookingFor wrote:

It's available on my street now too (though I didn't get a letter..people came round to the door instead)

That's new - canvassing for broadband, what next?!?

LookingFor wrote:

Can you get those first 3 months free with NTL even if you had BB before with a telecom? If you can, I might wait until the price for cancelling the contract comes down to €150, as the free 3 month period would then cancel out the termination fee That'd mean getting it at around December (still a long wait when you know you COULD have 1.5Mb now!).

1. Yes, you get the 3 months free regardless. At least no-one at NTL had asked me that question...
2. Maybe I'm stingy, but I wouldn't throw out a current contract like that. They get enough money from us! Your first call would be NTL, you can ask them how long the current promotion is going on for. Don't forget, not only do you get 3 months free, but also the €100 installation fee is waived too.

LookingFor wrote:

How long is the contract period with NTL? Having been stung once, I'm more wary now, even with as nice a product as NTL's

To be honest, I never asked about that! Knowing that I could downgrade if necessary was enough info for me. I *think* it is 12 months, but I cannot remember seeing anything about this. I'll check tonight at home & let ya know.

Repli

anyone frm hartstown get round to ringing? i cant until about 5pm

Kur4mA

Tried calling on my break but was left on hold and had to get back to work!

OfflerCrocGod

I phoned them and was told not yet and we cant tell you when So we have to wait - but phone up yourself the more ppl show an interest the better!

daymobrew

I just called into ntl:'s office in East Point Business Park (I work a few buildings up). I had written to Graham Sutherland (ntl Managing Directory) complaining about ntl: digital disruptions. I pleaded for cable broadband because I can't get DSL (eircom laid bad cable between estate and exchange).

Louise O'Callaghan replied including a comment that they'd investigate the capability of my address getting broadband and would have a result back by today (Aug 16).
Not being very patient, and getting excited at the possibility of getting BB, I went over to the office a few minutes ago.

I spoke with Paul Malone who checked the maps and said that the cable Riverwood would need to be relaid to support cable broadband. He said that it was old cable from the Cablelink days. He explained that new estates only needed a little bit of work to enable them, which would explain why Ongar is enabled but doesn't explain why Roselawn appears to be getting worked on.
Roselawn is much older than Riverwood, which is 6 years old at the most.

I'm quite down over this - I was really thinking ntl: would come back with an 'all go', considering the young age of my estate, but it seems we're a little black hole. Back to square one, writing to Minister Ahern, Phil Nolan and anyone else who might listen.