Was Elvis the greatest.....

Kingp35

Swarfboy wrote:

Sure enough Elvis was Great and I too love the 68 comeback....
But if you want to talk about Rockn'roll inventor.......look up chuck berry...
Also see even Elvis's comments on Chick Berry.... People know very little of chuck berry but he was the one with the riffs... a true musicans musican.!

gotta agree with this I have alot of Chuck Berry stuff and he, if anyone, was the founder of rock n roll and it has been said by alot of artists and music magazines etc. that this man started it all

Dr. Loon

Kingp35 wrote:

And yes true not all singers write their own songs but real artists do and all the truely great ones do.

We're gonna have to agree to disagree. I used to think a real artist was someone who wrote and performed their own material, but not any more. I'm kind of half way on that call. I dont' respect the likes of Westlife because I believe they have no talent regardless, but I respect Elvis, if he hadn't have existed I don't know what way music might be now. The world of music is a better place because he existed. Same with Sinatra.

I've never claimed Elvis thought up rock 'n' roll, but he gave it the introduction it needed. He also introduced "operatic" rock 'n' roll, which Roy Orbison also did. A whole bunch of songs wouldn't have existed without him, but because they were written for him, they do, and I'm glad of that.

If there were more singers out there who had the same passion that Elvis had for music, the entire music scene would be better. I'm sure of it.

irlirishkev

Dr. Loon wrote:

We're gonna have to agree to disagree. I used to think a real artist was someone who wrote and performed their own material, but not any more. I'm kind of half way on that call. I dont' respect the likes of Westlife because I believe they have no talent regardless, but I respect Elvis, if he hadn't have existed I don't know what way music might be now. The world of music is a better place because he existed. Same with Sinatra.

I've never claimed Elvis thought up rock 'n' roll, but he gave it the introduction it needed. He also introduced "operatic" rock 'n' roll, which Roy Orbison also did. A whole bunch of songs wouldn't have existed without him, but because they were written for him, they do, and I'm glad of that.

If there were more singers out there who had the same passion that Elvis had for music, the entire music scene would be better. I'm sure of it.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

Dr. Dre

Elvis gets the 1000th UK No.1 with 'One night'

Chong

Elvis is and always be a legend, I got his Hawaian special Aloha album and Chuck Berry's Greatest the other day off Amazon, and for as much love I have for Elvis I feel Chuck, and Buddy were equally as good.

JackKelly

what about the likes of Freddie Mercury? Great Performer, song writer, musician. I regard him higher than i do Elvis

Kingp35

Dr. Loon wrote:

We're gonna have to agree to disagree. I used to think a real artist was someone who wrote and performed their own material, but not any more. I'm kind of half way on that call. I dont' respect the likes of Westlife because I believe they have no talent regardless, but I respect Elvis, if he hadn't have existed I don't know what way music might be now. The world of music is a better place because he existed. Same with Sinatra.

I've never claimed Elvis thought up rock 'n' roll, but he gave it the introduction it needed. He also introduced "operatic" rock 'n' roll, which Roy Orbison also did.

I have to say I agree with you here in that Elvis the performer did change music and alot of music these days wuldnt have existed without him but the elvis wouldnt have existed without the likes of chuck berry and the people he covered so that list just goes on and on back through music. Im not discrediting Elvis he was an excellent entertainer and performer what Im saying is I dont get why he is worshipped like a god he is no better than alot of other people and to call one man the king of rock n roll is ridiculous because of the fact he didnt write his own stuff and he copied a for of music that aleady existed. True he changed it a bit but still Elvis would not have existed without the guys before him.

Ultimately I agree with you guys saying that he was an excellent performer and singer and he was but I could name so many more equally brilliant and better than he was simply because they performed original material.

Elvis was very good but to call him the king/founder/legend of rock n roll is taking it way too far and those he dress like him and worship him are a little strange tbh. A man wh does not write his own stuff cannot be credited the same as the people who do. Its as simple as that

Doctor J

Kingp35 wrote:

Elvis was very good but to call him the king/founder/legend of rock n roll is taking it way too far and those he dress like him and worship him are a little strange tbh. A man wh does not write his own stuff cannot be credited the same as the people who do. Its as simple as that

Being a songwriter and being a performer are very different things. Elvis was a great performer, a great arranger and producer of songs and part of his legacy is the people he inspired to greatness. He was an incredible interpreter of songs and made songs his own. Elvis was a phenomenon, in a way that Buddy Holly, Jeery Lee Lewis, Chuck Berry etc, despite their greatness, weren't. When Elvis broke through eveything changed in a way we can't really appreciate these days. There are great artists from his era but none had the impact Elvis had (and continues to have). He was the King, no dount about it.

BrookieD

Hi
He was a burger munching gimp and i am sick of seeing countless "Must Have collections" on the TV all the time, way to over hyped and could not act for his so called burgers.

Kingp35

Doctor J wrote:

He was the King, no dount about it.

why??

Yes he made songs his own but you elvis fans are so blind to the simple fact that if someone did not write the songs elvis would not have existed because he didnt make is own. Its actually laughable that you guys dont realise this. Wake up will ya!! The king of rock n roll would have to ability to write some songs dont ya think!!!!

Doctor J

Why? Because he put his soul into his singing in a way no-one else I've ever heard could do it. I only started appreciating Elvis in the last few years, I had dismissed his work in a similar fashion to what you're doing now. Then I actually listened to him.

"The king of rock n roll would have to ability to write some songs dont ya think!!!!"

Clearly, no. As I said, performing and songwriting are different things altogether. Frank Sinatra didn't write his own songs but are you going to dismiss him in an equally ridiculous manner? Frank, like Elvis, could guide a band and sculpt someone else's song into his own, which is an artform in itself. You have to appreciate the context in which Elvis' early material became such a revelation.

Doctor J

Why? Because he put his soul into his singing in a way no-one else I've ever heard could do it. I only started appreciating Elvis in the last few years, I had dismissed his work in a similar fashion to what you're doing now. Then I actually listened to him.

"The king of rock n roll would have to ability to write some songs dont ya think!!!!"

Clearly, no. As I said, performing and songwriting are different things altogether. Frank Sinatra didn't write his own songs but are you going to dismiss him in an equally ridiculous manner? Frank, like Elvis, could guide a band and sculpt someone else's song into his own, which is an artform in itself. You have to appreciate the context in which Elvis' early material became such a revelation.

Kingp35

Doctor J wrote:

Why? Because he put his soul into his singing in a way no-one else I've ever heard could do it. I only started appreciating Elvis in the last few years, I had dismissed his work in a similar fashion to what you're doing now. Then I actually listened to him.

Clearly, no. As I said, performing and songwriting are different things altogether. Frank Sinatra didn't write his own songs but are you going to dismiss him in an equally ridiculous manner? Frank, like Elvis, could guide a band and sculpt someone else's song into his own, which is an artform in itself. You have to appreciate the context in which Elvis' early material became such a revelation.

Eh if you have read my posts you will see that i am not dismissing his work i have said he was very talented in what he did and was an excellent performer and singer. I have already said this but you guys are taking it to another level saying he is the king. There have been better singers and better performers since elvis and they wrote their own songs. Its a fundamental aspect of being a truely great musician and Elvis was lacking this. If the man wrote his own songs he truely would have been the one of the best but he didnt. You love his music and his performances and I respect that he was one of the best performers bt he wasnt performing his own work whether he changed it to make it different or not it wasnt his own work and this is his downfall. Brilliant in his own right and up there but definitely not the best

Phil_321

Elvis is a true and deserving legend.
There is no such thing as a greatest though.

Dr. Loon

Kingp35 wrote:

There have been better singers and better performers since elvis and they wrote their own songs. Its a fundamental aspect of being a truely great musician and Elvis was lacking this.

Your problem is you have a mental block if an artist doesn't perform/write their own music. That's not what music is about. Music is about the enjoyment people get out of it. How the artist is regarded by the world and more importantly other musicians dictates their standing in the world of music. Elvis was named The King for a reason. Every credible artist out there hols him in very high regard. However, just because he didn't write his own music you don't place him the same regard.

Tell me, who has been a better singer since Elvis? There's nobody I can think of. Maybe Roy Orbison. Certainly not Sinatra - he didn't have the same range and was a pretty boring performer.

Elvis' influence on the world is quite obvious. I've said before, I used to think quite like yourself... if an artist doesn't write their own music than they're shít. This quite simply is not true, Elvis alone proves this.

Kingp35

Dr. Loon wrote:

Elvis' influence on the world is quite obvious. I've said before, I used to think quite like yourself... if an artist doesn't write their own music than they're shít. This quite simply is not true, Elvis alone proves this.

I didnt say he was sh1te i really like elvis' music its very good I just cant rate him as the king if he didnt write his own stuff. Its not a mental block its one mans opinion against another. I understand what your saying about the general public and how highly regarded he was/is but as a true music fan who knows more than the general public do I just dont think the man was as brilliant as he is made out to be.

I think Freddie Mercury was a better performer than Elvis the man was charismatic and was an unbelievable performer. Perhaps not as good a singer but the man could still sing.

mwnger

I would go along with Beerbreath's comments regarding Elvis early in this thread. Posters are doubting his legacy because he didn't write his own material, was just ripping off black culture and he wasn't even the first to do that. All of which is true but it doesn't at all take away from his importance. But I'm not talking about his music per se. Cos if Elvis was to be judged on his musical impact alone - then he trails behind the likes of the Beatles and other true musical innovators. But if he is to be judged on his cultural importance and his impact on society in general - then I don't think it's an exaggeration to say he's one of the most important individuals of the latter half of the 20th century, up there with figures like Kennedy and Gorberchev. The difference with them was that they were consciously trying to change the world, while Elvis was just a simple country boy who just wanted to sing songs.
There's no doubt that Elvis was the harbinger of the 'Swinging Sixties', the Sexual Revolution, the counter-culture, whatever you want to call it. What he (inadvertedly) started was taken up by the likes of Bob Dylan and the Beatles who ran with it, bringing a sort of ideology to rock 'n' roll, believing it could change the world for the better. The irony is that Elvis himself did not welcome much of this change. It’s well documented that he was very conservative in his politics (most memorably stated by Public Enemy, as someone mentioned). In fact, he lobbied the U.S. authorities to have the Beatles kicked out of America. He particularly despised John Lennon, blaming him (with some justification, it has to be said!) for creating the hippy movement.
So, yes I do believe Elvis was the great phenomenon his fans make him out to be, but a social phenomenon, in which music was the vehicle. I think his performance style was as integral to his impact as well. It’s as if society at that point was waiting for someone like him to go crazy. It’s probable that if Elvis never got into music and remained a humble truck driver, then the public would have gone mad for someone else – and the changes he was the catalyst for would have happened anyway. So I suppose...

…"if Elvis didn’t exist it would be necessary to invent him".

Dr. Loon

mwnger wrote:

In fact, he lobbied the U.S. authorities to have the Beatles kicked out of America. He particularly despised John Lennon, blaming him (with some justification, it has to be said!) for creating the hippy movement.

In all the books I've read on Elvis I've never once come across these "facts". Elvis was a big fan of all music, and covered many popular tunes, including Beatles numbers as well as Sinatra, Neil Diamond, and Chuck Berry. I've never once heard that he tried to get The Beatles kicked out of America, or that he hated John Lennon although I suppose it's possible. I know he had them over to his house and that he was slightly worried that they might be more popular than him.

Phil_321

Surely you've heard about Elvis' meeting with Nixon where he complained about America's drug problems, and how the Beatles among others were contributing to it. He was even made an honorary federal agent, by his own request, so he could try and do something about it.

http://www.archives.gov/exhibit_hall/when_nixon_met_elvis/part_1.html
http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,1423,00.html

Dr. Loon

Phil_321 wrote:

Surely you've heard about Elvis' meeting with Nixon where he complained about America's drug problems, and how the Beatles among others were contributing to it. He was even made an honorary federal agent, by his own request, so he could try and do something about it.

http://www.archives.gov/exhibit_hall/when_nixon_met_elvis/part_1.html
http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,1423,00.html

I'm well aware he met Nixon ans was made an honorary DEA agent, but I've never read that he believed The Beatles were causing Americas drug problems, and doubt the truth behind the E online article. In any case it has no bearing on whether he was The King or not. Although it might be interesting reading for fans.

Phil_321

I'm sure if you do a search you'll find more info on it, Elvis definately had a problem with the Beatles at this stage in his life. I'd heard about it previously, the eonline atricle was just the first result that came up when I googled.

Stalfos

There's a reason they call him "the king" it would have been great to be around in those days, not like now

irlirishkev

What I've never understood is why so many people give Elvis so much grief!

For 22 years he entertained the world, made a lot of people happy, touched so many peoples lives, gave so much money to charity.. etc etc etc..

For some reason, those who don't like Elvis tend to jump on the bandwagon and concentrate on his last couple of years, when he was a very sick individual. They slag him off and tear him to shreds.

Like I said, I'll never understand why this is..

Kevin.

Kingp35

irlirishkev wrote:

What I've never understood is why so many people give Elvis so much grief!

For 22 years he entertained the world, made a lot of people happy, touched so many peoples lives, gave so much money to charity.. etc etc etc..

For some reason, those who don't like Elvis tend to jump on the bandwagon and concentrate on his last couple of years, when he was a very sick individual. They slag him off and tear him to shreds.

Like I said, I'll never understand why this is..

Kevin.

ill never understand why people worship the ground he walks on, dress like him, talk like him and all that jazz.

He was good but some people take it too far

Dr. Loon

Kingp35 wrote:

ill never understand why people worship the ground he walks on, dress like him, talk like him and all that jazz.

He was good but some people take it too far

Why are there loads of goth idiots hanging around central bank?
Why do people who are into metal, tend to wear leather jackets jeans and have piercings and tatoos and generally have long hair?
Why do/did grunge heads all sport goatees and long hair?

It's all musical influences. Elvis's influence was a bit stronger on the world then metal/grunge etc... which is why you have all these loons dressing like him. He is easily THE most popular musical icon EVER.

Note - I think he's amazing, but I don't dress or style myself on him!

Kingsize

elvis is the king despite the fact that he didnt write his own songs.
Elvis is still a cultural phenomenon
you dont even have to own any of his records to appreciate how truly great he is.
Elvis basically wrote the rulebook .
but im not takin away from the fact that people go overboard,
but it must make Elvis fans sick to see the old cliches being dragged out for a cheap laugh
.

Kingsize

The thing about elvis being made an honorary dea agent is detailed in peter
guralnick's book(s) about elvis life.
Elvis was obsessive when he got a new hobby & apparently went a bit crazy collecting sherrifs badges & honorary law officer awards etc etc ,Elvis really hassled & hustled to get the DEA(cia i thought but might wrong) badge.
He was also obsessed with "pimpin his ride" & had many custom jobs done on
cars bikes RV's etc.
the other thing was his love of martial arts & thers aparently loads of footage from an unfinished kung fu movie he was starring in & funding!!