What do you think of the politics of boards.ie

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

WhiteWashMan wrote:

we are not always right, but then again, show me someone who is?

People will always defend themselves when they feel attacked



'i think you will find that everyone has the right to voice their opinion, but sometimes people say things that are just pig ignorant.'


contradiction,say what you want but not if you think a particular way.



'call boards.ie the band aid of ireland if you want, but i think it promotes harmony, rather than bringing up old wounds, creating factions, debating things that happened hundreds of years ago. or even last year.'

so your saying again that there are limitations as to what can be discussed on the site
What happened 100 years ago should be discussed what happened last year should be discussed and if you'll open your eyes, old wounds are still fresh.
I'm all for harmony peace and love but not at the expense of truth.

no, i gave my opinion. i didnt say that my word was a final say on what can be discussed.
i feel there is little point in discussing the good and bad of what happened years ago, unless people are willing to learn from it.
in my experience, people just like to whinge about how unfairly the irish were treated by the english, and refuse to accept that there is a different situation. these are my observations. you can debate them all you want, but its not going to change anything.

as for the truth, who is to say you know the truth, just becuase its what you want to believe....?

thegent wrote:

WhiteWashMan wrote:

we are not always right, but then again, show me someone who is?

People will always defend themselves when they feel attacked



'i think you will find that everyone has the right to voice their opinion, but sometimes people say things that are just pig ignorant.'

contradiction,say what you want but not if you think a particular way.

no, again its very subjective.
people can complain if i say that i think the IRA and irish nationalists are all bigoted scumbags. people may even think me pig ignorant.
do i not still have the right to say it though?

at this point, you are just attacking the things ive said, and your not actually discussing your original post.

are there some specifics that you want to talk about, or are you, at this point, just talking for the sake of talking.

im not sure if you have made your point or not yet....

seamus

Ghost Rider wrote:

Did someone say there was a forum for suggesting ideas for new boards? If so, where is it?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=461

WhiteWashMan

Ghost Rider wrote:

Did someone say there was a forum for suggesting ideas for new boards? If so, where is it?

from the drop down list

system -> forums

bonkey

thegent wrote:

contradiction,say what you want but not if you think a particular way.

No. Say what you want, but be held responsible for what you've said and how you've said it.

Insisting on civility doesn't stop people from making a point. It does, however, allow you to hold them responsible for making that point in an uncivil manner.

If one type of thread, or one set of ideological beliefs seem to be getting it harder than others, perhaps its because they are showing a continuing unwillingness to play inside the same lines that others have already agreed to.

so your saying again that there are limitations as to what can be discussed on the site

Can we distinguish between the site (boards.ie) and the Politics forum which is only a small section of the site?

Either way, though, there are of course limitations.

Incitement to hatred, and other illegal activities (as defined by Irish law) will not be tolerated for a start, nor will anything else which opens the forum's owners to legal liability (e.g. libel).

Within individual forums, there are further limitations, as defined by the purpose of the forum, and how it has its charter laid out.

The Politics forum, for example, is not for discussing the finer points of Astrophysics, nor is it for discussing whether Frodo and Bilbo were really related.

Equally, it is not a forum for racists to encourage us all to wipe the inferior <insert race here> from the country/face of the planet, even though one could argue that this is a political topic.

It is not a forum for posters to enage in ad hominem attacks against each other, whether that be directly (the "bonkey, you're a ****" variety) or in the direction of "I hate the west brit scum traitor mindset that you see so much of on this site".

So yes, there are of course limitations. It would be foolish not to have them. The question is whether or not the limitations are appropriate. Perhaps you could explain why you feel they're not, or why they are appropriate, but are being inappropriately applied.

and if you'll open your eyes, old wounds are still fresh.

I think the point Hobbes was making was that perhaps they're still fresh because people keep wanting to pick at them, and that perhaps boards.ie / the politics board has decided to play as a band-aid instead of a scratching mechanism.

peace and love but not at the expense of truth.

Exactly

And if you can argue for your truth using the language of peace and love, I guarantee you won't have any problems.

If, however, you start a thread talking about West Brits, or label as unpatriotic those who don't support Republicanism in any/every form, or just generally be insulting (like suggesting Dubiln is broken into posh areas and drugland), then its neither peace, love, nor truth.

Raiser

I have an example of the new knee-jerk-banning, silly-season, over-the-top crap.....

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=318139

Apparently making a tongue-in-cheek observation about "Dubs" is somehow "personal abuse".

Mod in this case than posts: Enjoy your ban. No personal attacks, please.

- Oh if he's not carefull the self-righteous smarm may just choke him....

thegent

And others provide less, and each finds their audience. None of which suggests one model is better or worse than another, just different.


It shuts down threads of any nature which get excessively adversarial.

nonsense, in your world then,Iran is one model, USA another, N.Korea another, none are any better than the other just find one that suits you and live there, I say again, nonsense!

the moderators have a duty to other posters to be more proactive

so your saying that the moderaters should not act in a professional manner out of some sense of duty, more nonsense

So what? It was ok to start a thread for posters to complain about mods, but when the mods complain back its unreasonable? As far as I can see, most of these complaints are of the form "you don't appreciate or understand our job".

go back and read bonkey I never said it was unreasonable for the mods to complain,you're just quoting out of context.

But why is it unfair? As with Gost Rider, is it just because you say so, or have you another reason to offer as to why it ws unfair?

Obviously I feel it was unfair, that is my opinion isn't that what this is all about opinions and the feedom to express them?
I also agree with Ghost Rider his thread did warrant political discussion.

You clearly wanted to address abuse of power by specific moderators in a specific forum.

Did I? Clearly? My remarks were never about specific mods or forums,they were general as is 'clearly' stated.

Keeks

Raiser wrote:

I have an example of the new knee-jerk-banning, silly-season, over-the-top crap.....

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=318139

Apparently making a tongue-in-cheek observation about "Dubs" is somehow "personal abuse".

Mod in this case than posts: Enjoy your ban. No personal attacks, please.

- Oh if he's not carefull the self-righteous smarm may just choke him....

This all goes back to what bonkey, WWM, seamus et al ahev being saying:
Its now what you say its how you say it!

How is anybody (read neutral) supposed to take the comment posted "Feckin' Dubs - "youse" are all up yer own...selves" as a tongue in cheek comment. Where are the smiles or other comments that indicate that. As it is, it is only a persoal attack on Dubline people.

azezil

Heh could be worse

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

nonsense, in your world then,Iran is one model, USA another, N.Korea another, none are any better than the other just find one that suits you and live there, I say again, nonsense!



so your saying that the moderaters should not act in a professional manner out of some sense of duty, more nonsense





go back and read bonkey I never said it was unreasonable for the mods to complain,you're just quoting out of context.




Obviously I feel it was unfair, that is my opinion isn't that what this is all about opinions and the feedom to express them?
I also agree with Ghost Rider his thread did warrant political discussion.



Did I? Clearly? My remarks were never about specific mods or forums,they were general as is 'clearly' stated.

now you are just arguing.

i still dont understand what point you are trying to make.

that anyone should be able to say what they want, or that you should be able to discuss what they want?

thegent

[WhiteWashMan]
i feel there is little point in discussing the good and bad of what happened years ago, unless people are willing to learn from it.
in my experience, people just like to whinge about how unfairly the irish were treated by the english, and refuse to accept that there is a different situation. these are my observations. you can debate them all you want, but its not going to change anything.

as for the truth, who is to say you know the truth, just becuase its what you want to believe....?

people can complain if i say that i think the IRA and irish nationalists are all bigoted scumbags. people may even think me pig ignorant.
do i not still have the right to say it though?

at this point, you are just attacking the things ive said, and your not actually discussing your original post

Just have a read through that again and see who is not sticking to the original post

are there some specifics that you want to talk about, or are you, at this point, just talking for the sake of talking.

And you say i was attacking you Which i never did. If you have nothing productive to say...

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

And you say i was attacking you Which i never did. If you have nothing productive to say...

thegent wrote:

nonsense, in your world then,Iran is one model, USA another, N.Korea another, none are any better than the other just find one that suits you and live there, I say again, nonsense!

at this point, i am willing to believe that you are just smudging any issue in an attempt to not answer any questions.

come on we can do this all day. i happen to be very good at it.

thegent

WhiteWashMan wrote:

now you are just arguing.

i still dont understand what point you are trying to make.

that anyone should be able to say what they want, or that you should be able to discuss what they want?

Yes, I'm arguing with you about these things, no-one else, your the one taking the conversation off the point.

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

Yes, I'm arguing with you about these things, no-one else, your the one taking the conversation off the point.

ok, why should you be allowed to say anything you want on this website?

no one has said you can discuss anything you want.

thegent

WhiteWashMan wrote:

come on we can do this all day. i happen to be very good at it.

Like I said if you have nothing productive to add then dont add anything

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

Like I said if you have nothing productive to add then dont add anything

its certainly your opinion that what i say is not productive. others would disagree.

so now you complain that people are with-holding your right to say what you want, and yet you are telling me not to say anything.

how does that work.

strikes me as a little more than ironic... no?

come on, you can do better than that.

thegent

WhiteWashMan wrote:

ok, why should you be allowed to say anything you want on this website?

no one has said you can discuss anything you want.

That’s more like it,
People are allowed to say what they want its called freedom of speech every modern state is supposed to support this.

But you just said that ' no one has said you can discuss what you want' therefore there is an agenda at work on this site if what you can discuss is limited provided its not of an illegal nature which I have not seen on this site. However I have seen, as I've said, discussions of a political nature and others cut off because the moderator deemed it unsuitable.

Keeks

thegent wrote:

People are allowed to say what they want its called freedom of speech every modern state is supposed to support this..

If that was the case we'd have no liable cases, would we?

Gordon

thegent wrote:

That’s more like it,
People are allowed to say what they want its called freedom of speech every modern state is supposed to support this.

This is a privately owned website, you do not have complete freedom of speech here.

WizZard

thegent wrote:

Like I said if you have nothing productive to add then dont add anything

And

thegent wrote:

I also agree with Ghost Rider his thread did warrant political discussion.

don't really make sense to be honest with you.

You advocate one thing in one post, yet do another. Is this a "Do as I say, and not as I do" attitude?

If you do agree, then explain why? Give reasons.

Statements like yours above do not add to any discussion/debate - they simply lead to "I don't agree, so there" types of remarks which beenfit nobody, and definitely not the thread, or forum, itself.

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

That’s more like it,
People are allowed to say what they want its called freedom of speech every modern state is supposed to support this.
.

thats not a reason to allow it here.
if all your friends jumped off a bridge, should we all do it?

thegent wrote:

But you just said that ' no one has said you can discuss what you want' therefore there is an agenda at work on this site if what you can discuss is limited provided its not of an illegal nature which I have not seen on this site. However I have seen, as I've said, discussions of a political nature and others cut off because the moderator deemed it unsuitable.

no, i dont believe it did. i suggested that i thought certain topics were a waste of time, and you certainly cant say certain things, but i never suggested you couldnt discuss whatever you want.

with regards to moderators modertaing a thread, do you think there is a point at which a thread becomes unsuitable?

WizZard

thegent wrote:

But you just said that ' no one has said you can discuss what you want' therefore there is an agenda at work on this site if what you can discuss is limited provided its not of an illegal nature which I have not seen on this site.

Yes, did you just start posting here without reading any of the rules or charters?

This site has never claimed to be a democracy - in fact it is oft quoted that it is a "benevolent dictatorship".
In other words, as long as you abide by the rules which are set for the benefit of all who visit, and not just a minority, then you are quite welcome. Otherwise you will find yourself at the receiving end of the other old favourite - "If you don't like it, then leave"

henbane

But you just said that ' no one has said you can discuss what you want' therefore there is an agenda at work on this site if what you can discuss is limited provided its not of an illegal nature which I have not seen on this site.

I have no idea what this means. Don't like to be a grammar nazi, but commas, clauses and even the lowly semi-colon are your friends.

Yes, I only made this post so I could link the PA punctuation gang

thegent

[WhiteWashMan]its certainly your opinion that what i say is not productive. others would disagree.

so now you complain that people are with-holding your right to say what you want, and yet you are telling me not to say anything.

how does that work.

you said i was going off the point when in fact it was you who was thats why i say you have nothing productive to say

come on, you can do better than that.

And now you continue to provoke, looking for a tit for tat exchange, childish
and immature. Some one here has a tagline that reads
'don’t fall into an argument with a fool, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with their experience'
It's appropriate here. I’m taking the high ground

seamus

thegent wrote:

People are allowed to say what they want its called freedom of speech every modern state is supposed to support this.

"Supposed". I think you'll find a massive difference in what's defined as free speech from country-to-country. Read the Irish consitution's definition and then read the U.S.A.'s constitution.

thegent

'But, you just said that ' no one has said you can discuss what you want' therefore ,there is an agenda at work on this site, if what you can discuss is limited. Provided its not of an illegal nature, which I have not seen on this site. '

Sorry, does it make sense now?

henbane

thegent wrote:

I’m taking the high ground

Ah, vgcats; Is there anything you can't do?

thegent

Exactly! If i go down there he will get me.

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

you said i was going off the point when in fact it was you who was thats why i say you have nothing productive to say



And now you continue to provoke, looking for a tit for tat exchange, childish
and immature. Some one here has a tagline that reads
'don’t fall into an argument with a fool, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with their experience'
It's appropriate here. I’m taking the high ground

but you just said i can say whatever i like.

why do you bother to tell me what i cant say.

along with the fact that you dont bother answering anything else, pretty much shows everyone that you dont have anything to say, you are actualloy just here for a childish tit for tat exchange.
ive asked you several questions, and made several points that you refuse to answer probably due to the fact that i have shown the hypocracy of several of your statements.

now, you can say that i have nothing useful to say, personally, im showing you up as being nothing more than someone who just likes to moan a lot, but really has nothing useful to say.

you say theres a problem with open discussion and open speech on the forum, yet refuse to get engaged in a conversation on the matter, preferring to just constantly reply to any fecitious remark made by me.

and thats ok. you can do that, but like i sid, at this stage, its not a debate, becuase you just arent joining in.
which really goes against you, becuase you are arging the virtue of open debate.

more irony i feel.

but there you go.

now, if you have nothing more to say aside from giving the opinion that nothing i say is useful, why bother come back with nothing useful?

WhiteWashMan

thegent wrote:

'But, you just said that ' no one has said you can discuss what you want' therefore ,there is an agenda at work on this site, if what you can discuss is limited. Provided its not of an illegal nature, which I have not seen on this site. '

Sorry, does it make sense now?

no.

its out of context. who said what?

thegent

WizZard wrote:

This site has never claimed to be a democracy - in fact it is oft quoted that it is a "benevolent dictatorship".

So, my arguments have been right all along thats all I wanted to know,what people think and if what I think is correct- thank you!