Waterford North Quays

azimuth17

Harry Palmr wrote: »

I took that to be concern that if they signed off the clock was ticking but with Covid market conditions in place they (Falcon) were not going to commit.
What we probably need for a quick resolution is a down payment, as a gesture of good will as much as anything.

Council statement Friday afternoon ; Over recent months the Council extended the contract to May 15th, 2021 with Falcon Real Estate Development Ireland (Falcon) for the North Quays to allow the developer (Falcon) time to put in place the necessary funding for the project, given the obvious constraints imposed by the Covid 19 pandemic. It is our view that it is unlikely that Falcon will be in a position to satisfy the contract preconditions in respect of funding, albeit we are informed that funding proposals will be submitted later today or tomorrow. As previously advised at our Council meetings, the rescission date under contract is Saturday, May 15th. In the circumstances we would not propose to comment further until Monday next.
ENDS

Harry Palmr

Tyranny of the deadline. I know we all like to impose them esp when money is a stake but if circumstances change then they need to be a bit flexible.

dzilla

obi604 wrote: »

jaysus, this thread was started 17 years ago !!

It has acne

Asdfgh2020

dzilla wrote: »

It has acne

You’d have to start asking is the council/Michael Walsh etc able for this kind of contract/development...sorting out pot holes is a bit different to negotiating a multi million euro developments...? I doubt this situation would have evolved if some private sector expertise had been involved

Wanderer78

Asdfgh2020 wrote:

You’d have to start asking is the council/Michael Walsh etc able for this kind of contract/development...sorting out pot holes is a bit different to negotiating a multi million euro developments...? I doubt this situation would have evolved if some private sector expertise had been involved

I doubt that, I'd imagine projects fall through all the time in the private sector, covid has been a major kick in the teeth for everyone, there will be major changes after it rolls through, I'd imagine many investments will go by the way side unfortunately. I hear great things about Michael Walsh and Co. , sounds like they know what they're doing there. I'd never get too caught up in that public v's private sector either, both are well capable of great things, and great fcuk ups also.

hardybuck

Asdfgh2020 wrote: »

You’d have to start asking is the council/Michael Walsh etc able for this kind of contract/development...sorting out pot holes is a bit different to negotiating a multi million euro developments...? I doubt this situation would have evolved if some private sector expertise had been involved

I'd be very surprised if the Council doesn't have an advisor with said expertise.

jimbojazz

Wonder was the Term sheet submitted to the council by Falcon yesterday, as promised by Rob?

Deiseen

jimbojazz wrote: »

Wonder was the Term sheet submitted to the council by Falcon yesterday, as promised by Rob?

I also want to know this.

Saturday still the deadline so let us see.

imacman

I hope the NQ progresses but the mood music isn't good and I think the odds are against it at this moment in time . If it does fall through its a massive blow for the city and combined with the university/TU fiasco it been a really depressing few weeks for the city and its development.I think at this stage Waterford has been sold so many pups by the government and others we could start a pet shop.

BBM77

imacman wrote: »

I hope the NQ progresses but the mood music isn't good and I think the odds are against it at this moment in time . If it does fall through its a massive blow for the city and combined with the university/TU fiasco it been a really depressing few weeks for the city and its development.I think at this stage Waterford has been sold so many pups by the government and others we could start a pet shop.

Not what I got from listening to DT interviews yesterday. Yes, Falcon is iffy but there seems to be confidence that it will still happen with another developer.

But yes the TUSE is depressing.

snotboogie

BBM77 wrote: »

Not what I got from listening to DT interviews yesterday. Yes, Falcon is iffy but there seems to be confidence that it will still happen with another developer.

But yes the TUSE is depressing.

I get the impression that the council actually want to go with another developer. Plenty of well established developers in Ireland will look very differently at the North Quays with the infrastructure commitments. While it will push the project out by a few years it may be better in the long run. Falcons design is a bit meh and they have no reputation here at all. I mean what have Falcon actually built? Their website talks about them being a small company.

BBM77

snotboogie wrote: »

I get the impression that the council actually want to go with another developer. Plenty of well established developers in Ireland will look very differently at the North Quays with the infrastructure commitments. While it will push the project out by a few years it may be better in the long run. Falcons design is a bit meh and they have no reputation here at all. I mean what have Falcon actually built? Their website talks about them being a small company.

That is true alright. Michael Walsh sounded as if he was not really bothered if Falcon pull out.

Also the construction industry councillor… I mean FF councillor Eamon Quinlan was upbeat so this is a good sign as well.

People need to remember that even with the COVID blip Waterford is under-developed. There is still a shortage of hotels and office space.

Deiseen

snotboogie wrote: »

I get the impression that the council actually want to go with another developer. Plenty of well established developers in Ireland will look very differently at the North Quays with the infrastructure commitments. While it will push the project out by a few years it may be better in the long run. Falcons design is a bit meh and they have no reputation here at all. I mean what have Falcon actually built? Their website talks about them being a small company.

As much as I would like to think that another developer would snap it up, we have to remember that this site has been lying idle for over 30 years and has not had serious movement until the last number of years - spearheaded by Rob/Falcon. I know it now has SDZ designation now but nothing moves fast in Waterford, most things don't move at all.

If they are ready to go, then I think the council would be insane not to proceed. If they are thinking something better might come along afterwards then it would be a complete disaster if something didn't.

SeanieW1977

BBM77 wrote: »

That is true alright. Michael Walsh sounded as if he was not really bothered if Falcon pull out.

Also the construction industry councillor… I mean FF councillor Eamon Quinlan was upbeat so this is a good sign as well.

People need to remember that even with the COVID blip Waterford is under-developed. There is still a shortage of hotels and office space.

Eamon quinlan is a parody at times.

914

snotboogie wrote: »

While it will push the project out by a few years it may be better in the long run.

Same was said about the Michael St center back in the 00's, over a decade later all that has happened is the houses were removed.

NQ's needs to be a statement of intent for Waterford. A watered down development may not deliver that.

All we have seen over the years is plans plans and more plans. Several NQ Quays (lost count how many plans I have seen, anyone remember the modal on display in the tax office?), Michael St development (think I have seen three plans for this area to date) and Bolsters Bilberry Tower. Can even add to that the redevelopment of Lisduggan shopping centre, Walsh Park (two plans), Waterford Airport (lost count of how many plans)

All these plans after plans and the only major development to take on any of the sites has been the removal of the houses on Alexander St, knocking of the flour Mills, and the travellers placing their horses on the Bilberry warf.

If I hear another "it might be better in the long run" relating to Waterford I'll scream.

We need to see cranes on these sites or it's gonna be another depressing decade after the whole TUSE sh1tshow.

Gavlor

BBM77 wrote: »

That is true alright. Michael Walsh sounded as if he was not really bothered if Falcon pull out.

Also the construction industry councillor… I mean FF councillor Eamon Quinlan was upbeat so this is a good sign as well.

People need to remember that even with the COVID blip Waterford is under-developed. There is still a shortage of hotels and office space.

Imagine that.... a CEO and co councillor playing down a potentially disastrous situation happening under their stewardship’s. I wonder why??!

E38E3E38E3EE33

From Eddie Mulligan's Facebook page:

Whilst there has been much speculation about the North Quays, here is a number of positive facts;

The main construction contract for the NQ infrastructural works comprising;

• Sustainable bridge
• Transport Hub
• Access Infrastructure

is progressing with tender documentation close to completion.

Planning Applications are being prepared for the following;

• Flood Defences
• Belmont link Road & N25 Port Road
• Greenway access provision

Tenders are currently being issued for the following;

• Ferrybank Pump Station
• Rock Stabilisation
• South Plaza (Clock Tower Area) Enabling Works
• Abbey Rd & Belmont Rd Sustainable Transport improvements

The involvement of Falcon Real Estate to date has ensured that our Strategic Development Zoned Site in Ferrybank has been rapidly advanced to a construction ready site within a very short period of time with Government funding for the infrastructure confirmed.

Without the Fawaz Al Hokair expressing interest, it would have taken 15 years to get where we’ve got to in 3 years, in my opinion.

Whether Falcon are the developers or not, we are now sitting on a prime City Centre water fronting real estate site with planning controlled within the entity of a Strategic Development Zone, thanks to Paudie Coffey.

The North Quays will be developed as an expansion of our City and the only question to be answered, is who the developer will be?

jelutong

As 914 said, plans,plans and more plans.

Oscar Madison

jelutong wrote: »

As 914 said, plans,plans and more plans.

Talk, talk & more talk!

Who ever thought that this project was ever going to start was seriously deluded!

Motivator

Oscar Madison wrote: »

Talk, talk & more talk!

Who ever thought that this project was ever going to start was seriously deluded!

I said the same thing two years ago and got a ban for apparently trying to cause an argument. Sad and all as it is to say, this was never going to happen as people thought it did. These Saudi lads, if they even exist, have never ever been seen or photographed in Waterford at any stage over the last four years. People think that they’re going to put €300m+ into a city without ever taking a look at the place? When these major projects are sanctioned, the company responsible will ferry in a team of people to set up shop to keep an eye on everything from the get go. We’ve never seen anything and nothing even rumoured to happen.

This Rob Cass fella is full of hot air and he was copped by quite a few people earlier on, especially on Twitter but somehow he had people believing this nonsense. Do people honestly believe that this guy is the companies sole rep in Ireland and is that trusted to be the man on the ground in a €300m+ ground breaking project?

Wanderer78

Motivator wrote:

I said the same thing two years ago and got a ban for apparently trying to cause an argument. Sad and all as it is to say, this was never going to happen as people thought it did. These Saudi lads, if they even exist, have never ever been seen or photographed in Waterford at any stage over the last four years. People think that they’re going to put €300m+ into a city without ever taking a look at the place? When these major projects are sanctioned, the company responsible will ferry in a team of people to set up shop to keep an eye on everything from the get go. We’ve never seen anything and nothing even rumoured to happen.

Ah bans are fun to be fair, but it's sad to see this slowly fall apart, hopefully something will happen to the site

Dexpat

Motivator wrote: »

I said the same thing two years ago and got a ban for apparently trying to cause an argument. Sad and all as it is to say, this was never going to happen as people thought it did. These Saudi lads, if they even exist, have never ever been seen or photographed in Waterford at any stage over the last four years. People think that they’re going to put €300m+ into a city without ever taking a look at the place? When these major projects are sanctioned, the company responsible will ferry in a team of people to set up shop to keep an eye on everything from the get go. We’ve never seen anything and nothing even rumoured to happen.

This Rob Cass fella is full of hot air and he was copped by quite a few people earlier on, especially on Twitter but somehow he had people believing this nonsense. Do people honestly believe that this guy is the companies sole rep in Ireland and is that trusted to be the man on the ground in a €300m+ ground breaking project?

The Saudi investors were in Waterford about two years ago and it was discussed on the previous thread before it was closed. This project is not very big in terms of the groups overall portfolio. I think I heard somewhere that they build the equivalent of a Dundrum town centre ever six months.

Whatever about the ultimate outcome I don't think it is right to say it was never going to happen. They have spent a considerable amout to date on planning etc without having anything to show for it. They can only make money if they buy the site. It's a lot to spend for an ego trip.

I don't doubt Rob Cass is genuine in terms of trying to get this over the line but it seems in the end it might fall down down to factors nothing to do with Waterford or this specifc development. Covid and macro financing issues are probably largely to blame. Or maybe the council have lost patience and/or want a different type of development, hence the possibility of other developers being lined up. Only those on the inside know.

I still think the Falcon development is the best option, as if they provide the financing and other assurances to the council they are ready to go immediately. Otherwise it will be delays as plans are redrawn etc. In that case I don't think it would be as long as a delay or deferrement as other projects in the past in Waterford have experienced. As has been posted earlier from Eddie Mulligans Facebook page a lot is happening already and this will mean it is a very attractive proposition.

Gardner

Motivator wrote: »

I said the same thing two years ago and got a ban for apparently trying to cause an argument. Sad and all as it is to say, this was never going to happen as people thought it did. These Saudi lads, if they even exist, have never ever been seen or photographed in Waterford at any stage over the last four years. People think that they’re going to put €300m+ into a city without ever taking a look at the place? When these major projects are sanctioned, the company responsible will ferry in a team of people to set up shop to keep an eye on everything from the get go. We’ve never seen anything and nothing even rumoured to happen.

This Rob Cass fella is full of hot air and he was copped by quite a few people earlier on, especially on Twitter but somehow he had people believing this nonsense. Do people honestly believe that this guy is the companies sole rep in Ireland and is that trusted to be the man on the ground in a €300m+ ground breaking project?

Yep spot on. Posted a few days ago the same thing. A few posters still hiding and talking nonsense on this thread. It's worth reading back the old thread for a bit if a laugh

Gardner

E38E3E38E3EE33 wrote: »

From Eddie Mulligan's Facebook page:

Spoof spoof and more spoof from Eddie. Don't cry on WLR if this project doesn't go ahead Eddie.

friendlyfun

If something is too good to be true it usually is too good to be true. That's an important adage in life imo.

azimuth17

Waterford is divided into two parts. Those who believe, rightly in my view, that the North Quays will get developed and those who believe that it wont. That second crew are , I suppose , entitled to their negative hurler on the ditch view, but I cannot understand the miserable glee and delight some take in the fact that they believe it may not happen. That is contemptible. Time will tell which group were right.

Five years ago John Halligan made a complete cod of negotiations for a second cath lab at UHW without which 24/7 cardiology cannot be put in place there. Tom O'Brien Building contractor of Waterford is starting work on Monday next on the second cath lab building. It is happening because people stuck at it and believed in it even when all the odds were stacked against it. I guess there are those among the glee merchants who also said it would never happen?

E38E3E38E3EE33

azimuth17 wrote: »

Waterford is divided into two parts. Those who believe, rightly in my view, that the North Quays will get developed and those who believe that it wont.

I think it's 3 parts:

Those who are hopeful, those who were talking about 100ft statues, and those who like to inject their own miserable negative outlook on everything but playing it off as their own insight.

Deiseen

Motivator wrote: »

I said the same thing two years ago and got a ban for apparently trying to cause an argument. Sad and all as it is to say, this was never going to happen as people thought it did. These Saudi lads, if they even exist, have never ever been seen or photographed in Waterford at any stage over the last four years. People think that they’re going to put €300m+ into a city without ever taking a look at the place? When these major projects are sanctioned, the company responsible will ferry in a team of people to set up shop to keep an eye on everything from the get go. We’ve never seen anything and nothing even rumoured to happen.

This Rob Cass fella is full of hot air and he was copped by quite a few people earlier on, especially on Twitter but somehow he had people believing this nonsense. Do people honestly believe that this guy is the companies sole rep in Ireland and is that trusted to be the man on the ground in a €300m+ ground breaking project?

Your main point here is wrong. The Saudi group were in Waterford a while back.

It was reported extensively in the papers at the time.

Motivator

Deiseen wrote: »

Your main point here is wrong. The Saudi group were in Waterford a while back.

It was reported extensively in the papers at the time.

John Cummins must have went to Party World so.

E38E3E38E3EE33

State still committed to funding for Waterford's North Quays

Can't wait for the experts here to explain how this is just another load of waffle.