Article on horrible side of Roy Keane

Guy:Incognito

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Depends on your definition of "abusing"..

ANything other that TALKING to the ref (not screaming) as there is not reason for a player to do anything beyond that.

MrJoeSoap

Okay, so what warrants a ten-game ban so?

Bare in mind Di Canio got an 11 game ban.

---> Back on-topic

Fact is, Keane has made more enemies than friends amongst the people that know him within the game. Great great player, thats not in doubt, but doesn't know how to control his anger when the red mist descends.

Remember the time he was sent off in the last minute of an Irish match for blatantly kicking an opponent out of frustration? Can't remember the game at the moment, it was mid-nineties.

Pigman II

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Remember the time he was sent off in the last minute of an Irish match for blatantly kicking an opponent out of frustration? Can't remember the game at the moment, it was mid-nineties.

That was against Russia in McCarthys first game. Mick had even made him captain on that occasion.

MrJoeSoap

Pigman II wrote:

That was against Russia in McCarthys first game. Mick had even made him captain on that occasion.

Cheers, I only have a vague recollection of the occasion, remember the red-card vividly though. By the touchline on the near side, he kicked the legs out from under the other player and straight away he knew he was off.

Guy:Incognito

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Cheers, I only have a vague recollection of the occasion, remember the red-card vividly though. By the touchline on the near side, he kicked the legs out from under the other player and straight away he knew he was off.

Seeing as we are brinign up random acts of violence, McAteer tried to kicka macadonian players head off (think it was in the same qualifiers)

Kingp35

Looklads no one is denying that he was a fantastic player but anyone who is denying he was a thug at times just has their head in the clouds or didnt watch Keane play.

Chucky the tree

i with joe on this. i will never have any respect for keane.

MrJoeSoap

McAteer was a dislikeable chap.*

* - I'm worried about a banning after some of the recent bans on here!

Guy:Incognito

Kingp35 wrote:

Looklads no one is denying that he was a fantastic player but anyone who is denying he was a thug at times just has their head in the clouds or didnt watch Keane play.

My pointr was that a lot of players (and a lot of top class players, obviouslyt this is where using mcAAteer becomes flawed, are flawed characters)have a side to their games that maybe they wouldnt be as good without. Shearer is a a dirty player, but seemed to get a lot of protection from refs in England, Rooney is prone to flashes, Gerrard has been know to fly in with two footed challenges , the list goes on.

MrJoeSoap

Stekelly wrote:

My pointr was that a lot of players (and a lot of top class players, obviouslyt this is where using mcAAteer becomes flawed, are flawed characters)have a side to their games that maybe they wouldnt be as good without. Shearer is a a dirty player, but seemed to get a lot of protection from refs in England, Rooney is prone to flashes, Gerrard has been know to fly in with two footed challenges , the list goes on.

None of the above, in my completely neutral opinion, are anything compared to Keane when he loses the rag. None of the above have, or probably will, be sent off ten times (at a conservative estimate) in their career.

Edit - [Its actually 13 red cards for United, almost 100 yellows, and 1 red for Ireland]

dirkey_wynne

MrJoeSoap wrote:

To be honest, I don't really listen to what Johnny Giles says anyway, he doesn't seem to have a clue whats going on half the time these days anyway.

To me, this goes to show a severe lack of insight into football. Giles is by far and away the best pundit out there - he's bang on right 99 times out of a 100 and he never dodges a question. To say he doesn't have a clue....well to me, tells me you don't have a clue!

Off topic, apologies.

As for Keane, the article is a load of b0llocks as others have said. Yes, he was a thug at times, absolutely. He did some rash things that he never should have done. Definitely. Would i change him as a footballer? No way. As a person I respect him also, stands up for what he believes in, willing to stick his neck out and voice an opinion even to his detriment. Honest to the last.

MrJoeSoap

dirkey_wynne wrote:

To me, this goes to show a severe lack of insight into football. Giles is by far and away the best pundit out there - he's bang on right 99 times out of a 100 and he never dodges a question. To say he doesn't have a clue....well to me, tells me you don't have a clue!

Giles is consistently off the ball in my opinion. There was a thread on here a while back about the farce that is RTE and its pundits, and Giles is every bit as much to blame for it. Before the last Villareal-United match his pre-game analysis of the Spanish side was something to the effect of "Well, they came 4th in Spain so they must be good". Very deep, John, well done.

Its fair enough if you want to listen to him, he does make some good points. They tend to be balanced by ones like the quote above. I do genuinely wonder at the amount of world soccer he watches other than the rare non-Premiership matches RTE show.

I prefer to watch games myself and make up my own mind about things rather than listen to "experts" like himself and Dunphy rant about non-events. I generally tend to mute the TV at half time these days anyway.

therecklessone

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Yeah cos Prutton "pushed" the referee...

They were the FA's words Joe, not mine.

Don't believe me?

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Prutton on the other hand, was extremely remorseful. He has since been heavily involved in community work and has taken his punishment like a man and kept his head down ever since.

Keane still hasn't shown remorse, quite simply, because he obviously has none.

I wasn't taking issue with post-offence behaviour, simply questioning the allegation that there was a difference between the punishment's handed out because of the clubs involved.

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Keane deliberately threw all his weight behind a tackle aimed at seriously injuring an opponent (which it did), and got a 9 match ban.

Lets get our facts straight. Keane got a four match ban for the tackle, and subsequently admitted in his book that it was a deliberate foul which earned him another five match ban (plus a fine) for bringing the game into disrepute, on two charges.

We can confirm that The FA have today charged Roy Keane with two cases of bringing the game into disrepute (E1).

Both charges relate to an incident with Manchester City's Alf Inge Haaland during the Manchester United v Manchester City FA Premier League fixture on April 21st 2001.

The first charge follows the challenge itself on Haaland, which is now alleged to have been improperly motivated, with an apparent element of revenge.

The second charge relates to Roy Keane allegedly publishing for financial profit or reward, an account in his autobiography, in which he speaks of a desire to exact revenge on Haaland, therefore bringing the game into disrepute.

Source

Now, can anyone point to any examples of tackles that have earned significantly more than a four match ban from the FA?

dirkey_wynne

MrJoeSoap wrote:

I prefer to watch games myself and make up my own mind about things rather than listen to "experts" like himself and Dunphy rant about non-events. I generally tend to mute the TV at half time these days anyway.

I agree, I like to watch games myself and make up my own mind. However Giles is one of the only pundits I have any time for. He's unbiased, forthright and knowledgable in his views, in my opinion. I tend to agree with most if not all of what he says.

Analysis these days is going down the tubes, this is why I feel Gilesy is a dying breed. Watching Packie last night on TV3, with Lawro and Toshack was excruciating.

Anyway, this is way off topic.

header

this article is a load off rubbish

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patrick vieira has been sent off more times than keaneo

therecklessone

The Muppet wrote:

Excellent , Can I use that one in future Ronan?

More than welcome mate!

MrJoeSoap

therecklessone wrote:

I wasn't taking issue with post-offence behaviour, simply questioning the allegation that there was a difference between the punishment's handed out because of the clubs involved.

Yeah I get ya. The fact still remains that Keane got a 4 game ban for effectively ending an opponents career. Had he not come out and admitted that he did it purposely (and everybody knew he did) he would have served only those four games. Comparatively, Prutton got a ten game ban for barely touching an official (I haven't seen the incident in a while but have a very vivid recollection of it and posting immediately on here about it being disgraceful, which it was, but a ten-game ban?).

The issue isn't solely about the difference between the two clubs, its obviously about the two types of incidents as well. Assaulting a referee should be an extremely heavily punishable offence.

The main point I wanted to make is:

There is a huge difference between barely laying ones hands on an official and damaging someones cruciate ligaments in a ferocious tackle (applying common sense here) but the punishments involved are completely out of proportion. Not that the FA is renowned for their common-sense approach.

What harm was done to Alan Wiley by David Prutton? The picture linked below is honestly the extent of Pruttons "assault", sorry I can't find a video clip.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40872000/jpg/_40872557_pruttonoff203.jpg

What harm was done to Haaland by Keane? Again, picture below. I think I have the clip at home but I'm in college now. I'm sure everyone knows it well anyway.

http://www.nrk.no/img/126646.jpeg

---

Anyway Recklessone, I'm not really disagreeing with you, this is more of a rant against the FA.

Nunu

The Keane tackle on Haaland was obscene, but it didn't 'effectively end his career'. Why do you feel the need to fabricate a long term injury caused? There was no lasting damage, cruciate or otherwise. Now if Keane wanted to end Haalands career he would have gone for the standing leg. Then there would have been definite serious damaged caused, but he didn't he just wanted to hit him hard to shake him up and let him know exactly what he thought of him.

Kingp35

Nunu wrote:

he just wanted to hit him hard to shake him up and let him know exactly what he thought of him.

I think there was a bit more than that involved. You dont wait a year to play against someone and tackle him as bad as that just "to shake him up"

therecklessone

I'm not disagreeing with you regarding the tackle on Haaland Joe, but again I'll ask...can anyone point to a tackle in the English game that got more than a 4 game ban (and for the tackle alone, not for something else that went with it)

MrJoeSoap wrote:

What harm was done to Alan Wiley by David Prutton?

Misses the point. What harm was done by Di Canio to Paul Alcock? All he did was push him, yeah? There can be no physical contact between players and officials, full stop, and FA policy should be to punish players who transgress very severly.

As for the severity of bans for serious foul play? Ironically, Keane's ban for the red card for his foul on Haaland was 3 matches, with an additional 1 for it being his 2nd red card of the season. Of course, the issue isn't Man Utd, or Roy Keane, but FA rules and regulations.

I'd rather not see violent conduct on the pitch, but at the same time I can see the logic in more severe punishment for "attacks" on referees than horror tackles.

Anyway, I think I've taken this off topic enough, so I'll bow out. :v:

MrJoeSoap

Nunu wrote:

The Keane tackle on Haaland was obscene, but it didn't 'effectively end his career'. Why do you feel the need to fabricate a long term injury caused?

Fabricate??? Keane damaged Haaland's cruciate knee ligaments!! Damaged knee ligaments are most certainly a long-term injury. Ask Robert Pires, Paul Gascoigne, Alan Shearer, Ronaldo, Ruud van Nistelrooy, etc...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/2189742.stm

Haaland was left with damaged knee ligaments after being fouled in the Manchester derby of April 2001 and has not started a game since.

It did "effectively" end his career, as had Keane not made the tackle Haaland would more than likely have played another season or two, barring picking up any other injuries. It's conjecture of course, but its a fairly logical point. Whether or not the Keane tackle damaged the standing leg as well is highly debatable, but the fact that you could count on one hand the number of games Haaland played after the tackle is not.

MrJoeSoap

Tell me someone else is watching Net 2 now. Theyre having this exact debate, Dunphy is completely losing it.

therecklessone

Seems this debate's continuing on RTE2...

Dunphy looks set to walk off set, he's said Rod Liddle was a guy who walked away from his wife and kid.

He's been roaring at Okie Doke, I thought he was gonna throw a slap at him.

Pure entertainment.

therecklessone

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Tell me someone else is watching Net 2 now. Theyre having this exact debate, Dunphy is cmopletely losing it.

Beat me to it...:D

Roddy23

that is the funniest 5 mins of tv i have seen in about 5years.Thought it was gonna turn into a free for all there. certianly beats the inept coverage of tv3 last night. At least the lads take it passionately

MrJoeSoap

Was informed on Messenger there was a fight brewing on Net2 so I stuck it on and they were having pretty much this exact debate! Rod Liddle's article etc...

I reckon they all read Boards!

"The storm has passed" - Bill O'Herlihy (even he was losing it for a bit!)

Necronomicon

I thought we were going to see a fight between Dunphy and Brady!!

Roddy23

Ah that was quality, the match wont live up to that, might as well turn off the tv now. Ah ill leave it on, its either that or college work.

Davei141

Anyone got a clip? i know its early but still, clip please.

MrJoeSoap

Wasn't taping it myself, sorry mate!

GuanYin

Likewise, I'd appreciate the clip if anyone has it.

Nunu

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Fabricate??? Keane damaged Haaland's cruciate knee ligaments!! Damaged knee ligaments are most certainly a long-term injury. Ask Robert Pires, Paul Gascoigne, Alan Shearer, Ronaldo, Ruud van Nistelrooy, etc...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/2189742.stm



It did "effectively" end his career, as had Keane not made the tackle Haaland would more than likely have played another season or two, barring picking up any other injuries. It's conjecture of course, but its a fairly logical point. Whether or not the Keane tackle damaged the standing leg as well is highly debatable, but the fact that you could count on one hand the number of games Haaland played after the tackle is not.

At least you know it was the other knee that ended Haalands career, unlike many other misguided/blinkered people. The idea that the kick on his right leg from Keane had some sort of knock on effect to his left leg is clutching at straws. Correct me if I'm wrong but did Haaland not sustain that injury in an international game against Bulgaria he started after the Utd game?

eirebhoy

Redspider usually records games so maybe he has the pre-match row.

GuanYin

I'll give him my firstborn if he does

Pighead

Pigman II wrote:

Well shouldn't we all be grateful that we have a guiding light like him there to show us the error of our ways? It's a wonder how we ever qualified for 2 major championships before he came on the scene.

Oh so because he's older and more 'mature' now his acts of recklessness, thoughtlessness, public betrayal, selfishness and mutiny can all be put down an 'opinionated' nature?

:mad: :mad: :mad:

Pighead

Pighead had waited long enough.He hit him hard with the 3 Angry faces. Take that you ninny. And dont ever stand over me sneering about Roy Keane again.

Pigman II

Pighead wrote:

And dont ever stand over me sneering about Roy Keane again.

Not sneering, just calling it like I see it. Anyway, what are you going to do about it?

GuanYin

Here is a partial audio file of the Dunphy incident.

And the full (25MB) Video is here

http://www.infactah.com/

The Muppet

psi wrote:

Here is a partial audio file of the Dunphy incident.

And the full (25MB) Video is here

http://www.infactah.com/

Thanks for the links, Welcome back.;)