Corporal punishment! yes or no?

lisa.c

Hopefully never!
I feel that if a child needs to be smacked then its down to the childs parents.
Teachers of any description should never be given authority to smack another persons child what ever the reason.

What is your opinion?

Sleipnir

If it helps them attain better spelling ability than you got in school, I say yes.

PH01

I voted yes for the hell of it. But, I would vote No %99.9999 of the time.

Teenagers are very hard to control and they're barely able to control themselves. A teacher whacking them isn't going to help.

Sleepy

If it reduces the amount of ill-bred little ****ers out there I'd be all for it. If the parents aren't going to teach kids discipline, why should the teacher's suffer?

Mossy Monk

if you have a little scumbag doing his thing in the classroom then yes, smack the living **** out of him

bandraoi

lisa.c wrote:

Hopefully never!
I feel that if a child needs to be smacked then its down to the childs parents.
Teachers of any description should never be given authority to smack another persons child what ever the reason.

What is your opinion?

Why should a parent get the right to smack and not a teacher or carer?
The teacher/carer takes the place of the parent while the child is under their care and surely should have the same disciplinary rights.

I'm not in favour of corporal punishment, which I would regard as taking the child aside and methodically and deliberatly hitting them. I don't see why carers particularly of young children should be automatically fired for instantly reacting to a situation with a light smack.

][cEMAN**

I have seen both sides of this and experienced it as well. Punishment for misbehaving, but also getting attacked for simply not meeting certain grades in primary school - by a headmaster!

I believe that kids knowing that teachers will get in trouble for touching them at all (even placing a hand on them in some instances) leads to kids developing a way of gettin away with anything. I've seen it after this was outlawed, and there was 1 pupil who started attacking the teachers - they could do nothing about it.

The only thing with this is as always it's not black and white. I would say a light slap or just a bit more leverage on this issue would be welcome, but abuse of it would be the danger. Closer watch on teachers if this were ever to return would be a must.

I've just seen the change of attitude in teenagers from before and after this, and i'm sad to say it's gotten progressively worse. In a lot of cases, it was only the teachers who were disciplining the children, as the parents could not or would not keep them under control.

Paladin

bandraoi wrote:

Why should a parent get the right to smack and not a teacher or carer?

You actually need to ask? Umm, possibly because the parents are the bloody parents? Had sex, got pregnant, gave birth to the little bundle of joy etc.
Should give them the right to choose whether they want to use smacking as a discipline or not.

I dont agree with teachers being given that power however. Its the parents choice on the disiplining of a child.

Considering the number of incredibly thick teachers Ive met in my life I find it tough enough to endure the fact they impart knowledge on children. It would be terrifying to trust their judgement when it came to corporal punishment.
Of course they themselves would have the power over theur own kids, but then thats purely their choice then.


That said, smacking is an extremely effective way to teach a child rights and wrongs. Children dont want to talk to reason out things. They dont care. If they associate a sharp smack (not harmful) with tearing down shelves in supermarkets, they wont tear down shelves. Simple psychology really.

I cant stand all these bleeding hearts that rekon smacking is abhorrent. Its a parents choice, and its not harmful. Its the non-smacked kids that are terrors. Scream when they want, get what they want, unbelieveable terrors. Trying to sleep on plane journeys with screaming kids and parents laughing at how cute they are and not trying to quieten them, despite the awful disturbance to the other tired passengers. Gah.

So I guess I agree with Lisa C. Weird

BEAT

When I was in school for the first year this was still aloud. The principal had a big wooden paddle in his office. Thank gawd the law was changed that year and they werent aloud to use it.
I dont think it would solve anyone's problems...only make them worse.
Making the kid leave the room is just as effective.

You have to remember that kids are finding ways to get guns in schools now and would probably anger such kids enough if you hit them infront of thier classmates they would come back and shoot everyone in the room.

It is a sick and complicated world, we dont need to complicate matters more by letting others dicipline our children with violence...that's the parents job

Boggle

Paladin wrote:

That said, smacking is an extremely effective way to teach a child rights and wrongs. Children dont want to talk to reason out things. They dont care. If they associate a sharp smack (not harmful) with tearing down shelves in supermarkets, they wont tear down shelves. Simple psychology really.

I cant stand all these bleeding hearts that rekon smacking is abhorrent. Its a parents choice, and its not harmful.

I have to agree completely with this - children dont always want to understand reason but have no choice bar understand a slap. As long as its not vicious and doesn't sting for more than a few minutes. I generally think it better than shouting aswell - I reckon kids shouldn't really be shouted at. Dunno why though...

Hello Kitty

Yeah it depends, id want to smack some child if he/she's behaving badly and are really annoying (spoiled brat) its the only way they'll learn. But then again I wouldnt really like someone smacking my child.

embee

Why have you started two threads on pretty much the same topic, lisa.c?

Big Chief

Sleepy wrote:

If it reduces the amount of ill-bred little ****ers out there I'd be all for it. If the parents aren't going to teach kids discipline, why should the teacher's suffer?

is one of the reasons i voted yes, in a perfect world the parents would have sole responsbility and actually take care of there kids, unfortunately this is not the case and a good load of parents havent a clue on how to discipline there children, so i would bring this back in yes

The Song Thrush

To those who vote yes, two q's:

If a boy is driving you mad and being a little brat, would you smack the **** out of him?

If a girl is driving you mad and being a little brat, would you smack the **** out of her?


I just noticed how people would feel more confident smacking a boy than a girl..

grimloch

it might be a good idea but the right can very easily be abused, im in school now so i dont want to be hit obviously,

one of our teachers im sure would love to hit us no doubt about it, but a good teacher gets respect in the classroom without having to threaten us or give out, we just behave.I think teachers who can't control a class would hit the pupils because of their inability to control us so id vote no

adonis

no no no no
progress, not regress.

you cant allow people to hit other people's children.
If someone hit my kids (dont got none) i would go crazy.
its not on.
what about capital punishment?
whos voting for bush?
nazis

OfflerCrocGod

No, children are not naturally trouble makers - it's the way they are raised that defines the person they grow up to be. If the child had good parents then they would not cause trouble therefore the issue of hitting them would never arise. The converse is true; you look at the classes in schools the "good" classes and the "bad" ones: the pupils who behaved where the ones where their parents were understanding and interested in their upbringing*, again the converse is true. If you are not a good parent then you will need violence to subdue your unruly kids and teach them the leason you think is important "Being violent achives what you want" Not a lesson I want to beat into ( teach if you prefer ) kids.


*Place 'upbringing' in Google and hit "I'm felling lucky"

elivsvonchiaing

When I was a kid I got this and it did me no harm - just a year later the law was changed. As I went through school - the kids in first year seemed to get worse. Corporal punishment, however, has been abused, hence the law.

It should be re-implemented in the context of humiliation and not violence, i.e. conducted in front of the class in the presence of a least one other teacher but preferably the principal. But whether this is given should be decided by at least three teachers - when in doubt including principal.

Pain e.g. a leathering won't always work. It probably needs to be allowed so a teacher can identify this.

People will object to this on the grounds of possible psychological damage - I reckon a lot more damage is done by school bullys.

the_syco

Lemme see; the threat of a whack, or the torment of the bully?

The effects are noticeable. I respect authority, but will defend my right to kick the crap out of anyone who thinks its "fun" to make my life hell.

Due to low grades, I was put in a class of trouble-makers. These would be the people most would fear meeting. Anywhere. Having been brought up when a whack is given, they still broke the rules, and made people's lives a misery. But they were controlable, to an extent, and I found them all to be totally sound people.

Without the threat, I see no fear in the eyes of the little trouble-makers. When once the little b4stards would be given out to for bullying anyone, now they could get away with murder. I complained to the school, but they could do little, but ask nicely. That made matters a little worse, but I overcame it by randomly hitting some little sh*te full force in the face with a heavy bag, along with other methods. If I had ever caught one of those who stoned me, I'd proberly regret what I'd do to the little f*cker.

Now, there are no "warnings". There'll be a slap on the wrists by the cops, followed by jail. Where once you got punished, you now could reign free, knowing you could get away with it, without punishment... untill you became 16, and get thrown into jail.

So yes; I don't agree with it, but it is neccesary.

billy the squid

http://www2.limerickpost.ie/fullnews.elive?id=70&category=news

its not only kids that need a bit of corporal punnishment these days

yeah they need to get a clip around the ear if they are out of line

climaxer

Definiately No. I have two kids an 11yr old daughter and my son will be 2yrs tomorrow and if any teacher layed a hand on them I would be furious. So far I've never had any bad complaints about my daugher in school and all her teachers have said she is a pleasure to teach and the only thing they say is she's a bit of a chatterbox but if she's playing up at all she can be corrected by talking directly and firmly too which is what I've always done. Personally I don't believe in the parents smacking their child either well 99% of the time anyway. I believe it should only be used as a last resort. I've always talked to my daughter and try and explain why something is wrong. I've used a technique since she was young and it really works. When a child is misbehaving try ignore them and give tonnes of praise etc. when they are good. A lot of the time kids only want their Mammy or Daddy's attention and some will even be naughty to get their attention.

pork99

Do a search on the inet for "Corporal punishment". I think you'll find mostly sites which have nothing to do with education.

From my memories of primary school in the 70s, when corporal punishment was not just legal but commonplace, I'd say it tended to be used as an outlet for those inflicting it. I can remember a number of fairly seedy priests and lay teachers who enjoyed giving the cane or the strap a bit too much (it tended to be the same ones who enjoyed physical contact with young boys a bit too much) it was therapuetic for them. They would come to class very angry and tense but after giving a few boys a good thrashing would become quite calm and relaxed, almost like "ahhh... I needed that".

][cEMAN**

I think most parents here who are saying no to this and "if someone hit my child..." are taking this in terms of they're probably good parents.

The other side of the coin here is that there are parents out there who don't care. Parents who send their kids off to school to become bullies - encourage it and show them how.

To say that you bring a child into this world you are the only one who should decide how it is raised is the reason why we have child social services - to take children out of potentially harmful situations. One of those is to do with parents who can't take care of the children. It is also for parents who think "I gave birth to the kid, I have the right to beat the crap out of it if it's bothering me". You don't. You're the guardian/carer, but you don't OWN the child. It's a human life and it deserves rights more than most would give it. Age, intelligence, or ability do not diminish this right in any way. Some people tend to forget that!

If we ignore the growing threat of unchecked children getting to do what they want with parents not taking responsibility, and teachers not being ABLE to, then we begin to see the increase in younger crimes and declining social behaviour from youths today.

For those parents who say they're doing a good job of raising their children and believe they would do no wrong, do you deny that your children are also shaped by the world around them? Their friends and teachers. By their friends, this then means that other parents come into the equation because their children are shaped by them. If they are bad parents then chances are that the kids may become bad influences.

As far as the teachers go, once they took away corporal punishment people thought they didn't have to look as closely at teachers. If they're not hitting the kids that's ok. However I know from experience that teachers through their words and actions can have a negative affect on kids.

At least if this came back they would need to keep a very close eye on teachers and there'd be less chance of them getting away with half the things they say/do right now.

And to one of the above questions, for either girl or boy, no I wouldn't touch another child nomatter how annoying they were, if I were not the carer or guardian of them. I would have no right.

lisa.c

embee wrote:

Why have you started two threads on pretty much the same topic, lisa.c?

ahem! embee one was a question on a topic i was concerned about.. the other is a poll on something different...will you kindly find someone else to annoy... if you dont like my threads then dont waste our time replying on them we do have better replies to read.

thank you
lisa.c

embee

One's a thread about teachers hitting kids, the other's a poll......... about teachers hitting kids.

I see how they are different, all right.

And don't get so defensive and paranoid. I didn't ask the question just because I wanted to annoy you, contrary to what you appear to think. It was a simple and fair question. The whole world isn't out to get you, lovely.

lisa.c

yes exactly one is a poll reguarding wether or not people agree or disagree with corporal punishment the other is a question i posted as a concerned mother reguarding an incident with my son... i dont find them the same at all.

Gurgle

I have a simple little rule re. my kids & smacking - nobody is permitted to do it. Not even me.
I had the misfortune of starting primary school with an absolute bitch in charge of junior & senior infants. She regularly broke wooden rulers on the thicker 4 year olds. Anyone who thinks that aided their education is seriously misguided, especially as the punishment reflected the teachers mood more than the childs behaviour.
Teachers are no better than any other group, they can't & shouldn't be trusted with the authority to use violence under any circumstances.

Redleslie2

There was one teacher in my primary school who would give everyone in the class a lash of the leather if one person misbehaved.

As far as I can recall kids who got leathered more often would tend to deal with their frustration at being unable to get even with the teacher by bullying other kids.

But if we're going to have corporal punishment in schools, why not have it in work as well?

nlgbbbblth

we used to get the leather in school - across the face occasionally but mostly the hand

Christian Brothers Primary School 1979 - 1984