Electrical Manufacturers To Penalise Online Retailers

MorningStar

Freddie59 wrote:

Ah no. That honour would lie 100% with your good self. I suppose you deserve it for all the things you accuse me of, they being:

You claim there is a rip off and I am asking what are you basing that on other than end price? It is a question for you claiming an event I justt want to know what basis.

Rodo wrote:

It was about planning to charge online retailers a higher wholesale price than high street shops in order to force the online price up to that of the shops. Right ?

First off there is no suggestion from anybody in any article that athe reason is to force on-line prices up. Is about discounts making up intent means you start with a bias.

The article is about on type of store accusing another. Not proven

Rodo wrote:

I agree with you here it does make clear business sense but only to the people who want this to happen. It certainly don't make clear business sense to the people who now have to pay more because businesses are whinging.

Business do business consumer consume. Bussiness sense is for business consumer sense is for consumers. Don't like a price don't buy. There is again no actual price increase or suggestion.

Online retailer was allowed discounts before and still is the only difference is the bricks store can get a further discount. That means prices go down. THere is no suggestion that the on-line store now pay more than they did before.

Rodo wrote:

This being the case it's a _____________ ?

Competative pricing based on selling power.

Rodo wrote:

"Only certain businessess have price banding within countries"
This being the case it's a _____________ ?"

You really didn't understand me if you think that is a cartel. Price banding is specific to chain stores and franchisese. Depending on the very local market (2 miles can be larger depending on store type) prices are set within that chain. So as I said house prices in one area being high means they will use higher prices in that area. Normally this is becasue rent for the shop is higher. A cartel requires a number of business in a market to agree prices for the same or similar goods to keep prices artificially high. A main points being you have to be a number of businesses and really need to control a large portion of the market.
In other words it is impossible in the consumer electronics market as therir are too many retailer and manufactureres. Manufacturers can't agree on a new DVD format yet you would believe they agree prices ?

Rodo wrote:

Wouldn't market awareness on Sony's part be to welcome the online sellers if they found it harder to diversify as they are a company who operate a one brand shop, and the opportunity of a new medium, and the possibilities of reaching millions would most certainly improve their end of year profit ??????

Do you know how a franchise works? Sony don't operate the stores directly. They worked out the figures and the mixtuure of high margins and product recognition the franchise works out for them. Sony are really in the business of production as a primary goal.

Rodo wrote:

Where's the clear business sense to this if they turn around and say to the online seller that they are now going to charge them more for a product that they did last month, and they can't justify the increase to production costs, overheads, etc, it's purley because tradtional shops can't compete ???

Where has that been said in the news paper article or any other? One of my main points is the article did not say what people think it did. Not getting a discount does not mean you suddenly start charging the on-line more.

If I sell you something for a €5 this week and Freddie the same for €5. Then this week I charge you €5 and Freddie €4. Am I increasing your costs? No. Would you feel a little angry that you aren't getting it for €4 would you complain? That is what has happened no more less.

Rodo wrote:

The online seller says **** that, and stocks another brand just because someone was whinging. Sony loses sales ?????
Again it's clear business sense but only to the businesses who are trying to protect themselves from the online traders, no one else

I agree that is what I said will happen ultimately with on-line store leading to more competition. It doesn't have to mean something bad. Sony want the most sales they seewhat they are doing as the best bet. Your arguement is valid on logic but they decided to go the other way. Their business their choice.

Rodo wrote:

If you were to apply the 80/20 principle here, and I am, it appears to me that you would be in the 2nd 20% mentioned, so I understand you seeing clear business sense. So if we apply it again there was what, five people posted here, one though it good, four thought it dodgy, correct, and we went all politican and had a vote, and the majority could then decide what they should call it, what would it be called _____________?

First off I think I have to point out you are in the top 20% who own stuff. That figure applies for the world and if you live in Ireland and have access to a computer you are certainly in the 20% of the wealthy people in the world.

People read the article and the comments on it and came to the wrong conclusions.
No mention of on-lines stores having their prices increased.
No mention of cartel.
No proof only accusation.
Now a journalist looking up the story who probably knows more on tha matter and direct information doesn't mention cartel I would say their is a reason. I don't take the view that people agreeing on something makes them right. I know what a cartel is and the accusation against Sony and 2 other manufacturers can't amount to a cartel in the market.

Freddie can't even give an answer to why he knows it is a rip off other than end price, can you?

I don't mind if people want to make themselves misreable believing rip off but if they claim they know this based on end price alone they don't know what they are talking about. I can see why they do think it but when they ignore details they just have opinion and a bias one at that.

Freddie59

MorningStar wrote:

Freddie can't even give an answer to why he knows it is a rip off other than end price, can you?

I don't need to comment further. The links below adequately highlight the FACTS!:D

Highest electricty price rises in Europe (even though we're recognised to have one of the best networks in the world;) ):
http://www.irishexaminer.com/text/story.asp?j=28294534634&p=z8z9453468x&n=28294534722

Car prices: (from the Irish Independent August 2004):

"THE EXPENSE of being a driver in Ireland on almost every level - including motor tax, speed fines and clamping - makes this country among the most expensive in Europe when it comes to putting a car on the road.

A Sunday Independent investigation has revealed what many motorists long suspected - that we get ripped off by garages, councils and the Government which charge the highest taxes and driving fees in the EU.

The cost of getting on the road and staying on the road in Ireland is second only to Holland in our survey of six EU countries.

The total cost of 10 motoring expenses, covering the main factors involved in putting and keeping a car on the road, came to €31,171.39 for a woman and €31,365.85 for man in Ireland compared to €25,120.05 for a woman and €25,250.43 for a man in Spain.

Ireland tops the league for the cost of taxing and insuring a car, and is second only to Holland for the cost of buying a new car.

The recommended retail price for a five-door, two-litre diesel Ford Mondeo is €31,330 in Holland and €29,515 in Ireland. But the same car can be bought for just €23,805 in Spain."

A General comparison (from finfacts.com):

http://www.finfacts.ie/euro.htm

The table at the end of the page adequately demonstrates how we are third behind only Finland and Italy for a lot of items. However, in these countries you will find a good road infrastructure and all the other things you would expect when PAYING ABOVE THE ODDS FOR EVERYTHING!

I could go on , but Morning Star, with his Utopian outlook, will, as usual try to convince everyone that the opposite is occuring:rolleyes: . My my.:o

MorningStar

Freddie59 wrote:

I could go on , but Morning Star, with his Utopian outlook, will, as usual try to convince everyone that the opposite is occuring:rolleyes: . My my.:o

Actually you can't go on as you are unable to answer the question I ask you. Do all the price comparison charts you want you are still not answering the question.
Given the number of times you have been unable to answer it there is no other conclusion to draw than you have only opinion!
Untill you actually answer the question I am going to ignore you.
I don't need to convince anyone you can't answer the question All you do is try to muddy the waters. No point as I still notice how you can't answer the question and keep avoiding it. We are talking retail so electricity means nothing and as with the everything else all you are doing is quoting end prices. I have only know stupid people to be unable to answer the same question or people who are wrong to be unable to answer a question.
I might not agree with an answer you give but as you don't answer it I might go with the knowledge I have of people who can't answer questions.
Note that you don't need smiles to be arcastic, clever, witty or express any other emotions it is actually quite clear if you say it right.
Why not try to rephrase the question so that I can see that you at least understand the question and are just choosing not to answer it becasue it would prove your argument is baseless.

I must also point out that the article you posted points out Ireland is not the most expensive place in the EU and shows prices pretty close to each other over all. Which unlike your interpretation does not mean we are paying over the odds for everything. We are not only behind Finland and Italy so you are mistaken or lying. You seem unable to look at facts objectively or in fact just unable to produce them to answer a question.

Freddie59

MorningStar wrote:

Actually you can't go on as you are unable to answer the question I ask you. Do all the price comparison charts you want you are still not answering the question.

Yes - of course all the price comparison charts are wrong if you say so.:)

MorningStar wrote:

Given the number of times you have been unable to answer it there is no other conclusion to draw than you have only opinion!

Of course I am.:rolleyes:

MorningStar wrote:

Untill you actually answer the question I am going to ignore you.

I'll lose a lot of sleep over that.:D

MorningStar wrote:

I must also point out that the article you posted points out Ireland is not the most expensive place in the EU and shows prices pretty close to each other over all.

You say tomato - I say tomato!

MorningStar wrote:

I We are not only behind Finland and Italy so you are mistaken or lying. You seem unable to look at facts objectively or in fact just unable to produce them to answer a question.

Yes, I'm unable to be objective. The countries quoted (and France) have better infrastructure, health service, and much more. What extra have we here? The M50 (biggest car park in the world) and a couple of towns bypassed. Certainly worth paying the highest rates in Europe!:o