What book, can make me believe in a god?

Paladin

Opening up an entirely new topic here, but Id like to ask.....
Is there any evidence of a god?

note: Previous people believing in a god do not count as evidence.
e.g.
Jesus Christ: There is some evidence the man existed. There is no evidence he was godlike.

The Bible so far is the only evidence christians have to offer. That is flawed as far as I'm concerned, in that there is nothing in the way of evidence in it. There are the gospels talking about miracles, but anybody could have written them. A drunk pedestrian could have written them.

So where can I find any evidence of a god? Or does the entire belief system of religion boil down to one unanswereed question:

Where did the universe come from?

DeVore

I long ago gave up looking for evidence of God. Its not that I believe he isnt there (the jury's out on that one) it just that I am fairly confident we dont have the knowledge or wisdom (?) to actually look in the right places.

He sure a sh|t isnt making it easy for us if he's hanging around in the ether.

Do you think the little people in the Sim games have any way within their environs of telling that its a computer game?

Whats interesting is that the pope called a very quiet meeting of the worlds top physicists and told them he'd rather if they didnt look into the first second of creation. That was God's providence according to him. What I find annoying is the way people attibute any area of science we dont already understand as being the likely seat of God. The start of the universe, the mind, nature, space-time continuum etc. Then when we do finally explain it with science, people jump up and say God is dead!

Thats straw man logic.

Either way, back to the book idea... No book can prove anything to you unless you make certain assumptions. Religious belief by its very nature is practically unprovable. However a book might *convince* you of a religious belief although I havent read one yet and I've read at least some of most of the great religious works ou there...

Tom.

"You are the messiah, I should know, I've followed a few!"

OSiriS

I'm not quite sure of the specifics at the moment, but as far as I know there was a man called jesus born in bethlahem around the day of a roman census, although that was 6BC or something, but as for the rest, who knows.

It may be that Jesus was the greatest con-artist in history who not only had thousands of people following him them, but billions now, 2000 years later...but thats just speculation.

---

===>My New Site<===

Chubby

Originally posted by OSiriS:
It may be that Jesus was the greatest con-artist in history who not only had thousands of people following him them, but billions now, 2000 years later...but thats just speculation.

The thing is we will never know for sure except that history tends to exagerate. And the bible is hardly an accurate account of past events. It reads more like a badly writen fantasy novel. Christians had gone on for so long believing in bible and not questioning the validity of its contents that they have no other evidence of their god. If you really want to look for evidence of god, look into other religions because at least their stories are more interest. But don't kid yourself, god did not create man, man created god!

WhiteWashMan

read either fingerprints of the gods, or in search of alantis
both books deal with the theory of earths genisis being alien in life form
i read tghem a few years ago. im agine my surprise when e x-files started going along that line as well.
hmm, personally, i think there may be something in it.....

Canaboid

Well done WWman. Go to the top of the class.
Its the only explanation that makes any sense.
We are living in a petri dish people.

bubbles

I think thats something like some of the Storylines they have is Stargate SG1 with the Gods etc who where really aliens....

Wouldn't you just love to have a time machince to go back too Jesus's time and have a look at what really went on...

Excelsior

a book didnt convince me.

---

It is so lonely here in my indecipherable tower of speech impedimency

Draco

There a book by Micheal Mordock (I think thats the aurthors name anyway) about a time traveller who does just that.

Draco

Illkillya

Michael Moor**** i think - i've read a series by him about a guy called Elric. I meant to bring that up actually, because its the one series that i cant decide whether i loved it or hated it. twas horrible, but twas brilliant in its own way

2040

g'way n' ****e!

Manach

My View,
I am stepping in to this ring with as much trepidation as Don Quixote would if he learnt the Windmills were packing armour-seeking missiles

Short answer no. God to believers, myself included, is essentially a spiritual concept I've not got the foggiest notion of how to present material proof. If I could though it would make a nice T-shirt.

General Points
1/ Could ask for proof that God does not exist, though that might then lead to one asking about the Toothfairy, Sandman and Father Xmas. Therefore won't bother.

2/ Could reply with the St Aquinas's proofs of the existence of God
Things are in motion, hence there is a first mover
Things are caused, hence there is a first cause
Things exist, hence there is a creator
Perfect goodness exists, hence has a source
Things are designed, hence have a purpose
But I lack the insight to understand this properly so won't bother.

3/ The opening article asked about beginning's - Books by Paul Davies about The Start of the Universe or Stephen J. Gould on Evolution are excellent starting points. They are strictly scientific texts, but they are written such that they give a sense a wonder on how we came to be how we are.

In short:
It's matter of individual belief - that belief may seem akin to jumping from a cliff and hoping you can learn to fly ere you splat, then again God knows.

Is mise
Poor deluded lazy and naive Papist.

Shiminay

I've been sitting back for the last couple of day's and trying to get my thoughts in order about this whole Bible/Faith/Christianity thing. Here's what I've come up with...

Faith - it's precisely that. People choose to believe in something because they have faith in it. The don't need the proof - and fair play to them! Personally, I don't believe in a God, but I really respect anyone that really does (not the people who go to mass or whatever every week out of a sense of duty - I know it's not necessary to go to mass to be a Christian, but this is just an example). It's good for people to have ideas and faith, but not to the extent that Wars are caused over it.

However, getting back on track, if a book gives you faith enough to believe in something, anything at all! That's cool for you. All you have to remember is to respect the faith and beliefs of others.

---

All the best,

Dav
@B^)
http://homepage.eircom.net/~davitt

WhiteWashMan

philosophy is more diverting topic than theology....

Shiminay

Agreed

---

All the best,

Dav
@B^)
http://homepage.eircom.net/~davitt

Paladin

Ummm....
I never actually said I was an athiest. Perhaps it is the logical assumption from my question, but my beliefs arent totally dismissive just yet. I certainly dont believe that any one specific one of the current gods or religions is definately right, and I certainly dont believe in divine intervention.
There is one question....
"how did the universe begin?"
The same question applies to god however....
I was just flicking through religious teaching books the other day (during religion class - silly during the LC I rekon) and I just thought their methods were a heap or bork.
So far possibly the most compelling book for me was stephen hawkings a brief history of time. Strange considering it is a very scientific book, but its what the book doesnt explain was what intrests me.
Id recommend a brief history of time to ANYBODY (should have put that in the topic about making ppl read one book).
Im a guy who cant make a judgement because I dont have the knowledge, which kind of defeats the idea of faith I suppose, but I rekon in the end of the day nobody can go too far wrong in life if they are just pretty decent people, and there cant be too much of an argument to that.

Excelsior

none i can make through a simple post anyway.
stephen hawking along with stephen jay gould and albert einstein and a huge proportion of the scientists i love and admire (darwin even) believed in god.
a semitic culture god too, but we won't go into specifics.
basically i really think these are face to face discussion topics.... maybe at MiLan we can have a go at it...

---

It is so lonely here in my indecipherable tower of speech impedimency

Excelsior

well you could work off descartes idea that all people are born with an innate intelligence of that which is perfect, an ideal, (harking back to the old greasy grecian socrates and aristotle there) and that this innate knowlege of a perfection attained is by deterministic logic, proof that a God exists.
as a christian here, i can not supply you with logic or rationale for that which i know.
sorry pladin you just have to stay as an atheist or be coraguoes or stupid enough to take a leap into the dark.

---

It is so lonely here in my indecipherable tower of speech impedimency