Someone wanna explain this to me...

fade2black

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/trank2009.html

Hobart

This guy here
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/

and here is how (and why) he does it (from a uefa perspective anyhow)
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/index.html

fade2black

Still though...Newcastle ahead of Man U etc...

p.pete

What did Newcastle do last year?

Pigman II

didn't they get to the qf's of the uefa cup?

fade2black

Maybe he's expecting big things from them in the next couple of years...it is rankings from 2009 after all....

Hobart

fade2black wrote:

Maybe he's expecting big things from them in the next couple of years...it is rankings from 2009 after all....

No it's not. It's rankings upto 2009. He is also using coefficents for his calculations. They are accurate, as far as I can see, if you look at his methods

p.pete

Pigman II wrote:

didn't they get to the qf's of the uefa cup?

Don't know but Chelsea got to the semi's of the CL and have less points for last year...

Guy:Incognito

fade2black wrote:

Still though...Newcastle ahead of Man U etc...

Well if Utd won the odd European game you might have a case.

mchurl

AZ Alkmaar 6th best in Europe???

Guy:Incognito

mchurl wrote:

AZ Alkmaar 6th best in Europe???

People are missing the reasons here, they win lots of games = they get lots of ranking points, its fairly simple.

Big Ears

Stekelly wrote:

People are missing the reasons here, they win lots of games = they get lots of ranking points, its fairly simple.

Some people just don't understand coefficiants , now..............[childish taunting voice]Newcastle are better than Man United , Newcastle are better than Man United[childish taunting voice/] :rolleyes: .

Jivin Turkey

p.pete wrote:

What did Newcastle do last year?

They were also semi-finalists in 03/04 and got to the second phase of the CL in 02/03 if I'm not mistaken.

eirebhoy

mchurl wrote:

AZ Alkmaar 6th best in Europe???

They are some bloody team. 6 AZ players were in the last Dutch squad and 8 AZ players have played for Holland this season. Big names aren't everything and I'm suprised how they are still probably known just as much now as they were 2 years ago by most people. I mention AZ in the pub and nobody knows who I'm talking about.

A win in the CL is ranked the same as a win in the UEFA cup which should be changed.

Jivin Turkey wrote:

They were also semi-finalists in 03/04 and got to the second phase of the CL in 02/03 if I'm not mistaken.

This is only the rankings for this season and last. Current rankings over 5 seasons:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/trank2005.html

PHB

Why would anybody want to look at that webpage?
It is utterly irrelevent.

redspider

This co-efficient is what Uefa use. Dont shoot the messenger. It has been discussed here before. My opinion is that they (Uefa) give too many points for the Uefa Cup games, and hence the table is skewed towards teams that do well in that competition. It is possible for a team to get knocked out of the CL and then go and do well in the Uefa Cup, and have more pts than the teams that beat them in the CL. That doesnt make sense!

To look at the "most relevant" table, use this one:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/trank2006.html
It covers the performances over the previous 4 seasons and this one "so far". Alkmaar are in 35th spot. Shelbourne are in 230th.

I'm sure someone out there has a table of some sort that measures success just in the CL, and a scheme such as the following is not too hard to do, say over the last 5 years:

Winner 6 pts
2nd place 4
last-4 3
last-8 2 pts
last-16 1 pt


redspider

cournioni

eirebhoy wrote:

They are some bloody team. 6 AZ players were in the last Dutch squad and 8 AZ players have played for Holland this season. Big names aren't everything and I'm suprised how they are still probably known just as much now as they were 2 years ago by most people. I mention AZ in the pub and nobody knows who I'm talking about.

And to think that David Connolly turned them down for a chance to play for the mighty Wimbledon...

The Rooster

They are relatively important in that they decide seedings in CL draws. Its usually advantageuos to be in top 8 and you definitely don't want to be outside the top 16 (though of course luck of the draw plays a part as well).

No question, the UEFA Cup gets too much credit.

The Muppet

Its simple to explain really . You can get stats to pove any point you want.

eirebhoy

PHB wrote:

Why would anybody want to look at that webpage?
It is utterly irrelevent.

Of the 16 teams that qualified for the knockouts this season, only 3 of them came from Pots 3 and 4, meaning only 3 teams from Pot 1 and 2 failed to qualify (Panathinaikos, Man Utd, Porto). As a Celtic fan I want Celtic to make Pot 2 if they qualify. Being 22nd in the club rankings with 6 or 7 teams ahead in the rankings not looking like qualifying for the CL, it means Celtic are likely to make Pot 2. That means they'll avoid the likes of Chelsea, Juve and Lyon for weaker teams.

You want your favourite club to be doing well in the rankings, don't see whats irrelevent.

PHB

Yeh I understand why the rankings are useful, I don't understand why anyone would want to look at the 2009 rankings since they need 3 more years of results before they are in anyway relevent, thus are utterly irrelevent

fade2black

I was doing an unrelated search and goggle caught me by the hand and said "hey, have a look at this". So I did.

Töpher

PHB wrote:

Yeh I understand why the rankings are useful, I don't understand why anyone would want to look at the 2009 rankings since they need 3 more years of results before they are in anyway relevent, thus are utterly irrelevent

If nothing else, it is a guide to the points earned over the last 2 seasons european competition, which IS relevant!

PHB

Yeh

I do wonder why it is there though

Töpher

Presumably so those interested can look at it and compare what sort of country rankings will be attainted from what sort of results etc. Particularily those who are hoping for certain levels with a certain timeframe. EL fans for want of a better description!