Help Mr Bigley ASAP

HashSlinging

Michael D. Higgins is trying to help Kenneth Bigley to safely return home. Bertie & Brian Cowan are not interested so if you want the Irish Gov to help this man and his suffering family send an e-mail to the following e-mail address stating your support. The poor mans brother was on the radio this morning begging for Ireland to help him so we should let the Gov know we want them to try something. Just even send a blank mail to join the petition.

bringbigleyhome@newstalk106.ie

ChipZilla

Nobody forced the guy to go out there.

He knew the risks before he went.

His gamble didn't pay off...

Nobody gives a toss about the number of Iraqis that die every day.

Why is that?

embee

I feel awful for Ken Bigley and his family....

HOWEVER

I think you are wrong about Bertie and Brian Cowen saying they are "not interested". I think that it is more the case that they would share the viewpoint of Blair/Bush et al that there can be absolutely no negotiation with terrorists under any circumstances.

And Michael D. Higgins .... why him of all people?!

Sleipnir

What if it was your brother?
Would you be so quick to say "he knew the risks before he went"
as his head is sawn from his body?

HashSlinging

FFS just dont send a mail then...

BuffyBot

Why would a group of Iraqi militants pay any attention to Michael D. Higgins?

Sleipnir

embee wrote:

And Michael D. Higgins .... why him of all people?!

Because he offered.

Blub2k4

HashSlinging wrote:

Michael D. Higgins is trying to help Kenneth Bigley to safely return home. Bertie & Brian Cowan are not interested so if you want the Irish Gov to help this man and his suffering family send an e-mail to the following e-mail address stating your support. The poor mans brother was on the radio this morning begging for Ireland to help him so we should let the Gov know we want them to try something. Just even send a blank mail to join the petition.

bringbigleyhome@newstalk106.ie

So are they going to allow him to fly back in through Shannon or what?
I think they are already "helping" enough myself.
Any ideas how much Bigley was being paid to work in a war zone for an illegal occupier?

embee

I just wonder what his ulterior motive is....

Sleipnir

Blub2k4 wrote:

So are they going to allow him to fly back in through Shannon or what?
I think they are already "helping" enough myself.
Any ideas how much Bigley was being paid to work in a war zone for an illegal occupier?

Probably a lot.
So what?
Are you saying that because he got paid for being in Iraq, Iraqis have every right to chop his head off?

BrookieD

Hi
There is a rally being set up Friday @ 18:00 to make there voice heard over this matter and to call form the PM to stand down in the UK. please see the post in the Politics section under name of "Mr Bigley"

If you know anyone in the UK or Liverpool area that can attend please asked them to do so .
also the media in the UK has picked up on this so there might be a fair few people.

cheers

Click Here for link

ravenhead

It's obvious that no amount of talking is going to help to have Kenneth Bigley released. The british government realise this & we should to.
What I can't understand is with the amount of intelligence that the americans are supposed to have in Iraq why has a millitery team been sent in to deal with this scum!! There is no point in giving into the likes of these people as this is only going to convince them that the world will accept this type of behaviour ... Fu@k, go in & blow the crap out of them!!! That's my opinion anyway

ChipZilla

Sleipnir wrote:

What if it was your brother?
Would you be so quick to say "he knew the risks before he went"
as his head is sawn from his body?

Three of my workmates are in Basra just now, and will be for another six months. They weighed up their options and went for it, as deciding factor was the salary for the 12 month stint (which was in the six-figure range as it went by the salary they were on x5). Would you risk being captured or executed for £150,000 or £160,000? That wouldn't buy you a house on your return...

So if that was my brother, I'd be saying "Cop on, you stupid f**ker" before he even left for Iraq...

ChipZilla

ravenhead wrote:

Fu@k, go in & blow the crap out of them!!! That's my opinion anyway

Who, the Iraqi population? The US are doing that already. Some would say that's what got them where they are in Iraq today...

Sleipnir

ChipZilla wrote:

Three of my workmates are in Basra just now, and will be for another six months. They weighed up their options and went for it, as deciding factor was the salary for the 12 month stint (which was in the six-figure range as it went by the salary they were on x5). Would you risk being captured or executed for £150,000 or £160,000? That wouldn't buy you a house on your return...

So if that was my brother, I'd be saying "Cop on, you stupid f**ker" before he even left for Iraq...

And if he went anyway?

What if one of your mates was now in the position of Bigley?
If you made a press statement like his brother has would you say
"You knew the risks when you went out there so tough"

He had been working in the Middle east for a couple of years and his brother's company is out there. I'm sure he knew the risks.
By accepting the risk we can now say

"Well you're screwed, but I did tell you....."

seamus

I have a particular pity for him because his general love of the Middle East is what had him there. Unlike most others working there, he wasn't draw by money, rather he'd been working with a Middle Eastern company for a few years, and moved to Iraq after the war. There are very few people who, while on camera pleading for their life, would also plead for help for the Iraqi people, the people who have captured them.

I have a funny feeling that he'll be set free without intervention from the Brits. I hope so anyway.

ChipZilla

I hope so too Seamus.

Sleipnir, quit harping on about my theoretical brother - that's neither here nor there. What if? What if? What if? The bottom line is that this guy DID KNOW where he stood by going and working in Iraq. He was captured - but them's the breaks...

ravenhead

ChipZilla wrote:

Who, the Iraqi population? The US are doing that already. Some would say that's what got them where they are in Iraq today...

No these ignorant people that believe that by terrorizing people the way they are doing, that they are going to get what they want.
I say hunt them down like you would any other common criminal, just because they are in Iraq doesn't mean that they should be left get away with what they are doing. If that happened here or in any other civilised country in the world you can be gauranteed that the powers that be would not stop until these people were brought to justice, what kind of a message is this giving to other militant ' oh grab some of the foreigners & we'll back down & you'll get what you want without anyone trying to stop you' ... I can't believe that has what the world has come to..

Sleipnir

seamus wrote:

Rather he'd been working with a Middle Eastern company for a few years.QUOTE]

Yeah, that was his brother's company. All his business is in the Middle East.
He had been working in Qatar for a while as well before so he didn't just get a plane from Heathrow when he heard there was money to be made in Iraq.

HashSlinging

People its really simple. JUST SEND A MAIL OR DONT SEND A MAIL

this is not about why, what, when or who.

monkeyfudge

The Guardian, Thursday September 23, 2004 wrote:

The 62-year-old, originally from the Liverpool area, was said to have ignored both threats and advice to leave the country.

I think I'd have taken those threats seriously, if I was in that situation.

Sleipnir

ravenhead wrote:

I say hunt them down like you would any other common criminal, just because they are in Iraq doesn't mean that they should be left get away with what they are doing.

Good idea.
Have you got the address where they're staying?

BrookieD

whether he is there for money or for the love of the land he does not deserve to get his head hacked off, thats what people are outraged at!!

ravenhead

HashSlinging wrote:

People its really simple. JUST SEND A MAIL OR DONT SEND A MAIL

this is not about why, what, when or who.

Speaking for myself, I already have, anything that might help!! But as this is such a touchy subject people are going to debate it when the topic arises :rolleyes:

ChipZilla

ravenhead wrote:

No these ignorant people that believe that by terrorizing people the way they are doing, that they are going to get what they want.
I say hunt them down like you would any other common criminal, just because they are in Iraq doesn't mean that they should be left get away with what they are doing. If that happened here or in any other civilised country in the world you can be gauranteed that the powers that be would not stop until these people were brought to justice, what kind of a message is this giving to other militant ' oh grab some of the foreigners & we'll back down & you'll get what you want without anyone trying to stop you' ... I can't believe that has what the world has come to..

How do you find these terrorists? The US forces are treating every civilian like they're a terrorist. Here are some numbers:

To date, just over 1,000 US soldiers have been killed in Iraq.
To date, between 10,000 and 37,000 Iraqis have been killed. Nobody knows the precise number because, as General Tommy Franks so eloquently said "We don't do bodycounts". And you say the Iraqis are the uncivilised ones?

ravenhead

Sleipnir wrote:

Good idea.
Have you got the address where they're staying?

Ha ha, nice one... but you have to seen where I'm coming from, the american's & brits have been in the country for months, so you would be a very foolish person to think that they don't have intelligence telling what's going on & where, it's about how they choose to use that intelligence.

HashSlinging

im all for debate!!

ravenhead

ChipZilla wrote:

How do you find these terrorists? The US forces are treating every civilian like they're a terrorist. Here are some numbers:

To date, just over 1,000 US soldiers have been killed in Iraq.
To date, between 10,000 and 37,000 Iraqis have been killed. Nobody knows the precise number because, as General Tommy Franks so eloquently said "We don't do bodycounts". And you say the Iraqis are the uncivilised ones?

I agree with you completely on this one, the USA has one of the worst records in history for the treatment of people in countries they have occupied, What I'm saying is that I find it very hard to believe that the world 'greatest nation' supposedly has no idea where this man is being held

Sleipnir

ChipZilla wrote:

How do you find these terrorists? The US forces are treating every civilian like they're a terrorist. Here are some numbers:

To date, just over 1,000 US soldiers have been killed in Iraq.
To date, between 10,000 and 37,000 Iraqis have been killed. Nobody knows the precise number because, as General Tommy Franks so eloquently said "We don't do bodycounts". And you say the Iraqis are the uncivilised ones?

"It's really not a number I'm terribly interested in."

General Colin Powell [When asked about the number of Iraqi people who were slaughtered by Americans in the 1991 "Desert Storm"

monkeyfudge

ravenhead wrote:

Ha ha, nice one... but you have to seen where I'm coming from, the american's & brits have been in the country for months, so you would be a very foolish person to think that they don't have intelligence telling what's going on & where, it's about how they choose to use that intelligence.

Oh yes... and we all saw how great their intelligence was when it came to subject of the WMDs.

optiplexgx270

ChipZilla wrote:

Nobody forced the guy to go out there.

He knew the risks before he went.

His gamble didn't pay off...

Nobody gives a toss about the number of Iraqis that die every day.

Why is that?

Watch the videos (and not the ones they show on tv the full length ones) and come back here and say that. You stupid ****.

And most of the Iraqis are not killed with a bread knife slicing trough their necks!

Some ppl are unbelievable. I was of your thinking until i got the videos spamed to me, now everything seems different.

seamus

optiplexgx270 wrote:

And most of the Iraqis are not killed with a bread knife slicing trough their necks!

Some ppl are unbelievable. I was of your thinking until i got the videos spamed to me, now everything seems different.

I think the point of the head removal is both shock and punishment. It's a horrific defiling of a person.

However, they're trying to get their point across, howsoever awful. Is one person killed by removal of the head much more horrific than 1000 killed by bullets to the head? The Iraqis haven't got the resources to kill as many Americans, comparable to the amount of Iraqis that are killed. So they counter quanitity with brutality.

I'm not condoning acts by either side, but if another country arrived in Ireland promising a new life and a better way, while all around people are being killed indiscriminately, and to quote above, the amount of dead is a number the other side is "really not a number I'm terribly interested in", does it not sound likely that the Irish would become equally complacent and uncaring for the lives of their "saviours"?

Borzoi

BuffyBot wrote:

Why would a group of Iraqi militants pay any attention to Michael D. Higgins?

Presumeably we're hoping too swap him for Mr Bigley

Who I do hope gets out of this okay.

optiplexgx270

Your missing MY piont...

I understand all that but i am of the thinking that it is much easier to shoot than do what they did never mind having it done to you.

But thats not my point.

ro_chez

optiplexgx270 wrote:

Your missing MY piont...

I understand all that but i am of the thinking that it is much easier to shoot than do what they did never mind having it done to you.

But thats not my point.

Do you even know what the **** your point is?

Blub2k4

Sleipnir wrote:

Probably a lot.
So what?
Are you saying that because he got paid for being in Iraq, Iraqis have every right to chop his head off?

No I am saying he knew the risks involved in taking part in an illegal occupation and I am not losing tears over him, if he had a conscience and actually cared about Iraqis he would have stayed at home.

ravenhead

optiplexgx270 wrote:

Your missing MY piont...

I understand all that but i am of the thinking that it is much easier to shoot than do what they did never mind having it done to you.

But thats not my point.

I agree completely with you, whenever these people are caught I personally think that death is too good a punishment for these vile evil people.
The spawn of satan would'nt get a look in with these people around

ravenhead

Blub2k4 wrote:

No I am saying he knew the risks involved in taking part in an illegal occupation and I am not losing tears over him, if he had a conscience and actually cared about Iraqis he would have stayed at home.

How can you say that!!! this man has gone to iraq to help it's people to rebuild their country, It has nothing to do with political gain or money. He is a man that wanted to put his abilities to good use & he should not have to pay with his life for wanting to help the people of iraq - what would you suggest, leave these people with no help ????

seamus

Blub2k4 wrote:

No I am saying he knew the risks involved in taking part in an illegal occupation and I am not losing tears over him, if he had a conscience and actually cared about Iraqis he would have stayed at home.

Well, illegal occupation or otherwise, the place still has to be rebuilt. Would you feel happier if everyone, contractors and all, just ****ed off and left the Iraqis to it?
And, as detailed above, he *was* at home, for all intents and purposes, having been working in the Middle East for the last 7 years.

Sleipnir

Blub2k4 wrote:

No I am saying he knew the risks involved in taking part in an illegal occupation and I am not losing tears over him, if he had a conscience and actually cared about Iraqis he would have stayed at home.

He is based in the Middle East. His work sends him all over the Middle East.
He didn't occupy the country illegally, the man who being threated with a beheading didn't do anythiing illegal.

ChipZilla

optiplexgx270 wrote:

Watch the videos.....

Seen 'em before. You need to see some videos of what US technology is capable of killing-wise. What's with the "You stupid ****" by the way. You don't agree with what I say, so that makes me a stupid ****? You must be an American, are you?

Ravenhead wrote:

I find it very hard to believe that the world 'greatest nation' supposedly has no idea where this man is being held

Exactly. But I'm still waiting for them to find Bin Laden...

seamus wrote:

but if another country arrived in Ireland promising a new life and a better way, while all around people are being killed indiscriminately, and to quote above, the amount of dead is a number the other side is "really not a number I'm terribly interested in", does it not sound likely that the Irish would become equally complacent and uncaring for the lives of their "saviours"?

Beat me to it. That was the next point I was going to make. You don't have to look back very far in our own history when the Irish and the British were dispatching each other to an early grave... Were the Old IRA or any of the other groups of the time terrorists? Maybe to the British. Not to me...

Borzoi wrote:

Presumeably we're hoping too swap him for Mr Bigley

Take Bertie and a few other as well to sweeten the deal...

optiplexgx270

Nope I'm from the same sh1thole you are (and the best part of it apparently) from im guessing.

ChipZilla

optiplexgx270 wrote:

Nope I'm from the same sh1thole you are (and the best part of it apparently) from im guessing.

You can't even string a proper sentence together, so I doubt it... You don't do "condescending" very well, optiplexgx270. But humour me - you're better than me for some reason? Is that what you're saying?

Anyway, back on topic....

Blub2k4

Whoever said I should think before I write things, I do think about what I write here.
Bigley is part of an illegal occupation, the rebuilding effort is a load of cobblers, the Iraqi state coffers are being drained by greedy Western companies and opportunists like Bigley. Why do the Iraqis need foreign companies to help with their rebuilding efforts? Ah yeah cos the yanks razed everything, and the Iraqis presumably dont have the wherewithall to rebuild themselves being savages or what? Think what you want he does not belong in Iraq, he is in a warzone following an illegal war and occupation, he was warned of the dangers, like I said no tears here.

optiplexgx270

I thought about rewriting it but didn’t think ye were worth the effort.

Illegal occupation? Oh come on!

Sleipnir

Blub2k4 wrote:

Whoever said I should think before I write things, I do think about what I write here.
Bigley is part of an illegal occupation, the rebuilding effort is a load of cobblers, the Iraqi state coffers are being drained by greedy Western companies and opportunists like Bigley. Why do the Iraqis need foreign companies to help with their rebuilding efforts? Ah yeah cos the yanks razed everything, and the Iraqis presumably dont have the wherewithall to rebuild themselves being savages or what? Think what you want he does not belong in Iraq, he is in a warzone following an illegal war and occupation, he was warned of the dangers, like I said no tears here.

Opportunist?
What is it with you, let me explain again;
HIS BROTHER OWNS A COMPANY IN THE MIDDLE EAST AND SUPPLIES TECHNICAL EQUIPMENT TO MIDDLE EASTERN COUNTRIES!!!

Kenneth Bigley worked for his brother's company before moving to another one.That company sent him to Iraq.

He worked there BEFORE the war so how is he being opportunistic?

Blub2k4

optiplexgx270 wrote:

I was of your thinking until i got the videos spamed to me, now everything seems different.

Just shows that you're a sucker for the media, I wouldn't boast about it if I were you.
Did "Shock and Awe" bother you too, or was that sufficiently sanitary for you?
I mean it was a bit like a fireworks display, just some of the sparks would have been body parts.

ChipZilla

Sleipnir wrote:

That company sent him to Iraq.

And he no choice in the matter? Somebody put a gun to his head?

Mighty_Mouse

And Michael D. Higgins .... why him of all people?!

Given his career. I don't think anyone can question Michael D's motives at this stage in the game.

He's hardly band-wagon material!!

Blub2k4

Sleipnir wrote:

Opportunist?
What is it with you, let me explain again;
HIS BROTHER OWNS A COMPANY IN THE MIDDLE EAST AND SUPPLIES TECHNICAL EQUIPMENT TO MIDDLE EASTERN COUNTRIES!!!

Kenneth Bigley worked for his brother's company before moving to another one.That company sent him to Iraq.

He worked there BEFORE the war so how is he being opportunistic?

Sorry I missed the bit where he was not being payed up to five times the going rate for his field of work. So they held a gun to his head? You dont think he was asked if he fancied big money?

optiplexgx270

HashSlinging wrote:

Michael D. Higgins is trying to help Kenneth Bigley to safely return home. Bertie & Brian Cowan are not interested so if you want the Irish Gov to help this man and his suffering family send an e-mail to the following e-mail address stating your support. The poor mans brother was on the radio this morning begging for Ireland to help him so we should let the Gov know we want them to try something. Just even send a blank mail to join the petition.

bringbigleyhome@newstalk106.ie

Ok ok let's leave it. The whole point of this thread was as stated above if you want to continue this whole occupation blah create a new thread for it people.