True meaning of Politics.

wiseones2cents

Do Any of you understand the significance of this song?

Artist: The Who Lyrics
Song: Won't Get Fooled Again Lyrics

We'll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals when they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgement of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again

The change, it had to come
We knew it all along
We were liberated from the foe, that's all
And the world looks just the same
And history ain't changed
'Cause the banners, they'd all flown in the last war

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
No, no!

I'll move myself and my family aside
If we happen to be left half alive
I'll get all my papers and smile at the sky
For I know that the hypnotized never lie
Do ya?

Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

There's nothing in the street
Looks any different to me
And the slogans are out-phased, by-the-bye
And the parting on the left
Is now parting on the right
And their beards have all grown longer overnight

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!

Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

Meet the new boss
Same as the old boss

aidan_walsh

wiseones2cents wrote:

Do Any of you understand the significance of this song?

This threads getting locked?

Laguna

What's it trying to proclaim that most people don't already know?, that all politics is a load of old **** and politicians only serve themselves and their own agenda?, I've known that all my life, hence why I've never voted and I never will. In the countries around the world that claim to have 'democracies', does anyone else not question the fact that all voting and vote counting is conducted in a completely clandestine manner?, who's to say your vote even gets counted?, the person with the most corporate backing gets into power; it's a fact.

Captain Trips

The true meaning of modern politics is that no-one is accountable and the party (or The Party) no matter which it is, simply take turns at being in power. They are the same people at the same banquets, meetings and management discussions.

One year, a politician is in charge of say social services, next year it's health. It's based on certain people with limited benefit to society maintaining control.

Modern democracy removes the people's ability to fight back as the politicians who doa poor job are unpunished and regardless, because of The Party system, retain an ability to continue in a power position without repercussion.

The modern parliamentary system ensures this, and is what is meant by "democracy" when you read it in media publications. It ensures a lethargy in the goverment function, wastes talent and keeps a population under control. E.g., the recent German elections - no account is made of the fact that 1/3 of the population voted for other candidates. And only 1/3 wanted either SDP or CD to be in power.

In US, the system gives two choices.

If anything, the Swiss system is far more progressive as it removes the adminstration heavy parliamentary system. There are 13 political parties, and it's largely irrelevant who they are as most if not all decisions affecting you take place at a local level. There is a president, but it changes every year, again, so it makes these professional politicians superfluous to the underlying very well functioning society.

Why is Harney running health? Why not....it's her or it's another and nothing will be accomplished. Even if she fails (which she will as it's essential that they do), FF/PD/FG/L/whatever live on.

Ideally, you work and live in the same region, and your local schools, hospitals, etc., should all be run by "town hall" style scnarios. WOuld it be wrong to allow each Province to govern themselves? Probably not at all. It works for the 8 million Swiss in 26 cantons. Ireland has 4 million in 26 counties. Furthermore, Zurich has a large population of 1 million (I think it's around that), much like Dublin's top heavy population. Modern globalisation prevents the live/work locally system, as we see more and more in Ireland with people commuting large distances, so you work more and spend less time actually thinking and realising how manipulative it is. Ideally, you would be near your local doctor, hospital (staffed by local people), police (Gardai being local) and so on. With priority being capital and financial gain, you break down to the lowest common denominator - hospitals staffed by workforces who have difficulty communication, Gardai introducing applicants from anywhere, etc., etc., .

But, it would mean having your professional career politican not having his/her face as a "leader" on TV, news, media as a hate/love figure, so it's unlikely to happen unless EVERYONE VOTES FOR ME to change it! I hope this doesn't seem paranoid, it's simply a perspective taking into account Ireland's transformation from the live/work locally lifestyle to a commuter lifestyle. I would hope no-one believes this to be a racist post, although I can see how it might be interpreted as such.

wiseones2cents

That is correct. It a crock of b.s. Doesn't matter who you vote for the Rich always win.And who do the rich help? the rich.

The U.S, is the most shameful display of Democracy that exists. both times bush had to scam his way to victory.

Corporations invest big dollars in candidates(they used to be called bribes but now are called donations) and when that candidate is elected they expect their money back plus a nice fat slice of interest. At tax payers expense.

Thats why Capitalism sucks the most. big business run the government. No matter who you vote for.

Listen to the verse. when the morals are all gone.
and the men who spurred us on.
Sit in judgement are ALL WRONG.
They decide and the guns and bombs start dropping.

This is about wars.

The rest of it says that nothing ever changes because violence has always breeded more violence.

You can vote all you want till the cows come home. Nothing every changes.

A revolution cleans house but voting?Takes the heat off the the politicians
so the people think they have done justice and go back to their normal routines, only to get robbed by the next guy and the cycle continues.

As the song ends. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss....

samb

I share much of your cynicism, espeically with regard the US, but I think our Democracy here is not too bad. Many people seem to believe politicians are all crooks and motivated by greed but I think that in many cases I think they are much more likely to come to well educated decisions than the general public, At least politicians must agrue and discuss the issues, while many of the general public make up their minds on issues without looking into all of the complexities.
So what is the alternatives? More democracy or none...?
Imagine a democracy based on text messaging or email, whereby every decision and law inacted was voted on by all. I think that would be a reciepe for disaster.
The other alternative, Anarcism maybe, is a very nice idea, but in reality would result in vigilantism, real survival of the fittest, and general misery.

If you guys are Anarchists I'd be interested in a thread on it. All anarchists I know are dead sound, correct in their critisisms, but lacking in practical solutions.

I asked a friend of mine a while back who was an anarchist ''So are you really an Anarchist?'', He replied ''No, just a cynic'', brilliant answer I thought.

aidan_walsh

aidan_walsh wrote:

This threads getting locked?

It will be alright if the op doesnt come back within the day to express his own opinion.
Those are the rules.
Tick tock...

bonkey

wiseones2cents wrote:

Do Any of you understand the significance of this song?

CSI is on the telly?

bonkey

Earthman wrote:

It will be alright if the op doesnt come back within the day to express his own opinion.

Earthman...I think you'll find he already did, about 8 hours before you posted this....

yes he did

The tick tock was the cryptic bit

Oh never mind

wiseones2cents

samb wrote:

I share much of your cynicism, espeically with regard the US, but I think our Democracy here is not too bad. Many people seem to believe politicians are all crooks and motivated by greed but I think that in many cases I think they are much more likely to come to well educated decisions than the general public, At least politicians must agrue and discuss the issues, while many of the general public make up their minds on issues without looking into all of the complexities.
So what is the alternatives? More democracy or none...?
Imagine a democracy based on text messaging or email, whereby every decision and law inacted was voted on by all. I think that would be a reciepe for disaster.
The other alternative, Anarcism maybe, is a very nice idea, but in reality would result in vigilantism, real survival of the fittest, and general misery.

If you guys are Anarchists I'd be interested in a thread on it. All anarchists I know are dead sound, correct in their critisisms, but lacking in practical solutions.

I asked a friend of mine a while back who was an anarchist ''So are you really an Anarchist?'', He replied ''No, just a cynic'', brilliant answer I thought.

We'll I wouldn't say the are all Crooks. Some Know it is crooked and stay because they feel at least within the governemnt they could do some good, rather than nothing(but most become corupt eventually anyways).

Others know its crooked but are profitting of the crookidness and rather risk loosing their high pages jobs. Just go with the flow.

Plus if anyone tried to expose the Government, the medias would start spinning info and make him look like the bad guy.(BBC is not too bad)

England may not be as bad yet. But Now that the Elites of the world are joining together,you will see....You will start to feel the squeeze.

What is the Alternative? Socialism with democracy. The existing government can stay as long as it wants. But when it starts to slide or does not keep its promises? THEN you call for an election and it must be supported by the Majority of the people.

In a socialist government. The government has alot more Money to play with, to even out the economic divides. More money for BETTER free Health care, More money for social services(That does not come out of your tax money), More money for retirees, More money for the poor, Basically you get the picture.

In Capitalism the money goes to big corporations. More money for big houses, Yachts,Ferraris,large tracts of land, Vacations, ridiculously overpriced art and junk.ect...And for only a small portion of the population 1-10% maximum.
The rest struggle.

Anarchy? What do you think exists in America today? The country is in complete chaos especially in the larger cities. Just look at all the crime in America. they say crime is down but only in their imagination.

Unfortunately I am neither an Anarchist, Cynic, Pessimist or Optimist. I am a realist. I call it as I see it.

Anarchy ≠ Chaos

Gurgle

samb wrote:

I think that in many cases I think they are much more likely to come to well educated decisions than the general public

But heres the catch:
A party member is instructed on how to vote by the party. They don't get to think it through and vote as best for their constituents.
The party 'owes' favours to whoever funds the party.
-> Decisions are made based on where the money is, not who the TDs are meant to represent.

IMHO, it should be illegal for any corporate entity to make a donation to a politician.

Thats just corruption plain and simple and its built into the system here same as every other 'democracy' in the world.

Freelancer

bonkey wrote:

CSI is on the telly?

I only just got that.......... deserves a

Cronus333

I fell horribly naive by comparison..... I'm still a PD though and believe that though our system has flaws, its the best we have.

Boggle

I reckon party politics should be banned and that true Democracy should come into play. With party politics, the weak performances of members or even the entire party can easily be overcome by numbers and block voting - if everyone was free to voice their own opinions then you might see some proper decisions being made as a poor performer would have no umbrella.

Many people seem to believe politicians are all crooks and motivated by greed but I think that in many cases I think they are much more likely to come to well educated decisions than the general public, At least politicians must agrue and discuss the issues, while many of the general public make up their minds on issues without looking into all of the complexities.

Youre having a giraffe.... (M50, port tunnel, e-voting, etc...)