Should the age limit for entry into An Garda Siochana be raised?

OFDM

The age limit for entry to An Garda Siochana is 26 years of age. This is one of the lowest age limits for entry to a police force in the world.
For instance, the limit for the NYPD and FBI is 35, while for the PSNI the limit is 52. Likewise, the average limits for English & Welsh police forces is 50 and for Scottish police forces it is 40, while the LAPD, San Francisco PD and LA Sherrif's Department have no upper age limit.

IMO, the restrictive age limit for the Gardaí prevents many capable and more experienced candidates who would bring desirable qualities learned from life experience outside the Gardaí to the job from applying.

What do other people think?

simu

Sounds like a good idea.

Jivin Turkey

My friend is a guard, he is 23, and he has been a guard for 2 years.

aidan_walsh

OFDM is talking about the upper age limit, after which you're no longer eligable to apply.

Personally, I think that while this might be beneficial anywhere else, the government are incapable of putting out an adequete number of officers as it is, and I don't believe this is because of a low upper age limit. There are other areas that need to be addressed first.

seamus

Jivin Turkey wrote:

My friend is a guard, he is 23, and he has been a guard for 2 years.

That's nice.

Anywho, I would agree. I'm sure there are plenty of people who spend four years in college, come out, and work for 5 or 6 years, only to yearn a change of career like the Gardai, but it's too late.
There has to be a lot of valuable, experienced people out there who would make great Gardai.

Perhaps the idea of such a low age limit is that recruits can be moulded easily (as opposed to having very set opinions like older people do) and also there'd be a belief that younger people are less corruptible, less backscratching going on than older recruits. Which is crap obviously.

Jivin Turkey

Ah right, makes sense now.

Definately should be increased so, although as you say, there are bigger problems, but increasing the age limit is hardly going to drain any resources.

pickarooney

It might be an idea to raise the lower limit, or at least require a few years more of study before you can join up.

Definetly a good idea. It would allow those people that decide to finish their army tours, and enter the police force. It would also allow people who have matured in their early thirties to change thier lives, should they so choose. Most otehr european countries allow the applications to join from older people. Seems somewhat Illogical to bar those over 26.

Zulu

Jivin Turkey wrote:

My friend is a guard, he is 23, and he has been a guard for 2 years.

I'm delighted for you.

monkeyfudge

oh no no no...

I turned 26 earlier this year and one of my first thoughts was that even if I suffer brain damage now and lose all sense of myself, I still wouldn't be able to join the Garda. I find that to be a very comforting thought, to be protected from some theoretical future insane version of myself who wants to be a Garda.

OFDM

pickarooney wrote:

It might be an idea to raise the lower limit, or at least require a few years more of study before you can join up.

The NYPD not only require you to be at least 21 years of age but you must also have 60 college credits, effectively means you have to have a bachelors degree.

DublinWriter

OFDM wrote:

The NYPD not only require you to be at least 21 years of age but you must also have 60 college credits, effectively means you have to have a bachelors degree.

Well, not to start a seperate chain of arguement, but basically American Degree=Leaving Cert.

Personally I think the age range should be increased to the PSNI limit of 52 for the basic reason that most young people who join the Gardai become insituitionalised having had relatively little other life experience.

As a result of that the force in general becomes very introspective and self-protective.

I have it on good authority that the 26 year limit will be dropped to 52 by the DOJ if an applicant over 26 is bloody minded enough to take their rejection to
court.

tovalee

OFDM wrote:

Tyou must also have 60 college credits, effectively means you have to have a bachelors degree.

60 credit hours isnt even half of a bachelors degree :eek:

Mighty_Mouse

of course there are a couple of people who missed the boat for whatever reason and realise that they really really want to be a guard. But I'm not comvinced. Would we end up with a higher percentage of guards who joined up out of no other option.
IMO this would result in many people with no particular motivation to be a guard other than job security joining.

Blub2k4

I think it would be a good idea, get a few people in later in life when they are chilled a bit and have a few life skills and are not just jumped up testosterone monsters that want to crack some skulls on a Friday night cos they have to work and cant go out and fight themselves.

Penfolds

If someone over 26 really wanted to get in, there's a loop-hole where you can train with the PSNI and then apply for a transfer to the Gardai shortly after you qualify.
I know of two people who did it this way and all they had to do was attend a course in templemore (think it was 1 month or so) and then pass the exams (most irish criminal law is copied from british criminal law anyway).

pork99

Penfolds wrote:

If someone over 26 really wanted to get in, there's a loop-hole where you can train with the PSNI and then apply for a transfer to the Gardai shortly after you qualify.
I know of two people who did it this way and all they had to do was attend a course in templemore (think it was 1 month or so) and then pass the exams (most irish criminal law is copied from british criminal law anyway).

just shows what a brain damaged regulation the 26 yo age limit is.

But it needs to be part of a radical reform of policing in this country with the Garda given more resources, increased in strength by a few thousand, better support from the courts system and new structures brought in to improve their links with and accountability to the general public (who are after all paying their wages).

OFDM

pork99 wrote:

just shows what a brain damaged regulation the 26 yo age limit is.

But it needs to be part of a radical reform of policing in this country with the Garda given more resources, increased in strength by a few thousand, better support from the courts system and new structures brought in to improve their links with and accountability to the general public (who are after all paying their wages).

It might also be a good idea to bring in something like the part-time Special Constable (volunteer unpaid police) they have in British police forces as it would help reduce the shortage of Gardaí at minimum cost.

pork99

OFDM wrote:

It might also be a good idea to bring in something like the part-time Special Constable (volunteer unpaid police) they have in British police forces as it would help reduce the shortage of Gardaí at minimum cost.

I doubt Irish people have sufficient civic responsibility for such a measure to be successful.

simu

pork99 wrote:

I doubt Irish people have sufficient civic responsibility for such a measure to be successful.

I wouldn't be so cynical. Many Irish people volunteer for sports clubs, charities etc

FGR

Wait a second..

The general concensus on this topic revolves around the theory that the age limit should be raised as they can't find enough younger recruits..??

Where on Earth did that mentality come out of? I've applied to the Gardai during the previous campaign. There was 300 positions available, and the one hall I sat in (One of dozens) had at least 200 people in it.

It's not a question of numbers; it's all about the resources the Government is willing to put into the Department of Justice to recruit the larger numbers.

I'm all for raising the age of entry; though the reasoning behind it being so low is so that trainees will experience discipline and vast amounts of physical/educational training which is so different to a normal college life. Did you know that the Policing Studies diploma was listed under CAO though the only way of attending the course is to be recruited as a Garda?

: )

OFDM

ForegoneReality wrote:

The general concensus on this topic revolves around the theory that the age limit should be raised as they can't find enough younger recruits..??

Maybe you should re-read the thread - wanting to have the age limit raised or removed has nothing to do getting enough number, it has to do with getting better candidates and removing unwarranted age discrimination.